Two-Weapon Combo?

[Mankcam]

I haven't found any rules in the BRP BGB for a two-weapon combo manuver - have I missed it at all? If so, how have others approached this?

My first thought is that it is a Stance or Technique, similar to how the Techniques are presented in 'Dragon Lines', that being essientially providing a bonus or allowing you to do something otherwise not available to those who do not know the technique.

I would probably incorperate it into a Fighting Style, just like Martial Arts as presented in 'Dragon Lines', except for my fantasy setting - perhaps like 'Florentine Style' for a medival europe setting. I tend to roleplay in Glorantha, so I'ld look at incorperating it into various combat-orientated cults instead.

Having said that, I'm not sure what the mechanics for it would be. Perhaps something along the lines that you can have two attack actions on the same strike rank (I'm using strike rank options obiviously), perhaps with the second weapon being at -30% (-20% off-hand penalty, -10% mult-action penalty). Perhaps if a character is ambidexturous then the off-hand penalty wouldn't apply and it would be just the -10% multi-action penalty. I think the second strike would have to occur on the same strike rank otherwise it would complicate matters, and I guess that's the whole point of it in terms of combat mechanics - an additional attack before another strike rank action (otherwise mechanically it's not much difference between any other additional attack, which really isn't a 'combo' effect).

Not sure if I'm explaining my thoughts clearly, but I just thought I'ld throw this one out to the forums for advice, as one of our players is wanting to fight with two blades, and I want to lock something in pretty soon

Any advice would be appreciated...

[heathd666]

although this thread is mostly about shield and weapon i believe in one of the pages it talks about 2 weapons

http://basicroleplaying.com/showthre...ields-in-melee

[Mankcam]

Thank you for directing me to that link, but for some reason I couldn't get it to open, so I'm back at square one...

[heathd666]

http://basicroleplaying.com/showthread.php/2344-Shields-in-melee

try this one

the link worked for me but that isnt saying much sorry if it still wont work for you

its currently on the second page about half way down there are alot of talk about 2 weapons and shields and a weapon i havnt ran into the problem yet but i am sure i will and will have to figure out my fix for it no rpg is perfect i guess thats why they make house rules

Edited August 17, 2011 by heathd666

[Mankcam]

In regards to my query with Dual-Weapon Combo, I have gone for a simple approach, that is to use the pre-existing Martial Arts rules in the BRP BGB.

Basically if a dual wielding swordsman succeeds in his Sword Attack and also rolls under his Martial Arts: Florentine Style or Martial Arts: Kenjitsu, etc etc then he has an additional damage roll (using the second weapon's damage dice). I'll also allow other options, say for example, the swordsman may want to receive an additional 'free parry' within that melee round (no 2nd action modifier) for example.

It looks like it will work, it covers the territory I was after and it fits in with a pre-existing rule, I'm not really bolting any new mechanic into the system.

Sounds reasonable to anyone?

[Chorpa]

This is otherwise covered by the spot rules on Two Weapons on p.233 in the BGB!

[Mankcam]

Kind of. I wasn't really happy with those rules.

It works okay for dual weapon fighting for general fighters (2nd weapon is 5 DEX ranks after first attack, and 2nd attack made at Difficult%). But what if someone is trained in dual-wielding, they should be able to attack much better this.

I see the rules indicate that if someone is trained not to have an off-hand penalty, then the Difficult Penalty is negated, but how does you learn it in the first place? Most abilities are expressed as a percentage, but this indicates that a 'Dual Wield Combo' is more like an Effect - this would be perfectly okay if BRP had additional Advantage/Disadvantage traits like GURPS, WoD Merits/Flaws, Savage Worlds Edges/Hindrances, D&D Feats etc.

But as there isn't any way to calculate it as an 'Advantage', then I thought the nearest way to calculate it would be to express it as a percentile for training/experience purposes, which got me thinking it was more of a Fighting Style rather than an individual technique, which led me back to the Martial Arts rules. This way the character's chance to succeed in dual-wielding increases with the more training they have with that Fighting Style.

That was my reasoning, I feel I'm on the right track, but feedback is appreciated.

Edited August 28, 2011 by Mankcam

[PhilHibbs]

I've had some great success in RQ3 with two swords against creatures with natural weapons, as a successful parry vs an unsuccessful attack deals damage to the attacking weapon. Scorpion men particularly are good for this tactic as you can cut their tail off and even up the number of attacks. Same for broo with their head butt attack.

[Chorpa]

Kind of. I wasn't really happy with those rules.

It works okay for dual weapon fighting for general fighters (2nd weapon is 5 DEX ranks after first attack, and 2nd attack made at Difficult%). But what if someone is trained in dual-wielding, they should be able to attack much better this.

I see the rules indicate that if someone is trained not to have an off-hand penalty, then the Difficult Penalty is negated, but how does you learn it in the first place? Most abilities are expressed as a percentage, but this indicates that a 'Dual Wield Combo' is more like an Effect - this would be perfectly okay if BRP had additional Advantage/Disadvantage traits like GURPS, WoD Merits/Flaws, Savage Worlds Edges/Hindrances, D&D Feats etc.

But as there isn't any way to calculate it as an 'Advantage', then I thought the nearest way to calculate it would be to express it as a percentile for training/experience purposes, which got me thinking it was more of a Fighting Style rather than an individual technique, which led me back to the Martial Arts rules. This way the character's chance to succeed in dual-wielding increases with the more training they have with that Fighting Style.

That was my reasoning, I feel I'm on the right track, but feedback is appreciated.

So if I understand it correctly you are thinking of having a Dual Weapon Fighting style, and just like Martial Arts it's nothing you roll extra for but instead you just gets the extra damage from the other attack. I am not sure I like it that way since it would be way more powerful than a regular Martial Arts attack if you have damage bonus and such, unless you ignore such stuff for the extra attack in that case it's the same as Martial Arts and I don't see any problems since it's just a cosmetic change.

Otherwise if you don't mind an extra roll you could say that if you roll under the Technique on you first attack you get to make a second attack with your offhand weapon. That way you would still have the normal weapon skills and the third skill for the technique. The extra skill point cost I think would balance the out the extra attack that occurs sometime and the technique would still negate the offhand penalty. And the extra attack roll would sort of balance out the fact you get damage bonuses on the second attack since you can still miss it.

[Mankcam]

Well I know I'm in the right ballpark using the Martial Arts rules, but I'm still not entirely sure of the final dynamic. I guess the simpliest approach is to make a roll under both your attack and martial arts trait which grants you an additional damage roll for 2nd weapon (no dmg bonus). This would be closest to the martial arts rules, just cosmetics as you say.

However, I do like your idea of rolling under both Attack and 'Technique: Dual-wielding' which grants an additional attack (or parry) roll upon that strike rank at a reduced or no offhand penalty, and no second action penalty. This probably feels more like a dual-wielding rule to me. I guess Dual-Wielding Combat would be a Knowledge skill, although it sounds awfully like a Fighting Style, which is what Martial Arts aims to cover.

I do like the fact that my previous suggestion is more in keeping with the Martial Arts rules as written, but your rule makes good sense... decisions decisions...

Thanks for your suggestions, it's giving me something to think about

Edited August 29, 2011 by Mankcam