Challenges of Using Runequest Glorantha Adventures in a Nehwon Setting

[Questbird]

[I posted this years ago on another site, which I recently noticed had disappeared into the vortex. I recovered it from the Wayback Machine and thought I might as well post it here. It's not exactly a Glorantha post, nor exactly RQ3 but it concerns adapting the River of Cradles/Zola Fel setting.]

(Originally published July 24, 2011)

In the latest of my Nehwon Campaigns, I used an adventure campaign called ‘Troubled Waters’ from the Runequest ‘River of Cradles’ supplement. In this post, I’ll talk about how I adapted this adventure for Nehwon.

Glorantha

Glorantha is the main game world setting for the game Runequest. I am no expert on it but it is quite a different place from Nehwon. Magic is commonplace; most people know a few spells. The influence of the gods is powerful, and forces from mythology have shaped (and continue to shape) the world. Everyone believes. As in Nehwon there are many gods and none is all-powerful; each commands a relatively limited sphere. Glorantha has all sorts of non-humans and a powerful, Chaos-worshipping empire of humans, which comes into conflict with barbarian cultures at its fringes. So far so un-Nehwonian.

The River of Cradles

This is a campaign setting from the times when RPG supplements were made with real love, which is one reason I wanted to use it. The Runequest game system is not so different from the Elric! rules I use in Nehwon, so no problems there. The River is in a fertile valley between arid grasslands and wasteland. There are many detailed human and non-human cultures in the area, including river folk, farmers, various barbarian tribes, newtlings (small lizard-like bipeds), and city folk and garrisons of the conquering Empire army at the top of the river. The maps are gorgeous and the detail is great. The campaign itself is interesting, if a bit linear (you travel up the river, so it couldn’t really be otherwise). I played it over ten sessions with two players who ran an exiled Quarmallian and an outcast from Klesh.

Where in Nehwon?

Because I knew this setting would be quite different from the norm, I wanted to place it carefully. I put it in the south of the Lankhmar Continent, draining from the southern Mountains of Hunger to the Sea of Stars. To the east are the Jungles of Klesh and to the west are the Quarmall Barrens. Leiber doesn’t really describe this area (perfect!). Fafhrd and the Mouser passed it to the south in Trapped in the Sea of Stars.

Other questions to resolve

What about all this magic and gods? The campaign did assume a lot more magic in the hands of characters and opponents, and more ‘godly’ powers. I toned both down but left the essentials. For example, a river god plays an important role in the adventure. I allowed it as a local effect (local to the river) and justified the extra magic because the area was closer to Godsland. It helped that the characters were both sorcerers of different traditions(1) and from areas considered quite outlandish for a mainstream Nehwon campaign. I took a similar attitude to the various intelligent non-humans around. Leiber after all had mermaids, Ice Gnomes, and invisible princesses.

How about the ‘evil empire’? How come Fafrhd and the Mouser never heard of it? No problem. It’s a recent development, and not really a huge empire, founded by a band of fanatical ex-slaves of Quarmall, confined mostly to the Mountains of Hunger between the Jungle of Klesh and the Great Southern Swamp. That works for my geography. Think of the Incas, who controlled a huge narrow empire from Ecuador to northern Chile in the late 15th century. Only not so huge. Something like that anyway. In any case, though the Empire’s military presence was visible in the campaign, it was not a major factor.

How did it work out?

Pretty well. The setting is a long way from Lankhmar, though even a typical Lankhmart rogue could have been used there. The only real changes I made while running it was the magic reduction and some setting adjustment as described above. Was it still Nehwonian? Yes, I think so. My campaign is a hodgepodge in any case, but what I love about Nehwon is that it is a land made for adventure and strange happenings. It is consistent in the broad view but sketchy on the specifics. This little corner fits nicely into my campaign. My players also gave it an interesting subplot of faith vs. skepticism, which Leiber might have appreciated.

Having said that, I don’t think all Gloranthan RPG settings would transplant so well. Some things just don’t translate that well to a Nehwonian setting.

1) In my campaign, Quarmallian sorcery is a combination of sneaky mind control powers and dark wizardry. Kleshite sorcery is more nature-focused.

[Darius West]

I am a fan of Fritz Lieber's Nehwon and Greg Stafford's Glorantha, and I don't think they are a good fit with each other at all.

Nehwon magic is always physically and mentally warping, and intrinsically "bad".  Nehwon gods, may exist, but they aren't much like Gloranthan gods imo.

Now if you want to run stories of roguery and derring do then either is fine in its own way, and the stories can serve as inspirations for scenarios in the other world, but they don't "nest" nicely with each other, again imo.

If you want players from one environment to wind up in the other, i.e. "isekai", then just create a fantastic context for portaling them in, and portaling them out again imo. 

If you wanted to get humorous, you could have it that Ningauble of the Seven Eyes actually keeps the lozenge of Glorantha (a lozenge with an upper and a lower dome, somewhat the worse for wear, with domes above and below) surrounded in a void in a jar labelled "Dragon Egg" on a shelf in his dwelling.  He sends people there to retrieve things or when he is annoyed with them.

Edited August 30, 2022 by Darius West

[smiorgan]

I've gamemastered quite a bit of Lankhmar - pure and pastiche - mostly with AD&D and a little bit with MRQ ( 😱). While I think Lankhmar is a very good fit for "generic" RQ  or BRP, I do not see it meshing with Gloranthan magic and religion at all. So, I might imagine adapting a few tombs, crypts from various Gloranthan adventures and possibly Raus' house from Pavis for an heist, but that's about it.

Mongoose RQ material for Lankhmar, while not outstanding,  is decent enough to be usable, especially the RQII version. If I were to run a Lankhmar game now that's what I would most probably use, rather than RQG. And for the adventures I'd rather convert old AD&D modules set in Lankhmar, or the Savage Worlds scenarios (probably not DCC RPG Lankhmar, whose "tone" and interpretation of the setting irritates me mightily).

Gloranthan material is about the last thing I would consider adapting.      

[Questbird]

On 8/30/2022 at 1:43 AM, smiorgan said:

I've gamemastered quite a bit of Lankhmar - pure and pastiche - mostly with AD&D and a little bit with MRQ ( 😱). While I think Lankhmar is a very good fit for "generic" RQ  or BRP, I do not see it meshing with Gloranthan magic and religion at all. So, I might imagine adapting a few tombs, crypts from various Gloranthan adventures and possibly Raus' house from Pavis for an heist, but that's about it.

Mongoose RQ material for Lankhmar, while not outstanding,  is decent enough to be usable, especially the RQII version. If I were to run a Lankhmar game now that's what I would most probably use, rather than RQG. And for the adventures I'd rather convert old AD&D modules set in Lankhmar, or the Savage Worlds scenarios (probably not DCC RPG Lankhmar, whose "tone" and interpretation of the setting irritates me mightily).

Gloranthan material is about the last thing I would consider adapting.      

 

 

Well, I happened to have that 'River of Cradles' supplement and I liked it, and I didn't want to start a Gloranthan campaign. So I adapted it, and in this case it was fine. The dry wasteland ('Vulture Country') to the east of the Zola Fel valley fit quite well for me with the Quarmall Barrens in the SE Lankhmar continent.

I also have Dorastor, but I wouldn't touch that one with a ten foot pole for Nehwon.

As for gods and magic, one character from the Zebra riding tribe, an advocate of Storm Bull eventually made it back to Lankhmar. He even found a struggling priest of Storm Bull in the Street of the Gods there, whom he helped to advance up the street. One more god in the Street of the Gods makes little difference. I just ruled that their powers were greater in the south of Nehwon, nearer to Godsland.

 

Quote

 

The gods in Lankhmar (that is, the gods and candidates for divinity who dwell or camp, it may be said, in the Imperishable City, not the gods of Lankhmar — a very different and most secret and dire matter)…the gods in Lankhmar sometimes seem as if they must be as numberless as the grains of sand in the Great Eastern Desert.

— Lean Times in Lankhmar

 

 

 

Edited September 2, 2022 by Questbird