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Grievous last won the day on January 20

Grievous had the most liked content!

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About Grievous

  • Rank
    Advanced Member


  • RPG Biography
    Over 30 years gaming, but only slowly becoming more deeply versed in Gloranthan lore.
  • Current games
    Too many to list, really. We go from system to system.
  • Blurb
    Illuminated in the ways of the Red Goddess
  1. The Maboder

    The Brusting survive among the Red Cow as the Sardaling bloodline. Of course, this doesn't mean that a group of them couldn't have gone off to join with Mabodh May-Not-Be-Moved to form the Six Stones clan, but just making a note of it. The Split Waters seem to claim Eoric's Stead and a chunk of land around it. The old Red Cow material just says the Split Waters don't respect the border markers at the Finger and come down to hunt there. Though until now there's been no direct indication of this, they could have some roots in the Osmann clan. There could have been a split/rivalry/feud among the Osmann when they joined with the Drutorae (to form the Red Cow) after being hounded by the Telmori, with some of them going across the river to ultimately join with Mabodh instead. Of course, they are a War clan, so maybe they don't need more elaborate reasons or background to come over to do their thing in Red Cow territory. Also, the Lissendings survive the Telmori scourge as a Torkani clan instead of being annihilated or even moved (presumably thanks to living on the other side of the river). They don't seem too likely to contribute to the Maboder to my eyes as they are still shown in their lands when other clans were cowering in forts. The Godori survive as Torkani too, but it seems more feasible parts of them could be in the Black Oak, at least. Going to look for kin taken as slaves as the reason to go to Prax sounds brilliant and possibly delightfully heavy material for stories.
  2. Working my way through the Entekosiad, I find this mention of halos which brings me back to this thread: "Bisos has received the halo which is characteristic of Carmanian divinities." So, maybe this idea wasn't motivating the halos in the new material, but an interesting aside anyway!
  3. Casualty rate in Gloranthan battles?

    I don't think we should assume that Gloranthan logistics goes beyond foraging and living off the land completely, even for the Lunars. The existence of Farquilis indeed implies that they recognize logistics as important, but to me it certainly doesn't mean that they aren't foraging/living off the land. Indeed, Farquilis and his organization could be there to partially organize and coordinate just these foraging activities in an efficient manner! Otherwise, I think we'd be looking at far too modern logistical practices. That said, certainly I do think Farquilis/the Lunars also coordinate goods (and services, both mundane and religio-magical) from their supply bases for their field armies and garrisons, to some extent. Further, a large part of their job is to organize local merchants to provide them with what they need in distant areas. This means - we should note - the bringing-in of coin to pay for these merchants (which is a logistical challenge in itself). However, I think there will always be times when the Lunar army simply takes what it needs from the local population. Of course, this is not sustainable (economically or diplomatically), so they have these other measures setup as well and they will hopefully take primacy in more peaceful periods where they supply garrisons, with the army spread out in more manageable chunks and so. But when armies gather, they will have to resort to foraging to sustain the huge logistical requirements and this will be a considerable burden on the local population/lands at the best of times and an absolute ravaging at the worst.
  4. Telmori and Wolfrunners

    That's some mighty speculation! I like it.
  5. Oh yes indeed - if anybody thought this thread was anything but a love song to the new looks, well, they were wrong.
  6. I grant you that - they might also well be pictures I have (wrongly) assumed to be depicting Orlanth. I could go digging, but actually finding the pictures is - to my mind at least - less relevant to my point than the impression that I was left with. Certainly there are at least the woodcut representations, which Joerg mentions above, and which I do remember from the time I was introduced to Glorantha. No four armed deities there. I always liked the woodcuts actually, and still do, even if I'm a bit unsure how to place them in the "new order" (they definitely hearken to a time when the game was more viking/dark age in feeling). I could see them having a role as "common art" depictions of the gods that you could find around clan tulas and in/around houses, as opposed to more erudite art that would be found at temples and holy sites. The first would be done by people less familiar with the gods (though really pretty much everyone in Orlanthi society is somewhat familiar even on a personal level), thus depicting them more or less as regular people, reflecting roles and tasks one finds in society, while the latter would be done by (or for) holy people who have deeper knowledge.
  7. The question of artistic interpretation in Glorantha isn't exactly comparable to our world, though. Considering these people have actually seen their gods, they would depict them as they experience them. Sure, there'd be artistic license, which could put multiple arms where there originally wasn't and such and there would be differences between people/experiences, which would account for variety. Of course, there'd also probably be a feedback loop there where the artistic depictions would actually start changing the actual visuals when the gods are encountered, which really touches on plenty of themes about Gloranthan metaphysics. Still there is a living connection to the gods which is of a different order from mystical experiences in our world. I'll also slightly disagree with multiple arms in our real world being only to hold more stuff - visuals like that are a feature of mystical and/or psychedelic experiences in our world, too, or at least are a close approximation of a visual experience that is otherwise nigh impossible to convey.
  8. Casualty rate in Gloranthan battles?

    There was the idea discussed here in another thread that the magic-as-WMD thing really only happens during the Hero Wars, developed first by the Lunars and then by Argrath's Sartar Magical Union. I think that's at least true in the current age in Glorantha, but certainly similar things may have cropped up in earlier times. So, maybe most Gloranthan current armies aren't quite so accustomed to taking such things into account and thus may actually fight more traditional-like. Of course, that's not to say magic isn't a huge factor, there's still going to lots of less world-shattering magic going around which brings in things that are indeed quite unlike our history (like crazy flying Orlanthi). This brings up a dichotomy that comes up in considering fantasy warfare, which is certainly present in Glorantha. I think most people initially want to approach fantasy battles as somewhat looking like their historical parallels, except just spiced up with magic. This is because people start from their expectations, which are mostly historical, but is also due to lack of a true understanding of how the magics available would change the battles (because while the magics are new to us as gamers, they wouldn't be new to the generals in-fiction). As you learn more about what makes Glorantha unique, and really start to understand the impact of various magics, you realize that this initial "simulation" of Gloranthan warfare is probably not an accurate rendition of how battles here should really look. At this point one struggles with the question of whether to a ) work with game mechanical implications as first principles in defining how war should look or b ) sticking with a more "Glorantha is historical warfare, just spiced up with magic" approach, which may not hold up under intellectual scrutiny or power-gamer abuse. I know that this is a dichotomy that I run into in my thinking quite often.
  9. To be honest I don't really remember a place where Orlanth was consistently and definitely depicted, but I'm talking about a general feel for his appearance I've picked up from Hero Wars/Heroquest era material (and also some Runequest stuff I've seen). Basically, I remember him as a bare-chested ur-Orlanthi, not much different from the Orlanthi you might otherwise see or maybe even from a generalized vision of Thor. I guess he could've been blue back then as well, but I only remember black and white pictures. To re-iterate a point made elsewhere, I'm very stoked to see a more consistent visual depiction of various gods and other things being a part of modern Glorantha. I'm also very interested in the decisions, influences and considerations that go into developing the Gloranthan look, hence this thread. There's still so many things I'd like to see more visual representations of (I wasn't expecting to see a depiction of the Red Emperor- even if rather small - in the Sourcebook, something which I've wanted to see for a long time), but I'm loving what we're getting and they are a big part of making this setting really take over real estate in my mind.
  10. Casualty rate in Gloranthan battles?

    That is certainly true, and the quote of course comes from a time when there was pretty much only light cavalry around, so "the only true rule" is somewhat contextual. But yes, the point still being valid that routing tends to lead to horrible casualties.
  11. Casualty rate in Gloranthan battles?

    "The only true rule for cavalry is to follow the enemy as long as he retreats." - Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson Always loved that quote. Really captures the cavalry spirit and also hammers home the point of a rout being devastating.
  12. Cool. I didn't think about it from the in-world religious representation angle, but my mind kinda already incorporate the halos as a visual sign of Lunar magic (and now seeing the Solars have 'em, why not for them too) happening. That's probably from seeing them occur "real time" in the King of Sartar comic. They are definitely a cool gimmick! Your comment about She Who Waits actually brought up a pretty obvious connection that I never really thought about (though I probably should've). The being who the Red Goddess will become in the future took part in creating her in the past. Now that's mastery of Time! Yeah, I can see a sort of inversion of the "barbarians in woad" thing there (though that's an inversion on the meta level). The odd thing about it is that conjures up questions about the blue-skinned peoples of Glorantha (usually associated with the watery folks) and any relations to Orlanth, but I guess there's room for multiple kinds of folk to have the same skin tone in there, esp. since if Orlanth wants to be blue, he can be bloody blue by me. I'd love to have multiple arms, sure. I guess I need to go do some Heroquesting.
  13. This kinda feels like a stupidly simple question, but I wonder: why is Orlanth blue and four (sometimes six) armed? Having gotten my feet wet in Glorantha back in the day, this certainly wasn't how Orlanth was portrayed as I remember it, but now it seems to be his canon appearance. I love it, but I wonder where this came from? Another thing I'm now wondering about as I look at all the god art in the Glorantha Sourcebook is all the halos. Some gods/heroes get them, others don't. I wonder at the significance there (interestingly the entire Lunar pantheon gets them - as well as Belintar, who seems the odd one out).
  14. That picture of Arkat is the [REDACTED BY GBAJI].
  15. I never realized the connection either. Now I can't stop imagining Mignola visiting Glorantha in comic form in the now... oh my...