metcalph

In addition, the Seven Mothers can serve as a stepping stone to more demanding cults.  Take for example Irrippi Ontor.  The requirements to become an initiate are pretty high. But join the Seven Mothers and you can study towards becoming a fully fledged Red Sage while not being so tied to the desk. 

Of course we you do make it via such a route, you might have to put up with snobbery about getting your degree from the Empire's equivalent of the University of American Samoa. 

The 850k figure includes individual cults to the Seven Mothers and not the Seven Mothers as a whole as presented in RQ:G. 

Irrippi is a knowledge cult. 

Yanafal is a warrior cult. 

Deezola is an earth cult. 

That's a large chunk of useful cults right there. 

Pretty much in the guide and bestiary would be known to the scholars of Lhankor Mhy.  The more removed people are from those academic sources the more outlandish their beliefs about Dragonewts become.

Since Dragonewts are pretty much weird, it might be just possible but that outlandish superstitions are closer to the Truth than the scholarly lore.

17 minutes ago, Ian_W said:

Replace Jeff with Nick, or yourself, or MoB, Simon, or Laurence, or most anyone else, and do we have a worse result ?

 

And by worse, I mean narrower, more brittle, more reliant on canon by Word Of God and less reliant on being some combination of true, beautiful or making sense without reference to authority ?

I am generally happy with the editorial decisions and output that Jeff has made and doubt that anybody else in the same position would have been substantially better.

You are free to disagree but to phrase your opinions in the form of personal attacks is just wasting people's time.

9 minutes ago, Ian_W said:

My dumbest theory is Jeff's involvement in the Glorantha Project was an Good Thing.

Sir, this is dumbest theories, not cheap abuse. 

9 hours ago, radmonger said:

I think this is the key point Dara Happa never had to build an empire. It preceded the nomads and barbarians who split off from it.

All real world empires started small, and had to build to whatever size they ended up as. With Rome as the outlier, and they do genuinely have lot in common with the Lunars.

Dara Happa started out large, possibly even lozenge-wide. Its whole claim is to unique purity and longevity, though presumably the Kraloreans would disagree. Their whole deal is that if the lunars are able to conquer the world, the result would be stable and peaceful.

At least until Glorantha gets hit by another rogue planet...

The Dara Happans may think that but the nearby cultures have a different view.  The Entekosiad (p30-31) tells the story of Brightface who was supposedly a loyal servant of the White Queen.  He conquered the whole world (or the lands surrounding Pelanda) for the White Queen before overthrowing her in a coup.  So their Empire was built but they chose to believe it was divinely ordained.

5 hours ago, MOB said:

In my latest Jaxarte story, which will feature in the forthcoming new edition of A Rough Guide to Boldhome, due out at Chaosium Con, our hero is a guest in one of Boldhome's Mostali mansions and comes across Dwarven tinned food. Each of these cylindrical metal containers is stamped with a symbol – "what appeared to be a cow, a sheep, some sort of flightless bird, and what looked to be a man":

Two of the footnotes from the tale:

11] The Dwarf of Dwarf Run will occasionally offer “Cows in Cans” and the like for trade: as these foodstuffs do not spoil they make excellent long-term provisions for buyers expecting to be besieged or about to take a long sea voyage. It is said that the Mostali have a special magical hand tool to effortlessly open their cans; if so, this is a secret they keep to themselves.

[12] Jaxarte does not go into details, but the famed cook Antonor Lukewarm of Geos in Jonstown is said to have sampled various Dwarven canned goods and recorded his impressions. He tasting notes said, “When the dwarves assert that their tinned beef is ‘100% cow’, let me warn you they are speaking quite literally. The can I sampled was certainly fresh, but in addition to meat it contained visible lumps of hair, horn, and viscera.” He tried the other varieties Jaxarte mentions; the sheep symbol proved to be mutton, the flightless bird was demi-bird (“tough, strangely bitter, and with bits of bone like chalk” ) and the man symbol was “probably herd man, but tasted like pork”.

I once had the idea that the Quicksilver Dwarves used jerked syrup as an additive for their canned food.

7 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

The Dying Earth RPG is on Humble Bundle again this month: I checked, and your adventure is included. 

Bundle of Holding and Humble Bundle are different entities.

If he travels to New Pavis with Lunar prisoners in tow then any Lunar troops are just going to relieve them of their captives without paying any ransom.  I'm sorry but the Lunar Empire makes the rules.  

The wisest bet would be to remain with the captives at Horngate and send a messenger to New Pavis to give instructions on where the ransom can be paid.  You might have to pay the local Praxian temple a small cut of the ransom but not even Halcyon Vor Enkorth is going to be stupid enough to... okay, he might be.  

Sending the captives to Pimpers Block runs the risk of meeting the Sable tribe which considering you have their allies is not going to end well.  By all means, encouage them on this path.

1 hour ago, Nick Brooke said:

There is wibbly-wobbly timey-wimeyness involved, I fear: Sun County says Garrath won the Garhound Contest in 1604, when Argrath is canonically eight years old (per word of @Jeff). I suspect we’d treat this as a typo for 1614, nowadays, and might just suggest that to @MOB…

Or that Argrath killed him and took his identity to hide from the Lunars.  

9 hours ago, Ageha said:

Has Yelm or his representative mortal groups ever actually won any conflict against the Orlanthi outside the brief Lunar occupation of Dragon Pass?

• Conquest of the Theyalans at the battle of Night and Day.  Lasted several decades before the Orlanthi hired Trolls and Malkioni to do their dirty work for them.
• Expulsion of Orlanth Dragonfriend from their lands.  
• Defeat of Jannisor.
• Defeat of the Kynnelfings.
• Conquest of Tarsh.

9 hours ago, Ageha said:

With the Second Council the Dara Happan Empire at least seems to achieve some sort of stalemate, though only after losing much of Peloria, if not most, to Orlanthi already, but come Arkat-Gbaji and the Pelorians just lose. Again. 

I don't recognize this version of events.  The Empire came into being after the Second Council defeated the last of the horse riders.  The Council then became split over the God Project whereupon the Dara Happans invaded.  The Second Council made peace and became part of the Dara Happan Empire.  In what sense is this a stalemate?

9 hours ago, Ageha said:

(On that note, also, Yelm's an incredible pushover when it comes to his turf. Whilst Orlanthi have gone on to turn basically ALL of Genertela outside Kralolera, Teshnos, Pent and a small bit of Peloria into Orlanthi cultural and religious spaces Peloria has...not managed to export its culture or religion even once?

You are using an sweeping definition of Orlanthi and a restrictive definition of Pelorians here.  At least compare apples with apples.  What is the Sun Dome temple if not Pelorian culture?  What is Illumination which came from Yelm and has an enduring presence in Ralios?  What is the Lunar Way which sprang from Yelm and has worshippers in Fronela, Peloria and the Wastelands even *after* the fall of the Lunar Empire?

Seven Mothers worshippers in Prax (as per Cults of Runequest: Mythology)

• Bison Trbe: 1%
• High Llama: 1%
• Impala: 3%
• Morokanth: 6%
• Pol Joni: lusers
• Rhino: 1%
• Sable: 10%
• Unicorn: 10%
• Zebra: lusers.

In free Dragon Pass:

• Grazelands: 5%
• Old Tarsh: 5%
• Sartar: 5%

To portray this as a defeat is like calling the Roman Empire a failure.

4 hours ago, David Scott said:

Get the feeling that Irrippi Ontor is really  a subcult of Buserian rather than providing all rune magics in his own right.  Think the same might apply to the other Seven Mothers and Lunar Gods.  For example: Yanafal/Humakt, Deezola/(Dendara/Ernalda), Etyries/Issaries, Jakaleel/Horned Man.

The mythology cult distributions are interesting.  In the Lunar Heartlands, Buserian is not listed but Lhankhor Mhy is.  

For example: cults as per the footnote. 

• Doblian 1%
• Karasal 1%
• First Blessed 2%
• Kostaddi 1%
• Oraya 1%
• Oronin 1%
• Silver Shadow 1%
• [Sylila - 0%]
• [Western Reaches - 1%]

Now I had thought this was Buserian listed under Lhankor Mhy but the statement that Buserian has been subsumed into Irrippi Ontor makes this quite curious.  It wouldn't be Irrippi Ontor as those people are listed under the Seven Mothers cults as per the footnote.  The absence of any Lhankorings in Sylila suggests that it's not spillover from the Lunar Provinces.  

So the following possibilities arise:

• The footnote was not intended to apply to the cult of the knowing god.
• The figures represent a Carmanian (or some other) version of the knowing god.  Doubful for it would demote the Ontorits to a minority sect of the knowing god which would be silly for the Lunar Empire.

54 minutes ago, Richard S. said:

If they were described as demons only by an in-universe speaker, I'd probably be on board with them just being another troll queendom, but given that the Guide itself doesn't get more specific than "demons" I'm inclined to think they're something else from the underworld.

I have not described them as "another troll queendom" and would highly appreciate it if you confined your musings to you think they are like instead of patronizing dismissals of my thoughts.

5 hours ago, jajagappa said:

I'd actually take the opposite approach. Demons are a big part of eastern mythos in general which seems distinct from the trolls.

The demons are vaguely described and the trolls are by definition demons.

Given that the Eastern Isles already has sea trolls and Ludoch, I'm inclined to make them variations of conventional Elder races rather than entirely different species.  Their main religion is the darkness deities ("A few renegade East Isles are also devoted to Darkness religions." CoR: Mythology p127).  So the main types of Andins would be:

Dwarves:  The Dwarves worship a shattered version of the decamony with many metals non-existant.  I don't think they have Gold, Silver, or Diamond Castes among them.  Their main gods are Lead and Iron.  The caste magics are quite different in scope from their orthodox mostali.  For example instead of Jolanthi, the Tin Dwarves make Gargoyles.  

Trolls:  The main troll types would be the Dark Trolls, Cave Trolls and the Trollkin.  They worship Kyger Litor under the name of Arlu.  Their main war god is Bandan who  is perhaps another name for Zorak Zoran.  

Dragonewts:  The Dragonewts are a mixture of barbarians and magisaurs.  They honor the Sheradpara instead of Dragon Magic (Martalak is sorcery, Festanur is Daka Fal and Ombardu is Oakfed but instead his sacrifical flame is their fiery breath).  The more magically powerful they are, the bigger, angrier and stupider they become.  The priests of Vith say they can enlighten these monsters but show little inclination in doing so in historical times.

Elves: Mainly dark elves with mushroom potions etc and perhaps a few moss monsters and goblins.  

Chaos monsters:  Vampires, Ghouls, Ogres, walktapuses etc.

Like their kindred elsewhere, the various types of Andins hate each other as much as they hate the humans.  Unlike their kindred elsewhere, the humans have kept them contained for so long, that they have been forced to come up with elaborate rules and rituals for interactions between themselves so to function in a hostile harmony.  Like for example, they have ritualized battles to resolves differences or tensions between them.  As a result, their material culture has become homogenized and also includes a lot of Vithelan and Vormaino influences.  For example, the rulers among them would wear makutas and lomphoks as a badge of their office.

The planets (with names of Dara Happan Gods) are:

• Sun (Yelm)
• Moskalf (Entekos/Dendara)
• Shargash (Shargash)
• Wagon (Lokarnos)
• The Blue Moon (Falsoretus)
• Artia
• Mastakos (Uleria)
• Red Moon (Verithurusa/Sedenya)
• Lightfore (Yelmalio)
• The Twinstars

Buserian is most probably associated with Lightfore as like Yelmalio, he has the Truth rune.

That leaves Ghevengus, Reladivus, Derdernus and Deumalos. 

Ghevengus or Veng are probably associated with Artia as they are bird deities whereas she is associated with bats.  Perhaps it was a planet of the Birds which got devastated in the Gods War and only Bats live there now?

Reladivus was perhaps a precursor to Lokarnos as the God of the Wagon Planet.

Derdurnus and Deumalos are practically obscure as we know very little about them or how the ancient Dara Happans viewed the planets they might represent.  It seems to me for example that the Twinstars had become a single planet with only an relic cult of their ancient duality surviving.  

Another way of looking at it would be that these are the ancient powers of the Celestial Court (Truth, Illusion, Motion, Stasis etc) attending to the Emperor (Yelm).  The Planet Shargash is a stand-in for Kargan Tor and Orenoar might have been associated with Lightfore.  Larnste would have been associated with the planet Mastakos.  Uleria might have been associated with the Twinstars but that would require an elaborate fanwank using a Pelandan myth involving her and Vogmaradan.

One could also use a similar exercise with the Avanparloth but the same problem occurs: the details don't mesh up with each other and we are unsure why.

Possible compromise: protection magic protects against crits *but* it reduces the damage to the minimum possible points of damage instead of zero.  

Although this means that a dagger would be more effective against magically armoured opponents than a sword for example.  

Spotted on facebook

31 minutes ago, Ian_W said:

Yes. But they are faster than Impalas trying to herd a mob of cattle out of Heortland.

That's what the Marcher County is for.  A series of forts which can intercept raiders.  Knight Fort is well beyond Holy Country territory (about 40 to 60 km away) and who built and when is not clear.  Going on an extended patrol into Prax with only heavy cavalry is a good way to get killed.

7 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

YGWV, much more fun if class mobility is permitted, I think the Loskalm are mobile no, so like them? Then PC Farmers may advance socially through their efforts...

If a PC Aeolian wants to be socially mobile, the best place for them is Black Horse County.  Starting out as a Farmer, they are never going make make a good sorcerer in any campaign and pretty much most gloranthan nobles are revolted by the idea of marrying a common oik.  

7 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

 

Maybe a company of knights travel a circuit weekly or biweekly to check in on things in the area. They like security as well as others in the area, again YGMV. Taking this a step further caravans may travel with the knights for part of there route for added protection?

The knights are slow compared to the Praxian riders.  Pretty sure that the Impalas are going to have fun using them for target practice.

6 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

So they are in the process of dying out slowly over a long period of time, their actual population is shrinking? Also  would there not be a constant threat of revolt by those nearby who do not own the land and are basically suppressed stick pickers and farmers? I suppose they could be kind and just group of feudal lords and not be suppressive. Sorry if I am missing it but farmers who do not accept their lot in life as such would just leave and make a living somewhere else wouldn't they? "Hey I could be a knight, warrior, whatever somewhere else, why sit hear and be a farmer giving a good portion of my efforts to the rich, high and mighty Esvulari as rent or whatever?

Just because they are endogamous does not mean their population is slowly dying out over time.  There are two minority sects in the near east that are endogamous: the Druze and the Yazidis.  Both have survived a lot longer than the Aeolians and both have had hostile neighbours, which is not true of the Aeolians.  Ever since they became Belintar's strongest supporters, their numbers would have increased steadily over the past three centuries.  The years since then have been troubled but that same is true for everybody in the area.

Why would people be itching to revolt against the Aeolians?  The Orlanthi have stickpickers and half-frees yet nobody assumes they will plot to revolt against their nobles or carry out a rent-strike over lack of opportunities for social advancement.

6 minutes ago, smiorgan said:

- Which skill should I test for the militiaman income? 

Loyalty (to commanding officer).

Just now, Akhôrahil said:

And while I don’t know if Xemela still has the ”Saint” title, that’s this kind of reinterpretation as well (assuming she’s ”just” CA).

No, the Malkioni worship the Gods knowing full well that they actually are the Gods - they are not monotheists.  Case in point: the father of Malkio, Aerlit, is the son of Vadrus, the son of Umath, the son of Aether and Gata.

4 minutes ago, Akhôrahil said:

That makes it the ideal reinterpretation if you want to incorporate other gods under the IG? Not another god (because there aren’t any other gods), but still worthy of veneration. Ehemeristic Orlanth.

The Malkioni already worship Gods under the Invisible God.