Stored "Heroic" POW

[PhilHibbs]

4 hours ago, Richard S. said:

Smoking Ruins page 187: " Each point of POW stored in the Hero World can be used as a Rune point."

Can heroic POW used in this way be recovered? And if so, how?

I'd rule no, but that you should never need to. It's not something that you can just draw on like a bank account, but if anything causes you to lose POW such as a vampire or Divine Intervention then you could draw on the Heroic POW first.

We haven't seen the full rules for this yet.

Edited November 3, 2023 by PhilHibbs

[Darius West]

It is interesting to see the direction the rules are going in.

[French Desperate WindChild]

Officially -and temporary-, until the rules are published, David answered "yes"

but what I understand until now :

- you can use heroic pow for heroic abilities (when they are not automatic) and heroic spells you may know / have

- you can use heroic pow for any use a runepool can be used.

- you cannot recover heroic pow by worshipping anyone. The only way is to be worshipped by others (but I don't have any metrics)

 

Am I up to date ?

Edited November 3, 2023 by French Desperate WindChild

[Richard S.]

5 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

I'd rule no, but that you should never need to. It's not something that you can just draw on like a bank account, but if anything causes you to lose POW such as a vampire or Divine Intervention then you could draw on the Heroic POW first.

We haven't seen the full rules for this yet.

We haven't seen the full rules yet, but the rules we do have don't mention being able to use it to replenish your own POW. It does add to your magical attack/defense on the resistance table though, just by existing in the Hero Plane. Besides that, spending it as RP is the only mentioned benefit so I imagine that's largely the point of it, especially since we now know it can be recovered by worship. Also, you kind of have to spend it to use the heroic abilities we've seen.

2 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

- you cannot recover heroic pow by worshipping anyone. The only way is to be worshipped by others (but I don't have any metrics)

Based on David's answer the current ruling is that it recovers whenever you normally recover RP. I wouldn't be surprised if the HQ rules do eventually link it to worship of the adventurer though.

 

I think the Hero Soul is basically the Rune Magic equivalent of a Fetch.

[PhilHibbs]

2 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

Officially -and temporary-, until the rules are published, David answered "yes"

Ah, I think I misinterpreted it, I thought the question was "Can I get that POW back as actual POW". Makes sense that it is about RP recovery.

[PhilHibbs]

I'd tie it to votive images. You have to get a temple or shrine to take a votive image of you, and to celebrate your heroic deeds as part of their worship. As to how many points you get back, maybe one per votive image each seasonal holy day. Maybe 1d2-1 per votive image. Maybe 1dX where X is the dice size at or immediately below your number of RP.

[French Desperate WindChild]

1 hour ago, Richard S. said:

I think the Hero Soul is basically the Rune Magic equivalent of a Fetch.

I may be wrong, and, until there are no supplement (I will by it the D day 😛 ) for that, every thing may change for sure.

But I understood* that when RP is what part of your soul you "sacrifice" (or "entrust") to your god, Hero Soul was what part of your soul you "store"/ "separate from the mundane world" in the god time for yourself (it is still a part of you, in this sense, yes i agree, like a fetch).

so my hypothesis is that HS is not technically dependant on a god

- you can "fuel" any of your runepools (if you have one or more) with it because as a hero you have a facility to manipulate the gate between mundane and god worlds

- but you can't "fuel" your HS from one of your runepools because "your" runepools are not "yours" but only a kind of your part in your god(s) power

 

after all , you may be a hero (HS) without any initiation, so without any runepool. How to recover it then if you need to worship a god ?

 

* the white bull campaign is my source for all my post

[kalidor]

Roll a loyalty (comunity), give gifts to get bonuses, use inspiration, then... if you get a special success, next holy day with you in the ceremony recover a 1d3 Hero Points

[kalidor]

That is if people care about you. If people fear you, I am looking at you Harrek, well, is easier you know. Please Gods keep away the infamous White bear away of our village!!! There you have It. A lot Easier!

[Shiningbrow]

15 hours ago, Richard S. said:

I think the Hero Soul is basically the Rune Magic equivalent of a Fetch.

Are you thinking an actual equivalent, or just a rough analogy?

I would have thought the Allied Spirit to be the equivalent. (although, even there, not quite).

Largely because a shaman could have a Hero Soul as well, and they do fairly different things.

[Richard S.]

10 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

Are you thinking an actual equivalent, or just a rough analogy?

I would have thought the Allied Spirit to be the equivalent. (although, even there, not quite).

Largely because a shaman could have a Hero Soul as well, and they do fairly different things.

More a rough analogy, but there are some interesting parallels. While the Fetch is a part of your soul residing in the spirit world, the Hero Soul lives in the hero plane, and both of them give you a constant presence in and awareness of that plane. Both of them are created and grown by sacrificing POW to them, but that POW still remains "attached" to you and counts towards magical attack and defense. And of course, it allows you to draw on its POW to fuel its respective type of magic. I wouldn't be surprised if heroic abilities are also "stored" in the hero soul like how fetches can capture and hold spirits.

There are a few key dissimilarities though, such as that the hero soul doesn't appear as a separate being from the hero, and it doesn't have charisma. It's just raw POW. They're definitely not the same thing, or incompatible, but I think there might be some intentional connections between the two.

https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/so-what-is-the-hero-soul/

[soltakss]

  On 11/3/2023 at 4:25 AM, Richard S. said:

Smoking Ruins page 187: " Each point of POW stored in the Hero World can be used as a Rune point."

Can heroic POW used in this way be recovered? And if so, how?

In my Glorantha, your Hero Soul is like a Shaman's Stored POW, but for Heroes, and it acts as a generic Rune Pool, so you spend Hero Soul MPs as Rune Points. You could spend them as Diving Intervention, but things would be really bad if you had to do that.

On 11/3/2023 at 2:51 PM, Richard S. said:

I think the Hero Soul is basically the Rune Magic equivalent of a Fetch.

Yes, I agree, but for Heroes and HeroQuestors not just for Rune Magic. It is your presence on the Hero Plane or your Heroic Self, in the same way that a Fetch is a Shaman's presence on the Spirit Plane or a Spirit Self.

 

[PhilHibbs]

On 11/5/2023 at 10:59 AM, soltakss said:

In my Glorantha, your Hero Soul is like a Shaman's Stored POW, but for Heroes, and it acts as a generic Rune Pool, so you spend Hero Soul MPs as Rune Points.

How do you recover those spent Hero Soul RP? Oh, you mean you recover them like MP, all back in 24 hours? 😲

[Malin]

I have no idea if the rules I use will correspond to the actual rules once they are released, they are based on trying to reverse-engineer comments and the chaosium white bull campaign and me riffing on that. I am also quite generous since we are doing a campaign where we will go quite high in power level as we go on. So this is what we use in my campaign since we are going a fair bit into hero territory:

Note: The PC's was a part of the original quest to find the White Bull, that is where they got their first hero point.

Hero rules (mine, not official)

• Once you have acquired the Mastery rune, and your first hero point, you are a hero. You have a permanent connection to the hero plane through your hero form. In some way, you are now part of the myths, and have become part of the world.

• You gain abilities you could not gain otherwise by doing heroquests. These can be either rune spells normally not available, or bespoke gifts depending on the deeds performed. These gifts are fueled by hero points.

• One hero point is free if the quest succeeds, more can be bought for POW at the end of the quest, and you can buy gifts for it earned during the quest just like when sacrificing for rune points.

• Hero points can be used to cast any normal rune spell, but rune points can not be used for hero gifts.

• Hero points are not replenished by worshipping a god, they are replenished when people worship your heroic deeds (and eventually, you).

• If several points are needed to use a hero gift, the first point needs to be a HP, but the rest can be fueled with normal RPs.

For our heroes, being part of bringing the White Bull back, they will be venerated each seasonal holy day. This is wildday of harmony week (in my world). The high holy day is wildday of harmony week in Storm season (in my world). Currently this is at a rate of 1HP per occasion, as if they had a votive image there. This can be increased with effort to spread the cult and your legend.

 

 

[Shiningbrow]

14 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

How do you recover those spent Hero Soul RP? Oh, you mean you recover them like MP, all back in 24 hours? 😲

It's Heroic - so obviously it should only take a few rounds to get them all back 😁

[Shiningbrow]

47 minutes ago, Malin said:

I have no idea if the rules I use will correspond to the actual rules once they are released, they are based on trying to reverse-engineer comments and the chaosium white bull campaign and me riffing on that. I am also quite generous since we are doing a campaign where we will go quite high in power level as we go on. So this is what we use in my campaign since we are going a fair bit into hero territory:

Note: The PC's was a part of the original quest to find the White Bull, that is where they got their first hero point.

Hero rules (mine, not official)

 

• Once you have acquired the Mastery rune, and your first hero point, you are a hero. You have a permanent connection to the hero plane through your hero form. In some way, you are now part of the myths, and have become part of the world.

   

• You gain abilities you could not gain otherwise by doing heroquests. These can be either rune spells normally not available, or bespoke gifts depending on the deeds performed. These gifts are fueled by hero points.

   

• One hero point is free if the quest succeeds, more can be bought for POW at the end of the quest, and you can buy gifts for it earned during the quest just like when sacrificing for rune points.

   

• Hero points can be used to cast any normal rune spell, but rune points can not be used for hero gifts.

   

• Hero points are not replenished by worshipping a god, they are replenished when people worship your heroic deeds (and eventually, you).

• If several points are needed to use a hero gift, the first point needs to be a HP, but the rest can be fueled with normal RPs.

For our heroes, being part of bringing the White Bull back, they will be venerated each seasonal holy day. This is wildday of harmony week (in my world). The high holy day is wildday of harmony week in Storm season (in my world). Currently this is at a rate of 1HP per occasion, as if they had a votive image there. This can be increased with effort to spread the cult and your legend.

 

 

 

Part of your system here is why I would strongly urge PCs to have as their first Heroic Ability be a Runespell that can be taught... it encourages worship. E.g., if a Lhankor Mhy questor came back with a spell that doubles INT (same as the other spells like Charisma and Strength of Basmol) or gives 100% to any Lore or Language, then the cult would be very happy! Anything that's going to be an obvious, and on-going, benefit for the cult.

Or for Orlanthi, a variant of the Arming of Orlanth, where a set of ritually prepared armaments are instantly donned/equipped on the caster - ie, shield on arm, spear or sword in hand, sandals on feet... (probably others as well - like actual armour pieces). Works no matter where the equipment actually is.

Edited November 7, 2023 by Shiningbrow
Added Orlanthi idea

[Malin]

48 minutes ago, Shiningbrow said:

Part of your system here is why I would strongly urge PCs to have as their first Heroic Ability be a Runespell that can be taught... it encourages worship

Yeah! Especially for a heroquest within their cult purvey! That is a very good way to make sure they are remembered. With a mixed/outside heroquest like I ran, the players "reputation" is very much tied to the growth of the cult, so that is where they have to work.

[Jens]

10 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

variant of the Arming of Orlanth

Clearly the Arming of Orlanth is a Heroic ability that lets you grow additional arms, so that you can wield all four magical weapons at once.