MJ Sadique

I didn't bother take this in account because the answer is already recapitulate in "Le Maître des Runes" in bandersnatch section : creature with extensible neck have an weapon SR of 0 (weapon more than 4m so SR weapon is 0, rq2/rq3 base rules). case closed. I won't speak about giant because there an extant table SIZ (1-100) / Kg in RQ3 and giants SIZ are awfully wrong if you look at this table. clue : a 10 times higher man have x100 surafce surface and x1000 mass (kg) if size is link to mass... 1,80m, 90Kg, SIZ 14 =x10=> 18,m 90tons SIZ (guess it). SR are a time, do you really count the time of your watch from 60 to 1 sec for each minutes... the system is simple, (SR is a) time counting is from 1 to 10 (end of the round, rq3). Let's make a technical control (BFS.D) of your idea/system (I will named you SR init because it's D20 comparable unit) : -Better for the GM : not because you have to change init depending the configuration. The global use is more complex. X -Faster for the GM : Surely not because each player must wait for the master to choose init dice, then roll it then choose his actions X. It's not the faster option because you can just give MAX init - SIZ modifier (1 init lost per 5 or 10 SIZ) it will be more quantitative so more fair. -Stronger for the GM : does it solve more case ? I'm pretty sure a Duck with a full of DEX 5 will be faster than a Zorani with DEX 24 (X). Archer outside the street will have D20ini, player inside D12 or less. Spells casting more than one round (like a 25SR spell) will become a big problem if SR is variable and more if it's count from 20 to 1.X Diamond properties for player : -Clarity : Nope, it's not clear for me so as a player. Because you are using a speed system (higher init act first), it may pass in rq2 if player don't know the rules. rq3 never because of sorcery and lot more thing.X -Solidity : Nope because different situation cause different INIT dices so player won't have a stable basic to know how play unless you give a table. X -Precious : does it give player anything... situations are more thrilling, the very best good point, shorter people will loe playing in tunnel but. Globally the very excellent point who is a more thrilling combat, more dices rolls (ini) -Gygax as spirit protector of dices will love it- have a lot of counter part, even without more analysis a lot of problem will arise from it. I'm not sure we gain anything valuable in term of rules, the cost is too big for it. BFS.D not approved

Yeah, you are perfectly right Pentallion. And in the actual system you're not far from the correct answer, but unless you do a Monster Coliseum with the original map andbeing confronted to the problem and you can't find the simplest and more effective answer. (To you all, do an true arena fight, you'll learn more than never and moreover if you have tricky players). First and before answering : I'm the first concerned by the SR tables... I love the principles an idea but trully hate the numbers used for DEX/SIZ modifier which strictly have no reason to be (no logic at all, no matter formula or idea used). If not enough, The weapons are arbitrary used numbers based on what the max length of an short / 1H / 2H are most European weapons, Empiric = no logic. To add up another one, the best should to use length instead of time in SR (I will save you this reason). Why SR is still great, and why we should still used it : because in term of "time to strike" you add up your speed, you steps length and the you weapon length (Quickness an reach of our dear styopa) so the SR of an action = 1 + DEX + SIZ + Weapon. In rq2, the 1 is missed because if you do an attack at SR 3, even with all modifier to 0 the second can only happen after so at SR4 ! In Rq3, the just combine 1 + DEX to a create a new dex meaning "you have to take a minimum of time to to something". (2-weapons-2-attacks-in-the-same-round saved !) "And my allosaurus ?" yes I come to it : First thing you can in mind, is the japenese concept of maai (space)... with a big weapon you have a larger area of control (maai) and can strike someone with a shorter maai (because he is not aware or have a shorter weapon). In case of Monster Coliseum play (situation1) or classic cases : Situation 1, coliseum fight : you pin-point your location and the monster, and treat the situation as a ranged fighting. You have to use SR to move in range, and at your strike SR, if nobody in range (half movement + weapon lenght, human+2H sword 1,5m+1,5m = 3m; allosaurus 7x1,5 = 11m) you can't attack, if in range you do a strike ! Situation 2, Human vs human : Usual case of the rules. Situation 3, Human vs monster : Offensive maai, the monster need 2m of movement to be in range, human 4m. As the rule said, you have to use SR to move in range and the after this you can use SR of you attack to perform it. but you need a grid for each fight, not the best situation. Situation 4 : You mounted rules, the longer weapon strike first (medium blue vs allosaurus) and after this in melee fight were everyone are at range use standard SR (light blue vs allosaurus) unless you have cunning fighter who side attack and direct go to melee saving you the reach problem (dark blue vs allosaurus). First have no problem with the rule, you can fight or run ! And unless you do ninja fights : two man running along a way and exchanging strikes, you can never move and strike. In the rule you add the two SR used and do the all simultaneously. (simplest, no house rules, manageable an enough logic for haimji -I don't post for veteran but for new master). There is another best answer come from the sorcery's haste/rise dex spell principle (2MP = DEX+2 = SR-1,I finally come to it after 1h of writing, muahahhh) : -For DEX/SIZ over 20+ you can give 1pt of B.SR for each 2Pts of DEX/SIZ over 20 : Which mean at a DEX or SIZ of 26, you have 3 Bonus Strike Rank (BSR like in berserk). This mean a big troll can use this 3 B.SR to shorter is attack SR (offensive use of reach) of even rise the SR attack of the enemy who could lose his attack if SR go over 10 (defensive use of SR). Personally, I often play with Sorcerer Runelord who use High speed spell and the B.SR given can be use in a lot of strategy... From all house rules it has pass my personnel technical control named BFS.D who mean that is better (quality of combat is rising for the GM), faster (no complex calculation before or during the fight for the GM) and stronger (resist more complain for the GM) and the diamond property (Clarity : the player understand it unlike some THACO + Solidity : the rules are fixed, no change interference + Precious : the players don't lose anything, only gain something). Arena - Human vs allosaurus.docx

1/ a Big Yes : fighting humanoid and "giantoid" could be scales properly but the mechanics will be more complex. And I know what I speak about because I already have convert RQ3 system to a time (SR) and/or length (a bit like some wargame) with all physics formula used to properly and truly simulate this. Formulas aren't so complex but results give a bit strange system. Between complexity+reality vs simplicity+fantasy, choose the last and don't make house rules realistic which is the theme of the thread. 3/ Oh Yes : if you follow the open tables of SIZ / Kg (TAI 1 to 100), a lot of creatures SIZ are awfully wrong. An the table itself is not perfectly logical but it's well constructed for something done in the 80' for a game... I don't know any game that is close to Runequest. 4/ Perhaps : it's not the forum for the Runequest 2.5 and between rq2 and rq3, the skills are the very big change ! The combat sections are not so far different. What I really think is Runequest 2/3 is made for humans fighting humans and sometimes big monsters, the systems is made for the first and limit compatible with the second. Because D&D was a human vs monster and Greg & RQ makers choose a human(oid) vs human(oid) games because fighting monster is just boriiiing. Killing tons of reptilians make you a great hunter, but fighting others intellect races and cultures make you a Hero. 2/ There is one, and NO SR should not be count upward ! : Ceiling rank is counting in seconds (time/SR) but Open-ended is counting in something akin to hertz (time inverse, D20) which feel not very instinctive and is a hell to truly manage when doing realist multiple actions (theme of the thread). What most of people forget/don't care is that SR is linked to movement and if you have relative strikes rank you could get : -Situation where 2 PC (on very low sr5 or very fast sr15) could have 5-10 SR difference which mean in human movement 30-60 meters difference in one round. So the slower run 30meters in 12 seconds (a snail running at 9km/h) and the faster 90m in 12s (27 km/h). -Situation where you cannot attacks (disposable SR5, sword strike rank 7) and the others like Olaf the berserker (axe SR4) do 2 ranged attacks (7sr) throw his two axes (4sr), jump off a roof (1sr) and grab his 2H axe... (2-weapons-2-attacks-in-the-same-round will be for optimized almost cheated fighter only) I will be harsh and make Two conclusions : You want to play D20 systems in Glorantha (Greg and Sandy 'll curse you, if not I will ) or you don't want to play Runequest at all.

Title said rq2rq3-2-weapons-2-attacks-in-the-same-round : and so in the RuneQuest Third Edition Rules, Deluxe Edition by The Avalon Hill Game Compagny or in the Runequest (3) French editions by Oriflam Strike Ranks, page (check yourself or roll a D100), book (don't bother me to tell you it's in combat) or go to player's notes : (in upload down there) And you are right, it's MY mistake first to not be precise : RQ2 is RAW is lower but it's a the little baby... RQ3 is a adult size !

negative-use-of-rune-magic : How so few word can bring so much questioning ? I'v read the thread one hour ago, and my personal Eurmal Tricksty spirit who sat on my shoulder non-stop ask me to think how marvellous and genius you are ! After speaking with Jeff in the new rq 2.5 sorcery about how runes are controlled by western magic, I had a change in mind. First : what is a Rune ? what possessing it mean ? For me, I always told my PC, a rune is non just a symbol or a brick of the universe, it's three in one : the ultimate nexus of a power existing in the "divin" plan, also all the knowledge, concepts and ideas of it and also it very incarnation. In short like a creature a soul, , a mind, a body. As a power, the negative is not possible. If it is, it won't be a very efficient use, 1/10 at best. As a knowledge (like a humakti mastering sword by the usage of death rune), I'll say it's possible because if you know everything about life, you know how end it ! As an incarnation, could DEATH, the sword of humakt be fertile ? yes, because all weapons of the world are the children of death... (tricky, yeah but it works) Second : I always think that you can turn you own magical energy into the power of a rune but I won't turn this way today because unless your personal energy is the law rune itself, you can't create a rune or even a tiny portion of it. You can gather it, control and manipulate it and disperse it : With this vision, you can use a rune to have an opposite or negative effect : If you gather all the Fire Rune (as brick element of the world) from you surrounding, won't people lose their fire, won't the place feel ... cold ? If you manipulate the movement rune to oppose the movement of a boat, like two opposing force this won't be a stasis use or state, just a conflict of movement but still look like something was in movement and then stop. But two movements are still in action If you disperse the fertility in the body of someone, he won't strictly die but the death rune element in him will gain majority effect ... and he will die but it's just an indirect effect. My little Eurmal is saying me a lot of thing but I'll leave it for another days. Great questioning Zit !!! the Eurmal in me really thank you !

100% or more... it's so much useless with the rule of the Cthulhu v7. In the old Basic system why not but not with the additionnels dices. Depend on the way you want to play it with this fellow : -Cool : Give another PC/NPC a bit over 50% and the bonus dice but always make him shoot in good situation like a shot at less than DEX/10 so another dice bonus. 75% and 2 dices bonus make you hit the target as easily as having 100%. -Bad : Play on the night, lights and malus to give him a reason to have 100%, always with half of the skill ! (major success only) -Dirty, like in Dirty MJ : Play the rules stupidly, give him the 100% and the two dices bonus. Make the fight be classic, sometimes easy and whenever you can give a bonus dice, give it and use the rule "at 3 bonus dices : automatic simple success". No test, no fun, strictly never let him touch a dice. Play with the others, explain them the way to get a bonus dice or two to hit. Make them understand that you can always success without having a perfect skill. And when the others get over 50% and 90% give them the extra D10% in another shooting skill. Always remember : Perfection mean no evolution and also you have and absolute confidence in your skill.... over-confidence had kill a lot of hunters.

Agree for the flawed because simples rules are hard to handle, and there are flaws but less than a lot of others sytems... In RuneQuest is for me like St Thomas said : "the perfect is the enemy of the good". If you ask to much you'll get a ROLEMASTER systems. BIG MISTAKE Styopa !! DEX SRm go from 1 to 4... no ZERO : you cannot have infinite speed so no 0 SR, you always need time to do something. There is 2 principles in initiative who are fundamentally different : -Systems like Runequest or THOAN which use linear time and qualitative speed (the greater DEX, the faster but no mesure). -System like Warhammer and D20 which use qualitative time and qualitative speed (The greater the faster but no estimation) For me Runequest is greater because you exactly know what happen and when. In D20, having a greater init is just giving a good feeling for the player and give more thrills. I could say that D20 system is the lower mechanics, the faster play, the better feeling (I really like play Fantasy Craft...in Iron kingdoms). Runequest is not counter-intuitive, it's a precise mechanic, the only non-intuitive is the SR modifier tables (love the logic, hate to have to look for it every time) but some thing making a qualitative speed into a precise and quantitative time is a complex an revolutionary idea (a bit like the number ZERO...) Another great problem with initiative base systems. Have you ever try playing in the arena of monster coliseum : Try it -With Runequest, the time go by each SR (1,2 sec) : every body move at the same time, when you move to someone, he can't teleport away ! -With D20 INIT, there is no time : The faster PC do it first action, instantaneously move at his full movement and no one can intercept him... he is teleporting !!!! When you strictly follow the INIT's systems rules you get anti-intuitive actions, the faster attain his target (cannot even move a millimeter, it's not his turn) do his multiples strikes actions at all PC in range an then he's personal time stop and this the turn on another half-god-manipulating time... it's not a flaw, it's chaotic !!!

I've Just translate the full text (a good think I've got the PDF version) : Preparation : Points of life social = (POW + Adequate social or professional competence)/10 (for every one) Give a score to every element in possession of the detective. A simple "I noticed that" does not carry far, and is hardly worth 10 %. A testimony turns around 25 %, a document give of 40 %. From his/her part, the criminal has a score of defence equal to his POW (power), or to one of his social skills (Charm, Credit …), according to his personality. Contest : In every element which he presents, the detective realizes a test under the score of the element, and the criminal make one under his score of defence. If the detective win, he imposes 1D6 points of damages on the social points of life. If the criminal takes him(it), the detective fails to take the support of his public and lose 1D6 points of social damages. Of course, an element (clue) being rarely enough to make confine somebody, in every new element which the detective give (bring out of his sleeve), he gains a die bonus. A success criticizes double the points of social damages. End, arrest or not : When one of the participants falls to 0 social points of life, he admits defeat. PS : I personally think the dice bonus can be only use if the elements are linked, testimony to have seen Mr Jack and the loss hat of Mr Jones don't match unless the two men have been seen together as friends.

The concept is fine but Weapon/SIZ SR Modifier is the concept of Reach and DEX SR modifier is the concept of quickness ! I know most people think SR.modifier is a nightmarish concept but it's RUNEQUEST copyrighted systems. SRm is difficult to handle but it explain and resolve more problems than most peoples thinks, It also permit you to create new weapons or improvised weapon base on its length : -Classic case : Your two hands n' 2,0 meter length spear get cut in half leaving a 0,98 meter lenght spear, the SR of the weapon go from 1 to 2 so +1SR. -Non-Classic case : GM said you all fight in a short-wide alley so the rule said (in short) every long weapon get a -30%. A cunning player (me) will answer "as malkioni knight I want to use the shorten sword technique, an historical method to grab the part of the blade after the hilt to shorten the length and be able to fight in close combat". GM answer quickly without needed house rule : "You weapon get +1SR and no malus but you have to use it two hand so no shield on the left arm". -Vicious, Eurmal Inspiration, case (I prepared it as secret technique but still keep in my sleeve for another day) : a Rokari soldier challenge in first-blood duel a Loskalmi male knight of Xemela. The Rokari with a long sword is at SR 4 (1+2+1), the healer ask an orlanthi friend to borrow his sword and his solid looking sheath... make some movement, estimated SR7 (2+3+2) then he get the sword back to sheath and do some trick with the strap... The fight is prepared at middle distance (no distance to Melee (engagement) but A charge movement (SIZ SR = 0) is ok for the fastest one). The Rokari player said "I strike at SR 4 so first even if you charge at me", then the loskalmi one respond "I do a charge movement and strike at SR 2"...HOW ? First is charge : the quickness is given to loskalmi because he has a SRm of 1 (you can't hide how tall you are, nor your weapon reach but you can hide your quickness) Second is the secret technique trick : GM explanation "When the healer strike at you, sword in hand with sheath on, he made a looking sweeping strike... you see the sheath sliding along the blade and stop without getting off (the sheath is stopped by the strap attached to the hilt and the sheath) so during this brief strike his weapon length sword out of the sheath 0,80 (,10 in) + solid sheath 0,9m equal a 1,70 meter length weapon SR go from 2 to 1 . In the end his SR is 2 (0+1+1), almost unbeatable. With the thread theme "2-weapons-2-attacks-in-the-same-round" this technique need no extra rules, no house rules just a lot of an open-mind GM. If the first strike is at 2 then you clearly understand he can do a second attack easily (taking dagger + second strike) or (kick second strike + ranged attack (throwing a weapon) and even (shield attack + 2SR movement + round orlanthi shield throwing) ... PS add-on : if you want a quick fight, the simpliest house rule : Replace all +3 SR by + DEX SR modifier (Quickness). high DEX will be lethal and spells to rise dex too...

errors of translations XD, nope 1D6 by page : the very best one of all p64 the weapon named "arc à pierre" (bow stone ...) it take me times to understand this one XD In french : at the beginning of Combat p46 for SR types and the rest is in p52 but you need to carefully read : "Si une arme est utilisée comme une grande lance...". With 2 weapons, there's a lot of tactics you can do : Danold the Legendary Duck with sword SR7, shield SR8 and axe SR7 and (SIZ_SRm = 3, DEX_SRm = 2, sword SRm 2) Round 1 : A charge movement with shield head-on first follow by a powerful slash with sword: Shield attack at SR5 + Sword attack at SR8 Round 2 : Continue with a slash with his sword, and use his shield to attack to : sword attack at SR7 + Shield attack at SR 10 Round 3 : Continue with a slash with his sword, shield is boring so throw it at the enemy : sword attack at SR7 + Shield Ranged_attack at SR 9 (+DEX SRm) -First enemy out, next enemy at charge movement GM is cool no extra SR is need (every GM is cool with Danold) Round 4 : Equip second sword, do A charge movement with Sword follow by the second : 2nd sword equipped at SR3, sword Charge at 7, second sword attack at SR10 ... if he choose to have an axe instead of shield or sword, he can throw them Round X : A charge movement with Axe first follow by a powerful slash with Axe and a ranged attack : Axe1 attack at SR4 + Axe2 attack at SR7 + Axe1 ranged_attack at 10... A lot of combination and wisefull usage of charge... unless enemy have a spear XD

How do you handle it when the police become suspicious? In CoC v7 french ed. a good way to simulate an interrogation by a contest detective vs suspect (sort of social fight): -The detective attack with 3 weapons : a clue 10%, a testimony 25%, a document 40%. The attack do 1D6 Damage to suspect's social HP. -The suspect defend with it best skill or POW. The suspect have social HP at (POW + defense.Skill)/10 If your player had been spot or have left some of their own's possession in the fight, they have some problems...

Example is given with them but not only, I never give the full details to not copy-paste the full book : In Mounted fights, we only speak about these 2 weapons but it apply to every SR 0 types weapons using in thrusting. In the book, rules said you cannot use hacking/slashing weapon but using a 2 meters length halberd as a spear in thrusting is the same and in this case the longer strike first ! In unmounted fights : the same principle is here as long as you use thrusting movement. Macedonian/darra happan's spearman with their 5 meters long spears will get you first ! You will need this rules because players often use a charge movement for striking first at the start of the fight (a duck/halfling with a 3 SIZ.SRm will strike at SR4 instead of SR7 !!!) and the basic rule / reality of my spear is longer than your tiny sword so I strike first will temper them a lot !

Nooooooo, Sorry but there is an typing error : One minute = 5 rounds. One Round = 12 sec. One round is divided in 10 SR. (1SR = 1,2 sec is my usage only... you rarely need it). Why SR is very important : because Runequest use Movement pts (Mvmt) (and old gamers was using figurine for simulation). maths part : 12 sec a round is very important for simplier conversion because 1 movement point is 1 meter per SR and also 1 mvmt is 3 km/h (simplicity is here because just need to multiply by 3, which is impossible with 10sec round). In RuneQuest distance (spell and others) are given in meter, times are in minutes (spells). MOVEMENT : You have lots of creatures in RuneQuest : Dwarf, duck with 2 Mvmt, human, troll with 3 Mvmt and Elves with 4Mvmt and Horse, centaure with 10mvmt. In melee, you move according to your movement (cost : 1Fatigue point) and the double of it if you sprint (cost : 2FP) . So Dwarf and duck do 20-40 meters per full round of melee, human/troll 30-60, elves 40-80m and centaur 100-200m. -Your Strike rank is augmented by the distance you have to travel to get the target. Target at 10 meters : a Shortpack the dwarf at a melee speed will have to add 5 SR, if is SR at axe when charging is more that 5 then he can't strike this round and will strike at usual SR next round. But Olaf the Berserker as a human will have to move 4SR (12m) and with his axe SR of 4, he will strike this round at 8 ! -Shortpack the dwarf at a sprint speed will do 40 meters a round at a cost of 2FP but Trunk, the Vronkal will go at melee speed, lose only one FP an still do the same 40 meters. If you do some fight in the arena of Monster Coliseum (Le Maître des Runes) you absolutely have to master these ! bein short is dangerous ! and if you do 2 attack per round again two distant target, you HAVE to add SR+3 for the second attack and also the SR need to attain him or you end your round not doing a second strike !!! XD Strike Rank and special tactics : The tricks of SR are also vast, A fight is composed in multiple ranges of battle (headache assured !): -Start of the fight / from distance to Melee (engagement) : The longer weapon strike FIRST, don't take in account SR, SIZ/DEX only the weapon length. -In a charge movement / In the Melee : The strike Rank is based your DEX and the Weapon SR modifier (ignore your SR modifier of SIZ) -In the Middle of Fight / In the Melee : The strike Rank is based of your SIZ, your DEX and the Weapon SR modifiers. -In the Middle of Fight / In Close combat : The strike Rank is based of your SIZ, your DEX but the Weapon SR are modified (inversion without number clearly given) So you SIZ and weapon length doesn't much matter after the first contact. Usual SR if for melee strike, contact or charge modify it greatly !!! being a lot realist is time-consuming but pay greatly in an arena dog fight ! (do it once, it's fun and crazy !)

I always love your answer RosenMcStern, because you stick to the rules all the time and just throw the baby with his water when you don't like it ! In most of case, I don't care about the time lenght of a round but the SR are units of time. And they are a core element for SR because they determine your speed and a lot more... In case of Olaf the Berserker (thank you for naming him) it take 1SR to jump down from a roof to the ground so in the rule he strike at SR weapon + Sr mouvement = SR 5 the 8. Haimji answer was a good one, simplier and better than RosenMcStern long and complex one. ( Ockham razor : lex parsimoniae : the simplier is the better ! ). I've been playing with samurai in RQ3 during 20 years and in hundreds of sessions and the very best answer I can give as GM is : Olaf is making a complex mouvement so the simultaneous actions take 3 SR MORE : The two strikes will happen in the same time at SR5 + 3 = Double strike at SR8 ! the player will roll two separate attacks. (This is for Rosen) : But as a master I warn you Olaf, if the enemy use one action to dodge, he will roll two test, one for each attack. In case of success, your enemy will be able to attack you, having using your two actions to attack, you'll be at his mercy ! PS : Speaking about risk transfert is not in the rule, your personnal view of the thing, out of this system, and please don't add some fairness or equity in a battle or a system that strictly doesn't need it. Not everyone are old' rules tricksters... "Used historically" : LOL, even historians aren't all agree about this ! but i can do more : aboriginal archer don't have quiver ! how do they can carry around their bow and their arrows ? Do like me, just look at some reportage about amazonians hunting with a bow and you'll see people with doing it ! And more : you just have to possess a third hand to do the trick, how ? by having a servant like all ancient greeks had done ! It's very usefull a servant (and it's in the rules, you can have servants if you're a noble) some have even 2 hands... Better close the case because it's not this thread purpose I AGREE but aren't you playing at RUNEQUEST : an FANTASTIC AND MAGICAL UNIVERSE where vegetals elves shoot arrow perfectly at 300 meters, where a berserker warrior fight ten bears head-on and still win without big injuries ? Where trolls eats rocks and sometimes used twin axes in a magical lead ? Impossible is not part of the Glorantha ! but you can play elsewhere...

Ohoh.... very interresting ! I won't use it because the sheet will turn to shreds but I really like the idea. I may be more interresting than the skill up roll combining it with the skill class system. It's not really far from the experience system : My main complain about evolution it was that a skill' percentage never give you a true meaning of how good you are ! I've got 50% in attack, am I a good ? or just bad ? I am a pro, an elite ? Same thinking with a artisanal skill ? Chaosium brp/cthulhu answers : creating class (% ranges) to give an skill a level ! In most different versions I could resume them in four to five levels from 0% to 100% ( Beginner / Pro / Veteran / Elite / Master) personnally I prefer the percent ranges : Beginner at 10% / Pro at 30% / Veteran at 50% / Elite at 70% / Master at 90%. With this, you have a better understanding of how good you are ! But one question came back, another time Beginner VS Elite (fight or contest), does we need to even do a fight ? because elite soldier like (hero from Gladiator the movie) vs yourself (neet/roleplayer) ... do you really think you have any chance ? Do an elite really learn anything, because checking a skill by fighting a noob is not Chaosium brp/cthulhu answers : give one bonus dice at Veteran level and two bonus dice at Master level ! (It really work well) As for myself, I always think that you can fight/contest someone to a level close to you (next level higher or lower) but not more than that unless being some gloranthan heroes with Runes Power of by Fate's Rune power. What I like in Styopa system is that you can eliminate the skill roll for evolution (Elite is need 4 check and beginner only one)... but I don't know if deleting the random part of evolution will be so good ???

Enthusiastic... You understate me ! Over-Excited is more appropriate XD. I usually love n' studied the rules but don't base my game on them ! First is to create a mental image of YourGloranthaMayVary and then make the system fit it. It's our reality principles and science's very fundation : The world is always true, the laws of the world are always here to describe and not to decide what happen. ex: Haimji choose a fight from hidden fortress, if your rule cannot simulate it, the rules are at fault not what he want to do with them ! What I present in the this thread is what you can do at the best ! Rules are the weapons of the master, how you use them is how your play/are ! A game is made by the Master to describe and to manage everything and the players speaking about what's feel wrong and how things should be. But the GM is the one at work, he is the one who update/interpretate the world. Most systems have flaws but in 90% of times, the gamemaster is at fault because he refuse to change, to hear hsi players or stick to his rules ! (Communication Rune is lost XD) Glorantha is a Fantastic World Open-mind Universe, if you want to stick to a mechanical rule your are missing one thing : Greg Stafford get the first version of D&D by fax ! and he said "I can do better than this !". Then he and his friends created RUNEQUEST. (to me, it mean) Stick to the rule, just play D&D ! Return to the thread : I give an advice about Viking's book because it's a common theme when a viking jump off a roof (3 meters height) with two axes and simultaneous strike a monster. What will RuneQuest Rules treat this attack if a player want to to this ? (Viking's axe SR = 4) Everyone will say first attack SR4, second attack SR4+3 = 7... but the second attack will be 3,6 seconds latter. My cunning player will said : "How can my second strike be much latter, almost the time for an object to fall from 50 meters height ! I didn't know i was bron in tchernobyl !" Another (Mr fumble, Captain of the obvious) will add : "If the monster in an archer that strike at SR6, I will be killed because is arrow will flew between my too simultaneous attacks" ...Two attack in the same rounds : a nightmare for some master or a salvation. depend how you react to it ?

You're not **really** mistaken : the problem with every skill's description is : it just describe the basic meaning and usage of a skill. In reality, Nito kenjutsu is used in a more vast way and a lot of fighting skill in Land Of Ninja are under-rated because you cannot explain in few words what niten ryu justu is in reality (it's the GM job to fill the blanks). Let me clarify this, most techniques skills in the main book have 3 avantages (martial art () : give double kick damage, double foot damage & double AP on parry) but Nitokenjustsu give only use 2H weapon as 1H weapon & Use weapon with left arm with no malus. For myself I give it what it really mean and limit it's acquisition as being part of the Niten ryû school ! it's my way to fill the blank. In the theme of thread "2 weapons => 2-attacks-in-the-same-round" you need too skills main_weapon (right hand) + main_weapon (left hand) or in the Land of Ninja way : Main weapon + Two swords usage skill. The latter is simplier, more manageable and also more logic if you often use two weapons. Don't forget that in RQ and Basic, creating a new skill is possible, it's part of the system, the problem is to not create a broken or "duplicate skill that already exist".

It seems to me your two ways of classing is (or can be) the same but with differents points of view : 1/ Using a tree classification is GM's memory free but you need the tables to use it, which is not easy manageable in the heat of action. 2/ Using similarity need a few memory and you don't have to open your book every second which is more manageable in the heat of action. EXAMPLE Sword Sword_1H Sword_1H_long Sword_1H_short Sword_1H_short_curved Sword_1H_short_thrusting Sword_2H I take a Dravian language tree, modified a bit, so don't complain about the look please XD With G33K method, it's a genealogy method, each rank get from a weapon to another get a distance and malus : From Sword_1H_Long to Sword_1H_Short_thrusting there is a 3 steps so let's said -10% par step you get a -30% malus if using one weapon but the other's skill. With RosenMcStern principles, quite similar / not so similar / completely dissimilar weapons you could get -10% / -30% / -50% modifier. and in this case you could say between Sword_1H_Long and Sword_1H_Short_thrusting they are not so similar : you get -30%. ==> G33K method is a book rule without GM's point of view. so it's a more fair method but heavier in term of management ! but RosenMcStern is easier to play with but if your master is angry he can get you the -50% even if it's not completely dissimilar and you can't complain. Personnaly, I'll go to Rosen because I don't like tables (remember the terrible Rule Master) but I will use the old one word missing/in excess method (glory to Herowars) so from Sword_1H_Long to Sword_1H_Short_thrusting you have the word long, short and thrusting in differences so get -10% per word missing : you get -30%. A bit more tricky, easy to remember and no one can complain the equity of the GM. It's manageable, a lot more realist. One word : tree organisation is just a point of view resuming a lot things, in reality it's hellish more complex than this for weapons or languages...

One last clue for Haimji : You can read Monster Coliseum (Maître des runes en français) because there is the best description of fighters using 2 weapons or even using net (little rule that can do the trick). Land of Ninja is an excellent book for two weapons holders because there is the Miyamoto Musashi technique : NITO-Kenjustsu ! and a lot more ! Viking is also a good reading because the berserker is played in very clever way using axes as ranged weapons or two hands fights (it's even giving is usual strategy in the berserker sheet). No need to say : my 3 favorites books XD

Nope, this is a carefully reading of the rules... because in the very first part of the fighting chapter there is a "preparing your weapon" which clearly said you need 3SR (will stick to english term) to take the arrow (from you quiver) and get it in you bow. But who ever said you need to take take each arrow from your quiver ??? NO ONE. I said in "excellent conditions" : which mean, like in reality you don't let you arrow in the quiver, you prepare theme before-hand : -Mongols fighters had a peculiar technique to grab them in the hand to shoot them faster (FIRE RATE : 12 arrow in less than 18sec) -Spartans like ancient Greek had a lot of servants which helps the shooters so they can fast shoot at triple rate than usual -RQ rules are based at the longbow fire rate of 15 arrows by minutes max so 3 arrow per 12sec (one round) So you can forget the 3SR between each attack which give 1 attack each SR without the usual 3SR for taking the arrow !!! It's not interpretation of the rules, it's confronting the rule to REALITY ! and reality always win ! Dont' believe me, in less than 5min i found proof : look at the video down page : http://www.benjaminrose.com/post/archery-speed-shooting-techniques-part-2/ In all RUNEQUEST 3, you need 3SR between two actions ! WHY 3SR ? : because it's the most common DEX's SR modifier : writing 3SR is simplier than write down DEX Strike rank modifier everywhere. And if you think taking an object take always 3SR for people with a dex of 5 to 36, than you must have a problem !!! (Very first think my first GM told me). So I perhaps over-Interpretate the rules but I'm pretty sure I'm right and if you can justify that a DEX 36 PC take the same time to take an arrow in his quiver as someone who have DEX of 5 than go ahead ! I CAN DO MORE : RuneQuest 3 Land of Ninja, RuneLord MODE : With the KI, you can do an attack at each SR after you first attack (if you start at SR 1+) so 10 attack per round x SWEEP ATTACK (Naginata or hallebard can hit up to 3 target with 75% of damage) = maximum of 30 hits, 75% damage at all target in range ! a bit extrem, yes but in RQ3 you are more a runelord than never ! For the whip, I agree I use the wrong word and I apologize but Indiana jones whip is not a weapon to me, just a tool... I was thinking of using the chainwhip or Manrikigusari (yes I often play vormain/samurai) which is a melee weapon with ranged abilities so a bit "out of the regular rules" weapons : you need one action to attack at distance and another to take it back ! and it can be use as a whip or a lasso (it's written in the rule). More that, it's a regular 2 weapons in one which doesn't exist in RQ2.

Because it's hidden in the rules : You have 2 actions per round, you can attack with melee weapon, parry with a melee weapon or Dodge. With a one hand weapon, you can only attack one time (the rule don't say anymore) unless you have more than 100% : So having two weapons you can attack only once with your first weapon and you can do another attack or parry with your other weapon, may it be a sword or a kick, and headbutt ...but it's implicit (no clearly written rules) Ranged weapons, whip (is a ranged weapon) or spells aren't melee weapon so they don't consume actions and you can attack as much as you want as long you have enough time (RA : rank of actions). So a whip with an RA of 2 (in a round of 10 RA) can do up to 5 strikes. A bow in excellent conditions with melee RA of 1 can do up to 10 strikes...

Ohoh... if i'm not don't make any mistake you can use your rune raw to augment basic abilities like : -A waertagi having a Water Rune covering up is body with Water elements to swim better -A Loskalmi Noble charging up is body with Stasis Rune (and a tons of magic power) to be able to live hundreds years despite looking in is 40'. -Or an Orlanthi fumble using is Air Rune and becoming a permanent Airhead... XD Not an open-magic but close too and Glorantha's proof.

I really don't like the term free INT but it is not the same as in older RQ(3), you have your full INT minus the number of Spirit (pokemon playing and singing around while you cast a spell) points. But I agree, the limitation of spells you can have in active memory is bad for low INT Character; But if you're stupid why are you trying to be a sorcerer -Magic Scientist- ? It's like having "dumb and dumber" wanting to build a particle accelerator... That's not gonna happen even if Glorantha is a Fantastic World !!! And when jeff speak about Psychic energy, he probably mean the Energy your psychic/INT can manipulate. Magic stored in crystal is raw, event if you have 52 MP, you cannot manipulate all of it. If your hand cannot grab 52 knives at the same time, why your mind will be able to manipulate as much MP as you want ? Limitations by INT is Logic for the Magic of the Kingdom of Logic XD. Hard Limitations of Spells, Runes and Techniques are good for players but not for masters who wants doing some hero(questing) game; But RQ 2.5 is not made for Glorantha's hero(questing) .. Another subject : I don't think magic in crystals are marked by a Rune, it's not a sorcery or divine energy but an all-purpose energy like in any human being. Personally, in RQ3 I always use/give Matrice of magic points but sometimes I specifically give them a Magist's Matrice of Magic which is usable with sorcery only or Uz's Dark sorcery if it's a Matrice of Darkness energy (magic points). In this peculiar case where the energy perfectly fit the magic, I don't count the time usually needed for incantation. Question to Jeff : Will sorcerer be able to craft magical items of enchantments will be add in another chapter/book ?

Great Idea... Personnally, I always think the rune of the world should be the Rune of the "I travel incognito in my worlds" Goddess Glorantha herself ! In my Adventures, I create a Rune with combination of two Middle World rune and one Fertility sometimes encircled. The meaning of the Rune was Fertility of Worlds or The universe of thousands worlds (and points of views as Styopa reminds us) which perfectly describe Glorantha.

Ok, ... making spell is like imagine a polyhedron of (MP) faces, you can have all power you want but if your tiny brain can't process a 18 faces polyhedron, you just can't...unless you have the chance to be born with a big brain capacity, you'll do better/stronger spell than a simple minded one. The skill is just the ability to construct the spell, even if you're bad at it, as long as you can conceive the idea, you'll build what you want with enough time. To sum up, the concept of spell casting in the world of Glorantha is : -Imagination of the spell : Your choose the parameters of your spell, Intensity, duration and range (Player idea) -Conception of the spell : (free) INT constrain you to how much complex you can make a spell (INT limitation) -Construction of spell with the skill : the more time you have, the better chance you get ! (Skills & Time evolutions) As I had suspect, Sorcery is not a field / Battle skill. a sorcerer are like alchimist that need preparations. Your skill percentage should be interpeted as the chance to do the spell in pressure, danger with time limit. Usually, they cast their spells with preparations and never failed them but if they are in hurry, they are almost screwed. So sorcerers are more wizards (wise -ard : a person wise to the excess...) : which mean "stupids malkioni pray ascended masters, wise one imitate them".