Qizilbashwoman

motion of the... uh, air

I'm about to make you cringe: I am starting to be able to read German. But I pronounce it exactly like Yiddish: with a rolled r like Italian, five tense vowels [a ɛ ɪ ɔ ʊ], ü is [ɪ], ö is [ɛ], eu is [aɪ], ei is either [aɪ] or [ɛɪ], etc. and absolutely no glottal stops anywhere, which is like... the most infamous part of German to non-German speakers. Vos denkstu, mayn khaver? ([khaver = comrade < Hebrew]) I know, I know, I'm terrible. But I'm not about to mess up my Yiddish (i'm a third-year learner) just because I want to dig my way through scholarly articles in German.

I take what you were saying about the complexities of Dara Happa and Dara Happan women, although to be fair, at the time, it was ruled by Carmania and thus royal women seem to have benefitted. The Good Daughter confusion was my bad - that was her name in the Green Age and then the Dawn according to a bunch of things including the Entekosiad and I slept badly. No, I mean literally the initial Lunar Way freed all slaves who joined and this was followed by the First Manumission of the Imperium, which was still technically separate at the time. It was during the riots caused by the First Manumission that Valare, the author of the Entekosiad, was discovered by the agents seeking Natural Illuminates, which is why I know this little tidbit at all! Soon after, of course, the Empire was fused with the Lunar bureaucracy when Taken Egi was enthroned as the Red Emperor and slavery once again began to happen. By the current era, slavery is rampant. (It seems like the big turning point in the Lunar Empire was when Taken Egi's souls were damaged in 1449 during what I believe was a battle with the Mad Sultanate of Tork. Once He lost real souls, that's when the Lunar Empire really started losing its way to corruption and madness.)

well yes the people i feel bad for are the people who have to learn it as a second language, it's batshit, who wants to learn a language with such a remarkably ridiculous number of vowels and even more ridiculous number of diphthongs.

Not to be, uh, that person, but why is Barntar and not the Earth Goddess? Is it the phallicism of the plow? Inanna's "come plow my fields"? I've always been a little confused about why Barntar is Air rune

I'm an American citizen and I'm not sure they'd give me a Visa. Not a good time to be here, they're arresting American citizens in public who are carrying their passports. I'd flee but uh nobody would take me?

I see you don't live in, like, England or New England

There's two things to remember: what does your table want and will be comfortable with, and what does your table want to talk about. I'd like to just preface what I'm saying with this because one table might want a lot of flexibility in gender for play (i.e. the old hack that Lhankor Mhy women wear beards) but not really want to play games exploring it. They just want to fight or fuck uz and assassinate the Lunar governor, not discuss the issue. Another table might want to actually heroquest to prove Vinga is not Orlanth's daughter but the face She shows to Her women initiates and spread that truth to fight the Lunars amongst the disaffected youth. Be sure what your table wants to do. So... ideas about gender in prehistory and in modernity are not identical nor are they static, and certainly not over the last fifty years when Glorantha was being written and played. We've seen a massive amount of scholarship and cultural change. Like, where's my gays at in Glorantha? In my brain, I'm never going to ever think compulsory heterosexuality is a thing, because unless you are a Yelmalion jerk who hates all kind of love and sex anyway there's no cause for it. In my brain? Since Heler and Elmal's friendly rivalry over who gets to be husband for a year is a lot friendlier than most people's. But more seriously, I think flexibility is built-in for those of us with discomfort in all directions. If your table wants Vinga to be Orlanth, fine. The lore says she is either Orlanth as a woman or his daughter. You can pick. Multiple genders is openly stated, although it's not really clear the author knows or can define what that means. And if you want men and women to be inviolate categories in Glorantha, well, you can do that, too (although the game does provide some outlet for gender-bending, such as Vingans and the male White Ladies, the bone-setter guys). These statements about genders and sexes mean maybe we can question what it means when we talk about initiation. Vingans are adolescents who initiated as women. Maybe the four genders include - as in many societies - persons who initiate unexpectedly? This is something that people did in prehistory, that they did in history, that they did in the modern era, and that we do right now. The Scythian nomads figured out that drinking pregnant mare's urine induced abortions in women and feminised men and the Greeks reported they had amazons (women-men) and women who were born as men (we've found their graves). This is the origin of the drug pre-ma-rin. The Lunar societies are particularly ripe for this kind of interesting thing. Dara Happan women were slaves, not citizens. The Lunar Way (initially) freed all slaves and established a Darsenian-Spolite matriarchal tension, where women are primarily cultural and religious leaders and warriors while men are social and territorial leaders and warriors. Women and men work in a weird kind of parallel harmony: the Good Daughter and her Masks and her assassins and magical army versus Monsoon the Red Emperor and his Masks and his massive armies. There's even a parallel bureaucracy. But people cross the lines all the time: the infamous Seven Mothers include three actual men - a warlord, a criminal (perhaps an Orlanthi), and a big bearded ex-Buserian ex-Lhankorian scholar. So I think the answer is as always that your Glorantha may vary, and in ways that we know people in the past and right now actually do. Sorry this is messy; I'm mixing up a lot of things like uhhh Gloranthan theologies, gender 101, YGMV, game ideas, and so forth, and it's Sunday morning.;

Here's a theological question I'm unclear about: are the seven solar gods around Yelm his souls? (Yamsur is his death.) Also I need someone to make a meme of the sun gods with Yelmalio in the middle like this one (bloody Nysaloreans)

who said you can't wear pants as an Orlanthi, this comment just confuses me

Respectfully, Jeff, Kralorela supplements use the chopsticks font, the names are faux-Mandarin, and the society is faux-Ming-Qing with mandarins. If we're gonna make it Not Real Bronze Age China we have to fix this with a really big hammer. It's demonstrably driven people away. Shang China was men and women rulers, soldiers in bronze armor, wheeled chariots, cavalry, shamans of divine ancestor cults and river spirits, human sacrifice, and really amazing myths about the sun being murdered... Very good Gloranthan stuff to start with and then riffing off of. And using Gloranthan-style names would help immensely instead of faux-Mandarin. Sarah Allan's The Shape of the Turtle talks about Shang and Zhou mythic ideas, which are really weird compared to what we consider "Chinese"

I'd like to say I'm here for thissssssssssssssssssssss

Isn't Hedkoranth associated with a ram? Maybe he plays a bigger role in Risk/Talastar than in Kerofinela given Vorios and the preference of the Talastarings for sheepherding.

I'm aware, but they're like a weird new thing: "not troll, nor human, but Kitori". Tusk Riders without the Esrolan madness curse. I stan Kitori and wish they got more love.

Guide to Glorantha (p.339) paints this very differently: Perhaps protesters were killed, enslaved, or exiled, but anyone who just rolled their eyes seems to have been fine?

Heler is an option, since they switch gender at will in the Storm tribe presentation. Do you want Kitori? Because that's how you get Kitori. ... I want more Kitori, let's make this happen. Also let's liberate the ergeshi from the Gbaji-tainted Yelmalion scum, since we're talking Elmal and Kitori.

I actually don't know what to call them at this point, I get confused. Are they all Vingkotlings in the Storm Age? Is that the catch-all term for ... whatever we call this ethno-cultural complex? I know the Vingkotling name isn't really used anymore but rather "Orlanthi" because we have names like Sartarite, Esroli, and so forth, but the nomenclature is pretty confusing for the Storm peeps.

lmao and her priestesses smirk all year, and presumably wear the crown or whatever that signifies whoever won that last year

Here's some questions: What are the practical results of the wins? Rain is better for everyone in Summer, whether you're an agriculturalist or a herder. Better be clear. For example: Heler means rainy summer - but also a chance of flooding, spoiled food, disease, and a stormy winter. Hunting and raiding will be hard through all that underbrush and with a wet bowstring, you'll be eating rabbits all winter! A lot of girls will be born. Elmal means a hot, dry summer - but also a mild winter with good hunting, good health, and everyone loves meat! It's great raiding weather and the food won't go rotten. There will be a glut of boys born! That's just something I threw out there, because as it stands, who wants Elmal to win? There should be pros and cons to each win since it's a friendly rivalry inside the Storm Tribe. Elmal lets you smiteth yer enemies and winter's not so bad, but Heler really gets the fertility rolling and you can grow up your tribe. The real question is what happens when Esrola wins.

The Ram People were the Heortlings that invaded Dara Happa in the Storm Age. The soon-to-be-released Six Ages might not be canon but calls the Vingkotlings the Rams as well.

yes but that doesn't mean Kralorela can't have Tai influences; Tai peoples live in China and in fact originated there, only entering Southeast Asia rather recently. Austroasiatic speakers also have long been part of the Sinosphere; Vietnam was a Chinese subsidiary since the Han dynasty, and many Austroasiatic speakers lived in China. Many of these groups were crucial in the formation of early China; several of the early Chinese states, notably Chu, Yue and others, were not Chinese speaking, but spoke Tai and Austroasiatic languages. Their customs, metallurgy, music and culture affected Han peoples quite strongly.

It's this weird monolithic place with really terrible Western fake Chinese names. The rest of Glorantha just does its own thing but Kralorela refuses to just ... be Gloranthan and has terrible faux-Chinese names. It's really offputting and also ignores literally all of the rest of East and Southeast Asia for some kind of imaginary China that isn't even ACTUAL China. Let's get some Sumer in the mix, let's throw in some actual historical fun with the Dongson culture and the Zhou rebellion against the Shang and the kingdom of Dali. Maybe also some aggressive counter-culture from the Blood Sun weirdos by southern groups who disagree with the narrative and give an existential threat.We got weird anti-Solar pantheon pushing in from the Naughty North against the teachings of draconic enlightenment. Maybe there are slaves and they don't wanna be slaves? We already have the poison cult ladies. Let's also stick to names like Kralor rather than "suan chow", it's beyond grating in 2019 and into pretty much racist.

 This certainly has been the view, but I believe David Millians is working on an RQ book specifically focused on Kralorela that hopefully gives us a new and broader perspective. Oh, I didn't mean the Runners, although that's interesting, I meant the monkeys! Thank goodness and all praise David Millians. It would be entirely feasible to de-orientalise Kralorela! The entire premise is fascinating in the first place: draconic enlightenment.

Are they Man Rune like Praxian baboons? I'm not familiar with Kralorela because uhhh it's super orientalism and I lived all over Asia and study Asian lingustics, language and culture with a degree in East Asian studies.

Well that's... fair. I bow to the Truth rune from Jeff! I guess the megavolume Guide to Cults will prolly be more specific with local names like the Pentan term for the Pure Horse form of Sun Horse Yelm. ... Too bad I play HeroQuest, I'll be doing a lot of extrapolating. The RuneQuest materials are so sexy I buy them anyway 😞 Side note: does this forum have Rune Font support? I see only Mega Basic fonts and wow that would be a pretty sweet addition... Thanks so much! I use the GCRF but I had no idea the Khordavan font was available, that's just fun.