Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted

Hi everyone

 

I cant find Atgxtg's Corrected and Expanded SIZ Table.  I checked downloads section, and i searched online all the original images online are gone also.  Apparently i accidentally deleted the file off my computer and my backup failed. I am hoping someone still has the file and can upload it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Posted

Yeah, it can be added to the download page. Right now I just have to go through my notes and make sure I find the right table. I had a few pelimnary attempts and have to find the final version. 

 

I looked on the forum and found where I posted it long ago, but the picture hosting service dropped the jpg. Speaking on which, what format would people prefer it in? JPG? PNG? PDF, or Spreadhseet?

 

Also, I have a newer table that I've been using for the last 3-4 years instead of the Expanded & Revised on, and maybe I should post that one too. It solves all the problems with the official table, and has a consistent progression all along the table. 

  • Like 1

Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself.

Posted

Okay.

 

Hopefully I can get it done this weekend. First I have to search through a half dozen hard drives to find it, then clean it up and make it presentable. 

Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself.

Posted

Here's what I got from various discussions:

 

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/4518/brpsiztablemetriccorrec.png

 

 

I spotted a couple of errors that I need to fix.

1) SIZ 3 should be 38-51 pounds not 38-54.

2) SIZ 248 should be SIZ 240 to match with the table in thew BRP rulebook. However, according to the mathematical progression used in the table, SIZ 235 is probably the correct SIZ. I got to check with Jason on that and on a couple of things I discovered while working on the Expanded SIZ table that covers everything up to SIZ 330. THe table in the BRP book uses a increasing progression from SIZ 96 up to around 272 or so.

SIZ 96-103 is +1 ton per SIZ point
104-111 is +2 tons per SIZ point
112-119 is +3 tons per SIZ point

...and so on up to over +23 tons per SIZ point.

Unfortunately, the table breaks with the progression in a couple of spots that I believe are typos rather than intentional changes. For example SIZ 232 is listed as 1220 tons, only 36 tons more than the value for SIZ 224,but according to the mathematical progression used, it should probably be 1320 tons. 1320 would fit the progression perfectly (+16 tons per SIZ at that point), and smooth out the SIZ values from 224 to 232. But it would also throw the values over 232 off by 100 tons up to 330.


Give me a little time to work out the expanded SIZ table before we talk wiki.

 

If it's roughly humanoid (including Godzilla and T-Rex style dinosaurs) then use the Giant stats of 3D6+6 SIZ per 2m as a rough guideline. If you think they should be a bit chunkier then turn some of the D6s to 6s, if they should be weedier then change some of the 6s to D6s.

For non-humanoid creatures, find a creature that is roughly similar and use this as a basis.

Once you have statted a few of these then you will be able to use those as reference points.

Unfortunately there's nothing scientific about generating stats and any attempts I've seen that tries to use equations always needs tweaking.

 

Er.. what is your poblem? Just figure out how much it should weigh in metric or imperial tons, then consult the weight-to-SIZ chart in the book, or atgxtg's revised version. Please note that unless you wish to use the Strike Rank option (which does not represent creatures bigger than SIZ 20, though), it is only mass that you have to figure out, not height.

 

Well, some estimation is always going to be needed with doing up stats.
I find the sqaure-cube law very helpful.

That is, is you double the height, width, and depth of an object 8or critter), you should multiply it's lifting ability by 4 (+16), and mass by 8 (+24). You can pro-rate that so each +1 height is worth +2 STR and +3 SIZ.

It hold well up to SIZ 88 or so, where they stopped using the fixed progression.

If it help's I did have some notes for working up SIZ by volume (and/or density). It might help with ballpark figures.

If we dropped the CoC SIZ values after SIZ 88 and just continued on with the normal progression, things like battleships and daikaiju would be a LOT easier to stat out.

Last edited by Atgxtg; 5 Hours Ago at 15:20.

 

More on SIZ

 

SIZ in general uses a logarithmic doubling progression where each doubling of mass adds 8 to SIZ. SIZ 8 is about 50kg, SIZ 16 is about 100kg, SIZ 24 is about 200kg and so on. This holds true from around SIZ 8 to around SIZ 88. If you want a formula to convert a mass to a SIZ score for a spreadsheet or calculator try log (kg)* 26.575-37.15 (round down).

 

Because I've brought this up before. In fact I posted a "revised and expanded SIZ table"on the forms a few years back that fills in weight and mass values for the "missing SIZ" stats on the BRP SIZ table, and attempts to correct the errors on the BRP SIZ table. I think Rosen even used the table for his SIZ stats in BRP Mecha.

I'm the guy who has been working on a vehicle design system for BRP (off and on) and a BRP Bestiary (with Erasmus1966), and both use the x2mass =+8 SIZ progression along with stuff like the cube-square law to extrapolate good BRP game data from real world numbers and existing BRP stats.

The cube-square law really helps when making up giant or midget creatures. Basically if you double all of a creatures dimensions (length/width/height) you would add 16 to STR and 24 to SIZ. The 2 STR per 3 SIZ ratio holds true here and is why insects are so strong relative to their mass, and why giants can only get so big before their body can't support or move the mass.

I got a bit more real world formulas converted into BRP terms, too. Such as the relationship between SPEED, Thrust (read STR in BRP) and Power (i.e. POW). It did take a little more effort to work that stuff out in BRP terms but the payoff is that I have a consistent scale for turning real world data, such as mass, thrust, velocity, and power into SIZ, STR, MOV, and POW.

Eventually I'm hoping to boil it down to the point where a GM can just plug the real world data into a spreadsheet and it will spit out BRP game stats.

 

I got it to the point where it does most of the work. There are a few tricky bits, but I've got working formulas for most things. Right now I am working on simplifying a few things, adjusting scales, and trying to find a better formula for armor and weapons, plus a few spot rules to account for the differences in tech (for example, sailing ships probably need longer turns in chases, and modern aircraft can often chase targets beyond visual range).

But, if it helps, I got the vehicle top speed formula simplified down to:
SPD= (STR-DRAG)/2 or SPD = (POW-DRAG)/3
You read SPD on the SIZ table using m/s instead of kg.
STR is kg thrust
POW is in decajoules (I think).
DRAG is the vehicles SIZ plus modifiers for vehicle type, streamlining, and medium (air or water)

 

http://basicroleplaying.com/showthread.php/3544-Size-Attribute/page2

 

Child Sizes Chart

        Male           Male                  Female         Female  
Age     Height(")      Weight(#)      SIZ     Height(")      Weight(#)      SIZ
2       32-34-37       24-28-35       2       31-34-37       22-26-34       2       
3       35-37-41       28-32-40       3       34-37-40       26-30-40       3       
4       37-40-43       30-36-45       3       36-40-43       28-35-48       3
5       39-43-46       32-40-55       3       39-42-46       32-40-55       3
6       42-45-49       35-45-62       4       41-45-49       36-46-64       4
7       44-48-52       40-50-70       4       44-48-52       38-50-72       4       
8       46-50-55       45-56-80       4       46-50-55       44-55-84       5
9       48-53-57       48-65-96       5       48-52-57       48-64-96       5
10      50-55-60       55-70-110      6       49--57-59      52-72-112      6
11      51-56-62       60-80-130      7       51-60-65       58-80-130      6-7
12      53-59-64       65-90-140      7       54-60-65       66-90-146      7-8
13      56-61-67       70-100-155     7-8     57-62-67       72-100-160     7-8
14      58-64-70       80-110-170     8-9     58-63-68       80-110-170     8-9
15      61-67-72       90-124-184     10      59-64-68       86-115-180     9
16      62-68-74       100-135-196    10      59-64-69       92-120-18      10
17      63-69-75       106-142-205    11      59-64-69       96-122-190     10
18      64-69-75       114-148-215    11      60-65-69       98-125-192     11
19      64-70-75       116-152-218    11      59-64-69       98-128-196     11
20      64-70-75       120-155-224    12      60-65-69       100-128-196    11

And that's about the SIZ of it.  ;)

Posted

I actually think i will use the +8 = x2  like sizes 8 to 88 uses.

 

Yeah, it can be added to the download page. Right now I just have to go through my notes and make sure I find the right table. I had a few pelimnary attempts and have to find the final version. 

 

I looked on the forum and found where I posted it long ago, but the picture hosting service dropped the jpg. Speaking on which, what format would people prefer it in? JPG? PNG? PDF, or Spreadhseet?

 

Also, I have a newer table that I've been using for the last 3-4 years instead of the Expanded & Revised on, and maybe I should post that one too. It solves all the problems with the official table, and has a consistent progression all along the table. 

I would like to see both tables, but i think i will use the +8 = x2 version as it seems more manageable and consistent to me. I can use any of the formats you listed. so i have no preference. So use the format what works best for you and other users here. :)

Posted

Okay,

I'll work on it this weekend. 

 

For obvious reason's It will start as a spreadsheet, but these days it's pretty easy to turn one into a PDF. 

 

The image was good for posting in the forums, but it I am going to put it in the download section, PDF and spreadsheet are the ways to go. PDF is neater and more universal, while a spreadsheet is easier for me to code. 

 

I'll do both SIZ tables (well actually 3 tables, but one is just the corrected one from the book, and the second one expanded to cover more SIZ scores). The official one is riddled with errors.

 

Oh, and I can put in some stuff to do it the other way - that is to determine SIZ from mass (or weight). I use that quite a bit when stating up vehicles and animals. For instance, if you got an elephant with a mass of 5325 kg  it will be SIZ 61. 

 

 

I got some stuff for putting VOLume, POWer, and SPeeD on a stat scale that I found useful but others might not. On of the things is does is allow me to determine a car's approximate STR score based on it's engine's POW and top speed. 

  • Like 2

Chaos stalks my world, but she's a big girl and can take of herself.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...