TrippyHippy

If somebody turned up to a session with a character who had the stats: 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 18, 17 ...I would think that was suspicious at all. 🙂

I do D3+15 for all my stats.

Just to clarify, the game published by Margaret Weis Productions was Marvel Heroic Roleplay (Marvel Super Heroes was published way earlier by TSR in the 1980s) and the initiative system involved no rolling for Initiative at all - the ‘Watcher’ chooses who goes first or spends points from a ‘Doom Pool’ to get the NPCs to act first. Then the player who has acted chooses who acts next and so on. It works because the rolls are all contested anyway.

Gawd no. No more stats! Size is one more than most other games have. (Build was a mistake too!)

A ‘sickly’ person wouldn’t be physically Strong. I don’t really think we need a whole thread about this, but I’m happy to move on from the conversation.

I think that is the only major point I differ on. People who are overweight are generally described as such because it is unhealthy. Sure, the BMI Index is a crude measure and breaks down when it comes to high performing athletes who have a denser muscle than others, but you can still measure aspects of their constitution through blood testing and other techniques. If somebody is overweight though, then it is a compromise on their Health, ie Constitution. So, the example of having a character with low Strength, high Size and high Constitution could not be an overweight individual - to my mind at least. That is why I would see them as tall and lithe. Tall and Lithe can still have mechanical advantages through leverage, however. Having somebody who has higher Strength than Size could be because they are ripped, as you say, but if their Constitution is low then it either implies they have a very low immunity or some sort of genetic ailment which is a possibility, but also just because they happen to be short and stocky (and maybe easier to hide, for example).

Gotcha. For me, it depends a bit on genre, but I like to have simple Initiative systems in practice. I don’t really like the traditional Initiative+diceroll methods for the most part as they involve GM book keeping (writing down the order and possibly re-generating each round). In D&D this system is really baked in as there is too much of an advantage for some character abilities (like back stabbing or some spells) if the Initiative order is predictable. However, it matters less in BRP where there isn’t usually such a great advantage about who goes first. I Random card order - like that used in games like Savage Worlds or Alien - are usually a quick way of maintaining uncertainty with a bit of gameplay tension. These systems often don’t have an Initiative modifier, so gameplay that depend on speedy reaction times for their effectiveness aren’t always represented well. Fixed Initiative orders - like in order of Dex as is the default in BRP - are a really straightforward mechanicism. I actually include GURPS calculated scores in the same way - they are just a little more granulated to avoid having same scores. This highlights the basic issue when too many characters have the same Initiative score and there is no way of differentiating. I have resolved this by having players roll off before the game and then just get everybody to sit around the table in Initiative Order before. Of course, some find this a little boring, but in context, it works. Nominated turns is a great system if used in games where the mechanics are set up already with contested rolls. In Pendragon, for example, the Skill roll essentially integrates initiative because whoever wins the contest gets to apply damage, while the loser soaks it up. As combats are almost always 1-1 in Pendragon the actual initiative order becomes irrelevant. Recent systems like Marvel Heroic Roleplaying and others have also realised this, and just have players nominate who goes next (including a turn for GM controlled characters) after they have finished their turn in the spotlight. It actually encourages players to think about the narrative and team work. We have also used some variations around the table, like in D&D where whoever gets the highest Initiative score (after rolling) then gets to nominate the direction Initiative travels around the table. Clockwise or anticlockwise around the table, noting that the GM controlled characters will all act when it moves through them. Again, very simple in practice - and no book keeping. So that is me!

Oh, so like strike ranks or Feng Shui’s tick system?

It is about frame and leverage also, and is also significant when using Size to determine situations where somebody is claiming through a hole, etc. The thing is that the BRP system is based on the notion of trying to get a physical representation of reality. That is why they have Size in the first place, when other games don’t bother. It is a system built on quibble. Of course, you could just ditch the Size score entirely as other BRP spinoff game systems have done. In game terms, you are right - what Size does is act as a buffer score of sorts when determining HP and Damage bonus. I just take note that the height component is actually stated as relevant in the score. Well, that is a very broad stroke generalisation of mass to volume, while most professional athletes don’t use BMI as a useful reflection of their own physical health as their muscle mass density is usually far greater than the BMI scale allows. The same is true in more extremes when considering the span of all life on Earth. The main point is that Size has a contextual relationship with both Strength and Constitution. You read all three to get a sense of how a character is built. As I say, if you get a high Strength to low Size ratio then it tends to denote short and stocky to me. Like a Dwarf. However, short limbs also mean lack of leverage which can mean less applied force (DB) and a smaller frame (less HP unless Constitution is very high by contrast). A Size that outstrips Strength but maintaining a high Constitution would imply, to me, tall and lithe with a increased capacity for leverage (DB) and a bigger frame (more HP).

To be clear, are ‘impulse systems’ those that essentially forgo initiative order determination and simply have players nominating who goes next after their turn in whatever order suits the narrative and generally uses contested rolls to determine all outcomes? ‘Cos, I’m wondering if Pendragon basically did that years ago?

Not wanting to get into an old argument about it but Call of Cthulhu 7E is not a streamlined version of BRP. It adds rules to the base - it doesn’t simplify them.

This is all a point of opinion, not fact. In my view, BRP is a robust system with historical significance and there are plenty of options within the game presented to streamline. This is a good revision, that makes the system more internally consistent and has a wide application (for my purposes at least). You could argue that polyhedral dice are “old fashioned” but it doesn’t mean they don’t work as intended.

Mass doesn’t denote volume however, which is really what Size is about. Mass is literally a measure of inertia - how hard it is for something to be moved. It is related to density in most materials - so it is quite possible to have a high mass without occupying much space. In the case of a person with high muscle mass, a good indication of Strength, they may be packing a lot of poundage into a relatively small frame. Height isn’t a perfect indication of Size either, but my reading of somebody with a high Size but low Strength is that they are either quite overweight and unfit or tall and uncoordinated. If they have a low Size and high Strength, then that indicates to me that they are short and stocky.

To be sure, I’m not sure there was much promotion, if at all for this new edition of the BRP rulebook. It just happened, from my perspective, out of the blue. However, was there any notion that it was going to have rules like CoC7E/RoL? Did it actually promote itself as doing this? I recognise there was a clamour from some CoC7E/RoL fans to integrate them into a new edition, but that is not the same thing. For me, the new BRP book serves as a useful resource - related to, but not the same as Runequest, Call of Cthulhu, King Arthur Pendragon, Rivers of London and the rest. It is a good foundational text for a proposed open system. If I want specific rules found in other games, I’d buy the other games. Complaining that the BRP book isn’t adopting rules from RoL is like complaining that it doesn’t adopt D20 rolls from Pendragon. I don’t really get why people are criticising it on this level. However, what Chaosium could best do to support these new rules is release more old BRP titles on POD or just revamp them - Superworld especially.

Well, there is a horribly negative and long winded review on dtrpg now that complains how the new BRP book isn’t a real new edition, is too old fashioned and isn’t like Rivers of London. So, that’s nice.

There is some concession towards highest roll wins in a contested roll in this new BRP edition, but the 1/20th roll for Criticals is too ingrained long term to have matching dice I think.

But that is the point. The rules (or at least the optional rules) within the book cover this. The points buy system is balanced to ensure it doesn’t break down at super levels.

I think you have to take into account that these points buy rules also cater for superhero levels.

Actually what might be more interesting, for high Dex scores at least, is the rule from Superworld that has Initiative determined by DEX score as usual, but in intervals of 10. So, the highest initiative goes first and then subtracts 10 from their score. If there is nobody higher they go again and subtract 10 again, with multiple actions until somebody actually challenges their score. Strike ranks are quite specific to Runequest’s feel, I think.

The new revision of the BRP core rules have been going down pretty well, I think, and I for one like the manner in which the game system has been refined without altering the base beyond recognition. I do know that some people were hoping to integrate some ideas from new iterations of BRP, however, and I think one of the strengths of BRP lies in its flexibility as a system to integrate different ideas well. So I propose creating a thread where people can suggest new BRP systems and modifications that other people can take or leave as they wish. Here are a few of mine (taken from various sources): Calculations of Power Points: Why not calculate Power Points based on POW+CHA/2 in a levying manner similar to calculating Hit Points with SIZ+CON/2? Charisma can be under-utilised as a stat and now that they have shifted it back from being APP again, one can consider that the term ‘Charisma' often can refer to an innate or divine power anyway. Some adjustment might have to be made to the value of Charisma if using the Points build method, however. Uses of Power Points: For people bemoaning some of the missing ideas from Call of Cthulhu 7E, why not have an option to utilise Power Points to augment rolls by a factor of +/-5% for every PP spent? Or have PPs being spent on re-rolls or bonus dice or flip-flopping? Not every character is a spell caster or has super powers, but this rule allows them to make some utility from their Power scores. Divorce Sanity from POW - Sanity can go up or down and is an optional rule in any case, but for those feeling that POW is an overly influential Characteristic, why not simply have Sanity determined by an independent 3D6x5% roll? It does address the issue of having powerful-but-insane sorcerers by divorcing the notion of magical power being linked to rationality and mental health. Make both HP and PP percentile scores by multiplying both scores by 5. The values for using various Powers would also have to increase by a multiple of 5, but you could use the percentile score for a dynamic Luck total in a similar manner to CoC7E. The values for Damage would also need to be altered. However, you could simply have damage calculated by adding the two D10 scores together from the percentile attack score and then add/subtract for different aspects of the attack (like +5% for sharp/heavy/big respectively). The Damage modifier could also be adjusted (+5 instead of +D4; +10 instead of +d6 etc). For firearms and lethal damage you could simply take the straight percentile score rolled for the attack and apply it directly to the HP tally (as long as it is a successful attack). Flip-flops for advantaged/disadvantaged checks, blackjack reading of dice and matching dice for special successes. This is an old chestnut, but it makes the system more intuitive. Matching dice on a successful roll could give a bonus (like double damage) or allow a character to make a special move or stunt. Matching dice on a failed roll means a complication of some sort, incrementally getting worse the higher you roll. You get the best possible result if you can match your skill score exactly on a roll and the worse possible roll on a 00.

That’s a big ‘if’, but to me there is a distinction to be made between multiple editions of the same game and different games with related systems.

Um. That is three! I think that one thing Call of Cthulhu did, which Runequest didn’t quite do, is establish a new genre (horror) for gaming in. Runequest suggested a new way of running fantasy, but it was always going up against a behemoth in D&D. Call of Cthulhu, however, was completely different genre direction for gaming - hence it is complimentary in the minds of many D&D fans. To me, that is the mindset of people who talk about the *other* game. Note that Monte Cook was a D&D designer at the time he wrote that essay and in fact had a bit of an angle having been a co-writer of the D20 version of Call of Cthulhu released about then too. In my personal view, about 95% of my gaming experience could be handled by just three games: D&D, Traveller and Call of Cthulhu......although I still have time for games like Runequest, Pendragon, Paranoia, Warhammer, Cyberpunk, Vampire, etc. The only blank fill, for me, is in the Superheroes genre where I should like Champions but it is just too crunchy for me.

Also, will the Gaslight books be produced in some sort of enhanced format - leatherette covers, slipcases, etc?

Is there also meant to be a Gaslight Campaign coming soon too?

It may need to be double checked, but it appears that Mythic Polynesia has been withdrawn from drivethrurpg again. Hopefully, this means progress is being made and we can all move on. I’d still appreciate an official statement to address concerns though.