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Sir_Godspeed last won the day on June 20

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About Sir_Godspeed

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    Sycophantic Contrarian


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    Some DnD, mostly video games otherwise.
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    Very much a beginner. Mostly interested in the story- and lore aspect over crunch.

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  1. Regular tarring of wood can push survivability into many decades' worth of time in temperate climate, especially if it's a whole-timbered structure. Ultimately though, yes, wood needs replacing during regular maintenance. Thankfully, replacing wood is certainly doable.
  2. This is partly what makes this discussion so difficult. Like real religious beliefs, this isn't something one can discuss "objectively". Everything is written from someone's perspective, often with accompanying terminology. And frankly it is doing my head in. 😅 Ultimately, despite how much I'd like them to, many of these pieces are not going to fit with each other, just like Gnostic and Trinitarian and Twelver Islamic Christology aren't just nicely going to slot together. My impression of Hrestol is kind of a King Arthur-Buddha-Jesus character. Adventurist, spiritual, and more of a practice over technicalities kind of guy. That whole baggage came with his disagreeing disciples after he got crucified/swordified by the Brithini.
  3. I've edited my comment with a bit more information and thoughts. My apologies if that messed up anyone's initial reading.
  4. My bad, I had a piece of misremembered wiki information. I got the impression that Warera was also called Engr, but indeed it's another name for Malkion. I looked up in Revealed Mythologies, and it has a frankly bizarre version of events where Engr is mentioned. Specifically, it pg. 25. that deals specifically with the history of Brithos. For one, it explicitly states that the Vadeli were the native population of Brithela, descended from a goddess named Vadela (which at that point was a peninsula connected to Seshnela, prior to the Darkness). These Vadeli are then driven away by a group of newcomers: "The union of Aerlit Kolate and Warera Triolin fructified in the birth of Malkion, also called Engr. Upon a series of wives he begot numerous children, who later fought with the Vadeli for possession of the land before the Great Dawning" (I hope this does not excede the acceptable amount of text for quotation). It then goes on to state that these battles sank the southern portions of Brithela, and the Vadeli since then hid away, terrified of the Malkioni magics. There's a lot of weirdness here, and I would've loved to know from what perspective this text is written, as that might explain some of the weirdness. For one thing, this seems at odds with the idea of the Vadeli being a sub-tribe of the Viymorni through Viymorn's son Vadel (although Vadela might be Vadel's mother or something), but more importantly it seems to crash a lot with the generally presented location of the Vadeli as being in the south-west of Glorantha, in and around the Danmalastan-Pamaltela intersection, and around the Mostali lands in particular. The Republic of Zerendel, formed by Zzabur around the tribal holdings of the Enrovalini does not perhaps outright exclude the above version, but it does complicate things a whole lot. Lastly, it seems to imply that it was the "Malkioni" (not sure what to call them at this point) that "fired the first shot", not the Vadeli, and moreover the language used seems to imply - at least to my mind - that the "Malkioni" and Vadeli do not consider each other related at all. Perhaps implying that the whole shebang about "Six Original Peoples" is more of an after-the-fact classification system rather than "mythically accurate" (if such a thing can be said to be. I'm reminded of some research suggesting that the Twelve Tribes of Israel probably did not descend from a common male ancestor, and that the Abraham/Isaac story might be later historical justification for the Israelite kingdom's tribal confederation). I know Revealed Mythologies has been superceded by later iterations of the myths, but this seems a bit of a too radical departure for it to simply be outdated. I suspect it's intentionally different, based on different historical/mythical accounts... but whose? Maybe I'm overthinking it. Also, this leaves us another instance of someone named Malkion mucking about. This is hardly the transcendent intellect presented in the Zzaburi (or Old Hrestoli for that matter) chain of emanation from the One. Nor is it the aloof Malkion the Prophet/Ordelvis who sat in his Citadel of Thought being all-wise and stuff. This is a dude born from sexual union like anyone else, leading a war, it seems, for territory and resources. EDIT: The closest I get is that Revealed Mythologies on pg.6. talkes about Malkion the Founder during the Fourth Action, as "going out among the six original peoples" and "duplicating runes" in Danmalastan. A very sanitizen version if we are to believe the later section on Brithos. That being said, there's nothing preventing a place-bound Malkion the Prophet (Ordelvis, Malkion of the Third Action) from being "reborn" (or emanating) as a baby born to Air and Sea Erasanchula (Engr, Malkion the Founder, ie. Makion of the Fourth Action). If Yahweh or Vishnu can, why not Malkion. Perhaps this is the Malkion the Founder of which Hrestol spoke. A les sympathetic, more prosaic retelling of the ordering of Danmalastan, or the Republic of Zerendel (possibly greatly compressed as far as Gods Age narratives go). Although it does make me think about the oddness surrounding both Malkion and Waertag having so much in common. Heretical thought: Do the Waertagi hold Waertag and Malkion (the Founder or whoever) to be the same person? Wonder how Zzabur thinks about that, if indeed he does. EDIT: Did some editing around the "weirdness" paragraph and added an entirely new paragraph about pg.6.
  5. Is the emanationist theology (or "Malkionology" in reference to Christology) of Invisible God/The One -> Ferbrith -> Kiona -> Malkion etc. a more recent "invention" than what is being talked about here? From the Glorantha website, it seems Zzabur acknowledges these, which lead me to assume that this is an idea of very old provenance. Malkion is both the Invisible God and the Prophet, just at different stages and with different roles/names. What's interesting about this view is that different directions of Malkionism then disapproves of different emanational levels. Brithini Zzaburism disapproves of Malkion the Sacrifice (iirc), Irensavalism disapproves of Malkion the Creator/Makan (ie. Ferbrith or Kiona, depending on whether you consider the 2nd or 3rd action "creation", iirc.) Or should this be seen as a reinterpretation of Malkion the Prophet's God-Time wanderings and teachings put into a larger cosmogenic context? EDIT: Also, I thought Engr was Malkion (the Prophet)'s mother or wife or something?
  6. I get the feeling that an architecture historian would find some of these examples a bit odd for a Bronze Age/Antiquity-centred setting (some of these palaces and forts are from well after 1000 AD, more like 14-1700s, iirc., although I'm not an expert). They certainly look great though. The unifying concept of "onion-domes" in both Indian/Persian-inspired Seshnela and Russian-inspired Akem is pretty neat though.
  7. Eh, personally I find "sir" fine. I mean, if Pentans can be "sultans" it's difficult to argue that "sir" somehow is inappropriate.
  8. I found an response by Greg on a mailing list from 2007 where he states that the "Third Age Loskalmi Church is largely based on Irensavalist beliefs", although he goes on to say that this means they are "not Malkioni" aside from worshipping Malkion the Prophet. I assume by this he was referring to the split in the attitudes towards the Demiurge. https://glorantha.steff.in/digests/WorldofGlorantha/2007/0739.html From what I've come to understand, Irensavalism is basically Gnosticism, in that it sees the creator of the physical world not as an agent of the Godhead/Invisible God, but as a deceiver and an obstacle to true salvation/Joy. By this, I am guessing that what Greg means by Malkioni are more akin to small-o orthodox Christianity, who either sees the Demiurge as the Godhead, or as an agent/emanation of the Godhead/Invisible God. Correct me if I'm wrong here. Also, it's over ten years old so he may have changed his ideas since then, I couldn't say. From my above look, I'd guess it's less Malkion the Prophet/Sacrifice, etc. they see as corrupt, and more Malkion the Law or Ferbrith/Kiona, right? I know this is all made more complicated by the fact that we have several local names for these emanations/stages of Malkion/the Invisible God, eg. the Jrusteli Makan and all that. Sheesh. Nice and clear, thanks. Gotcha.
  9. Watch out, that kind of talk is liable to get you branded as a Riddler.
  10. When I first read the Guide, I got the impression that Loskalm really was the only stronghold of Hrestolism left, and that (New Idealist?) Hrestolism was the only real surviving form. What is the difference between Loskalmi Hrestolism and Hrestolism in other areas? And Men-of-All exist in Rokarism too? Are they simply mounted warrior Talari there?
  11. I was just using the Red Planet as an example by which to show how planets in Glorantha differ from the RW in general. The exact orbital mechanics of Sargash wasn't the focus.
  12. We're talking about the planets only here, really, although the difference between planets and stars in Glorantha is less defined than in the RW. In the RW Mars, a planet, would be a reflective body of mass that could never pass between Earth and Sun. In Glorantha, Shargash, a planet, is a luminous body of mass that can (hypothetically) pass between Earth and Yelm. Byll goes on to question whether these luminous bodies are opaque or not, that's a fair question. Even if they are opaque, then what we get isn't the RW "darkening" or even "blackening" of the sun, but more of a dimming.
  13. I'd say more Hellenic than Sumerian (although the difference might be moot). Lots of mystery cults, occultism and skullduggery - perhaps something akin to how the Greeks (and later Romans) became overly fascinated with Egyptian and Anatolian cults. The city-states feature large differences in governance, and often seek to legitimize *their* form of government based on the fragmentary and lost accounts of the Autarchy. City-leagues joining together to jostle for position. Minor fleet arms race over lake Felster itself. Generally looming fear of Seshnela in the west, if I recall correctly. EDIT: Didn't see Scott-Martin's post. Covers much of the same territory, and gets across the atmosphere really well.
  14. "Extreme religious conservatism" Yeah, about that... *stares at Lightbringer Missionaries, Esrolian Grandmother Earth Revival, Kitori, Empire of Wyrm's Friends' Dragon Cult, Alakoringite Orlanth Rex Cult, Sun Domers, Elmal-Yelmalio Synthesis, and more* That's not too bad a historical dynamism for extreme religious conservatives.
  15. Joerg mentioned this, but I'd just like to add as well: most of the entities in the Gloranthan sky are self-luminous as opposed to RW where they merely are reflective. Therefore they would presumably not "eclipse" the sun in the conventional sense (ie. darken it) even if they passed in front of it.
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