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If I remember correctly, it was about the same as other BRP games, except for subskills.

Yeah, it is a matter of tastes and styles. For instance, on one thread here some people were keen on going with a more generic light/medium/heavy pistol idea than listing identified weapons by caliber and make. Elsewhere I was looking at a new Western RPG, and in a review of the preview they reviewer was somewhat disappointed with the generic , Light, heavy pistol thing and was glad that the full game would get into make and models. Personally, I lead towards the details, since it is usually easier to cut them out or ignore them than it is to add them into where they aren't. But, if I was playing something like Spirit of the Century, I'd be more "fast and loose". Phoenix Command, did sort of go overboard, with the aiming by split seconds counts and such. In some cases the information the gave wasn't entirely accurate, either. SO I think there is a big difference between that, and, say, noting that one pistol holds 7 rounds and another holds 15.

Was it Space 1999 that had the "resdkins" as martians? Maybe an Interplanetary crossover?

Currently the critters chapters has: Bobcat, buffalo, cougar, wolverine, horses, rattlesnakes, bears (including the Kodiak), armadillo, coyote, donkey, burro, mule, jackrabbit, scorpion and wolf. Deer, cattle (including longhorns) dogs, elk, moose and such should make it into it. I'm thinking that the supernatural stuff would work better if kept to it's own chapters. That way people who want to include it can do so, while those who don't want it, can just ignore those sections. A chapter of two on unusual stuff could be nice (anyone see that old western with the vampire in it?). I agree that there should be some native American stuff in it. I'd like to see different info on the different tribes, too. Any sort of fair treatment really shows how screwed they got. While researching stuff on the net, I found a page that lists which treaties the US government broke by year. Just to cover the 1873-1885 period would probably take 2 or three pages. Even the "friendly" tribes got hosed.

I agree. That is why I think I used Luck rolls more that the other stat rolls. One example, in RQ, it looks like they specifically went out of their way to eliminate the need for stat rolls. The Throw skill was a perfect candidate for the Agility roll, but is instead, a skill. One that rarely got used in my campaigns.

Well, from what I've read, profit margins for ancient traders were very high. That was whty they did it. THe RQ3 idea of 250% increase isn';'t far from the truth. Of course, the risks were high as well. Storms, pirates, and monsters all take their toll.

That might depend on what information went with the weapons. Generally there is a lot on interesting stuff that doesn't end up on the tables that can indeed promote story. For instace, there was a reason why the slightly less powerful version of the "Peacemaker", the "Frontier" was popular, specifically because it used the same ammo as the Winchester rifle. And any big game rifle would probably benefit for notes of how they were used for hunting. There a lot of little details there that can add to the setting and story. Also quite a bit that the setting looses without it. People tend to think of the firearms in modern terms, and frankly they weren't that good. Parts weren't interchangeable, even between "identical" models. Early revolvers, really anything prior to metallic cartridges, couldn't be reloaded in combat. That was actually the reason why many carried two guns. Plus, unlike modern firearms, the differences between similar guns was probably more pronounced. Today we have dozens of companies producing lots of fairly similar 9mm and .45ACP pistols. But back in the old west, there were some big differences between a Colt .45 and a Smith & Wesson .45. For starters, they couldn't use the same ammo. Secondly, the S&W "broken open" and ejected the empty shell casings, making the weapon a lot easier to reload. In many ways the guns stuff is far more important story wise than the "critters' stuff. About 95% of the critters in the Old West, as anywhere else, have enough sense to stay clear of humans, and only attack when threated. I've got stats in the works for coyote's and bobcats, but they probably won't be needed much. More along the lines of sneaking onto the ranch after chickens or sheep.

I doubt anyone would pay for a 64page price list. 64 pages of weapon stats.... The Gatling gun gets a couple of pages, the 6 and 12 pounder cannon, then the pistols rifles, shotguns, and muskets. Yeah, enough for 64 pages. The critter book.... Might have a whole series here.

Thank's Triff, It is a start. I do plan on revisting some of the first drafts and cutting down to one damage stat, etc. In a way, the Eventually fatal table allow for some lower damages.

Similar. I think RQ3 came out before Seas of Fate. If I recall corectly, Seas of Fate is actually a little more advanced, too. Slightly different movement rates by the wind.

Ahh. Yes, that sounds right. Thanks.

CR? What is CR? BTW, that is just the approach I swiped/used. Give weapons a + to PEN. About 4 AP seems to match up right with the performance of most AP rounds, too. Usually combined with a drop in the damage die (AP rounds tend to do less damage, since they will usually leave small holes and even over penetrate, only dumping some of their energy into the target). Once I figure out what AP/weapon damage scale to use (I've got three that fit the data points given,so far), I should be able to get the quick conversion rules polished off enough for a first draft/test. The plan is to get the quick write up/conversion for real vehicles, then the vehicle modification rules (so you can turn a car into a super vehicle), and finally newer, better vehicle desgin system that is "reverse" engineered from the previous two texts. Oh, and someone along the line put up some starship design rules. I managed to get the scaling worked out between character SIZ and starship SIZ. (I had to refresh my memory on natural logs (ln) to do it, but I did it. And all the crunchy math is hidden behind the scenes. +1 one hull = +8 Size= x2 mass. It will make working out movement simple.). The spaceship stuff should work as follows: Pick a Hull rating; Find out how many spaces said hull rating gives you; Then fill up the spaces with components.

Thanks. Sounds like Superworld:WoW edition. Even my low end formula 40 AP M1A2 will withstand a +6D6 damage bonus, While the high end formula 70AP one is character proof. It looks like a super would be better off picking up and tossing the tank so it could break from falling damage than actually hit the thing. BTW, Could character is a higher powered campaign get more Hero Points like they do with skills?

One thing I'd like to try, would be the used stat rolls, but getting a better grade of success with the skill. I messed around with a "marginal" success idea for a BRP variant. My idea would be that someone who does something through a stat roll, might succeed, but he won't get the same type of results as someone who is skilled. But it takes more grafes of success to pull it off.

To someone with an advanced copy: What sort of STR and damage scores can we see with super-powered characters? I7m just wondering so I know where to place the AP scores for tanks.

Yes, but we need to consider how it will work in play. In BRP, character average around 12HP, and a combat pistol does around 6-8 points per hit. Two hits drop someone. If body armor stops half of it, it just changes it from 2 hits to 4. In game terms that would lean to most deaths being from blunt trauma. And while people have bben brought unconscious to the hosptial, that is atypical. Ususally it just causes brusing. WHat I think would work, and be simple, would be to make the SHOCK roll (as per CoC) based on the rolled damage, rather than the actual damage. And maybe toss on a point of damage. That way any hit that does 1/2HP or more could take someone down, even if it isn't pepentrating the vest.

I hope you players don't know where I live.

More than a few RPGs use the stat as a base approach. The Bond RPG used an appproach somewhat similar to your. Skill was added to stat and then multiplied by a Ease Factor, verey similar to the Stat x1%, x2%, x5%, x10%, rolls. There are some games that give the base chance of success for a task (30%, 65%, etc) and then the PC adds his mods to it. SO rather than an extremely difficult task being -90%, it might be 0% and an average task might start off at 50% Plus Stat and Skill mod. Another option would be to use the resistance table for everything. For example a guy with DEX 10 and Sword 8 would use an 18 for his ability on the resistance table. IF you were going to go with several different stat multiples as the base and add in skill, then you would probably want to put them on the sheet. Either by categories (a row of DEXx1%to DEXx10% above DEX skills) or by putting a multiplication table on the sheet. LOts of different ways to go with it.

Don't they still add to improvement rolls? That was probably their biggest impact .

But the spreading out of the damage greatly reduces the effect. IT is the inability to penetrate that makes the big difference. You have to keep in mind that most bullets don't have much energy. They reason why they kill is because they are small, and so concentrate all their energy at a small point. Also the armor does absorb some of the kinetic energy and slows down the transfer of energy. Slowing down the energy helps the body to absorb it. A knockout isn't likely ever with a penetrating round, let alone blunt trauma. Yeah it will hurt, but it isn't the same as an actual knife wound or strike from a mace. From what I've seen, something like a .32 isn't going to do any real damage through a functioning Cllass III vest. I could see some sort of stun/shock roll, but then, I could say the same for someone who got hit by an axe. Likewise, axes and such do cause blunt trauma to people in mail, plate and the like. I think that if we use the AP system for swords and axes we should use it for bullets. Or start tracking blunt trauma against mail.

I can see some uses. such as when a character's INT score differs radically from the player's. or for "general knowledge" or memory. All the RPGs that bring stat rolls to the front are those that didn't have category modifiers. RQ and SB didn't use stat rolls nearly as much.

Realistically, yes and no. In some ways multiple injuries offset each other. Sort of like the old joke about getting rid of a headache by slamming a hammer on your foot. Even blood loss works against itself somewhat. If a chest wound is putting you into shock, an inured limb isn't going to matter much. As far as my idea goes, I suppose you could use the wound penalty as a modifier to any additional mortality rolls. If you are using Hit points, then the loss of HPs will take care of itself. In fact, I7d serious consider kicking up the time increment by a factor of x5 or x10 with the HP option. I juet left it out to keep things simple. BTW, the original idea for the STUN roll was much simpler. Luckx2, Luck roll, and Luck x1/2%

I just uploaded a new file with rules to handle eventually fatal injuries in BRP. The option can be used with in in place of the normal Hit Point system.

Thanks. So I guess RQ3 is a good starting off point for my "Critter" stats for BRP Old West? At least until I get a copy of BRP. Hmm, maybe I should volunteer to work on the beastiary?