Joining multiple subcults of the same God

[Darius West]

On 2/17/2019 at 11:04 AM, womble said:

3) Yes, there is a reason. They are men. They don't qualify, any more than an Ernaldan who hasn't given birth to a healthy bairn can become a full priestess.

Well, that's pretty sexist, considering that Orlanth is a male deity and has no particular reason to allow females to join.  I mean, that essentially grants women who join Orlanth access to one more spell than males get, and when you get down to it, Vinga is just a thunder brother cult.  I mean, to be fair, Fearless is a pretty bad spell, but there is a principle at stake. There are no other thunder brother cults with listed spells that are "male only", so what's up with that?

On 2/17/2019 at 2:13 PM, daskindt said:

As an example, the distinction between Adventerous and Thunderous is barely relevant. As has been pointed out, once initiated to either, a single additional point of POW opens both aspect fully. It doesn’t feel like a meaningful decision. Subcults for the Thunderous Brothers or herocults like Ulanin get even more disappointing. HeroQuest handles the many varied subcults in far more interesting ways.

How does that work considering that nobody has even written up Ulanin for RQ:RiG, and the rest of the Thunder Brothers are thin on the ground too?  Hero Quest is a silly system by comparison.  "Oh my... can I dream up a reason why this keyword is relevant to this situation?  I know, I'll invent a spurious myth that nobody has ever heard of that makes my keyword relevant, provided it doesn't involve missile combat, because we can't even begin to describe it within the limited scope of the HQ rules system."

[PhilHibbs]

4 hours ago, Darius West said:

Well, that's pretty sexist,

Of course it is. Are you surprised that a Bronze Age world is sexist?

[womble]

5 hours ago, Darius West said:

Well, that's pretty sexist, considering that Orlanth is a male deity and has no particular reason to allow females to join.  I mean, that essentially grants women who join Orlanth access to one more spell than males get, and when you get down to it, Vinga is just a thunder brother cult.  I mean, to be fair, Fearless is a pretty bad spell, but there is a principle at stake. There are no other thunder brother cults with listed spells that are "male only", so what's up with that?

How does that work considering that nobody has even written up Ulanin for RQ:RiG, and the rest of the Thunder Brothers are thin on the ground too?  Hero Quest is a silly system by comparison.  "Oh my... can I dream up a reason why this keyword is relevant to this situation?  I know, I'll invent a spurious myth that nobody has ever heard of that makes my keyword relevant, provided it doesn't involve missile combat, because we can't even begin to describe it within the limited scope of the HQ rules system."

Note that there are ways for men to become Ernalda Priestesses. 

[soltakss]

On 2/17/2019 at 8:28 PM, PhilHibbs said:

I think it's normal for Eurmali to join multiple subcults. If Remove Hand is your only spell then the jokes will quickly become stale.

Nah, it never gets old. Like fart jokes.

[soltakss]

On 2/18/2019 at 3:14 PM, PhilHibbs said:

Another data point is the Aldrya cult, where the natural progression is by leaving one subcult and joining another.

The natural progression for Voria/Ernalda/Asrelia is to leave one cult and join the next, as you go from Child to Mother to Grandmother. They can be seen as all subcults of one larger cult.

[PhilHibbs]

2 hours ago, soltakss said:

The natural progression for Voria/Ernalda/Asrelia is to leave one cult and join the next, as you go from Child to Mother to Grandmother. They can be seen as all subcults of one larger cult.

"Can be seen as", yes, but there's an important mechanical difference in that subcults have the same RP pool but different cults don't. Or, there could be justification for transferring RP pools from one cult to another maybe, where there is a relationship like this?

[womble]

Thinking about this on some long drives, I was wondering whether an additional subcult might in some cases require additional tithing. You might consider that tithes are paid to a (specific) temple rather than to a Cult in general, so if you're Initiated at Larnste's Table to Adventurous, and you have to go to Leika as Tribal High Priest of the Wind Voices of the Starfire Ridges to get tested for Thunderous, they might both be wanting their cut of your income and time. Maybe it depends on your Loyalty (Temple) Passion(s)...

[Darius West]

On 2/20/2019 at 9:42 AM, PhilHibbs said:

Of course it is. Are you surprised that a Bronze Age world is sexist?

Actually yes I am surprised.  The notion of even allowing women into the masculine Orlanth cult and then offering them extra privileges is just plain stupid.  This is a Fem-Thor level of stupid. Now this sort of nonsense might fly in Esrolia, but not elsewhere.  Furthermore, there really isn't any reason why Vinga doesn't simply provide her spell for Orlanthi in general as an Associated cult like all the Thunder Brothers should do.

Edited February 28, 2019 by Darius West

[Joerg]

If it breathes, it is eligible to worship Orlanth used to be the criterion back in the days. That's not really a sexed criterion last time I checked. 

The great mother goddess has "if it has given birth, it is defiitely eligible" as her criterion. The inability to give birth needn't be an absolute exclusion criterion, but will make acceptance into the cult much harder. Orlanth's duties are a lot softer - he isn't required to fertilize Ernalda (although when that happens, it brings forth special powers), but to provide reasonable protection and material support. Nothing there really requires male reproductive organs.

Yes, the peer pressure in a Bronze-Ageish society would be immense, but rebelling against just that sort of pressure is Orlanth's playbook. (And to some extent, Yelmalio's, too, which explains the few canonical Light Ladies).