Darius West

Delete this comment plz.

It is probably better to think of Chaos like a form of biological taint which can sometimes produce superpower mutations (or awful crippling effects). Chaotic creatures use those overwhelmingly destructive powers for bad purposes, so nearly everyone hates them. In Glorantha, Chaos and Law are not really opposites in that way. Arrquong the Harbinger of Chaos is famously fond of Sorcerers of the West, whose deity carries the Law rune, famously saying that "the men of the West never did us any wrong". In Glorantha, there is a different dynamic going on, and it is the forces of Disorder who are the major adversaries of Chaos. This is because Glorantha is about escalation, and the disorder deities are presently dominant in the world, having already subverted and conquered the "lawful" forces during the Lesser Darkness. Chaos arrives in the Greater Darkness, and it is Disorder that is its foe. The way Greg put it, you become like the enemy you fight... Fight the Kingdom of War, become the Kingdom of War.

LOL, my bad, so it was, and a good thing too.

The new administration being the White Bulls. I have taken the info on New Pavis under Lunar occupation and reworked it to turn it into a city under a Gloranthan bronze age war economy under Argrath and his various regional allies.

Treat it like Ragnarok. Old and fated enemies meet and die in mutually assured destruction. Passions boil. Ideologies and ambitions clash, and the chivalry of Britain achieves what no outside force could ever manage, its own mindless annihilation. Perhaps highlight the futility of it all Bhagavad Gita-style with a foreshadowing by a saint or pagan magician, given that Merlin is now entombed and cannot do that narration. Plenty of nasty deaths need to be described as epitaphs for some great characters. Make sure to go out with a bang and not a whimper. Don't do a GoT and phone in the last ep.

I have already written up my own notes on the evolution of the city under the new administration if anyone wants to compare.

The fact is that the dragonewts never featured heavily in the history of Glorantha, which is largely written for and by humans imo. Now it is possible that someone broke into the dragonewt cities and smashed all their eggs, as happened before the Dragonkill, but as there are plenty of active dragons during the Hero Wars, it might be suicide. That being said, using the boardgame Dragon Pass, I can also raise the counter-argument that if one side of the Hero Wars managed to ally the dragonewts, that doesn't preclude the other side using a dragon to destroy the dragonewts... But then again, is that really lore-friendly, even if it could feasibly happen in the boardgame? Yeah, what can you say about creatures that have existed and reincarnated since Before Time and haven't quite figured out what this whole "eating" thing is all about *snortlaugh*. It is fair to underline the incompetence of the remaining dragonewts JRE, and I sometimes think that their idiosyncratic behavior may be a product not of the dragon path, but their ingrained long term dumbassery being translated into dogmatic and ritualized foolishness. But, we must always respect and give other cultures the benefit of the doubt, even (I must stress this), regardless of how ridiculous their antics may appear to be. The fact is, the dragonewts do have a very strange and wonderfully alien society, and the EWF has demonstrated that there is real power and potential there, and frankly I am very fond of them as a literary creation quite apart from their use as NPCs in RQ. To your actual point however, for the most part, dragons seem to be immune to the long term effects of humanity's mistakes and own-goals in Gloranthan history. Their magic is completely independent of the Theistic, sorcerous, and even shamanistic systems, as it is mystical in its inclination, and the fact that the Dragons are the one that haul down the Moon suggest to me that they and the dragonewts will be doing their own thing through the 4th Age and beyond. I can't see them boarding ships and sailing to the Grey Havens (forgive the comparison plz).

Jose, in short the answer is no, or I would have included them. Should they be included? Ah, well, that's a different question.

Good stats there.🙂

LOL good point but it never happened. This was back in RQ2 times. Not many people spent points on reflection.

Donandar is coming out in RQ:Gods of Glorantha. I have an advance copy. Here is what the cult gets in the new write-up using your format: I think your version is better fleshed out Jeff. The RQ:GoG version doesn't focus enough on Theater or poetry imo. Donandar is a small cult despite having holdings in several ruins in Dragon Pass via the Puppeteer Troupes.

I'm not against beefing up the usefulness of a spirit magic spell that is otherwise pretty useless. The cry is often heard in games "That fool is shimmering! Bombard them with spells, they have no countermagic!"

I don't think this is the last True Dragons. Just the latest batch. There is little to suggest that the dragonewts go extinct as a result of the Hero Wars.

In essence the way the idea of spirit spells is described is that they are magic performed by spirits invoked for the performance of the spells. When I say spirit magic is used against spirit, to clarify, I mean that it is a shamanic magic system that works according to a paradigm that magic is all about spirits. I agree that I expressed that badly. Mechanically, within the rules, both spells are POW vs POW. RQG rules does reduce all spirits to 3 stats. While Dominate and Demoralize are from different magical traditions, it would only be a minor tweak to treat Demoralize as a sorcery spell, and Dominate as a spirit spell. Glorantha is made of runes, and it is the runes that are controlled. Dominate Humanoid controls the man rune. Dominate Beast controls the beast rune. Dominate Spirit controls the spirit rune, and Dominate Elemental controls the element rune appropriate to the elemental. On the other hand, human meat in Glorantha is the manifestation of the man rune.

Infiltrate Badside. This is a job for newcomers only. The White Bulls know there are clandestine Lunars operating in the Big Rubble much as the Orlanthi used to. While this knowledge meant that most Orlanthi rebels and bandits did a good job of stopping this, some Lunars managed to slip through. Evidence suggests that they are now using elements in Badside as their intermediaries. As the players are newcomers, and not well known, if they can slum it in Badside until they can find out who the lunars are, they will be guaranteed access to a rental property in New Pavis, and a year's rent free. Catch Rubble Runners. Cock-fights, cat fights, dog fights, fish fights, the folk of New Pavis have an appetite for betting on animals fighting each other. The problem is that someone always takes issue with them. The latest version however has the nay-sayers beaten, as no cult protects or cares about rubble-runners, and getting them to fight to the death is now a somewhat lucrative business. Interested parties are prepared to pay 1L per SIZE point of live rubble runner, for as many as you can catch, as supplies of the creatures are low, and New Pavic bloodlust is high. Where do you catch the biggest rubble runners if not in the Big Rubble? Wanted Dead or Alive. A series of mysterious crimes have been taking place in New Pavis. Sometimes striking the wealthy, other times the poor, but often striking criminals or suspected criminals. Nobody knows who the perpetrator is, save that they seem to be of no known species, and their crimes are always audacious, outrageous, incriminating to the victim and humiliating. Their crimes are often sealed with a bat marked in red sealing wax. What sort of maniac could be behind these deranged crimes? Infamous shit-hole needs new goons. The Reed Inn (D15) is in trouble. It has always been in trouble but now it is slightly worse. Its owner Bagzaga Rag is a Dark Troll of Argan Argar who runs the bottom-of-the-bottom lowest quality drinking hole in New Pavis, that makes Loud Lilina's look like a palace. Bagzaga used to pay kick-backs to the "Red Bastards" street gang when the Lunars were running the city, but now the God's Own gang from Sunside is looking to run her out of town, if not kill her. The place is terrible. The beds are piles of tied reeds, as is the furniture. Much of it is riddled with various form of insect life which Bagzaga insists are free and tasty treats for her guests. The alcohol is barely drinkable, but will get you buzzed, but makes prison "toilet wine" look classy. Its clientelle are also disreputable low-lifes despised by the rest of Pavic society. Many locals want to get rid of this weeping sore in an otherwise respectable district. For all this, somehow, Bagzaga manages to run a profit, and she is prepared to pay for protection. Will the players consider this unusual offer? Just go and take a look. A local Lhankor Mhy sage and a Daughter of Pavis are pooling their resources to uncover a mystery, or so they say. They seem to think that there are a system of 8 fountains across the Big Rubble, one in each of the main districts, that don't fit. They are supposed to be from the founding of the city, but depict Pavis as a deity, which is chronologically impossible. There may even be a ninth fountain in the Puzzle Canal. The learned folk want the players to go to the supposed locations, and note whatever they can about the fountains, confirming their existence or not, and to take rubbings or make sketches if possible. Pay is surprisingly good for what should be an easy job with no fighting. Nothing is every what it seems in the Big Rubble though.

So you side with Harvar Ironfist then? Nay I say, and thrice nay! Elmal and Yelmalio are not the same god and have never been so. You speak of Sun Domes. They are hives of villainy. Good Elmali don't worship at them, but at their Orlanthi village shrines and temples. Yelmalios enter into Snakepipe Holow not to fight chaos but to placate and worship at its shrines! They have similar magics, it is true, but not the same. Elmal is the gate guard and horse master of the Orlanthi, and Elmal has the fire rune not the light rune. Elmal never bled out his fire on the Hill of Gold, because he never went to the Hill of Gold, and did not fight his liege Orlanth for that would be the very definition of disloyalty but Elmal is the Loyal thane, and so Elmal retains his fireblade and firearrow spells. Now it is true that he is not worshipped as widely as Yelmalio, but he fought hard through the Long Winter and with the New Ring of Orlanth risen his time is coming again anew. It is time to purge the false cult of Yelmalio, which is riddled with hidden Thanatar worship. This revelation by Monrogh was false and the product of Chaotic illumination, and only dreamed up recently and After Time, and a means by which the Lunars sought to spread dissention among the Orlanthi by making their loyal Elmal thanes think they are part of the Solar Pantheon, and follow a Yelm pantheon quisling version of Elmal. The loyal Elmali of Far Point will never succumb to this sleazy lunar ploy. The Lunars and Solars may look down their noses at the Elmali, calling them parochial savages, and the Elmali fight in the Orlanthi way as part of the shield wall, not as phalangites, but the Elmali bring fire-power to the battle field, and have their lord and friend the wind to fan those flames. You speak falsely and as a scion of Lunar tyranny, and the Elmali will never bow to these falsehoods.

Not so. That is godlearnerism. Elmal is Orlanth's loyal thane, while Orlanth fought Yelmalio on the Hill of Gold. If they were the same deity, Orlanthi myths would recognize that. Much of the repression conducted by Harvar Ironfist was to force the Tarshite tribes of Far Point to give up on Elmal worship. They are not the same deity, as Yelmalio only came into existence 60+ years ago and is a chaotic lunar plot to sow dissent and encourage covert Thanatar worship among loyal Elmali tribes.

It is perfectly possible to refuse to recognize spirits as being anything other than magical detritus.

I think this is something of a "how long is a piece of string" question. The string is as long as it needs to be for its purpose, unless and until it breaks. As to how often characters visit Camelot, well, how often do they need to go? Whenever I've played, I think we visited Camelot at least once per year, and sometimes more when there were matters to report on. If you want glory, it is wise to try to get yourself invited to the Feast of Pentecost at Camelot. Of course you may not see Arthur every year, but you are likely to find someone to provide patronage if you rub shoulders with the powerful. Of course this may not be possible if your own subenfeudalization means you owe first duty to another lord than Arthur.

That is something of an artefact of the system though. Yes we roll POW vs POW, but it might also be called WILL vs WILL or Sorcery vs Target's Permanent Magic Rune Concentration or any number of other things. Mind and body are one in a materialist paradigm.

BUMP

This...👍

The brain is part of the body. So is the nervous system. This is the materialist paradigm of sorcery. Control the body, control the mind, because the mind is part of the body. Spirit is a delusion to sorcerers, as it is just a shell of residual POW that exists after someone dies. A ghost is not a person to sorcerers, it is just an echo on the mythic energy background. If we started worrying they were all somehow "people", not just spirit trash, then what would we tap? Clearly all good Malkioni's souls go straight to Solace, and these "spirits" they leave behind are simply a product of their shedding of their sins.😉

I am aware of the trick, and suggest you always try to take out the commanders in the first hit (The ol' cut the head off the snake trick). For your average Sartarite who only has 3RP that is a high risk strategy tho. IMO, in Gloranthan warfare where RP are scarce for most people, you want to minimize the magic you use for maneuver so you can use it for keeping yourself alive with Heal Self (to keep your limbs from falling off at embarrassing moments), Shield and similar magic. That means mundane maneuvers like various forms of "unzipping the line" will be preferred. Skirmishing would be good too.

In fact the Ganges has been holy for thousands of years as Ali the Helering suggests. Herodotus refers to the rites on the Ganges and says they were being carried out for thousands of years before he saw them. In terms of the holiness of the waters, they are extremely rich and teeming in bacteriophages, which are microbes that eat many of the things that pollute the river. In any case, the British East India Company were well esconced in India in 1776, and in fact signed the Treaty of Purandar with the Maratha Empire that year. Potentially Americans who were prepared to at least pretend they were British Subjects might be able to travel to the Ganges unmolested, but it might take months. Heh. My parties almost always read them, and sought to abuse the spells, going more than a little mad, and ultimately having their abuse of power blow up in their faces. On the other hand, they also almost caused multiple TPKs because they could never organize who was paying the phone bill in their share house. Player: "OMFG Call the police!" (me) Keeper: You lift the receiver and the line is dead. Then you remember that even after 3 arguments, nobody actually paid the phone bill. Players: (collapse into mutual recriminations while facing a fresh threat).