Jeff

And Glorantha is flat. Distant objects are smaller and far enough away you can't see them without magic unless it is something truly huge like the Red Moon (40 km or so in diameter) or the Spike (about 6000 km tall). Here are some notes from last year: Glorantha is a flat world surmounted by a Sky Dome. The Sky Dome itself tilts back and forth, north and south, each year. The Sun's height in the sky also changes throughout the year. It is highest in the sky (and brightest) in Fire Season, lowest in the sky (and dullest) in Dark Season. These effects can and have been measured. Nick Brooke's charts in his Gloranthan Manifesto (volume one) are really useful for understanding this. One of the weirdest effects of this is in Pamaltela, where the God Learners observed that in the north the seasons were roughly the same as in Genertela, but heading further south into Jolar, it actually got warmer in Dark Season the further south you got. They theorized that due to the tilt of the Sky Dome in Dark Season, the celestial heat spilled out onto the Sea of Fire beyond the Nargan Desert, warming the south. The movement of the stars and planets are carefully observed by many Gloranthan cultures. Interestingly, the Sunpath planets do not have retrograde movement, apparent or real, as they move along the Sunpath. However, the Southpath planets do move erratically. Shargash is perhaps the worst, speeding up and slowing down depending on the length of its path, although regardless of path taken, it always takes two weeks to go across the Sky Dome. (See the Guide to Glorantha for more details). This stuff is all observable and measureable. Although there is a distance beyond which things cannot be seen (varying on the size of the object) with powerful enough magic this can be overcome. For example, atop the Footstool of Yelm in Raibanth it is said that the Emperor can see anything in the Middle World. And there are tales that during the Broken Council, watchers sat atop the Tower in Dorastor and watched for the movements of their enemies in Dragon Pass and even Seshnela.

The map scale has always been one Dragone Pass hex is 5 miles or about 8 km. That's the absolute scale. That is the scale for the map in the Starter Set, the maps the Guide to Glorantha, etc. There hasn't been use of things like "keymiles" in nearly thirty years. So that is just a weird anachronism.

Not according to the Red Goddess it is not. The truth is that much of the Entekosiad had its origins in The Yuthuppa Book, where Greg explored a lot of Pelorian low mythology. Greg then played around with the idea that Entekos was the origin of the Red Goddess, but She shot that down pretty hard.

Beyond Yelmalio, there are several Light (as in Sky without Fire or Heat) deities. Polaris is the most important Star God, but there are not doubt lesser Star cults. Yelorna is another Light goddess. And of course Dayzatar is associated with the Light Rune. Dendara has a secondary association with the Light Rune. Call me wacky but I find five to be more one.

It is intended. You are clearly playing a different style of game with different player expectations than the game designers. That's fine, but for me, I think further discussion is pointless.

Most of my players are not Gloranthaphiles. The main difference is that I simply what everyone through the character generation process in the core rules and usually do that collectively - which means, pick a culture first, then do a family background. If they have a strong and defined idea what they want, we steer it that way, but most don't have a particular idea beyond "I want to play a warrior type or I want to play a noble woman or an aged veteran down on his luck" and so on. Once they get past the family background and the Runes, it becomes really clear what kind of occupation and then what cult would work best for them. The Zebra Rider with a strong Fire Rune and a strong Man Rune got to chose between Yelmalio ("that's the god of Light in the Darkness") or Pavis, and picked Yelmalio ("I don't want to be confined to one city!"). The Pol-Joni with the strong Death and Air Runes debated between Humakt and Orlanth, but her background made it easy to chose the god of Death and War over Storm and Adventure. And so on.

What makes them work is necessity. The Sun Dome temples early on learned that disciplined masses of spearmen could outperform tribal militias, horse thanes, arrays of levies led by Sun priests, mobs of trolls, etc. Sure they aren't better than the best units that Sartar or the Lunar Empire can muster, but they are better than MOST units.

I think it is useful for people to know that this is not how the writers approach any of these cults, and even the tools being used for analysis would be discouraged for writers. To me this whole approach seems to be an attempt to hammer a square peg into a round hole. The cults are what they are - that's the setting. If you want to change them for your game, do it. If you want to get rid of Boldhome, the Holy Country, or the Lunar Empire, do it. But to the RQ design team, these cults have the spells and abilities they should have. Sure, there are local variants with some additional spells or a some well-known spells missing, or with some gifts and geases not seen elsewhere, but they are more or less as published. Plenty of people have played Yelmalio characters - heck, one of my current group plays a Yelmalio-worshiping Zebra Rider! In my own games, we've had players follow Yelmalio, Orlanth, Ernalda, Humakt, Issaries, Lhankor Mhy, Eurmal, Chalana Arroy, Maran Gor, Babeester Gor, Storm Bull. Ty Kora Tek, Pavis, Lanbril, Lodril, Yelm, Seven Mothers, Yanafal Tarnils, Shargash, Aldrya, Zorak Zoran, Kyger Litor, Argan Argar, Heler, Waha, Eiritha, Ygg, Dormal, Daka Fal, Black Fang, and various Malkioni sects. And that's just RQG. Each of these cults provided fun and interest for their players. I don't think any player I have gamed with ever picked a cult because they were trying to figure out which was most effective. Almost always they start with a culture, then a background, then pick the Runes that appeals to them, then pick an occupation - and only then pick out a cult that would work for them. As an aside, a quick survey of the Red Book of Magic rune spells A-C had about 52% of the spells being fundamentally non-combat oriented and only 48% being primarily combat related. That's high of course, but no where near the 4 out 5 spells you claimed above. Are you reading the same material?

This entire discussion is so far away from the approach that anyone on our design team takes as to be almost painful to read. This is like a glimpse through a glass darkly into a strange Bizarro dimension.

Probably because they are small minority of the actual cult. There are plenty of cults that offer spells or abilities of marginal utility to certain communities. Humakt's undead fighting abilities are not important in areas without a lot of undead, and Sense Chaos is not terribly useful in most civilised lands.

The Grazeland Pony Breeders are Pure Horse People, and are descended from Yelm. They maintain their restrictions that they herd only horses and do not engage in agriculture, which allows them to contact Yelm directly.

David - I recommend you reread the skill: Initiates also may train in the Kuschile Horse Archery skill, allowing them their normal archery chance from horseback regardless of their riding ability. This latter ability costs the same as Ride but is independent of that training. Learners of this skill must accept one random geas in exchange. With Kuschile Horse Archery, you might be barely able to gallop (25% Ride) but can still shoot your bow at your regular 75 or 85%. That's a BIG deal, especially for an agricultural society like most Sun Dome temples.

How are you discussing with them? How are you meeting them? I mean they are dead after all. Are you wandering around the Hero Plane somewhere trying to find them? Did you critical a Love Family roll while visiting Orlanth's Hall on his high holy day? Is this the start of the Lightbringers Quest, when the ghosts show up? Are you hiring a Daka Fal priest to summon their spirit? What is going on? Each approach to the dead is going to have a different result.

They are all as old as each other. Both have their roots in the First Age.

If I recall, Greg figured that Kuschile Horse Archery dates from when the Pelorian Kargzant was recognized as Yelmalio in the First Age. As Yelmalio is also the solar horse god, it meant that the cult members of the Peloria hills could serve as mounted archery without being particularly good horsemen.

Kuschile Horse Archery allows relatively poor horsemen to be good mounted archers. I expect it is much more common in Dragon Pass than in Prax (the Praxian tribes don't really need it because they are excellent riders to begin with).

Are we talking Sun County in Prax? The point is that Yelmalio's weapons are the spear and pike, large shield, and the bow or javelin. His followers might be familiar with other weapons, but he doesn't particularly mind or care.

The number of souls we say a person has is really a matter of how a cult defines things. So with the Orlanthi we have: Darkness Soul (the individual’s shadow); Water Soul (blood and bodily fluids); Earth Soul (bones, tissues); Fire Soul (bodily heat); and Air Soul (the vital breath). The Orlanth cult says your vital breath is the essential you - and it, as magical Air, will return to Orlanth's Hall until it is carried down again by Orlanth's winds to return to the world. If you are a hero, part of it always exists there in Orlanth's Hall. Meanwhile, the Ernalda cult focuses on the bones and tissues that can be preserved and cared for within the Earth, where its magical essence resides with Ty Kora Tek. And it is possible to meet the same dead soul in both the Lands of the Dead (Ty Kora Tek) and Storm Home or at the Four Winds or wherever.

Old Wind Temple is about 5 km into the mountains, and likely fairly high up. Let's assume that Last Rest (also called Old Wind Village) is around 1000 meters elevation and Zomi Mountain is 2400 meters.

I doubt Ernalda is particular important to the wind children.

Old Wind Temple is just on the other side of the mountain from Dragon Rest. There is a pilgrimage path from Last Stop up into the mountain valley where the Stormwalkers live.

The Wind Children are the descendants of Air spirits and mortals who mated in the Gods Age. They are able to deal with Air spirits as kin and are far more attuned to the Air Rune than humans. They might even understand and label the Air Gods differently than earth-bound humans do, as their proximity to them gives them a more Air-oriented perspective - like looking at clouds and weather systems primarily from the point of view of a pilot rather than a farmer.

Zzabur says that the will, the ego, the self - all that is explainable in materialist terms as matter and energy. There is spirit and soul, and that is the energy source that powers the raw matter - the body. But when the body dies, the energy is NOT the self. And thus it is nonsense to talk about Solace or whatever. Sure maybe some of that energy goes to various places, but you are not that energy.

Have you ever been spelunking or tried to wander around in the dark with just a Coleman lantern (which is infinitely better than any torch)? But honestly, you have made your point ad infinitum - you don't think the Waha or Yelmalio cults have the Rune magic you wish they had. A few people agree with you, others do not. At this point I think this particular thread is over and I am locking it down. Create a new one if you want without such a negative name.

You are welcome to do whatever you want, but I see no reason to add any such spell to the published cult or to the Cults Book.