davecake

And those that see Chaos as not philosophically wrong, like the Lunars, see the idea of that potential, for new creation and for things to exist beyond the rules of this one, as a creative force that can transcend the limits of the world. But while it’s impossible to say if they are wrong at a philosophical level, at a practical level Chaos is horrific - it doesn’t belong in the world. The Kabbalistic concept of the qlippoth is one that’s worth considering. The Sephiroth are often compared to the Runes (that metaphor is used for the art on page 149 of the Guide, for example, though obviously the two systems do not neatly correspond), the qlippoth are the unholy and impure corruptions of those primal powers of creation. There is a sense in which the qlippoth sugggest an excess, a mold overfilled. ‘Evil’ can come about from not just things taken to extremes, but things that are lacking or out of balance - too little mercy, too little love, or when has appropriate love for family but does not balance it with love for mankind. Chaos is when things are at extremes or corrupted, not merely lacking. For the most part, Chaos is clearly unnatural, or it bubbles beneath the surface.

Pretty close to how I imagine the Vadeli, yes. It’s not just pushing the rules, it’s doing innovative things to use them in ways not quite intended. For example they work around not being permitted to act as ‘rulers’ by building a social hierarchy around maritime law, which is why their rulers are Admirals.

This was not true in the PDF I was looking at (which explicitly said they got the penalty) but it was clearly a mistake - I redownloaded it, and the new version had corrected the mistake and now says the opposite. I wish Chaosium made it easier to know you have the current version of the PDF besides download and comparison of the text. Some services let you know when the PDF is updated, that would be great.

Not Dwarven Maker spells - they usually take a point of POW to cast. Even if you only lose the POW on a successful cast, you still going to think twice about any form of relying on repeated long duration casting attempts if it means having to try to cast it days ahead of time in the hopes it will be needed. You only want to be casting a spell like that when you definitely need it.

Iron dwarves are sorcerers too, if fairly specialised ones without a wide range of spells. I think even for the iron dwarves, the extra 3-4 APS is usually a pretty convincing argument. Especially as, if it is a really important battle, Iron dwarves will want to cast magic on their iron armour itself, given that they can protect themselves from critical that way.

While true, remember the dwarves are THE great Stasis rune culture, much more so than the Law rune. And that the same magical fact that makes Brithini society the way it is (immortality if you adhere to the narrow letter of the caste rules) that is also the foundation of Vadeli society, they just have a very different attitude - not noted for their socially conservative nature, rather anything that isn’t forbidden must therefore be permitted is the Vadeli attitude, and they use Lawful sorcery just as freely and effectively as the Mostali or Brithini, frequently to do Disorderly things like deception and murder. its helpful to think of the magical effect of Brithini and Vadeli caste laws as something like a lifelong magical ritual that grants an ongoing benefit, or as similar to mystic austerities or gifts and geases. Brithini then use it cautiously to guide their culture, Vadeli treat it like power-gaming PCs and have long since found all the loopholes.

Only said by people who would fail their Runic Philosophy exam... Law in this sense isn’t human law, it’s natural law, and nature is quite frequently Disorderly. Especially natural phenomena beloved of gods like Orlanth (storms) or Lodril. As far as human law goes, if the fundamental principles underlying your legal philosophy are ‘ no one can make you do anything’ and ‘violence is always an option’ and ‘there is always another way’* then your law is hardly hostile to Disorder, rather it assumes it will happen and just tries to tidy up the mess. Many cultures, but especially the Orlanthi, don’t necessarily associate the law with direct opposition to Disorder. * yes, even this last principle, usually interpreted as Ernalda offering alternatives to violence, also means that pragmatism and good outcomes are rated more by the Orlanthi than consistency and Yelmic ideas of inflexible Justice. Yelmic culture sees Ernaldan efforts to resolve feuds with weregelds and such as people being able to buy their way out of the appropriate punishment for their crimes. Offering weregeld for a slain Imperial citizen like a Lunar officer is like being offered a bribe for someone to get away with murder, to a Yelmic noble. Yelmic culture of course, thinks Stasis and Harmony are far better than Disorder and flexible Change.

I was really surprised to see characters like Leika or Asborn in the Adventure book wearing unenchanted iron armor, with huge casting penalties (Leika is a Rune Lord who can cast a lot of defensive magic too - I don’t think she is wanting the magic defenses if it interferes with her own casting), and I think it might be an error - the AP of their armour indicates it in enchanted. Unenchanted iron seems a really interesting option for armoured warriors that are themselves poor spell casters with poor intrinsic magic defenses (Brithini Horali for example) but even then 50% extra AP probably seems more inviting, at least for armor and shields.

Dwarves are known to trade for iron, both enchanted and unenchanted. This happens quite often in some places - in Dragon Pass, this most happens with the Cold Hard Iron Tribute arrangement with the Cinsina Tribe. The terms of trade are ruinous, usually required deeds and service ranging from extraordinary through heroic, occasionally near suicidal and refused, but still considered worth it by the Cinsina, particularly the Red Cow clan, who desperately need iron weapons because they live next to the Telmori. (Coming Storm page 62) Over the years they have accumulated more iron than any tribe in Sartar. But the vagaries of fortune have meant they’ve traded some, given it as dowries or tribute or bribes/gifts, lost some in battle, and quite a bit has ended up with other tribes. Sometimes they’ve needed the help of other just to put together the tribute at all. My impression is that the ‘Cold Hard’ iron is enchanted, and we know it is delivered fully worked into weapons - if not it can be enchanted. My suspicion is the the dwarves also mark such weapons with serial numbers or consignment marks or similar, and keep track of its origins - while they might resent non-Mostali having iron weapons a little, they also know it’s a result of a formally contracted trade, so they won’t try to reclaim it unless the deal is broken. Besides, humans might use it to kill elves or trolls, which is cool. Iron axe heads or spear shafts are the most common - because the amount of metal is smaller, you get a far better deal than a sword or mace, and axe heads are very familiar to dwarves.

I think Asrelia mostly uses tally sticks to keep track of debts, which they can administer without any beard assistance if necessary. But this makes the free transfer of debts between temples complicated, so there is always a fee and it’s really the province of Issaries etc. Asrelia is very into accumulating and dealing with wealth, but moving it around over distances is really the business of others. But their ability to preserve large quantities of perishable goods indefinitely effectively lets them arbitrage over time instead of space, which is a big deal (futures trading etc!). Plus now they have the greatest sea port in the world.

Kallyr is bit too recent to be fully dramatised (in the campaign start date of 1625 the really tragic bits haven’t happened yet), same with Bryan too. But songs and plays about the lineage of Sartar are common. And almost all tragedies, obviously. Groups of travelling players seem like a great idea. Some will be Donandar magicians, some mostly innocent artists, some thieves or con men on the side ( a Trickster or two perhaps), some even ogres or worse. ( in the West, certain sorcerer thieves are often travelling entertainers I think - the Telendarian tradition of magic, forever tainted by its association with the Vadeli, and forced underground by Talor).

And so Orlaront goes to hang out with that Argrath guy in Pavis, and immediately starts work on building a base of draconic magic friendly allies in Pavis who can extract EWF secrets from the Rubble, starts the Sun County civil war in the process. Now Argrath feels he has the magical secrets that have been shown to be the only thing useful against the Empire.... but in order to use them he is going to have to get Kallyr out of the way... Kallyr is such a great tragic figure, close to getting everything right, but just when she should be seeing her plans come to fruition instead we’ll intentioned bad choices and missteps see her brought down by those more ruthless, cynical and adaptable.

The problem with leaving your money with Chalana Arroy is returning to the temple where you stashed your loot and discovering that they have charitably donated it to those who needed it more than you did. Victims of illness who were starving, etc. Don’t worry, you get the full amount as healing credit against your future needs!

Magic, and as people have said, javelins to disrupt the line. Phalanxes are vulnerable to missiles. Which is why Yelmalio teaches Lightwall. I think Humakti might also try to hack at the pikes as they advance, trying to break them. Which why Yelmalio teaches Repair. Orlanthi will generally try to go for a flanking manoeuvre emphasising mobility. Which is why a Yelmalio force is never pure phalangites. But it’s still the best tactic.

Yes. But most of the time, as few deserve a truly hideous hell, he sends you off to your gods... who then judge you in their own way. Eg Heortlings don’t generally head off to a deeper Hell or an unending Limbo unless they are truly awful and probably Chaotic, and no god will claim their soul - almost always they head off to the Orlanthi gods who then decide if they are heroes of honor who deserve a seat at Orlanth and Ernaldas table, or low churls who scrabble for scraps outside the hall. Daka Fal usually is not judging your conduct but the magical connections you made and which after life you belong in. And most of the time, he is just telling you what you already believe to be true (there is a reason his face is a mirror).

Yes. Daka Fal is also Grandfather Mortal though, who of course was mortal, so is he is dead now, so the first Mortal and the Judge of the Dead are the same being. He doesn't actually judge the dead much, just redirects them on to where they should go. In general, most myths seem to say the Horned Man came after the invention of mortality - there was no need for him until the living and dead were separate.

Not in mine, I guess. I don’t think they have any defined role in the cult. Eiritha seems so focussed on physical world processes I guess.

I didn’t know there was ever much more than that written up. I think it’s mostly just talking to rock spirits with a minority of full shamans.

Shamans of Daka Fal or Waha can still join/start Spirit Cults. Some are even common (Waha shamans joining Oakfed, for example). Daka Fal shamans may belong to a whole lineage that deals with particular spirits. But their Power is already split between the needs of their cult, and maintaining their fetch and shamanic powers - they will have a lot less power for spirit cults. Kygor Litor shamans and Aldrya shamans are a different story - they have restrictions on what sort of spirits they can bind to their fetch (and both only normally spirit travel to the Underworld). So they can't join just any spirit cult either. But they both have a lot of great rune magic, and a few other options open to them. Kygor Litor shaman-priestesses can get spirits from Ancestor Worship (their ancestor is Korasting not Daka Fal, but not very rules different) and access to many Darkness powers via Dehore or Subere. Aldrya shamans have fewer options but they can still join Flamal (and use many plant spirits). But even Jakaleel shamans can still join other spirit cults if they want (though they are probably more inclined to reach out to other paths in the Lunar way instead). Golden Bow shamans aren't restricted to Solar spirits (but Fire elementals are great). And so on. Personally, I hold with Kolat as a shamanic cult itself, that offers its own shamanic path, but that doesn't mean it doesn't act as a spirit cult as well. Same with the Earth Witch.

There are descriptions of Lunars being killed or run out of the area en masse in Prax, but thats Prax and Pavis. Almost all the Lunars (except the Sables) are culturally distinct recent settlers or visitors. A Praxian army or Orlanthi city dwellers are going to find it easy to go around stabbing foreigners. In Sartar, whole bloodlines have gone over to worship of the Lunars, and more recently in the Great Winter. Many in Northern Sartar are originally Tarshite, and have been Lunar for generations. You can't slaughter whole chunks of your own clan. That's kinstrife. Thats an invitation to Chaos and doom. They are members of your clan or citizens of your city, and have legal rights, maybe allies on the ring, maybe links by marriage. Even the 'Lunar' leaders that came in with the occupation are mostly only from Tarsh - they are culturally much closer than they are to Praxians. Plenty of 'Lunars' are going to decide that even with the change in government, sticking around where they have houses, businesses, families is still better than setting off to somewhere they don't know, or left for very good reasons. And most Sartarites are going to disapprove, but they might have good reasons not to turn it into a pogrom. And plenty of Sartarite converts to the Lunar religion will find real spiritual value in it, and decide not to convert back, even if it is no longer as politically expedient. They still want to live where they always lived, on their own lands, among their own people. That will mean showing that, despite their weird new religion, they are still valuable members of their new communities.

Not quite. It's similar to worshipping Argan Argar without worshipping the Only Old One while the Only Old One is still alive, active in the world, and the core of a cult system that runs an Empire. In other words, questions will be asked, and more questions the more powerful you get. The Yelm in the modern era is closely controlled by the Red Emperor - you need the Emperors permission to become a member of Yelm Imperator, the elite core of powerful sacred rulers of the cult, and he doesn't grant it unless you also join the Red Goddess cult, and are Illuminated. Which isn't to saw there aren't plenty of people who worship Yelm without worshipping the Red Emperor, and not just ones outside the Empire. But at a certain point it becomes an issue.

Viking sagas were the go to sources for Orlanthi bad behaviour for a long while, and probably still are - while the recent tendency is to make the Orlanthi less Viking in cultural trappings, their legal system is still quite similar, so many of the plots hold well. In particular, Njals saga shows how even the best efforts of leaders who want peace can get dragged into a vicious vendetta by their clans/families. It was a big inspiration for a famous Orlanthi story, the story of the enmity between Lokamayadon and Rastalulf ending in the Immolation. Another one is Grettirs Saga, which shows how outlawry can basically lead straight to the life of a classic murder hobo, as Grettir, pursued by his enemies, basically wanders about asking each settlement if there is something or someone he can slaughter for cash - and it also shows how one feud can involve a lot of incidental death of those peripherally involved. Speaking of Lokamayadon, by the end of Argraths saga there are probably more than a few traditionalist Orlanth comparing Argrath to Lokamaydon, and accusing him of 'Lokamayadism', the crime of changing religious rules for personal power.

Argrath wins the Hero Wars. He has to change Orlanthi society a lot to do so - he is at least as significant in this respect as Alakoring - and somewhat in the other direction, Alakoring reduced the influence of priests and magicians and increased the power of kings and chiefs to fight against dragon mystics, Argrath wants to increase the influence of magicians by bringing in dragon mystics, and eventually will want to reduce the power of traditional clan chiefs and kings so he can build an Empire. We get Argraths Imperial perspective on this as the triumph of Storm, but you could write it from another perspective as the final submission of Orlanth to the Dragon Emperor via Lunar utuma or something like that

The Kralorelan narrative is that when Empires rise and fall you try really hard to pretend its the same Empire all along.

I think it has quite a lot. Sure, less than the modern day, but wealth really counts in Orlanthi culture. A rich carl can become a thane, a thane can become a chief. Its far more socially mobile than Solar culture, or even Esrolian (where the major houses have a lock on power, so lineage counts strongly). This isn't a straight positive though. It means ambitious Orlanthi leaders are competing quite aggressively for glory and wealth - and the quick paths to both involve violence. An ambitious low born Solar leader has to find a way to make money that is legal and probably requires noble patronage and probably still has to suck up to the nobility for generations - for example, use their wealth to become a priest of a cult eligible to retire into the Yelm the Elder cult, leverage money etc to get noble favour, maybe marry into a family with full citizenship, to give their children or grandchildren a chance at real power. A similarly ambitious Orlanthi can become a thane or a chief in one generation, if they can get enough wealth and reputation - and a shortcut to both is straight out stealing stuff from your neighbours at sword point. And the legal system is such that wealth and status is going to give you a lot of ability to resist legal attempts to restrain you, as long as you are open about it (unlike Solar culture, in which attempting to advance yourself by raiding your neighbours might get you executed). The Ernaldan customs emphasise peace making because they really need it - there are strong social incentives to start violent feuds.