BRP Gold Book or MRQII?

[Philotomy]

I'm planning a pseudo-historical/fantasy heroic Celtic campaign. I have the BRP gold book, but I heard some good things about MRQII, and am seriously considering that, too, although I haven't actually seen or read it, yet.

What are some pros and cons of using one or the other? How easily would it be to mix them? Anything to watch out for?

For magic, my initial idea is to have a setup like this:

Sidhe/Foreign Wizards: Use basic magic.

Druids: Use sorcery, with certain spells associated with certain gods.

Seers: Use psychic abilities associated with divination

Bards: Use psychic abilities associated with influence

Does that seem like a good approach? I realize there are a lot of options for magic. I haven't really looked into anything other than what is in the gold book. Should I? What about the magic system(s) in MRQII?

[lawrence.whitaker]

Either will work well for such a campaign. Its perhaps a question of the effort you want to put into making the system work for the setting.

BRP is a generic toolkit with hundreds of options for customising to a level of detail you want to achieve. You'll need to decide which components to include/exclude and tinker with to get the right feel.

MRQII is specifically designed for gritty fantasy and will certainly fit a fanatsy/pseudo-historical celtic game very well. Again though, you'll want to make some choices regarding magic. MRQII has four magic systems: Common, which is local-effect charms and spells; Divine, which is chanelling a god's power; Sorcery, which is manipulating the nature of the universe; and Spirit, which is bargaining with and controlling all sorts of spirits. Of these, Divine and Spirit Magic are the only one that would directly fit into a Celtic campaign with minimal effort - although you may also want to tinker with Divine Magic spells to reflect the heroics of figures like Nuada Silverarm. Sorcery wouldn't fit if you're striving for a degree of accuracy or veracity. Common Magic may work, but, again, might need some limitations. However, all the magic systems are independent so picking and choosing which to use is very easy: you can exclude Common Magic, for instance, without any impact on the other magical traditions.

MRQII combat simulates both gritty and heroic Celtic combats very well. If you then include Heroic Abilities (like dodging arrows, leaping shield walls and the like) then you have the right materials for simulating things like the Cattle Raid of Cooley.

There's arguably less work to do with MRQII, but both RQ and BRP are very similar in many respects and you could easily blend the two together to make your own, unique system that does precisely what you want it to support. Its all a matter of the time you have available to develop the system and what components you want and need to include.

Hope this helps!

[Mugen]

I'm planning a pseudo-historical/fantasy heroic Celtic campaign. I have the BRP gold book, but I heard some good things about MRQII, and am seriously considering that, too, although I haven't actually seen or read it, yet.

What are some pros and cons of using one or the other? How easily would it be to mix them? Anything to watch out for?

For magic, my initial idea is to have a setup like this:

Sidhe/Foreign Wizards: Use basic magic.

Druids: Use sorcery, with certain spells associated with certain gods.

Seers: Use psychic abilities associated with divination

Bards: Use psychic abilities associated with influence

Does that seem like a good approach? I realize there are a lot of options for magic. I haven't really looked into anything other than what is in the gold book. Should I? What about the magic system(s) in MRQII?

In MRQII, you will find 4 magic systems :

-Common Magic : A series of simple spells dealing mostly with combat and bonuses to skills. Very similar to "Gold Book"'s Sorcery, actually, except it requires a "Common Magic" skill to be performed.

-Sorcery : A very powerful approach of magic. You learn spells from Grimoires and have the possibility to change their parameters at will. This is actually an evolution of "Gold Book"'s Magic.

-Divine Magic : In this You dedicate a portion of your POW to a deity in exchange of very powerful powers.

-Shamanism : Where you deal with spirits and elemental entities, go out of your body to find them and bind them to fetishes.

According to your definitions :

-Divine Magic might be a better fit for Druids than BRP Sorcery;

-Sidhes and Foreigners might be interested by Common Magic or Sorcery, but this is subject to discussion.

Note that MRQ II do not use Resistance Table at all so you will have to find replacements. For instance, opposed tests between casting skill and Evade will have to be changed into POW vs DEX tests.

[frogspawner]

Pro-BRP: You have the book already, and your ideas for adapting it's magic to that setting sound just fine.

Pro-MRQ2: Heroic abilities sound suitable, and having the author answer questions within 45 mins of your posting can't hurt, either!

[Mugen]

Pro-MRQ2: Heroic abilities sound suitable, and having the author answer questions within 45 mins of your posting can't hurt, either!

Plus, his supernatural senses allows him to know a question has been asked on ANY forum.

[Daxos232]

Philotomy, I think an important factor to consider would be your own previous experience. How long have you been playing tabletop RPGs? And how long have you played BRP, and how familiar are you with it?

I ask this because I myself just got into tabletop RPGs a year ago and started with BRP. It was very difficult for me, and I switched to MRQ2, which is better for beginners. Its already set to go as is. With BRP you will have to put some things together and you have many choices to tweak your game with.

Another factor is time, when is your group getting together to play? If its very soon you may not have the time to make your setting with BRP. But if you do, you will find BRP is a very customizable and rewarding system. And no one says you can't convert to BRP later if you use MRQ2 first.

[RosenMcStern]

Having just written or published a wagonload of pseudo-historical fantasy supplements for both systems, I can say that: er, essentially what Loz said. Both sytems work very fine for the job, MRQ requires less effort as it is more specialized: more rules for melee combat, more detailed rules for Pact/Allegiance, etc. If you are already done creating magic for your races with BRP, then go with the Golden Book. If you are starting from scratch, MRQ is the quicker route to Fantasy. Both will give you a lot of fun.

[Philotomy]

Thank you for your responses.

I've gone ahead and ordered MRQII. The heroic abilities and other aspects of the system sound attractive and worthy of a closer look. Interesting that MRQII does not use the Resistance Table. All other BRP-derived games that I'm familiar with have included it.

Daxos, you asked about my previous RPG experience, and how long I have to develop the campaign before the game begins. I've been playing RPGs since the late 70s. I have a lot of experience running Call of Cthulhu (including recently). I also ran (1e) Stormbringer, back in the 80s, but it's been a long time. While I played Runequest a couple of times (Chasoium's RQ2), I never owned or ran it. Anyway, I'm not unfamiliar with BRP, but running Call of Cthulhu isn't quite the same thing as running a more heroic and combat-oriented BRP variant. I'm trying to bring myself up to speed, basically.

I like to tinker with rules to fit them to a setting, in any case, so it's not that I feel overwhelmed or out of my depth; I'm mainly looking for "landmarks" that give me an idea of what to expect and which direction I might go. For example, knowing that MRQII is already "tweaked" for gritty fantasy and has a lot of that customization built-in is very helpful knowledge. Even if I don't decide to use MRQII, I can still reference it as a guideline. I'm also intrigued by the fact that it has more detailed rules for Allegiances, since I've been thinking about a Liberty vs. Domination dichotomy (similar, but not quite the same thing as Chaos vs. Law).

As far as urgency goes, I have the luxury of time. I'm running an ongoing original D&D campaign, so my group is already gaming and there's no pressure. No one is waiting on me.

RosenMcStern, which pseudo-historical fantasy supplements are you involved with? Those kinds of things are right up my alley, so I'll probably end up picking them up at some point, even if they're not directly applicable to what I'm currently doing. I've been wondering about the Rome supplement. For example, I imagine that it covers Gauls, and grabbing some of that might be a no-brainer.

Thanks, again, for the advice!

Edited October 28, 2010 by Philotomy

[Daxos232]

Daxos, you asked about my previous RPG experience, and how long I have to develop the campaign before the game begins. I've been playing RPGs since the late 70s.

As far as urgency goes, I have the luxury of time. I'm running an ongoing original D&D campaign, so my group is already gaming and there's no pressure. No one is waiting on me.

Lol, with 30 years of experience, and plenty of time, BRP should be no problem.

I'm also intrigued by the fact that it has more detailed rules for Allegiances, since I've been thinking about a Liberty vs. Domination dichotomy (similar, but not quite the same thing as Chaos vs. Law).

I think that sounds pretty good, and I hope it turns out well. It'd be nice to see something new compared to the old, "Good vs. Evil" and, "Law vs. Chaos" philosophies.

[Mugen]

Interesting that MRQII does not use the Resistance Table. All other BRP-derived games that I'm familiar with have included it.

This is due to the fact MRQII uses a skill opposition rule for all kind of opposition.

As a consequence, it does not use characteristic rolls either. You will test "Brawn" skill instead of STRx5, Evade instead of DEXx5 and so on...

[Philotomy]

I'm reading through my newly acquired copy of MRQII. Haven't got to magic, yet, but I like the combat system. Very nice.

[Taxboy]

I'm reading through my newly acquired copy of MRQII. Haven't got to magic, yet, but I like the combat system. Very nice.

so much better than D&D ah, the combat is realistic and the magic is very cool. I dislike mcdonalds rps like d&d with a passion. Hero is a good system too but magic is way too complicated