Tattoo Removal

[DrDave]

There was talk about tattoo removal of cult tattoo.  Now cult tattoo have a lot mystical significance, but there are others (apparently a lot) that are much more cultural and can change.  Like re-marrying. 

I kinda think that this would cause enough demand that someone would come up with some magic and that people would sell tattoo removal services.

 

 

[Lordabdul]

30 minutes ago, DrDave said:

but there are others (apparently a lot) that are much more cultural and can change.  Like re-marrying. 

My understanding is that when you marry into a different clan, you don't get tattooed with that clan's markings. You got your own clan's tattoos during your adult initiation rites, and that's what you have for the rest of your life. You're "adopted" into your new partner's clan, but you're very much "that person from the other clan originally". In the very unlikely event that you actually switch clans for real, you might get additional clan tattoos (but I don't know in what situation that would happen). Trying to remove your old tattoos feels to me like trying to reject your kin and origins, which feels like an Orlanthi taboo to me.... which isn't to say it's not possible. When you leave a cult and survive the Spirit of Reprisal, maybe there's a way to get some tattoo removal, but it's probably from some very shady and dodgy people.

Edited April 20, 2020 by lordabdul

[Sir_Godspeed]

Child adoption across clan boundaries (probably rare, but not impossible). Making of new clans from disparate members. That's at least a couple of situations where removal of previous tattoos might be applicable - not sure IF they are though.

[jajagappa]

26 minutes ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

Child adoption across clan boundaries

Children don't have tattoos - they only get those on initiation into adulthood so that won't be any issue.

27 minutes ago, Sir_Godspeed said:

Making of new clans from disparate members.

You'd certainly get new tattoos for whatever the new wyter is. Kind of like that with Argrath and the White Bull brotherhood.  Argrath later claims association with the vanished Karandoli clan of the Colymar - don't know whether he suddenly appeared with that tattoo or not though. (And he should have had other Colymar clan tattoos from his initiation - unless he abandoned the clan before he could get them.)

[Lordabdul]

5 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

You'd certainly get new tattoos for whatever the new wyter is.

Yep, but even then I would assume that, most of the time, the various members would proudly display their original tattoos, and that becomes the tattoos of different factions and bloodlines within the new clan.

However, if the previous clan disintegrated for some super shameful reasons (collusion with Chaos, partying with broos, whatever), there might indeed be some arguments for having a tattoo removal. But again in my Glorantha it would be a very uncommon occurrence. I'm not sure how I would handle it... as with many things Gloranthan, you can either handle it in a simple logical way (hire a talented artist who can re-tattoo on top and make it look legit), in a convoluted magical way (find some cult or wizard or spirit that somehow has a justifiable way to alter the skin), or in a convoluted mythical way (heroquest your way out of the origins and genealogy of your clan somehow, and the tattoos magically disappear). I'm tempted to go with option 2 but haven't thought this through much.

[French Desperate WindChild]

or if you are banished / rejected.

You may want to remove your previous one to forget / reject this part of your story, and replace it by your next community, if you find one.

Or maybe transform the previous one (if the mark cannot be deleted) to the new one

 

 

[Darius West]

On 4/21/2020 at 8:09 AM, lordabdul said:

My understanding is that when you marry into a different clan, you don't get tattooed with that clan's markings. You got your own clan's tattoos during your adult initiation rites, and that's what you have for the rest of your life. You're "adopted" into your new partner's clan, but you're very much "that person from the other clan originally". In the very unlikely event that you actually switch clans for real, you might get additional clan tattoos (but I don't know in what situation that would happen). Trying to remove your old tattoos feels to me like trying to reject your kin and origins, which feels like an Orlanthi taboo to me.... which isn't to say it's not possible. When you leave a cult and survive the Spirit of Reprisal, maybe there's a way to get some tattoo removal, but it's probably from some very shady and dodgy people.

I agree completely lordabdul.  This is the sort of thing that would be part of the criminal underworld.  This is something spies and thieves would do.  Of course the next questions are who, and how.  Obviously Lanbril is an obvious choice, but potentially also Krarsht, and of course Eurmal.  As to how to do it, well, I would argue that low potency acid, or flaying, combined with rapid subsequent divine healing would be the answer, provided the healing is done by a deity who would be sympathetic to such a dubious undertaking.  The process will be at least as painful as actually getting tattooed, if not more so.  It is worth remembering that to be without tattoos is to be the equivalent of an uninitiated teenager, and will be seen as a sign of irresponsibility and ignorance in a society that tattoos adults like the Orlanthi. 

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, Darius West said:

As to how to do it, well, I would argue that low potency acid, or flaying, combined with rapid subsequent divine healing would be the answer,

Krarshtkid pratzim!  Works wonders to dissolve away those annoying tattoos. And for those really hard to remove tattoos, just let the little krarshtkids nibble away for awhile!

[Lordabdul]

2 hours ago, Darius West said:

Obviously Lanbril is an obvious choice, but potentially also Krarsht, and of course Eurmal.

When I wrote my previous post I tried to come up with proposals for who might provide tattoo removal services, but I couldn't come up with anything... I figured Lanbril cultists might be the middle-persons to put you in relation with someone actually providing the service, but Lanbril itself doesn't quite fit IMHO.  I didn't think of Eurmal, but that might probably work -- although Eurmalis might conceal your tattoos instead of actually remove them.  Krarsht is a lot more like what I had in mind, but I'm not very familiar with her cult so I'll have to read up on that.

1 hour ago, jajagappa said:

Krarshtkid pratzim!

It looks like this is more like an "expand, entangle and stick" kind of substance, no? But yeah, I would probably introduce some kind of Chaos monster body fluid that would eat the flesh where the tattoo is, followed by some healing spells. It might never quite heal back correctly though, so the character would have to come up with something: "oh yeah I fought some Krarshtkids a few years ago... nasty little buggers. Now stop asking me about my past!".

[Joerg]

Exposure to Gorp "acid" sounds more entropic than treatment with pratzim. The Flames of Ehilm or the Baths of Nelat may purify the bearer of the tattoo too. As might a Tap spell targeting the passion to the clan, or the elemental rune (storm or earth) identified with the Heortling gender role model..

There may be side effects.

Edited April 25, 2020 by Joerg