Joerg

I don't think that the Orlanthi artwork that has been done prior to the Guide has in any way been invalidated - if you look at the mural and the carvings in the image where the Vingan presents the (shaved, and more importantly severed) head of the clan champion to his chief and his advisers are completely in line with earlier representations. The city of Pavis was the only "Sartarite" city that we had aerial views of for a long time. While the aerial views of Sartar's cities in Sartar - Kingdom of Heroes and Sartar Companion probably are in some need for an update, this is the first time we get to see Esrolian-influenced architecture and art. I admit that I still have somewhat mixed feelings about the new representation of Clearwine, but if the Balazar citadels can have such architecture, why shouldn't Second Age Orlanthi cities have had it? In case of Clearwine, there should be an almost jarring side-by-side of woodcarvings and ancient, somewhat awkwardly restored frescoes or mosaics for their religious artwork (thinking of recent "vandalism" in Spain when local volunteers were not hindered restoring ancient murals or statues). The giant architect(s) of the Balazar citadels might have done similar work for the EWF a century or two earlier. We haven't seen enough votive ceramic and wooden/bone figures left at shrines or temples. Woven and stitched tapestries should rule. Heck, I want an image of the loomhouse, with unfinished works in the frames, ideally being worked on. I am a great fan of the Swenstown trading scene. I never wanted the Sartarite cities to look like Hedeby, and Manching with its rectangular grid of almost uniform standardized generous town houses is a bit too orderly for Sartar. On the other side, I can see the City of Karse layout (based on Edward's Caernarfon two peaceful centuries after walled city and castle were planted in the wild) expanded by some of the planned chaos of the contemporary Bergen Brygge as the wooden port district shooting up after the Opening and some rather idyllic fisherfolk village on skerries in the estuary, all of it slightly re-styled into Seleucid Phoenicia/Judaea or even Ugarit/Mohenjo Daro style architecture. (Leave the layout of Punic Wars Carthage for one of the Pasos Isles naval bases...) The Orlanthi do have a civilized past their back-to-the-roots emigrants into the Dragonkill-emptied homeland tried very hard to ignore. It took repeated assaults on the Colymar village to re-construct the "class 2" ruins (in Pavis Box categories) of Clearwine Fort. (There was a joke that the old Chaosium headquarters, prior to the Issaries-split-off, could have been described as such - a flat-roofed office/storage house with intact roof.) I think there should be a shrine in a pre-Christian stave-church predecessor type of temple to the clan wyter in clans outside of such inherited architecture. Even if the clan is worshipping Orlanth on some sacred hilltop, the clan regalia will keep better and are more easily guarded in such an edifice. Reconstructions of the Cape Arcona temple (to Svantevits) might be another good influence. The Lusatian/Hallstatt fortified town of Biskupin might be a good model for an all-lumber architecture away from easily accessible quarries. I am rather curious what kind of imitation of Heortling and Esrolian art styles in Grazer iconography ambitious Vendref artisans have come up with. While I think that the Grazers might have their own jewelers from their own culture, a lot of their material culture is going to be produced in the three trade posts instituted by Sartar. I would expect some scythian style gold work...

Large giants should be good craftsmen because of their affinity to creation magic (their species itself being a remnant from the Creation Age), and those with a stronger affinity to Disorder should be hampered by that. Any artisan is only as good as his imagination or the way he understood the work order if doing contractual work. The stupid brutes like the encounters in Griffin Mountain or the tainted ones like Bigclub from Snake Pipe hollow should be lousy craftsmen. They might be able to improvise their clothing or their weaponry without much trouble, but getting them to understand principles like static or planning is a different proposal. We would probably be astonished at Bigclub's ability to knap a boulder into a usable hand-axe, or to skin a few bisons for a new loincloth, and I see no big problem there. Hand-eye-coordination probably finds its limits at giants' eyesight. But then, I would expect a lot of the cradle artifacts to be sung rather than hand-crafted, and in that case, the complexity achievable is not tied to any manipulation bonus.

I guess not for lunch break reading. How far down the pipeline is that? Does Kalin know?

Which Storm Bull example? Another thread? In case of the killing of a scapegoat animal sacrifice (unlikely to be an actual goat outside of Lunar interference), I can see why the peaceful cut wouldn't be applied, but then there is the question how that meat will be used. Dog food would be an alternative, if the sacrificers did keep dogs, but that's as rare in Dragon Pass as are domestic goats. I am wondering about sacrifices to Humakt. And what about sacrifices of horses (to Elmal)? So the worship (deity) skill sort of includes the Peaceful Cut, or replaces it in worship situations (where Cult Lore might be the more efficient augment)? A majority of the meat consumed in an agricultural society (even in the cities) may originate in the sacrifices performed by the clan or the stead (compare the Paulus letter about consumption of sacrificial meat). Abstinence from meat consumption prior to a holy day may simply be lack of leftovers from the last sacrifices. A major reason to slaughter a beast outside of a sacrifice might be the requirements of hospitality. Those who can afford to house guests will eat better. Among the Praxians, eating meat is the price for sapience, and beasts will be slaughtered outside of bigger religious rites, hence the ersatz-rite held by the butcher.

There is the question which Lunars are up and about to interdict Orlanth worship, and for which reasons. There is a strong revanchist faction in Dara Happa which has numerous grievances - the invasion which ended the Bright Empire and their blessed Khordavu lineage, the years of indignant tribute paid while the foreigners prevented the Dara Happans from having an emperor (a state of being they fear more than outright exposure to Chaos) when Ordanyestu was adviser, the reign of the Golden Dragon during the EWF, and the tax in magic and goods that went to the Third Council. They claim that the 1042 retaliatory raid was cheated of much of the treasure, and they blame the losses of the Dragonkill on the hill barbarians, too. While they were pleased that the Conquering Daughter put the hill barbarians in their place and that Hon-eel cheated the Tarshites by installing her son as their king, they still feel entitled to a return of those riches they claim were stolen from them, and they want the god of their ancient foes to suffer in Hell, too. This faction has no interest whatsoever in turning the hill barbarians into followers of the Lunar Way. The Lunars obsessed with the ultimate ascension of their goddess as sole ruler of the Middle Sky (known to the Orlanthi as Middle Air) have a reason to cripple the Storm God and his claims to that realm. They aren't that interested in punishing his worshippers, and would welcome them as followers of the Lunar Way since that is one way to weaken the cult of Orlanth, but they surely are out to drain any flow of magics that may strengthen Orlanth's hold on the Middle Sky. The Tarshites are mainly interested in adding the riches of the land to their own domain, which includes the inhabitants, and to some extent also their magic. Phargentes, Moirades and Pharandros inherited a "Vingkotling" lineage Orlanthi kingdom, with Hon-eel claiming the precedent of Yarandros, the fourth king of the Pauper dynasty, for her son Phoronestes as successor of the last non-Lunar Illaro dynasty king, and Phoronestes likewise for his son Philigos. They are aware of the futility in suppressing the urban temples of Orlanth (or the easily identified holy places next to the major settlements), but see the value in weakening the rebel magic of the kings and chiefs. Their preferred outcome of the occupation was assimilation of the Sartarites to the Lunar Way similar to their own kingdom, under their control. It isn't quite clear where the Eel-ariash ambitions lay in this. On the one hand, they are actively pursuing the betterment of the Lunar Way and her domain over the world, on the other hand they are the patrons of Hon-eel's Tarsh dynasty. Sor-eel in Pavis has been quite tolerant of the temple to Orlanth there, sending in Faltikus, which seems to place him in the Tarshite camp.

What is the situation with ritual sacrifice of beasts? Are the spirits/souls of these beasts released, or are they given to (into the care of) the recipient of the sacrifice? In other words, is the peaceful cut necessarily a part of animal sacrifice?

Malkionism has always verged on the edge of henotheism towards the Earth and Sea Mothers of their race. At the same time, there is the philosophical problem of Earth being so entwined with Matter. Any Orlanthi henotheism includes Ernalda. The Waertagi are henotheist Sea worshippers. Ehilm in Ralios will have a degree of henotheist worship, but the Autarchy was called the Stygian Empire for its mastery of/alliance with Darkness, so it wouldn't have been that dominant. Ehilm pretty much stands in for Yelm in any henotheist worship. Dara Happan or Pentan Yelm doesn't get many sorcerers. Idovanus as Carmanian Yelm has already been mentioned. The Red Moon has its own sorcerers ripped out of the Carmanian (dualist, Irensavalist) tradition. Red Moon sorcery outside of the empire has not been reported to make any major impact. Seshnela was fighting a civil war between lineal Hrestolism aka Makanism and Rokarism when the moon rose, and had no great use for henotheism any more. Ralios has its Arkati mysteries, and those who confess to stygian Arkatism are opposed to Nysalor in all its appearances. Arachne Solara is a difficult concept to grasp outside of (theist) mysticism. Maintaining both stringent logic and mystic insight is possible (see Irensavalism and Arkatism) and deals with higher realities. Arachne Solara is the mystic expression of the Universe from the theist approach. The God Learners may have learned about that, but their understanding of the theist entities was already incomplete. Something beyond that?

The Aedin's Wall myth in Heortling Mythology names Aedin as just another deity (daimon), not a giant. However, the cradles and their toys are renowned pieces of artisanhood, and for giant-built structures look at the citadels of Balazar.

Should be. I never played RQ2, but basically this is a set of rules that uses ships like characters or monsters, with a few special abilities, and requires a few skills from player characters who interact with the ships. I would be very astonished if these rules or a variation thereof aren't in the Big Golden Book of BRP, too. I used them as a GM in RQ3 in the variation for the Vikings box. Shiphandling in a chase mostly, no real naval battle.

Not to my knowledge, unless you count the Cradle. Ship rules came with RQ3 DeLuxe, and good ones, too. RQ6/Mythras has a nice pdf on this topic, too.

Toddlers are halfway out of the mother's responsibility unless she is the main nanny of the household (or even stead). Older sisters near initiation (from either side) are going to be assistant toddler keepers. The core family of father mother full siblings is rarely the reality. It is pretty common for at least one parent to be absent. It is pretty common to have patchwork families, although only the children of one of the parents at the abode of the clan. First cousins and uncles, aunts, nieces and nephews within the same age bracket will grow up as siblings. If there are more households on the stead/in the townhouse enclosure, the children of the other households will grow up like cousins to the sibling group mentioned above. Children of renowned god-talkers or of companions of tribal nobles are likely to see their parent(s) only on rare visits, and more likely to regard their grandparents or an uncle or aunt as their primary adult relationship. All of that is of course a matter of social standing. Cottar households will have fewer folk to fall back to, and might be forced to step their births further apart.

In the middle of combat, Meditate is not your friend. There is sorcery, with considerably longer casting times and longer durations, where the use of meditation becomes interesting. If you are casting a spirit spell without having the focus at hand, meditation still only betters your chance of success marginally, but the repeat casting would be two melee rounds later. There may be situations where the attempt to cast the spell will make you the focus of attention. If so, you probably will want the best chance you can get for the spell to come off as expected. I haven't familiarized myself enough with the enchantment rules in RQG, but in RQ3 characters dabbling in enchantments usually used the ceremony bonus to prevent waste of material and preparation. The accelerated MP regeneration feature is extremely nifty if you just had a successful Divine Intervention or some other cause to lower your POW dramatically. Approaching maximum POW, the benefits diminish.

Yes. I think I said so.. However, there seems to be something like a fluctuating steady state in population, with population maxing out somewhere near sustainable maximum (which is 180k to 200k for Sartar, I suppose). With each woman having 4 or 5 surviving kids, the population would explode. My calculations were based on the assumption that the clan population of 50% will more or less reflect a steady state, and that requires some child mortality, to whichever factors. Without child mortality, making a cut at 12 years, you need clan population divided by 24 births per year, nnd for a steady state population, as many adult deaths. Making the cut at age 15, it's clan population divided by 30. I'll have to check with an expert on Bronze and Iron Age graveyard populations, but I think my suggested attrition isn't too far from historical conditions. So had other regimes bent on racial purity. Parent status is enough of a deal that the Orlanthi have an ersatz-ritual, the Wanderlore quests. There is a lot of status for a pregnant woman. Fertility magics get boosted (and reflect well on the unborn child, too). Having a breastfeeding baby on the arm is similar. Contraception charms and fertility charms probably exist, and might even out in the statistic. But that job would be distributed between the godi and the elders - in fact, this is one job which the elders are best qualified to do. This sounds like the Murphy's Rules self-beheading quota projected on initiations. And we are talking about Orlanthi. Flawed humans are well within expectations when each and every magic went exactly right.

Monrogh clearly has claimed the inheritance of Palangio the Iron Vrok with the temple at Vanntar, so there is some good precedent for a hostile neighbor relationship. Slavery is a secondary concern, much like in the US Civil War.

With half the clan consisting of underage children, one has to inflict quite a death toll to keep population numbers stable. On average, a bit over half the children would survive to become adult. Doing the math for a steady state takes a bit. With an average age of iniitation of say 16 years we can group the children in four age groups. Age up to four can be considered 80% survival, age group 5 to 8 70% survival, age group 9 to 12 60% survival and age group 13-16 50% survival. With 50 births a year, that corresponds to 160 toddlers up to age 4, 140 children 5-8, 120 children 9-12 and 100 children 13-16, about to be initiated. On average, that's 30 initiations per year (taking into account that there will be a number of adults in the 13-16 range, and that mortality at that age may be lower) in a clan with 1040 people (adding up the number of children and doubling the result), and 30 deaths of adults, to keep the numbers stable. When times have been hard, mortality goes up, and the children-to-adults ratio will rise, even when initiation age gets lowered. Population numbers will go down for half a generation while the birth rate increases, but my child mortality numbers above already take into account occasional famine and plague. The child mortality rates probably are too high with only a 10% mortality rate for the adults. Let's drop the 13-16 age range from the number of children. That's an average of 40 children initiated per year in a clan of 840 people, and as many deaths of adults, still a 10% death rate. Using the same survival rates with 80 children born in a year: 256 children age 1-4, 224 children age 5-8, 192 children age 9-12, 48 initiations per year on average. Total people in the clan 672*2 = 1344, on the high end of clan size, and a 14% death rate of adults of all ages. Numbers of dead children in 4 years: age 0-4 64, age 5-8 32, age 9-12 32 - a total of 128, meaning 32 dead children per year to accompany the 48 adults - up to 80 funerals in the clan, same number as the births, so the numbers check out. Since the deaths will occur in times of hardship, probably less than half the number of funerals. Let's try lower child mortality, 60 births a year, children defined as under 13. age 1-4: 210 (30 deaths in 4 years, one child out of eight) age 5-8: 190 (20 deaths in 4 years, one child out of ten) age 9-12: 180 (10 deaths in 4 years, one child out of 18) - 60 deaths in four years, or 15 deaths per year. On average 45 initiations per year, and as many adult deaths, in a clan of 960 people. Even less than 10% of the adults. 60 births a year means about 180 fertile mothers and as many fathers out of 480 adults. That leaves 120 non-reproductive adults, or a higher average birth frequency. It also means that there is a moderately high likelihood that a young woman leaving the clan above age 17 will leave a (usually welcome) child behind in her parental household, or take it along for adoption. Widows leaving the clan should equal widows returning to the clan, and daugthers married out of the clan should equal daughters-in-law received, in a steady state situation. Widows remaining in the clan may still reproduce, with or without re-marrying inside the clan. These numbers might need some attrition for people leaving the clan without dying, possibly taking along a few toddlers if moving to a city, joining the household of some tribal noble, or being taken into slavery, but that will just re-define the death figures.

While it is great that the parents and grandparents get involved in the big events of the past, there should be a list of local events that give equally great fame on a local level. Players should feel free to add local claims to fame for event-less years.

What age of giving birth to the parents did your math assume? A woman stays in the cult of Ernalda until she stops giving birth for good. When creating the family at Redhorse Stead in my ongoing experiment to find out how the Elmal split would have affected families and clans, I encountered the problem that there are way too many children. It isn't unusual to grow up with your uncles and aunts in the same age group if your father is a first- or second-born child. Female initiation can start at 12 years old, in extreme cases considerably earlier. Male initiation can be delayed until age 17 or even later, and may start at age 14. Special boys, rattle born children etc. may face adulthood at 12 or earlier. Marriage age starts around 17, three to five years into adulthood. First children will appear a year or two afterwards. Last children may pop up more than 20 years into a long-lasting marriage, or in someone's fourties. Powerful men and very fertile women are likely to get children in their fifties. It can be more extreme with heroic characters. Esroilian Queen Bruvala gave birth to her last daughter Brengala in her late sixties. King Hofstaring fathered a daughter on Entarios the Supporter of the Greenhaven Earth Temple around age 100. There may be an age difference between the parents, somewhere inside five years is considered normal, and even fifteen years won't raise much of an eyebrow - in either direction. About half the marriages may last long enough to see the children reach adulthood. Having children from several partners, primary and secondary, isn't unusual. The age difference between the grandparents of a single person can be an entire generation. I had one grandfather who served in WW1 and one grandmother born after that war - they were/would have been 64 and 46 when I was born.

Yes, from his mother's side there's Inora, and probably Tara, the Lady of the Wild. The sisters at Dini only appear as a nameless and shapeless group. Not sure whether Niskis is the right name to bring up here - the Niskis episode was when Orlanth in disguise replaced the exiled Storm King as Ernalda's lover. (And I wonder how many inhabitants of Storm Village were fooled by this...) Tat and Tol are the two rather inexperienced if scoring lovers who explore the world, and I think that until the conception of Barntar we have to deal with Tat rather than Niskis.

Then it is the absence of a cult that enables the Grandmothers to enforce their misandry and authoritarian rule in her name? It isn't like joining the Grandmothers requires any form of enlightenment. From what we discussed about Bruvala and her successors, carrying the previous ressentiments over and letting them dictate her decisions is pretty much a non-liberated approach. Fact is that the Grandmothers weighed the disobedience of headstrong husbands or husband candidates like Rastagar, FInelvanth or Broyan heavier than furthering Chaos and bringing destruction upon their very families. Did the Kitori have a grudge against Broyan of the Volsaxi? Sure. Would the Norinel connection have egged them on and given them the whereabouts and means to strike? If they could remove an ally of Samastina, certainly. Not out of love for the Lunar cause, but for hate and fear of Kodig. A question why this ancient principle chooses a shape associated with a more ancient reign of sky people may still be asked - does her shape hark back to a time of avimorph sky humanoids/vaguely anthropomorph bird people in the early Golden Age? Revisiting slavery: The Esrolians provide at least one group of the Heortlings in Dragon Pass who have a tradition of slavery, and with the autocratic rule of the grandmothers and their at times spendthrift expenditure of men without any regard of personhood, possibly as a general cultural trait.

The storm boys get their tutelage whenever they walk out of the door. 6 out of 7 males are Orlanth initiates, thus there is no shortage. And there will always be uncles or granduncles who may serve as a role model. Between these two Elmali bloodlines there are enough followers of Orlanth that you don't need to go to the Storm Voice, who will lead the clan services anyway that all boys within reach of the iniitiation group are going to attend. The herders have both Orlanth and Elmal, making the extended field trip to the summer pastures a different kind of school. Being left with the sheep (that do quite well on their own in the mountains of modern Norway, give or take the occasional loss to wolverines or wolves) offers them an opportunity to test those observed or instructed manly patterns. The toxic ones, too. Then there is peer review, especially from those recently initiated. I've also skipped the non-godspecific adulthood rite. The Elmali are going to experience the Star Heart and I Fought We Won just like the Orlanthi will, although their way there may be different, and their way onward too, or do they go through the Initiation of Orlanth, skip some stuff, meet Hengall, return, and then get a separate rite to Guard the Stead, Bind the Horse or whatever? The dual initiation of Jaronil may have been true from his original initiation, or he may have qualified for the other deity later on. Which one ever came first.

The cult of Elmal does provide its own red-headed fighting woman - Redaylde/Redalda, the horse-loving daughter or Orlanth/Vingkot. And yes, the future of this position in Monrogh's ideal patriarchal society should be one of the telling points for the conversion conflict. If I get to make this into a freeform about the Monrogh conversion, the characters Chalanyr and Organda will have this on their agenda. For a breeder cult, the Elmali are in the difficult position that the Hyaloring horse mother Hippoi somehow didn't get as adopted as did Beren (and Ulanin). All the studs, little of the mare. Yelmalio isn't in any better position. I will need to make the Defender of the Stead the focus of the Brightshields, the other Elmali bloodline. The outline above has about as much about horses as the topic can bear, possibly too much of it, but it made economic sense to me. Here's a look at the Brightshield Elmali. A lot less ambition and muted drama, mostly, but if placed in the Monrogh era, that might change during private Elmal services at the Redhorse stead. If placed in the Hero Wars era, replace the plague with the losses due to the WIndstop. --------------------------------- The Brightshield household Unlike the isolated Redhorse Stead, the Brightshield household headed by Korlaman is located in the clan village. It is a square, two-story stone building with a slightly enlarged inner court with areas that while roofed are open to the central area. On the inside, only the ground floor has stone walls, everthing above is built from timber. In the center of the inner court there is a pillar built from the same stone as the walls, with a torch-shaped oil lamp on top, under a convex bronze shield protecting the flame from rain and symbolizing the celestial dome above the ever-burning torch atop the mountain. Current head of the weakest bloodline in the clan is Asborn Elmalandtisson Brightshield, well past his sixtieth anniversary and a somewhat quarrelsome and headstrong initiate of Orlanth Thunderous who breeds the white bulls used for a number of the clan sacrifices on a stead away from the main village. Korlaman Halfbreath is the ailing patriarch of the household, A mighty warrior in his youth, he contracted a bad spear wound to his chest which he barely survived. He used to boast that even though he could draw only half as much breath as anyone else, he was twice as alive, but now that he has seen his 58th year, he ruefully adds that he also lived twice as fast as anyone else. Others say that he aged along with his wife Ivarna, who was ten years his elder. Asborn has been a widower for three years. He has resisted suggestions to marry a young lower status wife to be his partner for his final years or one of the elderly widows remaining with the clan, leaving the post of hearthmistress to his older daughter-in-law. The younger brother of Asborn farms the household’s allotted land around the clan village with the hallmark spotted white oxen that did not fit the criterion for sacrificial white bulls. Korlamans sons Instand (35 years old) and Intagarn (32 years old) are both initates of Elmal, continuing their grandfather’s creed in the bloodline. None of Asborn’s surviving son has initiated to the Sun God, and the household shrine in the stead has received only token service and sacrifice to Elmal over the last decades. Instand is the plowman of the household while Intagarn tends to the cattle herd, aiding Asborn in his breeding program to provide those white bulls. The brothers are accomplished warriors and exemplary men of the clan’s hearthguard, regularly taking sacred watch duty during the clan rites or at the wyter’s shrine. There was no great glory to be won in those roles, however, and the boast of the raiders in the clan warband sting. Instand’s 39-year-old wife Bevara is hearthmistress of the household. An initiate of Mahome and Ernalda originally from the Riverbottom clan, she never could break into the domination of the Richmeadow wives in the loomhouse. Intagarn’s 29-year-old wife Ravenna is a prideful Ernaldan weaver born to a Ravenfriend master weaver. Both couples have experienced joy and sorrow with their offspring. Five years ago a plague struck the clan, and four children of the household were claimed by Malia. (Alternatively, five years ago the Windstop claimed the children while the two brothers carried the responsibility to guard the clan with their magic.) Ernesta Instandsdotter is the oldest child of the household at just seventeen years. The matchmakers are looking out for a suitable husband among the rural clans, but she feels that her skill at making glazed earthware might be better placed in the tribal city. 14-year-old Kalf Instandsson is mourning for his cousin and age mate Oresta, oldest child of Intagarn, and his younger brother Borni. He spends half of his days and nights over at Redhorse Stead learning the finer points of horsemanship and horse breeding. 12-year-old Karesta is the older of the surviving daughters of Intagarn and Ravenna. She has become the focus for her younger cousins Hengall (six years old) and Votena (4 years old) and her own baby sister Garneva (approaching her second birthday). The household also offers roof and table to Durstan Thrallborn, a clan orphan of sixteen years and recent initiate to Orlanth. Durstan was taken in after he was the sole survivor of his family and has proven a valuable helper both on the fields and with the herd. Durstan received responsibility for a white heifer born last year that had not been accepted by her mother, and under his care the orphaned beast has become a veritable beauty, catching the eye of Asborn. Durstan is determined to hang on to the heifer and raise his status in the clan and gain the Brightshield name for himself.

Ok. But that is what I would expect from a leaping kick, not a move to gain a foothold without something to grab and hold on to. Not sure if my interpretation is correct, but I would let a character make a jump roll before allowing him to kick someone into the head from a running start (using targeted hit location attack rules), much like a rider making his ride roll to maneuver himself into an attack position. If it is a chase scene across rooftops or garden walls, that normal success would mean that the jump delivered the leading foot on the top of the wall and one or both hands in position to pull the character up and let him continue afterwards, or to roll on top of a not too steep roof as result of the leap. A normal success should allow the jumper to clear the horse rump and to pull himself into the saddle. High llama riders either need to be significantly taller or have a different technique like pushing their foot into a sling on the flank of their steed. Olympic high jump heights were about chest high before Dick Fosbury changed the way the athletes had leaped since antiquity. No idea whether pole vaulting introduced this earlier or whether it copied the high jump technique - the original pole vault may have had only a sand box for the landing, so coming down feet first before rolling off would have been essential for the survival of the vaulter. The Fosbury Flop doesn't look advisable to try without a thick springy cushion for the landing or virtually no falling distance from that height, either. Circus athletes routinely leap onto the (slightly hunching) shoulders of their team mates from the ground, or take on additional momentum by leaping from the robbers ladder assist of one of their team mates, or one of those seesaw catapults.

Is it clearing that height with the lowest part of their body or reaching that height with their outstretched arms? I read the jump height as the latter - you jump up to reach a branch/dangling rope/the edge of the wall or roof, rather than you leap up to land standing on your feet.

@Bohemond was right - keep the dialog parts, replace Orlanth by Kodig and rewrite the myth in between, and you get the dystopian view of the male storm that is prevalent among the Imarjan Grandmothers, themselves being as much of a group of entitled violators of personhood. And, as I just mentioned over in the slavery thread, the resulting marriage of Orlanth is as much a searing purification of Orlanth as the Baths of Nelat, only this purification comes across as pleasurable while hurting and abrading his asshole self. You don't need to write a myth about pleasurable wooings, you can take existing ones from the Downland Migration. Durev and Orane, Barntar and Mahome. Each of these with a purpose-made version of Orlanth - one a wooden puppet given personhood, the other purpose-bred.

Those might be derived from the Gerran martyrium, when her "hosts" amputated all her limbs and more (without killing her) for food during the Greater Darkness. While it is tempting to make comparisons to the accelerated mystic training the Kralori subjected Sheng Seleris to, there was no direct cultural exchange between Kralorela and Peloria before Sheng's conquests, and Danfive's piercings and mutilations predate that. Austerity in mystic practices aren't that rare, but the point in many of these is that they are self-inflicted. Tne Dnnfive Xaron mutilations appear to be cathartic rather than punitive in nature, self- or at least peer-inflicted as token of liberation from former crimes. Of course, like the Gerran self- or peer-inflicted piercings and amputations, the voluntary nature of these do reflect an involuntary earlier practice. Danfive is a product of Bull Shah rule in Peloria, which was about as cruel as the horse warlords and the Spolites ever got. The Bull shahs in turn learned their inflicting of torture from YarGan and the Blue People, which leads back to the conflict between Vadel and Zzabur the Flayer and what they did to non-Danmalastani. But the general thrust of these austerity practices appears to be the cynical "pain is good for your character" sentiment. Dara Happan society has always been tiered, and the upper layer may have started out as feathered non-humanoids like King Griffon, with the humans a servant population in their right place, and not only satisfied but pleased to bask in the glory of their overlords in that place. Mythically, that is. The Lodriiites aren't slaves. Or are they? Vinga appears to be another Sairdite deity. I know that Jeff Richard used to say that everything about Ernalda comes from Saird, although that was before Greg developed and shared his Ezel material. Vinga appears to be the deified version of Janerra Alone, who led her On Jorri people from oppression under the Storm invaders to be an integral new part and component of the Storm Kingdom. It is the wooing of Orlanth, not the passive accepting role that has been discussed over in the Orlanth Abuser thread, not the elusive Lady of the Wild style "I won't be conquered, so conquer me" style, but the woman taking agency after nobody in her group has succeeded, taking on the traits of the oppressor yet retaining the capacity for giving birth. Saird is a distinct part of Peloria, on the fringe of the Solar microcosmos (as depicted in the Copper Tablets with the eight towers). It doesn't appear to have been part of Murharzarm's realm, but it became part of Anaxial's realm in a mythic overlap possibly caused by the reconstruction of the universe from shards of reality. The Anaxial myth has Anaxial seeding the new post-flood world with equals who lose status for departing early, with only the people who remain on the ship until the ship is transformed to the new city (Yuthuppa) fully worthy of personhood. Yet even so, the initial Yuthuppans were tiered. The Pelorian Vinga or Janerra was the female child saved by pregnant Herustana against the divine plan that Anaxial carried out with his ark, the remainder of the female rule preceding Brightface, the one who became the wife of Urvairinus. The one who reappears generations later as the slave who suffers being amputated for food, gateway to a very different form of liberation. There is a question about the status of the On Jorri in Orlanth's kingdom. Even though kin of the demigod ruler of the mortals, they appear in the list of other "wretch" populations that the Orlanthi took in as lower tier and/or lowest tier "us". King of Dragon Pass first explored this myth, introducing the Nalda Bin people, from which later came an entire list of such refugee ethnicities absorbed by the Orlanthi. The Clan Questionnaire hinged the question of acceptance of thralldom on this mythic event - you are given the chance to include them as full co-equals (carls), as mostly co-equals but of lower status (cottars), or as wretches who better be thankful that their children may have a better (still under-priivileged) life in your clan while being worked (too death, this being the Great Darkness) without gaining much of the fruit of their work (thralls). The way of Gerra, to whom losing her hair was one of the earliest amputations/humiliations in the Manarlarvus cycle of her myth. In a way, <G/Jan>erra changing from her nurturer mother role to the warrior mother is a series of amputations, too. While not exactly a parallel to the painful purification myths elsewhere (like the Baths of Nelat stuff), Janerra sheds much of her self to become one with Orlanth, to become Orlanth, impregnating herself that way. Reducing motherhood to just impregnation and delivery of the blessed child destined to rule and accept her people. (And pinging back to the Orlanth Abuser thread, this is paralleled by Orlanth's married life. While pleasant, Orlanth's marriage is an ongoing ordeal of purification. Lucky bastard.) At last, a return to the "slaves of the bird-headed tyrants": Imarja, Esrolian archetype of ruthless authoritarian rule, fearing Kodig. A goose bill may appear less brutal than a raptor bird's, but the bite while not cutting is every bit as powerful and may rip out flesh without cutting it off first.