svensson

The Ruins of Persepolis, by Tachar

A model by B. Werner of the North Palace of the citadel of Masada.

Like you guys, I'm having a lot of fun reading the Lightbringers and Earth Goddesses volumes, but I can't seem to remember when the next two volumes are due out. Like a knucklehead, I wrote it down somewhere and lost the note.

I believe there's two due out before Christmas and two more due by March 2024, but does anyone have anything more specific?

Eurmal.

With the introduction of the Starter Set, is is reasonable to expect the release of a Pendragon main rules book sometime in the next year?

1 hour ago, Baron said:

I finally saw the movie myself. According to the numbers I've seen, which I'll share here, it might not have done well enough to merit a sequel. Although they could push ahead anyway on a second try. There's also a TV show in the works, that might make another movie palatable.

The numbers (I'm just copy-pasting someone else):

April 17th:

Domestic Box Office $74,248,871

International Box Office $82,933,261

Worldwide Box Office $157,182,132

Source: https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Dungeons-and-Dragons-Honor-Among-Thieves-(2023)#tab=summary

Budget: $151 million

Standard to break even 2.5X the budget: $378 million

Currently losing: 378-157 = $221 million

https://screenrant.com/how-much-ant-man-wasp-quantumania-cost-to-make/

So, the film has grossed ~97 million (assuming that Hasbro got the normal 60% of the ticket sales... but it could be less if Hasbro didn't have as good as contract as the other big players) on a budget of $150 million to make (and a reasonable estimate of an additional $100 million to promote).

It tanked.

April 27:

Well, at this point I think it's safe to say it did tank:

Grosses:

Domestic (46.5%) $83,262,439

International (53.5%) $95,800,000

Worldwide $179,062,439

https://www.boxofficemojo.com/release/rl1879410177/

May 14:

Budget: $151 million

Standard to break even 2.5X the budget: $378 million

Worldwide Box office: $203 million

Currently losing: 378-203 = $175 million

Those numbers are to date AND very generous BTW the multiplier is 2.5 to 3 X it's budget to break even.

 

I do have to speak up for the bard (and monk) though. Of course, I'm speaking from the POV of 1st ed AD&D, which is my D&D. I can't speak to other editions. The bard is supposed to be based on the Celtic figure, who studied under druid tutelage. He studied law and acted as an arbiter. He was the society's historian. He acted as herald. He also held the role our modern press is supposed to fill, that is, a check on unsuitable rulers. He supposedly has powers one might attribute to magic. Now, that's the history. In 1st ed he has to be a powerful fighter, then possess the skills of a powerful thief. That latter probably for the stealth skills as opposed to stealing. Finally he gets druid spells and other magical powers. Again, I can't speak for other D&D editions, but in 1st ed he's a power to be reckoned with, which is why he appears in an appendix instead of the rules proper, as an option some DMs might not employ.

If you're interested in more, I recommend Keith Taylor's Bard series.

The monk also appears at the end of the chargen section as optional in 1st ed. With his high movement rate, ability to deflect missile weapons, stunning strike (or even "quivering palm," which is a one-shot death blow), special abilities like speaking with plants and animals, and multiple attacks, he has lots of potential. If you say he's not as effective as a warrior with great equipment, well I guess that depends on what you want to accomplish. The game isn't all about combat. But as an unarmored and unarmed combatant, he can be a lot of fun to play. You don't choose a monk if you just want to hit things with your sword.

So yeah, I didn't think the movie was all that, but it made me laugh. And its bard didn't stack up to the other "player characters." A missed opportunity in my book.

In later editions, the bard is not the badass Fighter + Thief + Magic guy in 1st edition. They are NOT Gellor from the Gord the Rogue books. From 3.0 onwards, bards are the dilettante talky guy. This is fine if the player is a social, clever, 'talky' person AND if the referee is social and witty enough to work with it.. But it sucks if the player doesn't have that personality. They can do a lot of things, but they don't do anything well enough to take up that necessary spot in a 4-player party.

Their magic is mostly of the support variety, with a mix of charm and sonic damage spells. Their magic is mostly arcane with a small number of clerical spells as leavening. And at no point are they as good at their spells as the wizards or clerics they're supposed replace.

And a even multiclass Fighter Thief is a better combatant and thief than a single classed bard of twice the level.

Their songs can be helpful, but really it's support magic.

Bards and monks are great for the fifth guy in the party, but they simply cannot hold down the workload of they guy they replace any of the four classes you need in a basic 4-person party [tank, cleric, damager, trap-monkey].

7 hours ago, Ian A. Thomson said:

Yay 🙂

Yes, these are the standard riding zebras. The war zebras are of course a different story! 🙂

Well, even if they are 5 or more hands taller with the increased musculature that implies, a War Zebra is slower than a Impala or High Llama and far, far less massive than a bison or rhino.

Looking VERY forward to it, @Ian A. Thomson!

I also want to say that I like the cover illustration. The zebras look like... well, zebras and not Percheron destriers with stripes on them. I've tried to explain to players that zebras are 'about 1/3 again the size of pony' and they keep insisting that they can go 'quatro a' quatro' with Bison Tribe lancer and win. Hopefully a picture showing characters actually mounted on zebras will disabuse them of that notion.

4 hours ago, Jeff said:

Perhaps you should read what you linked to? Let me quote it again:

"There are about 170k people in Sartar (including the Far Point but not the Pol-Joni). 

Let’s assume a little over half are initiated adults. That gets us 90k cultists."

Now my updated figures have the number of initiated adults in Sartar at 115k, which is a little higher, but not much of a change.

I have no idea where you are getting you 20% initiation rates from. What RuneQuest publication are you referring to? I am pretty sure the Guide and the Sourcebook are completely silent on such matters.

 

 

It was always my impression that initiation into an approved cult was a requirement for adulthood in Orlanthi tribes. This is supported by the RQG character generation rules.

So, are we reverting to the RQ2 situation where initiation is earned in play?

In support for my vision of the Storm oriented Elmal Cult [see the Documents section], meet Elmenest, Sun Thane of the Enhyli

2 hours ago, Scotty said:

Pleas

As the announcement above, July. Please note that we don't do pre orders per:

 

Thanks Scotty!

@Rick Meints Do we have a hypothetically theoretical, almost proposed, definitely maybe date when we can preorder the Proserpedia?

1 hour ago, moonwolf8 said:

That pretty much describes politics in a nutshell.

Which is precisely why politicians try so very hard to restrict voting access. 

Well, don't forget the part where there are limited resources of everything for everyone... And the more I have, the less you get.

This is also a major source of trouble for humanity. Remember, the corporate masters at Nestle don't belief that clean fresh water is a human right.... HOWEVER, in the spirit of full disclosure, they ARE correct that the world wastes most of its water and water is become more scarce by the year.

39 minutes ago, Jeff said:

You seem to be missing the obvious - in Glorantha, people really can wield part of the power of their god. To do that they need to have a tangible spiritual connection and follow the demands of their deity. But in return, they really can fly, hurl lightning, make the crops fruitful, turn into a wolf, whatever. When they do that, they ever so briefly manifest the god in the ordinary world. Really and objectively. And quite often.

 

And all this is why Rune Spells are LOUD.

Unless it's specifically designed to be stealthy or deceptive [Dark Walk, Illusionary [Whatever]], a Rune Spell caster is going to stand out like scream in a movie theater... For a moment they get bigger, their expressions are more primal, their voices full of more authority and so on.. they are physically manifesting their god's spiritual power on the Mundane plane.

2 hours ago, mfbrandi said:

An old thing by Jonathan Barnes (LRB, 4 July 1985) on Walter Burkert on Greek religion and its contrasts with Christianity:

————————————————————————————

• First, as Burkert stresses, Greek religion had no creed, no sacred texts, no revelation; there was no profession or caste of priests; there was no orthodoxy, and in consequence no heresy. It was a religion without articles and without dogma …
• Secondly, Greek religion had no particular attachment to an eschatology. After death nothing much was threatened or promised, and post-mortem hopes and fears played little part in normal Greek religion …
• Lastly, Greek religion had little to do with morality … The Olympians are not, and were not thought to be, moral exemplars or moral instructors … If there was such a thing as Greek popular morality – a set of shared ethical values and beliefs – it was only loosely connected to Greek popular religion.

————————————————————————————

This is not to say impiety could not be a capital offence, nor that breaking oaths sworn by the gods was not savagely punished. That is, by some measures, the classical Athenians took religion seriously.

(Clearly, not all religion in the ancient world was like the Greeks’, but they weren’t unique in having deadbeat gods — the gods of Sumer were too lazy to provide their own food, so created us to do it, then one of them tried to wipe us out for making too much noise. But the Sumerians weren’t in believing this irreligious.)

So where did it all go wrong for Gloranthan religion? Pick a side that is supposed to be a phase in a cycle, then munchkin toward apocalypse.

It all 'went wrong' in the Godtime with the advent of competing gods of different Runic associations and pantheons.

This led to competition and competition led to worshipers taking sides.

The came in the incursion of Chaos and everything went even more 'wrong'.

Greek mythology developed in a relatively small region with smaller cultural groups, where a 'culture' was 5000 people at most. Remember, Greece is a country very poor in natural resources, with poor, rocky soil. It takes a lot of area to feed one city /cultural grouping. AND the area was known for its regionalism... In the Bronze Age a Delphian was completely different from a Theban, even if they shared the same language.

What's more, what most of us know as 'Greek mythology' is the distilled and abridged version given to us by Edith Hamilton and her Athenian sensibilities ['Athenian' meaning city not necessarily goddess]. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Sparta, Delphi, Thebes and the rest of Hellenic world had highly localized myths and legends that trivialized Hercules in favor of a local hero and marginalized the myths of Zeus in favor of those of Poseidon.

4 hours ago, HreshtIronBorne said:

We ran this campaign arc and called it Face Down in the Mud. It was an awesome and epic campaign that spanned years. Did River of Cradles, Borderlands, Strangers in Prax, Griffin Mountain, and the Cradle Adventure. It kept going on from there but, those were the big moments. 

 

I strongly suggest going with the 1610's time frame. Way way less work to dive right into gaming with tons of books and stuff to play through. 

Wish I'd played in that one. That would have been fun, even if RQ3 was ticky/tack as Hell.

Did the players meet the Coders or Baran? Either one would have been fun, if for VERY different reasons.

28 minutes ago, Joerg said:

That spirit is called the White Bull, and was bound to/by Argrath, leading all the able-bodied young warriors astray into the western wetlands. Of course, a white heifer might counterbalance that.

@Joerg I'm not talking about a specific White Bull/Buffalo heroquest. I'm talking about the rejuvenation of ONE TRIBE'S spirit tradition when their deceased Grandmother [beast] Spirit is reborn on the Mundane Plane and the PCs have to protect it for the good of the tribe.

I was thinking of something rather less 'epic' than resurrecting Genert, animating Eiritha, and so on. My idea is more of a 'balance of power' shift on the Plains as some minor tribes were rejuvenated by the reappearance of their deceased Grandmother spirits [the Rhinos come to mind].

The idea is something of a 'temporal HeroQuest' or campaign where PCs have to find, protect, and nurture an infant [calf/kid/cub] as it becomes a new Grandmother for the tribe.

I'm not 100% up on my Plains cultures myths, but in the very broad brush it might be thought of as a 'white buffalo' quest.

Well, I wasn't thinking in terms of resurrecting Genert... That might be a little bit above my pay grade, mythologically speaking 😂

But I really could see a band of Beast Rider nomads entering the Spirit Plane or Hell the source of their spirit traditions to some of the tribes.

@soltakss, you lookin' for a collaborator?

I suppose this is a question for @Jeff or @Rick Meints , but I'll propose it to the Collective Shrunken Head.

We know that the Hero Wars are a time of great mystical upheaval for Glorantha, almost a Second GodTime, where the rules of Time are being stretched and flexed. Possibilities that no one believes could exist become realities. We know that Argrath apotheosizes into a God to directly confront the Red Goddess.

But do other Gods come into existence too?

As a 'for instance' that would set one of the favored 'sandboxes' [pun intended] on fire, what would happen if some of the lost Minor Tribe ancestors of Prax were reborn? What if Basmol the Lion and Grandfather Rhino [among others] were mystically regenerated by the energies of the Hero Wars?

I would **certainly** lead to a lot of conflict among the Tribes as the scales rebalanced themselves. And in conflict we find adventure.

What do you guys think?

On 4/27/2023 at 11:12 AM, Darius West said:

What about the cult of Finovan?  He rides upon Rolling Thunder, a magnificent stolen horse.  As the pre-eminent rustling and raiding deity, why doesn't he get a mention?   Rustling cattle is very hard on foot.  Elmal may raise the horses, but Finovan steals them and rides them.  If Elmal or Yelmalio were a better rider, Finovan wouldn't raid successfully.

That is the best of Terrestrial horse culture myth...
-- Cu Chulainn loved two horses he stole to pull his chariot.

-- The Turkish, Bedouin, and Mongols each had proverbs and aphorisms that announced that the best horse of a warrior is one stolen from his enemies.

-- The Plains Indians cultures, especially the Sioux and Comanche, lauded the qualities of stolen horses and one couldn't be considered a serious warrior among many tribes without stealing a horse from another tribe.

It's for reasons like this that I included the Movement/Change Rune in my highly unoffical, very IMGU writeup of Elmal's cult.

1 hour ago, Jeff said:

Some Sartarite clans certainly claim ancient or mythological origins - although such claims should not be understand as historical links.

After all, to hear them tell it EVERY Irishman is a direct descendant of Cu Chulain AND Brian Boru! And every Scot is blood-kin to William Wallace. 😁

Which does NOT mean that we Americans don't have our version of, um, let's just call it 'mythological misunderstandings' too... I mean, I love my country, but I know my people... 🤣😅😂

On 4/21/2023 at 9:28 AM, Zit said:

I'm wondering what would a trade with Mostali look like. In Griffin Mountain, they trade bronze weapon against food, but what else could be exchanged with them ?

Replying to the OP

Cloth, Rope, Animal Products [glues, hair, feathers, leather, etc.], Plant Products [fibers, wicks, herbs, etc.], Gems [not every gemstone is everywhere, after all], Sorcerous Grimoires, Sorcery Matrices, Alchemical Ingredients...

Yes, it's true that many of the resources can be substituted with metalwork [chain for rope, etc.]. But Mostali of the Openhandist Heresy are comparatively few in number. Trade makes up for resources they don't have and prevents them having to maintain too many members of any given caste just to make disposable items.

To the OP:

1. Friendly fire isn't friendly.

2. Grenades are addressed 'To Whom It May Concern'

3. Cover and Concealment are VERY different things. Yes, they're related but don't confuse them!

4. It's only 'cover' if it actually blocks the enemy fire. Hiding behind a tree when a tank gun is firing at you is not helpful.

5. No plan survives contact with Player Characters.

6. If it's stupid but it worked, it wasn't stupid.

7. Contact with enemy forces always happens at the corners of 4 maps, each of a different scale, in lousy lighting conditions, and with a radio that has a short somewhere in the headset cord.

53 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Yes, understood what you were saying. The reality is that what we'll have available for canon for much of Glorantha will be what's in the Guide and the upcoming Cults books (which will make a majority of cultures playable), and then the core Hero Wars areas of: Dragon Pass, Prax (incl. Pavis), the Holy Country, and parts of the Lunar Empire. 

I remember reading a response from @Jeff that an official Chaosium Heroquest book was also in the pipeline...
Probably titled 'HeroQuest 4 Grogs Dummies'... And I say that cuz Ah R Wun....