Wulfsland and Telmori, post-1625

[Scorus]

A few questions here. I saw the following statement by @Jeff in another topic:

After the liberation of Sartar, Jomes Wulf and his Lunar soldiers abandoned these lands, which are now claimed by the Cinsina, Telmori, and Torkani tribes, as well as by the surviving Maboder. A few retired Lunar veterans have held on, refusing to abandon the lands they won at sword-point. 

1) Who holds Stonegate?

2) Many Maboder seemed to be dissipated into other clans by marriage. Are they reforming from the diaspora or are these the slaves of Wulfsland?

3) What is the structure, if any, for the Maboder now? Are they a clan? A tribe? A bunch of loosely connected people with or without a leader?

4) The Glorantha Sourcebook says that Kallyr allied the Telmori, so I assume she benefited from their historic bodyguard role of the Sartar Royal Family? Did Argrath have a bodyguard at first, obviously ending before he betrayed them?

[jajagappa]

2 hours ago, Scorus said:

1) Who holds Stonegate?

Those who you noted:  A few retired Lunar veterans have held on

2 hours ago, Scorus said:

2) Many Maboder seemed to be dissipated into other clans by marriage. Are they reforming from the diaspora or are these the slaves of Wulfsland?

Both. 

2 hours ago, Scorus said:

3) What is the structure, if any, for the Maboder now? Are they a clan? A tribe? A bunch of loosely connected people with or without a leader?

The tribe was destroyed, the clans broken.  There are no wyters remaining, and no leaders.  There has been no structure to the Maboder since 1606.  They are only a group who acknowledge some blood kinship at this point.

2 hours ago, Scorus said:

Kallyr allied the Telmori, so I assume she benefited from their historic bodyguard role of the Sartar Royal Family?

Yes.

2 hours ago, Scorus said:

Did Argrath have a bodyguard at first, obviously ending before he betrayed them?

Not the Telmori.  He has White Bull Brothers as bodyguards (or possibly loyal PC's as seen in Jeff's White Bull Campaign). 

[Scorus]

I can't imagine a few lunar vets would be able to hang on long fighting Cinsina and Torkani during they day and the Telmori at night!

[metcalph]

5 hours ago, Scorus said:

I can't imagine a few lunar vets would be able to hang on long fighting Cinsina and Torkani during they day and the Telmori at night!

They don't fight them.  I think it's more like Stonegate is a Bit Too Hard.  Let somebody else try to seize it and we'll storm the weakened occupiers.  

[davecake]

On 4/17/2021 at 5:41 AM, metcalph said:

They don't fight them.  I think it's more like Stonegate is a Bit Too Hard.  Let somebody else try to seize it and we'll storm the weakened occupiers

Yes, neither the Cinsina or the Torkani have a traditional right to Stonegate, the Maboder are not a tribe any more and not organised enough to try to take it, and everyone hates the Telmori and is happy to have a bunch of people willing to continue to be the buffer and do most of the Telmori fighting. 

And the inhabitants of Stonegate may be (largely) Lunar vets, but they aren't current members of the Lunar military or subject to Lunar government command - and many of then aren't Lunars at all. They are better neighbours than the Telmori. Its unstable, but I think they can hang on for a few (fairly unpleasant) years, until the issue comes to Argraths attention. 

[Jape_Vicho]

On 4/16/2021 at 1:36 AM, Scorus said:

2) Many Maboder seemed to be dissipated into other clans by marriage. Are they reforming from the diaspora or are these the slaves of Wulfsland?

3) What is the structure, if any, for the Maboder now? Are they a clan? A tribe? A bunch of loosely connected people with or without a leader?

If I was to invent their story after their destruction (I think there's nothing written about it, but I'm sure it will be explained in the Sartar Set), I would say some of them allied wulf and inhabited it's conquered territories. After all, the Maboder were the most pro-lunar of the tribes anyway (that's why I like them so much), and one would expect a certain degree of 7M initiates, so when the Telmori attacked and broke the tribe, and after that a lunar warchief retook part of their lands, why not join him as his warriors?

After the Dragonrise everything is different of course, the Great Winter has alienated many pro-lunar sartarites, and their continuous defeats and escape from Sartar makes most pro-lunars have to act with caution as to not be branded traitors, and with Wulf and most lunar soldiers gone, they probably seek some sort of independence from their remnants, and of course to restore the tribe and clans. I would say that in 1625 ex-maboder warbands occupy the land of what was Wulfsland, only now with far less warriors to fend off the Telmori and have a cordial relation with the veterans at Stonegate. The Cisina, Culbrea and Torkani don't love them, but as others said, they prefer them to the werewolves. Kallyr most certainly doesn't like them, and favors the Telmori, but she can't just send an army against them, as the neighboring tribes would not like it, and she doesn't have the soldiers to spare anyways, so she just silently supports the Telmori cause. 

But this is all fanfiction, we will se once the Sartar Set comes out. 

[Joerg]

3 hours ago, Jape_Vicho said:

If I was to invent their story after their destruction (I think there's nothing written about it, but I'm sure it will be explained in the Sartar Set),

The Coming Storm has maps about the history of the Cinsina and Maboder tribes, and mentions a number of Maboder survivors who joined the Red Cow clan after 1607.