jajagappa

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

Chaos bugs and where to find them...

Any Chaos nest - the Footprint, Snakepipe Hollow, Dorastor, ...

I had broo flies seeking out anything that was bleeding in Snakepipe Hollow (e.g. after my PC's blew a giant's head off with a thunderstone, swarms of broo flies came to feast on the carcass and lay their eggs in the body). Lots of opportunities for chaotic variations, or to inflict horrors on your PCs.

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

Am I absentmindedly missing insect humanoids in Glorantha?

Timinits. Guide p.503: "“Timinit” can be translated as “insect people,” and numerous types exist." (Some of them originally appeared in the RQ3 Glorantha Bestiary.) They live on Jrustela and in the Kumanku Islands between Jrustela and Fonrit.

3 hours ago, StephenMcG said:

What I need are the tools to plan and run the session. 

That's why my Nochet work includes a Sandbox session generator. It takes time of year and current location as inputs, where PC's may be going, then let's you roll for an event (which might be common, uncommon, or rare) and an encounter (i.e. who - which might be a significant figure, a local personality, or someone the PC's know well), plus resulting attitude and motivation (which might include following up on some rumor) of the encountered character. And options for engaging the PC's. 

As you interweave specific set scenarios and sandbox events, and take the PC's actions into account, you begin to get those layers you note. But the layers are only roughly there at the start in the form of passions for your PC's, passions for the House/clan/patron they are interacting with, and perhaps a set of goals identified by PC's, their patron, and possibly a villain/rival that you want as part of the plot line.

20 minutes ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

Seems to me that Nochet plus Ships and Shores make a natural combination for a great RQ campaign - I purchased both for that exact reason.

Definitely! One thing I tried to do in the character backgrounds in the Nochet Adventurer's Guide was to incorporate links regarding seafaring, distant lands, the colony at Dosakayo, etc. which could encourage a seafaring expedition. There are any number of opportunities to fill in scenarios based on both works.

21 minutes ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

Any way they can be marketed or bundled together on DTRPG with some minor savings or extra goodies?

I don't think bundling would be viable for either Martin or myself. Marketing is certainly feasible. 

3 hours ago, StephenMcG said:

I am clueless though at running an urban campaign, managing the social situations, laying down the mosaic of politics in a way players can negotiate, get involved and find things out.

Trying to get players to follow the intricacies of high-level city politics (and remember them from session-to-session) is a challenge. That's why I find it easier to start "local". Let the players take "ownership" of a set of figures they know and develop some backstory about. That gives you some framing to add some "politics" around the relationships they've established. Much easier to know that your Biggest Rival lives in that neighborhood, and that neighborhood belongs to the Ingilli's, so when your rival challenges you, you have to wonder whether it is personal, or if the Ingillis are up to some scheme.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

In my experience, it helps when the player characters and a bunch of NPCs have a common history in the city. Depending on player buy-in and tools offered to the players, you might start out with a bunch of friends, rivals, patrons, friendly resources, reserved or even hostile resources created by the player group. Harald Smith's "Nochet - Queen of Cities" offers some mechanics towards this turnout.

When I started my Nochet campaign, what I found I needed was: 1) a common "cause" for the characters (in Nochet, it's the House, the urban equivalent of a clan, which is effectively the character's patron), and 2) a set of known NPC's (if you're in an urban setting, you know people).

For your House/clan/family, it helps to map out some basic relationships. What neighborhood are they in? Who are their allies, rivals, and foes? (Citizens of the Lunar Empire has some nice ideas on that based on your city block and its immediate neighbors.) Setting that up gives you some immediate context, and it's really not that different than looking at the clans of Sartar, just much more concentrated. (E.g. in the Colymar, the Orlmarth ally with the Ernaldori, they hate the Greydogs of the Lismelder tribe, they are rivals of the Taraling because the Ernaldori are rivals, they are friends with and marry the Hiordings, they think the Varmandi are poor, troublesome, pains in the @$&, and of course like most Colymari they hate the Malani.)

In my Nochet books, I have a concept of a Cast of Characters (NPCs). These are about 100 "stock" characters (took the idea out of old Commedia dell'Arte characters). For each PC, you roll to determine their Best Friend, Current Mentor, Primary Contact, Love Interest, Main Rival, Worst Foe, and Biggest Pain in the @$&.  

That gives each player/PC a set of 7 people they immediately know besides the main figures in their House/clan. And with a group of PC's, there will be overlap which allows you and the players to put together some back stories about these figures, and that interlinks with the relationships your House has in the neighborhood and city. 

Once you have that, then you can draw on a lot of standard soap opera narratives. Your Best Friend is being shaken down by your Rival from the neighboring clan, and they need your help. What's up with that? Time to investigate and help out... And you can interweave these sandbox situations throughout a larger campaign arc (e.g. House Marele is now suffering from loss of wealth during the Siege and is suspect among the great Houses because they remained neutral and did not choose a side among the major alliances. They need new allies and new wealth - and send the PC's on various missions to help restore their reputation and position.) 

36 minutes ago, Joerg said:

became Kitori in the Chaosium House

The Kitori certainly predate the use of Midkemia Press' Carse work.

44 minutes ago, Joerg said:

The other source for the existence of camels in Glorantha is the Trickster story about Mother Mammal being surprised so badly that the child became the camel.

That's the only reference I recall.

2 hours ago, Joerg said:

"free roaming titanotheres" makes me wonder whether there are clans who have semi-domesticated these meat mountains?

I suspect not. They're likely considered sacred storm beasts, close to the gods.

Well, much taller and not much hump, but camels nonetheless.

3 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

hey why isn't there a camel tribe or is it one of the missing beast tribes?

They're called "High Llama" (e.g. alticamelus)! 

1 hour ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

The "fact" that the King of Sartar must marry the Feathered Horse Queen is, in effect, a mythical forgery, faked by Arkati/Ernaldan heroquesters.

But blessed by the dragonewts nonetheless! Maybe the Ducks were the "Arkati"?

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

“Queendom of Jab” is there and trails up in the hills will be perilous, fraught with danger will they not? Are the trails somewhat where the red dashed line is?

Remember that the Queendom of Jab doesn't occur until Gagix becomes Scorpion Queen and overruns that area after 1616. Belintar would have kept such largely in check (as would plenty of Storm Bull worshipers). The center of scorpionmen queendoms before then is within the confines of the Footprint - largely trapped by the high cliff walls (some 1000+ feet) and the Stone Wood. But Chaos being Chaos, they would find ways to climb up (or perhaps fly depending on the Chaos type) or follow the burrows of krarshtkids. That's how I think Gagix eventually erupted into the Jab Hills - combination of krarshtkid tunnels and limestone caverns. The Jab Hills before 1616 were dotted with isolated clans and their villages. Free-roaming sky bulls and titanotheres used to graze there, but have now moved south of the Bullflood.

As for the trail, from Bullflood it largely follows the course of the Bullflood River (vs. inland), but once in the mountains, yes, the trail goes through the vale between Stormwalk Mountain and the mountain immediately to the south (which I've named Founders' Peak - i.e. where the Storm Bull's sons, the Founders of the tribes, were born). The Low Temple (aka the Hoof Shrine) is at the western end of that vale. You can either continue on to Prax from there, or begin the ascent of Stormwalk (which as the spiral indicates is a winding trail that wraps seven times around the mountain to reach the top). One of the great wind child aeries is near the top of Founders' Peak.

7 minutes ago, Nick Brooke said:

In general, I view these things as the Tinfang Warbles and Trotter the Hobbits of Glorantha: discarded first drafts. Greg Stafford was a publisher, he could easily have shared this stuff with the world if he thought it worth doing, and he never did. But YGWV, of course.

It's kind of like an archaeological dig - there's a lot of broken pots and vases to sift through. Sometimes you find interesting nuggets, sometimes you just see how the pieces evolved over time, and then there's all the stuff that really was just thrown out.

28 minutes ago, glarkhag said:

was originally posted somewhere else?

It was one of Jeff's FB posts collected on the Well of Daliath. I don't recall seeing it before (but perhaps appeared in one of Greg's Roots of Glorantha works?). Maybe @scott-martin knows?

16 minutes ago, Ali the Helering said:

The question is a matter of in what way that utility is expressed.

I think this is often the hard question/issue to get across successfully in a modern game where we don't have active deities.

Perhaps when coming from other RPGs there is an expectation that these are simply transactional, utilitarian arrangements (in exchange for X worship, I get Y spells that are relevant to my occupation and balanced vs other deities)?

Whereas what Glorantha offers is a way-of-life in accord with the deities that help your culture (vs. you the individual) prosper.

3 hours ago, Martin said:

I wonder...maybe whether meeting Imarja comes in the area of the Heron Hegemony? She is a bird goddess and that area is ruled by the council of birds?

That was where I initially thought to place her, but then I realized the ritual path has to form a square so has to start at Ganderland. Imarja as the Creatrix thus is both the beginning and the end of the path.

5 hours ago, g33k said:

The "obvious" route -- I think -- is along the edge of the water, passing south of the Shadow Plateau & through southern Heortland, south of the Stormwalk, then turning northward & passing near Monkey Ruins.  But maybe I'm forgetting a problem with that...? Should/would they be going upriver from Nochet, and passing north of the plateau, going through Beast Valley & Sartar &c?  Or am I overlooking some other, better route that would occur to them?

South of the Shadow Plateau is largely very difficult swamp (Bottomland Marsh) and dense, overgrown woods (The Tangle). As the Guide notes: The Tangle is an area so overgrown that it is difficult for anyone to pass through. It lies between the Shadow Plateau and the bay and drifts off imperceptibly into the Bottomland Marsh.

If you're avoiding the obvious sea passage from Nochet to Karse, then your better choice is north of the Shadow Plateau. Go up the Lyksos to the New River into Beast Valley. Find guides to take you to Vorda Hill and Volsaxiland and then to Whitewall. The shorter path then is along the Sartar Royal Roads. However, if you've got Storm Bulls, take the Heortland Road south to Durengard, then the trails up the Bullflood and immediately south of Stormwalk Mountain so that you can honor Storm Bull at his Low Temple and cut through to Prax.  

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

anything published that details dwarven areas, tunnels, cave complexes, etc. and what source. Thank you Sir

I don't recall anything else published for Glorantha that would give you that.

9 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Does anyone have other detailed dwarf locations they know of?

Are you talking worldwide, or just Dragon Pass/Prax?

If the latter, then also the Dwarf Palace in Boldhome (currently closed) and Greatway in the Rockwood Mountains.

2 hours ago, Bohemond said:

When Esrola was first mentioned, she was described as one of Ernalda's daughters. But then the Heroquest rules elevated her to a third sister of Ernalda and Maran Gor, and developed a whole theology around them being triplets. Now the Earth Goddesses has made her a daughter again and seems to have reduced her importance. What's behind those changes? 

Actually, if you look at the genealogy chart in Earth Goddesses, you'll find Esrola is a daughter of Gata (and sister of Asrelia), not of Ernalda.

There are multiple ways of looking at the Earth goddesses which you have to keep in mind. All the Earth goddesses can be seen as "daughters" of Gata. Look at the passage on p.22: Gata is "the primal variously called the Three, Six, Nine, or One Hundred Twenty-Four Earths."

The Three are: Maiden, Mother, Crone. This is now seen as: Voria, Ernalda, Asrelia (or their dark counterparts). But there's a progression there. Once it was: Ernalda, Asrelia, Gata. And you are likely to find tales of Ernalda as the Crone as well. They are One and they are Three.

There's also another division of the Earth as Six Sisters (you can find this in the Esrolia book and the Prosopaedia). These are: Ernalda, Maran, Esrola, Orana, Delaeo, and Delaina. It's another, equally viable division of the Earth. 

And there's the various Grain/Land Goddesses, which are something like physical divisions of Gata. And at some point, Ernalda becomes one of those land goddesses as well ruling over Ernaldela (northwest of the Spike). And in that sense, Ernalda becomes one of the daughters of Gata (and sisters of Esrola) as well. 

These are parts of the secrets of the Earth goddesses: they are One, they are Three, they are Six, they are Many.

What is important with Ernalda is that she is the one who has become/gained the status of Earth Queen. Therefore, she is now the head of the Earth Pantheon and rules all the Grain Goddesses (generally). And in that sense, Esrola is also Ernalda's daughter - land and grain goddess for a small part of the Holy Country, or grain goddess for her special grain. 

3 minutes ago, Bohemond said:

In most cases, you have no way of knowing the identity of the people whose ceremony you're intersecting with, because they look like the god to you, and vice-versa. 

From a God-time perspective, you just need to cast them as the Rivals of Ernalda. These might be any of the Serpent-beasts - hsunchen foes, for instance - or they could even be Ernalda's sisters (e.g. Maran Gor, Esrola, etc) or other Earth goddesses who claim sovereignty (e.g. Kero Fin who marries Umath, King of Storms). Maran Gor could send dinosaurs in to stomp upon the ceremony. Gata gave birth to the amphibians and the reptiles, so they may be rivals, and you could have Cliff Toads or crocodiles as foes. Ernalda may have to find Another Way to prove her sovereignty over those.

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

Don't overlook the omnipresent rivalries between the elemental tribes.

And that's also a good point regarding others who might attack in a Pavis setting.

Ernalda is a goddess of settled agricultural communities. The nomads likely don't want such to succeed. In line with their elemental affinities: Morocanth for Darkness foes; High Llama for Water foes; Impala for Fire foes (as well as previously noted Agimori); Sable Riders for Moon foes. And any group of outlaw, renegard Praxians for Gagarth.

44 minutes ago, Bohemond said:

I thought about Oakfed or Daga, because this is happening in Fire Season when they would be strong. But do either of those have enough actual followers to produce a good fight scenario. I would imagine more spirts or even something like fires breaking out, but that's a lot harder to do an RQ style fight, especially with character who are very green and who would therefore have a lot of trouble with even just one spirit.

Don't confine yourself to "cult followers"! 

You've noted this is going to be an Ernalda ceremony - i.e. it's a ritual that brings the Gods World close to the mundane, so it opens it up to various possibilities.

For Oakfed, they notice that the torches seem to be brightening, enlarging beyond expectations. Suddenly small salamanders (fire elementals) descend from the torches and start to touch sacred objects (grain, or whatever) and those burst into flame. They are attacking ritual objects and may cause the ceremony to fail if the fires go unchecked and the elementals aren't destroyed. (Or you could come up with other alternatives to elementals - Agimori might be a choice, and they are trying to steal a ritual object that will bring their fertility back, but at a consequence to the village...)

For Daga, you could use the Agimori noted above, but the consequence of their action is that it frees Daga from his iron box, and then additional quests are needed (probably allying Zola Fel cultists) to defeat him. Or maybe some sort of dry, clay golems rise up from the bare earth and they begin to touch everything nearby - their touch withers anything living turning it to dust. (Whether such an attack also affects people is a question, but perhaps if they do enough damage to a hit location by bringing it to 0, it does.)

3 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

If most people speak at least 30% I am guessing 15% would have you be able to read/write basic things

Speaking does not correlate to any level of read/write skill. 

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

Where are these "new knights" from? Who are they, who leads them? King Rickard?

I think some of this is where I got the notion that the Aeolians were suppressing the pagan Oranthi and stealing their idols when they discovered them.

Obviously this is from the very, very early RQ days when there was still a lot of cross-over. But, yes, these would be Rikard's western allies (and not the local Aeolians).