Shrinkwrapping!

[drohem]

The problem with this is it isn't uncommon for stores to get only one copy of all but the most popular products these days. That wasn't that uncommon even with more obscure products years ago; the place I bought my copies of most BTRC rules only had one copy of each of them for example.

Well, I am so anal about my books, I would purchase two copies: one for preview and one for sale.

Well no, I would purchase three copies; the extra would be for my personal stash.

Ok, ok...really it would be four copies; the fourth would be for my pristine RPG collection.

[Kloster]

Ironically, this is sort of a side thread of a side thread. The idea being that one of the advantages of closed systems is that you can see what you are buying before you buy, where as with PDFs and many third party products, you are forced to buy blind.

I wonder what other regional differences might exist in RPGing?

Language?

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[Nightshade]

One big difference is that without OGL, we'd be more likely to see a game system carried in it's entirety by local stores. Allowing those of us living in the non-wrapped world to see what we are buying.

If we flip through it and don't buy it, then it doesn't sell. That will affect what my local shop does as far as restocking and future products. Likewise, it something flies off the shelf that company's stuff will be better stocked by the store.

The problem is that even prior to 3e, many stores were getting leery of new product anyway; if you buy a bunch of copies of something and it sells badly, you've already taken a bath, but it may well not matter to future purchase as the company that produced it has already folded. So you just have to repeat the process with the next game anyway. This is pretty much a chonic problem new companies have to face, which is why many of them have given up trying to sell to most stores at all.

Sad shop owner also buys practically nothnig but D&D RPG stuff, since there is so much stuff that he can't keep up with D&D AND keep up wth the other RPGs anymore.

Net result. OGL turned his shop from a gaming store to a D&D store. That's bad for people who want to play games other than D&D.

That's an issue of the dominance of D&D, though, not the fact that they did the OGL; it was already starting to happen in some places before TSR went into collapse and sold out to WOTC.

[Nightshade]

Language?

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

I suspect he was thinking more in terms of U.S. regionalism.

[Kloster]

...

OGL did what is was supposed to do for WotC. It turned around the trend in RPGing and made D&D/D20 the predominant system again. Practically any company that is writing good D20 stuff was writing good or better non-D20 stuff before OGL.

...

It already WAS the dominant force, even before OGL!

...

OGL won't help BRP much, since the majority of RPGers don't give a squat about BRP anyway. And most D&Ders don't look at and buy non D20 products.

True, even if Mongoose tries hard to push the other way.

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[Kloster]

I suspect he was thinking more in terms of U.S. regionalism.

:innocent:

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[Atgxtg]

It already WAS the dominant force, even before OGL!

In the mid 90s that started to change. AD&D 2nd edition was losing market share, and companies liek White Wolf were gaining ground. The RPG shops in my area went from being 75% D&D due to volume (there was more D&D stuff than non) to the reverse.

Once D20 came out, lots of companies jumped on the d20 wagon and dropped thier own lines. Within two years or so D&D return to preeminence.

True, even if Mongoose tries hard to push the other way.

There not. They make far more money from OGL D&D than they do from MRQ. MRQ just gives then another niche to sell too. Currently that niche comprises of a small percentage of RQ fans and a large does of disenchanted D&Ders. But, since Mongoose is doing to MRQ what WotC did with D&D (splitting everything off into a different supplement), I suspect the disenchanted D&Ders will end up as disenchanted MRQers.

[Nightshade]

There not. They make far more money from OGL D&D than they do from MRQ. MRQ just gives then another niche to sell too. Currently that niche comprises of a small percentage of RQ fans and a large does of disenchanted D&Ders. But, since Mongoose is doing to MRQ what WotC did with D&D (splitting everything off into a different supplement), I suspect the disenchanted D&Ders will end up as disenchanted MRQers.

Assuming what disenchanted them was supplimentitis. It might have simply been a search for a different sort of fantasy experience than the high-heroic, cinematic D20 one.

[Atgxtg]

Assuming what disenchanted them was supplimentitis. It might have simply been a search for a different sort of fantasy experience than the high-heroic, cinematic D20 one.

No, from what I've read, most of the people seem to be disgusted with the endless number of supplements add ons, and such that expand the game. A lot of groups play at the Gms house so he does have to carry a bookself with him on gaming night.

[Kloster]

In the mid 90s that started to change. AD&D 2nd edition was losing market share, and companies liek White Wolf were gaining ground. The RPG shops in my area went from being 75% D&D due to volume (there was more D&D stuff than non) to the reverse.

...

For me (in far away Europe), TSR never went below 50% of gamestore exposure, even if they were losing marketshares (to WhiteWolf, RTG, Games Workshop and some others).

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[Kloster]

No, from what I've read, most of the people seem to be disgusted with the endless number of supplements add ons, and such that expand the game. A lot of groups play at the Gms house so he does have to carry a bookself with him on gaming night.

I like to remember I was not the one GMing WoD games.

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[Kloster]

...

There not. They make far more money from OGL D&D than they do from MRQ. MRQ just gives then another niche to sell too. Currently that niche comprises of a small percentage of RQ fans and a large does of disenchanted D&Ders. But, since Mongoose is doing to MRQ what WotC did with D&D (splitting everything off into a different supplement), I suspect the disenchanted D&Ders will end up as disenchanted MRQers.

What I was replying to was: "And most D&Ders don't look at and buy non D20 products."

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[soltakss]

Wayland's Forge, here in Birmingham UK, always wraps their products. I've never asked them to open one so I could have a look at the contents but I'm sure they would.

I've never been one for browsing through a book - generally I buy what i need or want rather than buy on impulse.

[Atgxtg]

Wayland's Forge, here in Birmingham UK, always wraps their products. I've never asked them to open one so I could have a look at the contents but I'm sure they would.

I've never been one for browsing through a book - generally I buy what i need or want rather than buy on impulse.

How do you know what you need or want without some exposure to the product? I can see if you are following a preexisting line, but what about something new?

[drohem]

Unless you are single, young, and fairly well-off, I think that impluse buying is a thing of the past. Especially with product prices these days. Twenty years ago the price of products was such that you reasonably purchase a product or two a month and still not feel the sting, but these days it hurts when a is product is $30-$50 each.

[Nightshade]

Unless you are single, young, and fairly well-off, I think that impluse buying is a thing of the past. Especially with product prices these days. Twenty years ago the price of products was such that you reasonably purchase a product or two a month and still not feel the sting, but these days it hurts when a is product is $30-$50 each.

There are people who can do that (I've got at least one in my group) but I'm not one of them.

[soltakss]

How do you know what you need or want without some exposure to the product?

Some things I take on trust, some times I look at a friend's book or follow reviews.

I've no real interest on non BRP/RQ/HQ products anyway, so I'm fairly set in my crusty old ways.

I can see if you are following a preexisting line, but what about something new?

Something new? I tried that once. It didn't work.