Gollum

From what I read in a previous thread, the BRP Essentials will become a 64-96 page book ... Even if it is not the big golden book, it is still better than just 20 or even 32. Now, it may be wrong, of course. The discussion was here: http://basicroleplaying.org/topic/4861-brp-essentials-status/

I suppose (I just suppose, I absolutely don't know for sure) that Mythic Iceland's author, Pedro Ziviani, is already working with a draft of BRP Essentials for the new edition of his game. So, this draft may already exist ... Unless Pedro Ziviani is directly working with BRP Essential's author ... Or unless he is BRP Essential's author ... The problem is that if you, Clarence, go to another publisher, Starships/Space and Odd Soot will be written for another D100 system. For the fans of that system, it will be good news. But for those who don't really like that other system, it will be bad news. At the limit, as long as it is just game world (Odd Soot), there is no insurmountable problem. Attributes and skills are roughly the same and conversions will be quite easy to do. But for something with much more rules (Starships/Space), there will be many little incompatibilities. Combats rules are different, for instance, and, so, spaceship combat rules will be different. That will make the game much more hard to convert in the new BRP system when it will be published out. I absolutely understand that BPR Essentials is not a priority for Chaosium. K Peterson is perfectly right here. And I also can understand that some secrets have to be kept (even when I don't know the exact reason). But please, Chaosium's editors or authors, please, do all what you can to keep Clarence with us. Send him a draft, as it is. Or give him enough hints to start his work. Or, if all that is not possible, just convince him to wait with good arguments of your choice! I'm absolutely not saying that you should tell all of us what BRPS essentials will be (even if I would like to know, of course). I'm just saying that you should give authors much more hints to help them going on with the BRP system. Otherwise, they won't have any other choice than going away to another publisher. Loosing Starships/Space and Odd Soot would really be a pity.

A better idea of what will become the BRP system in BRP Essentials could help here, couldn't it? No secret, of course, but just an idea about the general direction that the game will take: like Runequest 6, like Cthulhu 7, like OpenQuest, like the BRP Quick-Start Edition ... For the moment, we don't know anything but the fact that it can go in any of these directions ... or even something totally different ... and that we will have to wait a lot of time before knowing. A better idea could help to know if it is worth waiting. Players and GMs like me can go on with the "old" BRP rules while waiting. No problem for us ... But authors like Clarence, who have to design and test their game (which requires a lot of time) have only the choice to search for another publisher. That is very bad news for the upcoming BRP generic system. When it will be published out, Clarence - and maybe some other authors - will have just gone away to other publishers. And no matter how good will be the new BRP Essentials rules, they won't come back to Chaosium. Once they will have written most of their stuff with another version of the D100 system, they won't rework and rewrite everything ... So, can we have some more hints, please? And if the secret really has to be kept, maybe some private message from BRP Essentials' authors to Clarence could help him making the right decision.

We want to know, we want to know! But we surely won't before the next Gencon.

Of course it is different. The mechanism is different, and, so, it gives to the players a different feeling about what happens ... But there are still a lot of similarities. The player doesn't know whether it will work. Even with the Fate/Story point, the GM has veto power. The player guides the story in a unexpected direction. It was a fight, supposed to be handled as a normal fight, and the player suddenly decides to use his Craft (Smith) skill to win. Dice are involved, but the player chooses the skill he wants to use. So, he surely chooses a skill in which he is very good. The randomness of the dice are really lowered. With the Fate/Story points, the player can win a point if the GM refuses his idea. With the skill roll, he can win an experience check at the end of the adventure. Having said that, I'm absolutely not against Fate/Story points. They are a good tool ... In some genres of stories. But not in every genres. That is why, in my humble opinion, it would not be a good idea in a universal book like the BRP Essentials. Or as an optional rule. Exactly as it is in the big golden book. Because it does exist in the big golden book.

Here is how it can be played with rules as written ... Orlanthi Player: "Can I recognize the BigBad's Tulwar and remember a secret weakness that I can use to break it more easily? GM: "You can try ... Make a Craft (Smith) roll." Orlanthi Player, after rolling the dice: "I succeeded!" GM: "An ordinary success or a special one?" Orlanthi Player: "An ordinary one." GM: "OK. You recognize the style of the weapon. It was forged by the Black Smith of Ganumea... But you don't remember any secret weakness that you could exploit. The black Smith of Ganumea makes good quality weapons ..." And for "Daine may only seem like a paid retainer, but I would trust him with my life, my honor, or anything else -- and he may safely place the same trust in me!", any good GM would use that sort of character background to make the game more fun. At least, I would. Character background are always amazing hooks to write new adventures - or to give Player Characters a very good reason to accept a mission. So, as you can see, Fate/Story points are not necessary to handle that sort of things. BRP rules are flexible enough to allow them.

Personally, I find that the BRP System (at least, as written in its Big Golden Book version) is already a perfect balance between "simulation" and "narration". It is quite good to give plausible results. A bullet or a car crash can kill but don't systematically do it, for instance, exactly like in real life. Some games, like GURPS, may do that better. But ... The BRP System is simple enough to let the game master and the players play with the quite realistic results given by the rule system. The game master, for instance, can easily make the task difficulty vary depending on how the players describe their actions. If one player says: "I search the room", he will probably ask for a a Spot roll. But if the player tells: "I search the room patiently, taking all the time I need to clear out the drawers of the desk, as well as the closet. I also tap everywhere I can to find a possible secret compartment. And I even look under the carpet ...", the game master can then decide that the roll becomes easy. And because an easy action double the odds, the narration suddenly influences much more the result than the character skill or the dice. Likewise, the game master can rule that the characters are able to dodge bullets, in order to recreate the atmosphere of stories like those of James Bond or Indiana Jones ... Brief, he can make the rules vary a lot to fit to the genre and the story... Some games, like Ambre Diceless RPG may take much more that narration into account. But ... In my humble opinion, The BRP System is a very good balance between Amber Diceless RPG and GURPS. There are dice and quite realistic rules. But what tell the players has a huge influence on their action results. So, it would be a pity to change that balance. Especially for the universal system (BRP Essentials), which is supposed to cover every possible genres or stories. a specific game world can require more realistic rules or more narrative ones. But the universal and generic basics of the system just need that amazing balance.

Thank you very much for that answer ... Like you, I think it will be very easy to use with the new BRP essentials rules as soon as they will be published out ... And because it is based on the Big Golden Book, it can be used right now! It was the best choice to make!

Just a question... Does After the Vampire Wars use the Big Golden Book rules or the coming Basic Essentials ones?

In GURPS, there are both. Vacc suit (Environment Suit) and Zero-G (Free Fall). But they have different purpose. Environment Suit is the skill of getting into the suit quickly and operating it, while free fall is the skill of moving in zero gravity environment. Having said that, both skills are a cap to the action you are trying to do in zero gravity environment. For instance, if someone with Brawling 14, Environment Suit 12 and Free Fall 13 tries to punch another guy in space while wearing his vacc suit, he will roll against the worse of these three skills: 12. You can give a penalty to a skill used under Zero-G environment for the characters who don't succeed a Vacc Suit roll or, as GURPS do, consider that this skill is a cap for every other skill used in zero gravity environment. Both works well but the second solution is better during combats because it reduces the number of dice rolls.

If their adaptation to the new conditions of space is not true, that is just a description feature. But if it is true, if they are really more adapted to space than normal humans, you can give them a bonus of +10 to +20 % (choose what you prefer) to all physical skills used in low gravity environment to compensate their -3 to STR and -1 to CON. You can even decide that the -1 to CON only applies on normal gravity environment (heart and breathing problems).

Oh yes! What all of you wrote above is judicious advice. Since making up a character on the fly is not hard (I often do that too), converting one from a system to another is not really hardest. And from a D100 game to another D100 game, it even easier ... I just have to give up my interest of accuracy and do it more roughly. I also love the weapon variant example. All that is very clever. Thank you very much. I'm now totally convinced that the multiplicity of D100 essential games won't necessarily split apart the community.

That's right. Since all success rolls are determined with a D100, it is easy to take any character from any game and to know whether he succeeds with any D100 rule ... But the problem comes more when you want to play an adventure designed by another publisher. You have some conversions to do to and this is not always easy. What BRP skill best corresponds to RuneQuest Essential Endurance, Evade or Locale for instance? Likewise for weapon damages and armor protections, which are not always the same ...

Yes, and one of the greatest features of the Big Golden Book was precisely taking rules from different D100 role playing games (Cthulhu, RuneQuest, Stormbringer ...) and to offer them as optional rules ... of a still very consistent system! Of course, it is impossible to do something like that in 32 pages only ... So, I join to all others who would like to have a big book of optional rules for the BRP Essentials. It could precisely be the right time to talk about other D100 publishers and to make the split community a more unified community.

I'm really happy to read that my experience is in minority and that several others buy books from different editors. Being sure that my worry is nothing more than a pessimistic idea would be great news for me.

I may be very pessimistic, here, indeed. Contrary to what I believe, the different essential rules may attract more players to the D100 system, and someone who tries a BRP Essential game may want to try an other D100 system after that ... But I doubt. I sometimes glance at what other publishers offer, thinking that it is very interesting, but, eventually, I only buy BRP products. And I suppose that a RuneQuest Essential fan, for instance, rarely buy a BRP product. Please, don't see my posts like a criticism. They are not. They are just a worry. The worry of someone who feels danger coming, because he saw it happening in other communities. The D20 system, for instance. But not only. The community of the French roleplaying game Mega has also been split so much that it doesn't really exist anymore now*. _____ * Hopefully, Mega's original authors are working on a new edition which will surely gather it together again.

Yes. At the beginning, Pathfinder was just another D20 option. Now, it is a direct competitor of D&D. And there is another problem, too. If one publisher want to design a campaign or game world world with the D100 system, which essential rules will he choose? BRP, BRP Essentials, Legend, OpenQuest, Revolution D100, RuneQuest, ... ? By choosing, that publisher will only interest part of the community instead of interesting the whole D100 community. Of course, some Revolution D100 game masters will look from time to time what OpenQuest publishers do, and vice versa ... But not all, because there will be conversions to do before playing. While someone who plays GURPS or Savage Worlds is potentially interested by all GURPS or Savage Worlds products, no matter the publisher, because he knows that the rules remain the same (except some optional ones) ...

I do agree with TrippyHippy. Having a lot of games with rule variations is a good thing, especially when these rule variations are necessary to recreate the atmosphere of the genre being played ... But a problem arise when you have several different "basic set", different "essential" rules. And, sadly, that becomes to be the case with BRP ... Eventually, two game masters will have less and less in common, and it will become harder and harder for them to share things (adventures, characters ..) without having conversions to do, exactly as if they were playing different role playing systems. GURPS succeeded to use the same rules with different game worlds and genre. The fourth edition is now 12 years old and those who played with the 2004 Basic Set go on playing with it: it didn't change at all. A lot of optional rules have been added. But the core rules are always the same. Savage Worlds can also be played in different genre, including lovecraftian horror (Realms of Cthulhu), but it remains the same game with the same character's attributes and skills and basic rules. The D100 community may be bigger than GURPS' or Savage's one, but if it is split and split over several different "essential" rules, it will eventually disappear. And, of course, we can't change the past. But we can try to change the future. And try to avoid things like those who happened with the D20 community. The Open D20 License was a great idea, at the beginning. Now, Pathfinder's players don't share anymore anything with D&D's or True D20's one. They still all use the D20 system. But they are not anymore a communities. They are several separated communities. The only thing who "saved" them is that they were the biggest role playing game community at the beginning. I doubt the D100 community could survive such a split. I would like it. But I doubt.

There is still a book, Realms of Cthulhu, which allows to play horrific Cthulhu campaigns with Savage rules. I didn't play it, but I have it and it is surprising to see how a pulp and heroic game can also be used to play harshly realistic adventures with just little changes.

What you say here is absolutely right. Two different stories, even in the same kind of world, can have so different atmospheres that it is impossible to play them with exactly the same rule. Because there is not only the problem of universe (past, present, future, with or without fantastic elements like magic ...). There is also the problem of genre (harshly realistic, quite realistic, heroic, crazily cinematic, super-heroic ...). So, a game which allows to play every possible kind of stories has to be generic as well as universal. And it is possible. This is indeed what means GURPS : Generic Universal Role Playing System. It really allows to play Star Trek (heroic SF) as well as Aliens (harshly realistic and horrific SF), Star Wars (magic SF) or any other kind of SF stories ... And the BRP System Big Golden Book also allows it. To do that, you just need optional rules that can be switched on or off, depending on the genre you want to play. Fate/Chance/Power points which can be spent to allows heroic actions. Fatigue rules, sanity and a bleeding system for harshly realistic games. More or less points for creating characters. And so on. Is it possible in 32 pages only? I don't think so ... GURPS Lite, for instance, stay in a line between realism and heroism. Now, even with such limited rules, the GM can still make things vary, depending on how he chooses the difficulty of actions, and the required rolls. In an Aliens-like story, for instance, bullets will be impossible to parry and the GM will surely ask a will roll to be able to combat an alien. While in a Star-Wars-like campaign, characters will be able to dodge blasters by jumping on the floor or behind a cover, and they will never be frozen by fear when meeting an horrible monster ... That are little tricks than can allow more or less realism/heroism in a game and really have an impact on the genre and the atmosphere of the game.

Yes. There is a lot in GURPS Lite. But no magic, psychic powers, super heroe powers or anything like that... Because there was no place to put them. The old version, GURPS Lite for the third edition, had some magic spells. But so little ones that they were uninteresting. So Sean Punch and Scott Haring (GURPS Lite's authors) were right to remove them. Likewise, there is a very little list of equipment in GURPS Lite. Nothing about explosives, hand grenades, ultra-tech weapons, vehicles ... Having said that, BRP rules are much more easy to explain than GURPS ones. Especially for combats. So, there could be more in a 32 pages BRP Essentials than in GURPS Lite*. _____ * Which is still a very great introduction to GURPS.

Yes. That is precisely the problem with optional rules. Each one of us would like to find the one he uses the most*. But if you add one of them in a basic book, why not the other ones? ... And then, you end up with another very big book. Very big books are great, but this is not at all the purpose of Essentials. _____ * I play a lot of Call of Cthulhu adventures with the Big Golden Book rules. I know, it is a bit strange while there is a very good Call of Cthulhu game. But I also play some other adventures (SF or Fantasy ones) and I like to use about the same rules for all the games I play. Changing worlds but not changing rules ... The Big Golden Book was really the philosopher's stone for me.

Yes. I saw that yesterday, while searching through the Big Golden Book just before sleeping. But thank you for the reference ... It is a very interesting optional rule for heroic/cinematic campaigns where the player characters are supposed to be more tougher than their foe. And, as said in this box, it allows them to survive more easily their foe's critical successes, which gives an atmosphere more close from D&D ... Even if it will still remain very different.

Yes. I saw that yesterday, while searching through the Big Golden Book just before sleeping. But thank you for the reference ... It is a very interesting optional rules for heroic/cinematic campaigns where the player characters are supposed to be more tougher than their foe. And, as said in this box, it allows them to survive more easily their foe's critical successes, which gives an atmosphere more close from D&D ... Even if it will still remain very different.

There is another mook rule (and full of other interesting advices) in Astounding Adventure*: all mook characters have a defense roll equal to DEX + Hit Points + Armor Points. When a mook character is hit, the GM makes a defense roll for him. Success: he goes on fighting without penalty. Failure: he is dead or incapacitated. Likewise, there is an alternate rule which allows to have more Hit Points at the start of the game: SIZ + CON instead of (SIZ + CON) / 2. That allows characters to survive more wounds ... But I don't remember where it comes from. * http://www.chaosium.com/astounding-adventures-pdf/