Rapid Fire Talent + Dual-Wielding handguns

[Grimmshade]

In Pulp Cthulhu, does the Rapid Fire Talent apply to the Dual-Wielding rules for handguns?

[redfive]

I was wondering the same thing, as I was intending on using Dual Wielding and I have a player who took Rapid Fire. I think I'm ruling that it does. But I'm trying to figure out how target switching with multiple handgun shots actually works. Right now my thought is:

 

1) The talent only applies to the main hand gun, second gun shots will still take a penalty die. So up to three shots without penalty die, and then up to 3 more with (I still have some confusion around number of targets...)

2) They can fire at a single target with both, and don't take a penalty die an any of the shots at a single target

3) Same as (2) but they can choose two targets, but take a penalty die on the second target (they are essentially focusing on shooting at one target)

4) They can fire at two targets (one with each gun) and don't take a penalty die 

5) They can fire at any number of targets, with no penalty die

 

Honestly it's not totally clear to me how the handgun multiple fire is supposed to work for if they can choose multiple targets or not. At the moment I think I'm leaning towards (1) or (2).

[soltakss]

On 1/16/2021 at 5:08 AM, Grimmshade said:

In Pulp Cthulhu, does the Rapid Fire Talent apply to the Dual-Wielding rules for handguns?

Why not?

As a Keeper what do you want to achieve? Firing two handguns very quickly? 

I am sure that people will tell us why revolvers, for example, wouldn't be suitable and that automatic handguns would jam and whatever.

But, if it fits what you want to do then go for it.

As an Investigator, explain what you want to do and see if the keeper accepts it.

[Numtini]

I've seen this come up several times on different boards and barring an intervention via an official ruling, the general consensus has been to adjust it based on the kind of game you want to run. 

[Grimmshade]

1 minute ago, Numtini said:

I've seen this come up several times on different boards and barring an intervention via an official ruling, the general consensus has been to adjust it based on the kind of game you want to run. 

Without an official ruling, I'd probably allow it as it simulates characters like The Shadow and The Spider well. I do worry a little that it overpowers the Talent.

[redfive]

Maybe a related rule question, if someone doesn't have the talent and fires multiple shots from two handgun while duel wielding, is it one penalty die or two? Basically do they get a penalty die from the dual wielding and then an additional for the multiple shots from a handgun?

[Grimmshade]

35 minutes ago, redfive said:

Maybe a related rule question, if someone doesn't have the talent and fires multiple shots from two handgun while duel wielding, is it one penalty die or two? Basically do they get a penalty die from the dual wielding and then an additional for the multiple shots from a handgun?

Good question, which brings up another question for me. I'm not at home right now, but does Dual Wielding add a penalty die to each shot? If so, I'd say that it adds 2 penalty die when combined with muli-shot, and now I'm wondering if there would still be a single penalty die on each shot if combined with Rapid Fire due to dual wield. (In which case I'd definitely allow the combo)

Edited January 24, 2021 by Grimmshade

[redfive]

Duel Wielding does apply a penalty to each shot. However there is an example near there that has a character making two different attacks. One is a single shot from each handgun while duel wielding (with one penalty die), the other is the same character taking 3 shots each from each handgun while duel wielding each with one penalty die.

 

To me it seems like that second attack should be two penalty die per shot? In either case I think what I'm going to tell my player is that for now the way I'm ruling it is the feat prevents a penalty die for firing multiple shots from a single handgun, but that they will still get a penalty die if they choose to duel wield (but only one).

[Grimmshade]

I think that's how I'll rule it also. 

[klecser]

4 hours ago, Grimmshade said:

Without an official ruling, I'd probably allow it as it simulates characters like The Shadow and The Spider well. I do worry a little that it overpowers the Talent.

Many Mythos monsters take 1 or no damage from handguns. The system itself limits the power of any Investigator, even in Pulp.