First Impressions

[Moes1980]

 

So, I was able to run a one shot adventure that came with the keeper screen yesterday and I thought I would post a review/first impressions of the game. 7th edition is my first and only experience with CoC games, and it was tons of fun! Here is a not-so-brief overview of my impression of certain rules and how it all worked. I tried to write it as spoiler-free as possible, but very astute players may pick up on a thing or two, maybe.

1) Sanity loss was not as debilitating as I thought it would be, but it did seem to kick in at the worse moments. In the final fight, for example, a character who had indefinite insanity lost a sanity point (even though they passed their sanity role) and had a bout of madness for 9 rounds (in other words, there was no way to avoid the madness in the final scene!). I rolled randomly and the chart said to pick a person of interest from their background, and that the player hallucinates and sees this person. So, he started shooting another one of the players as he thought it was his arch enemy. And yes, he dealt a mortal wound to him!

2) I allowed the optional rule for rolling luck. Most players were hesitant to use it, as decreasing their luck stat seemed to be a pretty steep cost. Also, one player rolled three 1s, and so he started out with a luck of 15! That meant the group luck was 15, which really hurt the group (hurt as in it killed everyone! More on this below).

2.5) I also used luck rolls when characters asked about something I hadn't thought of. For example, they found a pile of old junk and asked if they could find rope in it. I called for a luck roll to see. Second, in the fight at the end where guns were not helping much, and one character wanted to free another player from some grabbing tentacles, I called for a luck roll to see if one of the player's signature straight razor had fallen out of his pocket. In both cases, the luck roll failed.

3) The idea roll only came up once. The players were a bit stuck, and I wanted to hurry things along a bit as we only had one session to play this scenario. They had already discovered most of the main clues, so I allowed an idea roll in order to see how the clues fit together. Basically, I told them straight up that they had two locations to explore, but the choice was theirs.

4) There was really only one combat, though technically we did things in initiative order twice, but the first time the party just ran away (Good idea). In one scene, I thought for sure there would be a combat, but the players surprised me. Combat is very deadly. One player fired his rifle at an animal and did impaling damage (with an extreme success), and dished out 15 or 20 points of damage. This made everyone pretty nervous about starting fights.

5) I had planned for a chase scene but it never happened, mainly because the players avoided a major combat. So, I didn't get to try those rules out. Also no magic rules used.

6) Players did try to push rolls a few times, and with disastrious consequences. At one point, for example, a player tried to steal a stick of dynamite out of another player's pocket, failed, tried to push, and failed again. So I ruled that not only did the other player notice the attempt, but that the stick was dropped into a creek and floated away.

The worst was at the end, however, where one player, who was seriously injured and laying up against the back of a cave wall (he was shot by the other player who was going insane), tried to light a stick of dynamite to kill the big horrible monster causing all the trouble. In the scenario, lighting a stick requires a luck roll as the sticks are damp and hard to light. Well, this was the character with a luck of 15 (it was actually now 9 as he had burnt luck earlier). He failed his role, then pushed, and failed again (I am not sure if you can actually push luck rolls, but since this was an actual task of lighting the fuse, I figured it made sense to be able to push it). I was debating on what terrible thing should happen when I suddenly realized that he had rolled a 97, a critical failure on a failed push roll! So, yeah, in his haste and desperation to light the fuse, he accidently touched the stick to the flame and exploded the dynamite (trying to light a stick of dynamite after sustaining major blood loss, and in the dark, is a risky thing to do). He and everyone in the cave, along with the monster, were instantly killed (as per the published scenario rules). So, no one made it out alive, but they did kill the evil boss monster. It was very memorable.

Oh, I almost forgot, I also allowed for a pushed luck roll to search a pile of junk (I don't remember what they were looking for) but failed, and the player cut himself on a rusty nail for 3 points of damage, a third of their health! I did have to deny a few requests to push some rolls, but this came more from not quite knowing how they worked. After a few times, the players were able to figure out how it worked and then it wasn't a problem. Personally, I love the push mechanic, the tension it builds and the very bad things that happen when they go wrong is loads of fun. For those who aren't sure about it, I would say give it a go! On a related note, the bonus/penalty die/dice seemed to work well enough. It saved me time from trying to figure out how much of bonus/penalty modifier I should apply.

7) The scenario recommended giving an epilogue . I can't really restate it here for risk of spoilers, but basically, it was along the lines of a newspaper story coming out several months later where people had no idea what the heck happened. None of the player character bodies were ever found.

8) I was initially worried that the game might get stale or boring with not much action happening until the end, but this was not the case. The atmosphere, mystery, and slowly ratcheting up the steaks and weirdness kept everyone engaged. Veteran players of DnD and other RPGs were jumping scared from plain old barn mice! Part of this might of been that I was just running a really good published adventure, but it was still comforting to see that it is possible to keep the game exciting with few combats and dice rolls.

9) In conclusion, I found the game to be extremely enjoyable, but I do think it requires a bit of skill on the game master's part, as well as an understanding from the players that they are not action heroes. Pacing seems to be very important. Right when the players were starting to get a little bored or frustrated, I made sure to make those the times I "fast forwarded" ahead, called for an idea role, or had something interesting happen. The last thing I wanted was the players sitting around not sure what to do. If they started to not drive the story with their actions, then I would drive it with events that escalated the situation.

Having a well-written adventure also seems to be pretty important. I do not yet feel confident that I can write a good scenario for this game, and I don't think I will try for a while as I want to get more players for the game. In terms of how it compares to older versions, I can't say. All I can say is, it was far more horror than it was pulp action. I think a gun was shot only 4 or 5times in 6 hours of playing. Characters got seriously injured from doing things like climbing up into a cave and searching piles of junk. One player who had a bout of madness was punching a tree and hurting himself, he lost half his health doing that!

In conclusion, I am very happy with this game, I love every rule mechanic and aspect about it so far! I can't wait to pick up the investigator's handbook and Horror on the Orient Express on Tuesday!

[JohnnyDollar]

That's an awesome review of your experience, very detailed.  I've played CoC for years and "grew up" on the older version of the system.  I've yet to really take a stab at 7th edition full swing, but I plan to incorporate into my gaming club.  I've been pouring over the rules and tried the solo scenario to familiarize myself with the basics.

I have a question for you, when the bonus/penalty die mechanic came up in your session for pushing, did it take the players some getting used to? I had a similar fear with D&D 5th edition's advantage system but came to really love that.  I am assuming the bonus/penalty system will probably be the same way, that once implemented it'll feel second nature.

Second, did multiple attacks come up at all?  I am a little hazy on how those work in this edition.  I've noticed that say a .38 has the Attack section as 1(3).  I take this to mean that it can fire once or three times.  In the old system, the "extra" shots came within the DEX ordering but this system mention about a straight penalty to the shots?

Thanks for taking the time to answer these questions...or if anyone else posts here, feel free to take a stab.  Glowing review and it makes me happy to see this version taking off so well!

[trystero]

Congratulations on running your first CoC game; it sounds like you had a good time, and I hope there are more sessions to come!

[Moes1980]

Hi Johnny Dollar, I am glad that you liked the review! The bonus/penalty mechanic was pretty straight forward and easy to implement. The only hiccup was one player was rerolling the ones die instead of the tens, but that was an easy fix. The push mechanic took slightly more getting used to as players learned that it was not a do-over, and could not be applied to all types of rolls. However, they did get the hang of things very quickly, and for a first time playing this game for all involved, it was surprisingly smooth experience with very little rules referencing. It should be noted, however, that even though this was the first time for me and the players to play CoC, everyone was still a veteran player, with the exception of one player (who still picked it up pretty quick). 

 

As for multiple attacks, as I understand it, you can shoot your gun a number of times equal to its rate of fire, but if you do, every shot must include a penalty die, and all shots are made on your turn, in dex order (though, readied ranged weapons attack at dex +50). I told the players this but they never opted to take multiple shots. Machine guns, however, have more options as they can fire semi and fully automatic, and also have the option for doing suppressive fire (you can unload a 50 round drum in your Tommy gun in one turn!). I did not read these rules too carefully as I knew there would be no machine guns in the scenario, but it is something along the lines of firing bursts of ammunition (i.e. you roll to hit for a group of bullets instead of each individual bullet). I am also not sure if the  penalty die applies to melee attacks. There was also a confusing contradiction in the rules where a monster had two attacks, but also stated that it only had a swarm attack, which affects everyone within 10 yards. I wasn't sure how to interpret that, but the players avoided that encounter so again, it didn't come up. I was planning on splitting the difference, and saying the monster can attack up to two people in the area, along with anyone within 10 yards. 

I am glad people are enjoying the review, and I look forward to my next session. I have already started preparing for my next demo!

[Moes1980]

Oh, I guess I should point out what was the most confusing elements for the players to grasp. This element was when the degree of success mattered and when it didn't. For example, they knew that an extreme success in shooting meant more damage, so they started to think that with all skill checks, a better roll would mean more detail, even though that is not necessarily the case. Really, the only time the player needs to tell me the degree of success is with opposed melee combat roles. All other roles are either a success of failure, with different thresholds required for success. However, I never explained this nuance of the rules to them, and even found myself going along with it and giving more information or improved results when players rolled a hard or extreme success, even if only a normal success was necessary. 

I will explain this difference in more detail for a regular gaming group, once I get it going, but I figured I didn't really need to spend the time on it for one shot adventure.  

[Moes1980]

11 hours ago, trystero said:

Congratulations on running your first CoC game; it sounds like you had a good time, and I hope there are more sessions to come!

 

Thanks, we all had a blast (no pun intended)! I look forward to having many more game sessions. 

[rust]

5 minutes ago, Moes1980 said:

However, I never explained this nuance of the rules to them, and even found myself going along with it and giving more information or improved results when players rolled a hard or extreme success, even if only a normal success was necessary. 

I think you should keep this habit. While it is not a part of the Call of Cthulhu rules, it is the rule in many other games and I consider it quite useful because it adds detail to the referee's descriptions.

[JohnnyDollar]

Thank you Moes for the reply.  That clears things up immensely.  After reading what you wrote I went back to the combat and firearms section and re-read it.  I think you're 100% right that pushing, bonus/penalty, etc will be a little odd at first but then easy peasy.   

As a side note, I agree with Rust in the fact you should keep doing what you're doing with extreme successes.  Especially if your group likes it, keep it going!

[Scott Dorward]

Glad to hear it went well! It sounds like you did an excellent job as Keeper.

A fumble with dynamite is the perfect climax to this scenario.

[Moes1980]

10 hours ago, Scott Dorward said:

Glad to hear it went well! It sounds like you did an excellent job as Keeper.

A fumble with dynamite is the perfect climax to this scenario.

 

 

Thank you, sir, for writing an excellent adventure! I wish I could talk more about it but I really don't want to spoil things for others. I never thought I could play a game where players would be seriously spooked by mice! It was fantastic! 

[Moes1980]

On 06/09/2016 at 2:48 AM, rust said:

I think you should keep this habit. While it is not a part of the Call of Cthulhu rules, it is the rule in many other games and I consider it quite useful because it adds detail to the referee's descriptions.

 

 

19 hours ago, JohnnyDollar said:

Thank you Moes for the reply.  That clears things up immensely.  After reading what you wrote I went back to the combat and firearms section and re-read it.  I think you're 100% right that pushing, bonus/penalty, etc will be a little odd at first but then easy peasy.   

As a side note, I agree with Rust in the fact you should keep doing what you're doing with extreme successes.  Especially if your group likes it, keep it going!

 

 

Yes, I think I might have actually misunderstood this rule, anyway. Reading back through some adventures, this method is actually used. Official rule or not, however, I think you are both right, so I will keep using it. Thank you all for your feedback

[L Kelly]

Good read, I haven't picked up 7th ed yet. Waiting for car MOT results before any new purchases. The push rules intrigue me. Hope you have many moe Cthulhu games

[umbraldragon]

Moe, play mo' Cthulhu! Even though you thought you made mistakes, there is a good reason to show degrees of success.  It helps make things a little more realistic in my point of view.  I use it in most games I play no matter what the rules are.  I don't always make a fumble a complete disaster.  It depends on the story line.  Sometimes it's succeed at a cost - they don't usually like the cost...hehe.  And unlike a D&D game, Investigators really shouldn't wade into every potential battle - they'll probably get killt for Krize Sakez!  It should only really happen in a climax scene like the one you described with the dynamite taking out everyone including the bad guy!  Self sacrifice has ever been an element in CoC.  You did good Moe...

To comment on First Impressions...7th edition has a lot to offer.  In terms of layout and design, it is by far the most beautiful book Chaosium has put together.  For those who've been using 5.2 or 6th editions like me, I prefer the 6th edition rules set.  If this is your first time, I'd recommend the 7th edition since you will have tons of new and rewritten material coming at you, specifically designed for 7th edition.  Although there are some things I will take from the 7th edition and use in my 6th edition games, I can't particularly wrap my mind around a few others, like the "new chase rules."  I like the old chase rules.  Just to clarify some things about me.  I have played CoC since the 4th edition and I fell in love with it right away.  I didn't get into Rune Quest until the 6th edition and it too has radically changed my point of view on gaming as a whole especially when it comes to D100 gaming.  When it's all said and done, use what works for you.  We all belong to the same tribe.  Gamers.  Keep gaming.  Cthulhu for president!