House/Optional Rules for BRP

[TrippyHippy]

The new revision of the BRP core rules have been going down pretty well, I think, and I for one like the manner in which the game system has been refined without altering the base beyond recognition. I do know that some people were hoping to integrate some ideas from new iterations of BRP, however, and I think one of the strengths of BRP lies in its flexibility as a system to integrate different ideas well. So I propose creating a thread where people can suggest new BRP systems and modifications that other people can take or leave as they wish. 

Here are a few of mine (taken from various sources): 

• Calculations of Power Points: Why not calculate Power Points based on POW+CHA/2 in a levying manner similar to calculating Hit Points with SIZ+CON/2? Charisma can be under-utilised as a stat and now that they have shifted it back from being APP again, one can consider that the term ‘Charisma' often can refer to an innate or divine power anyway. Some adjustment might have to be made to the value of Charisma if using the Points build method, however.
• Uses of Power Points: For people bemoaning some of the missing ideas from Call of Cthulhu 7E, why not have an option to utilise Power Points to augment rolls by a factor of +/-5% for every PP spent? Or have PPs being spent on re-rolls or bonus dice or flip-flopping? Not every character is a spell caster or has super powers, but this rule allows them to make some utility from their Power scores. 
• Divorce Sanity from POW - Sanity can go up or down and is an optional rule in any case, but for those feeling that POW is an overly influential Characteristic, why not simply have Sanity determined by an independent 3D6x5% roll? It does address the issue of having powerful-but-insane sorcerers by divorcing the notion of magical power being linked to rationality and mental health.  
• Make both HP and PP percentile scores by multiplying both scores by 5.
  • The values for using various Powers would also have to increase by a multiple of 5, but you could use the percentile score for a dynamic Luck total in a similar manner to CoC7E. 
  • The values for Damage would also need to be altered. However, you could simply have damage calculated by adding the two D10 scores together from the percentile attack score and then add/subtract for different aspects of the attack (like +5% for sharp/heavy/big respectively). The Damage modifier could also be adjusted (+5 instead of +D4; +10 instead of +d6 etc). For firearms and lethal damage you could simply take the straight percentile score rolled for the attack and apply it directly to the HP tally (as long as it is a successful attack).
• Flip-flops for advantaged/disadvantaged checks, blackjack reading of dice and matching dice for special successes. This is an old chestnut, but it makes the system more intuitive. Matching dice on a successful roll could give a bonus (like double damage) or allow a character to make a special move or stunt. Matching dice on a failed roll means a complication of some sort, incrementally getting worse the higher you roll. You get the best possible result if you can match your skill score exactly on a roll and the worse possible roll on a 00. 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 14, 2023 by TrippyHippy

[hix]

Putting Strike Ranks back in

[TrippyHippy]

Actually what might be more interesting, for high Dex scores at least, is the rule from Superworld that has Initiative determined by DEX score as usual, but in intervals of 10. 

So, the highest initiative goes first and then subtracts 10 from their score. If there is nobody higher they go again and subtract 10 again, with multiple actions until somebody actually challenges their score. 

Strike ranks are quite specific to Runequest’s feel, I think. 

 

 

[pansophy]

Removing the amount of Combat skills for not so combat heavy games, using only: Brawl, Melee, Firearms, Heavy Weapons & Throw. 
Then, simplify Damage done by weapons: 1-handed: 1d6; 2-handed 1d8; Firearms 1d10; Heavy Weapons 1d12. I know, this does not necessarily make a Grenade Launcher more deadly than a Revolver, but might still potentially kill a character.

In using those house rules, we are not trying to simulate combat to the very detail, but want to make it survivable to progress the story while still keeping the tension. The Healing rules are tough as they are written already, so characters might survive a round of combat, but definitely will not stay in it for long.

[Stan Shinn]

On 4/14/2023 at 6:11 PM, TrippyHippy said:

...blackjack reading of dice...

 

 

 

 

What is "blackjack reading of dice"?

[Ravenheart87]

24 minutes ago, Stan Shinn said:

What is "blackjack reading of dice"?

When doing opposed rolls if both sides has the same success level, whoever rolled the highest wins.

[Stan Shinn]

23 minutes ago, Ravenheart87 said:

When doing opposed rolls if both sides has the same success level, whoever rolled the highest wins.

Ah, that's a great approach!

[Stan Shinn]

Here are my house rules. I would love any commentary or other ways to improve these approaches. Basically, I don't want my players to have to do multiplication or division during the middle of combat, so these rules aim to help with that.

• Easy Special Success/Critical Success Calculation: Any roll of 1-20 is potentially a higher success level. On a roll of 1-5, roll again. If the second roll is a success, then it is a critical success. Likewise, on a roll of 6-20, roll again. If the second roll is a success, it is a special success. 
• Easy Fumble Calculation:If your skill is less than 100%, a roll of 99 or 00 is a fumble; if your skill is over 100%, only a 00 roll is a fumble. 
• Easy Difficult/Easy Roll Calculation: At the GM's discretion, dice rolls can be made with advantage (flip the dice and take the higher of the two results) or disadvantage (flip the dice and take the lower of the two options). Easy rolls are made with advantage (instead of % x 2), and Difficult rolls are made with Disadvantage (instead of % x 1/2).

I am also putting around some rules to make gaming with miniatures function more like other modern games (and wargames). Here's one rule I've used for that:

• Ambush: On your turn, you hold your attack and await an opportunity to act. Until the beginning of your next turn, you may react once and attack under one of two circumstances:
  • Waylay: You may stop an enemy during its movement that moves within visible range to shoot at it (if within range) or engage in melee (if the target moves within 5’, at which point you make a free move to close with the target and attack). After the waylay attack resolves, the target may resume its movement and actions if it can. 
  • Return Fire: Immediately return fire against an attacker who shoots at you.

Still wondering if reducing turn length from 12 seconds to 6 seconds, and making move more like D&D (30' for a walk, 60' for a run) might work better with miniatures.

[Mugen]

On 4/15/2023 at 1:11 AM, TrippyHippy said:

• Make both HP and PP percentile scores by multiplying both scores by 5.
  • The values for using various Powers would also have to increase by a multiple of 5, but you could use the percentile score for a dynamic Luck total in a similar manner to CoC7E. 
  • The values for Damage would also need to be altered. However, you could simply have damage calculated by adding the two D10 scores together from the percentile attack score and then add/subtract for different aspects of the attack (like +5% for sharp/heavy/big respectively). The Damage modifier could also be adjusted (+5 instead of +D4; +10 instead of +d6 etc). For firearms and lethal damage you could simply take the straight percentile score rolled for the attack and apply it directly to the HP tally (as long as it is a successful attack).

Isn't your rule for damage the same as Unknown Armies ?

On 4/15/2023 at 1:11 AM, TrippyHippy said:

• Flip-flops for advantaged/disadvantaged checks, blackjack reading of dice and matching dice for special successes. 

Concerning the blackjack method, the reluctancy of Chaosium to have it as an option is very strange to me. I know it confuses some players, but once you've gone past this confusion, it's both simple and effective. Far better than the "highest skill wins" option from the BRP SRD, at least. Plus, the game that introduced it is Pendragon, a Chaosium game.

Edited April 18, 2023 by Mugen

[Ravenheart87]

1 hour ago, Mugen said:

Concerning the blackjack method, the reluctancy of Chaosium to have it as an option is very strange to me. I know it confuses some players, but once you've gone past this confusion, it's both simple and effective. Far better than the "highest skill wins" option from the BRP SRD, at least. Plus, the game that introduced it is Pendragon, a Chaosium game.

It is an opotion in BRP - see Opposed Skills Using Highest Successful Result on page 174 of the BGB and page 112 of the new edition.

[TrippyHippy]

1 hour ago, Mugen said:

Isn't your rule for damage the same as Unknown Armies ?

Yup. 👍

Concerning the blackjack method, the reluctancy of Chaosium to have it as an option is very strange to me. I know it confuses some players, but once you've gone past this confusion, it's both simple and effective. Far better than the "highest skill wins" option from the BRP SRD, at least. Plus, the game that introduced it is Pendragon, a Chaosium game.

There is some concession towards highest roll wins in a contested roll in this new BRP edition, but the 1/20th roll for Criticals is too ingrained long term to have matching dice I think.

[Barak Shathur]

If a weapon is used both for attacking and parrying in the same round, it incurs the cumulative -30% penalty for each of those actions beyond the first, not just for parrying. 

In melee, a shield can be used to cover the locations given in the Shields table if it is not used to parry actively with, as per the rules for slung shields. 
 

 

[NickMiddleton]

On 4/15/2023 at 4:15 AM, pansophy said:

Removing the amount of Combat skills for not so combat heavy games, using only: Brawl, Melee, Firearms, Heavy Weapons & Throw. 

Mine are Unarmed (fighting not holding anything), Melee (fighting with things in your hands), Missile (throwing and other ranged weapons powered and aimed in the same action - javelins, bows etc), and Projectiles (ranged weapons where aiming and powering are separate actions: crossbows, fire arms etc).

I also these days use a lot of “specialisations” -  Weapon Groups in Magic World are specialisations for example. But they can also be a style: so Duelling is a potential Melee or Unarmed specialisation; Firearms FIBUA (Fighting in Built Up Areas) and Marksmanship potential Projectile specialisations. I tend to make field, artillery and siege weapons specialisation by technology / role in Projectiles.

I should really do something with my draft Magic World / BRP companion…

 

Edited April 18, 2023 by NickMiddleton

[Mugen]

8 hours ago, TrippyHippy said:

There is some concession towards highest roll wins in a contested roll in this new BRP edition, but the 1/20th roll for Criticals is too ingrained long term to have matching dice I think.

To be honest, matching tuces is not an option I like, because it does not scale with skills above 100%. I like when experts get something even when a task is super easy for them.

I prefer crits under the tens of the skill, and specials under half the skill. Like in SPQR and french Rêve de Dragon.

[Mugen]

1) In combat, when a parry's Success Level matches the attack's, damage is reduced by an amoubt depending on the weapon. If the défender rolled higher, that amount is doubled.

Dodge uses skill opposition rules.

2) in a blackjack opposed skill resolution, if both protagonists failed their roll, the highest roll wins.

3) tens of a succesful roll are its success level. Crits count as 10. In case of an opposition where both protagonists have the same SL, the difference is the Success Level.

[hix]

On 4/14/2023 at 7:17 PM, TrippyHippy said:

Actually what might be more interesting, for high Dex scores at least, is the rule from Superworld that has Initiative determined by DEX score as usual, but in intervals of 10. Strike ranks are quite specific to Runequest’s feel, I think.

The BGB has the superworld method as DEX ranks, iirc. But impulse systems in general are the only way we play now. Static initiative just has too many frustrations. Round-based impulse, despite displaying what somebody on here called "the worst of both worlds", is our jam. Breaks up the flow enough, doesn't require any sorting, and most importantly for us in a game with guns, makes movement over time matter.

[TrippyHippy]

8 hours ago, hix said:

The BGB has the superworld method as DEX ranks, iirc. But impulse systems in general are the only way we play now. Static initiative just has too many frustrations. Round-based impulse, despite displaying what somebody on here called "the worst of both worlds", is our jam. Breaks up the flow enough, doesn't require any sorting, and most importantly for us in a game with guns, makes movement over time matter.

To be clear, are ‘impulse systems’ those that essentially forgo initiative order determination and simply have players nominating who goes next after their turn in whatever order suits the narrative and generally uses contested rolls to determine all outcomes? 

‘Cos, I’m wondering if Pendragon basically did that years ago?

Edited April 19, 2023 by TrippyHippy

[hix]

3 hours ago, TrippyHippy said:

‘impulse systems’

I borrowed the term from wargames, where it's an impulse system if what you are doing takes time, allows reactions, and movement happens as the impulses (strike ranks, phases, whatever) tick by. As opposed to an "i go you go" static initiative system.An example of a "pure" impulse system would be Ringworld, where there's no rounds, you just keep counting impulses.

[TrippyHippy]

Oh, so like strike ranks or Feng Shui’s tick system?

[hix]

yeah, gurps counts too with the way they use seconds

Edited April 19, 2023 by hix

[TrippyHippy]

Gotcha. 

For me, it depends a bit on genre, but I like to have simple Initiative systems in practice.

I don’t really like the traditional Initiative+diceroll methods for the most part as they involve GM book keeping (writing down the order and possibly re-generating each round). In D&D this system is really baked in as there is too much of an advantage for some character abilities (like back stabbing or some spells) if the Initiative order is predictable. However, it matters less in BRP where there isn’t usually such a great advantage about who goes first. I

Random card order - like that used in games like Savage Worlds or Alien - are usually a quick way of maintaining uncertainty with a bit of gameplay tension. These systems often don’t have an Initiative modifier, so gameplay that depend on speedy reaction times for their effectiveness aren’t always represented well.

Fixed Initiative orders - like in order of Dex as is the default in BRP - are a really straightforward mechanicism. I actually include GURPS calculated scores in the same way - they are just a little more granulated to avoid having same scores. This highlights the basic issue when too many characters have the same Initiative score and there is no way of differentiating. I have resolved this by having players roll off before the game and then just get everybody to sit around the table in Initiative Order before. Of course, some find this a little boring, but in context, it works.

Nominated turns is a great system if used in games where the mechanics are set up already with contested rolls. In Pendragon, for example, the Skill roll essentially integrates initiative because whoever wins the contest gets to apply damage, while the loser soaks it up. As combats are almost always 1-1 in Pendragon the actual initiative order becomes irrelevant. Recent systems like Marvel Heroic Roleplaying and others have also realised this, and just have players nominate who goes next (including a turn for GM controlled characters) after they have finished their turn in the spotlight. It actually encourages players to think about the narrative and team work. 

We have also used some variations around the table, like in D&D where whoever gets the highest Initiative score (after rolling) then gets to nominate the direction Initiative travels around the table. Clockwise or anticlockwise around the table, noting that the GM controlled characters will all act when it moves through them. Again, very simple in practice - and no book keeping. 

So that is me!

[Mugen]

About non-standard initiative systems, I quite like the following ideas, and it's possible to use those in BRP.

-"Popcorn initiative" from Margaret Weis' Marvel Super Heroes game. Initiative is only rolled to determine who acts first. Afterwards, next character is chosen by the acting character. Of course, you can't chose a character that has already acted before everyone acts.

-7th Sea first edition : you roll a number of d10 equal to your maximum number of actions. Each die is a "Initiative Rank" where you'll be able to perform an action. For instance, if you rolled 8, 6 and 3, you'll be able to act at IR 8, 6 and 3. In order to react to an action, you need to discard dice whose sum is equal or superior to the die of the acting character. So, if I attack the character above at IR 9, he'll have to discard his 6 and 3 in order to actively parry my attack. He will still has a passive defense nonetheless.

-White Wolf Street Fighter. Each move a character can perform has a Speed value, which depends on the nature of the move (hard punch are slower but deal more damage, parries and dodges are very quick) and Dexterity. At the start of a turn, a character plays one move card face down. Then, actions are resolved in ascending Speed order, from slowest to quickest. The interesting part is that anyone with a quicker move can interrupt the acting character at any time, provided he is targetted by the move or targets the acting character. The interrupting character then performs his full action round. After that, the original acting character resules his action round. Of course, "cascade" interruptions can occur, where each character is interrupted by a quicker opponent.

[TrippyHippy]

15 hours ago, Mugen said:

About non-standard initiative systems, I quite like the following ideas, and it's possible to use those in BRP.

-"Popcorn initiative" from Margaret Weis' Marvel Super Heroes game. Initiative is only rolled to determine who acts first. Afterwards, next character is chosen by the acting character. Of course, you can't chose a character that has already acted before everyone acts.

Just to clarify, the game published by Margaret Weis Productions was Marvel Heroic Roleplay (Marvel Super Heroes was published way earlier by TSR in the 1980s) and the initiative system involved no rolling for Initiative at all - the ‘Watcher’ chooses who goes first or spends points from a ‘Doom Pool’ to get the NPCs to act first. Then the player who has acted chooses who acts next and so on. It works because the rolls are all contested anyway.