d100rules is coming...

[rust]

Well, f.ex. SIZ is gone, which I know is a stat that many people like.

Instead there will be height and weight tables, where the roll will be modified by STR and race. HP = 1/2 STR + 1/2 CON.

It's a way to avoid the freakish SIZ 5 dwarf at 35 kg, but with a STR of 20. :cool:

This looks like a very good idea to me. :thumb:

I hope you did not delete EDU (or at least made it possible to re-introduce

it without problems), many of my players' characters are of the "cerebral"

kind ...

[dragonewt]

Well, f.ex. SIZ is gone, which I know is a stat that many people like.

I always found size to be a good abstract value for determining the outcome of many things. As the HP enhancer based on Mass by Health, As the damage enhancer based on Mass by Strength, and more usefully, as an abstract value that could provide ENC and be opposed by STR (without the need for a lookup table during play).

In many ways, I think SIZ actually simplified many interactions.

[frogspawner]

Well, f.ex. SIZ is gone, which I know is a stat that many people like.

Fine by me. Are HP purely based on CON, then? Or Weight?

I hope you did not delete EDU...

Isn't d100rules for Fantasy settings, where EDU doesn't usually feature?

In many ways, I think SIZ actually simplified many interactions.

There'll still be Weight, though - and if you measure weight in Stones, you have a perfectly usable SIZ-equivalent number right there. I suspect "SIZ is gone" just means it's modifiers on various skills, and similar (over-?)complications, will be gone. Right?

[Trifletraxor]

I hope you did not delete EDU (or at least made it possible to re-introduce it without problems), many of my players' characters are of the "cerebral" kind ...

It should probably not be that hard to re-introduce, but EDU is not included.

I always found size to be a good abstract value for determining the outcome of many things. As the HP enhancer based on Mass by Health, As the damage enhancer based on Mass by Strength, and more usefully, as an abstract value that could provide ENC and be opposed by STR (without the need for a lookup table during play).

In many ways, I think SIZ actually simplified many interactions.

With SIZ gone and STR being linked to mass, STR takes over many of the functions SIZ had before.

Fine by me. Are HP purely based on CON, then? Or Weight?

HP = 1/2 STR + 1/2 CON. Strenght is used as it both represent SIZ to a certain degree, but also because higher muscle mass lessens the severity of injuries.

Isn't d100rules for Fantasy settings, where EDU doesn't usually feature?

Yes. There will be some notes in the addendum on how to use it in modern settings, but the primary focus is fantasy.

I suspect "SIZ is gone" just means it's modifiers on various skills, and similar (over-?)complications, will be gone. Right?

Right. The rule system is a "light" one. Stats determine the base% for skills, but do not influence them after character generation.

SGL.

[frogspawner]

Looks pretty good to me!

[Rurik]

After rolling up a couple of characters two characteristics really bothered me - SIZ and APP (and to a lesser extent INT).

SIZ and INT bother me because 2d6+6 is troublesome for how I roll up characters. I Use the 4d6 drop the lowest method. For SIZ and INT 3d6 drop lowest and add six seems to result in a lot of of big, smart people, while 2d6+6 straight up is a bit to much to the other extreme. Mind you I have no problem with the fact that the racial characteristics for humans are rated 2d6+6 and I will continue to use those values for random NPC's - it just creates a problem with how I like to roll up characters. I really can live with INT rolled on 3d6 - it was never a problem in RQ2 - but SIZ did need a different scale - SIZ 3 humans just don't make sense (yes I know there have been miniature people, but they are a far rarer that rolling SIZ on 3d6 represents). So for me dropping SIZ allows for INT to be rolled on 3d6 again.

SIZ also is awkward because as a rating of Mass works well to represent a fat, weak person (SIZ 16 STR 7 is a weak blob - fair enough) but how do you explain the SIZ 8 STR 18 person? - harder to visualize (forget about the SIZ 5 STR 24 Dwarf). So I can see where it can make sense to drop SIZ.

APP bothers me because it carries so much less importance that other Characteristics. I prefer CHA. MRQ got it right by using CHA and increasing it's importance over previous BRP versions. In BRP games that use APP it is almost always the Characteristic that gets short changed. Whether you let characters assign rolls, swap a set of rolls, reallocate some points or use a pure point based system parties tend to be ugly, with maybe one or two really good looking people (when a player wants their character to be attractive). There are almost never average looking people in the party.

So for me, I think STR, CON, INT, POW, DEX, CHA all rolled on 3d6 would be an ideal set of Characteristics.

Sorry for my ramblings and off topic wanderings here. It is just that I was pondering similar changes, and can definitely support dropping SIZ.

[Trifletraxor]

...

So for me, I think STR, CON, INT, POW, DEX, CHA all rolled on 3d6 would be an ideal set of Characteristics.

Well, that's almost exactly how it will be in d100rules. APP will still be called APP, but it will be short for appeal (stolen from RQ4), which is basically the same as chararisma. Non-sentient creatures will not have the INT-stat, which makes rolling 3D6 for all the stats for humans the natural choice.

SGL.

[Thalaba]

There are a couple of things I don't understand about removing SIZ.

Let's say you're sneaking into some lair or temple steal some things or slay the bad guy, and you accidentally kill the dwarf (str 24) who was in your party while you were fignting a guard (str 14). Now, to avoid calling attention to your self, you decide it would be best to hide the bodies in the snake pit, but you are not very strong yourself.

There is no size, so you must go by strength - it will take two people to move the small dwarf, but only one to move the big guard. Is that correct?

What about objects - do they have strengths now instead of sizes, too? What mechanic is used to roll a big boulder out of the way?

Thanks!

Thalaba

[Al.]

There is no size, so you must go by strength - it will take two people to move the small dwarf, but only one to move the big guard. Is that correct?

Siz is mass and a lot of mass is muscle mass. STR is strongly related to muscle mass.

Monsieur Perrin himself he say that making Dwarves Siz 2d6 was a mistake and in retrospect he'd have kept them as Siz 3d6.

This to my mind is one of the positives to binning SIZ as a characteristic. It removes the potential to equate SIZ with height/length (which it measures only tangentially) rather than mass (which it measures exactly)

[Rurik]

Well, that's almost exactly how it will be in d100rules. APP will still be called APP, but it will be short for appeal (stolen from RQ4), which is basically the same as chararisma. Non-sentient creatures will not have the INT-stat, which makes rolling 3D6 for all the stats for humans the natural choice.

SGL.

Well then score another one for drools. With the doomed trollkin that is 2 for 2.

Is APP(eal) used for more skills bonuses, etc. as well?

[RosenMcStern]

Both having and not having SIZ is open to quirks and inconsistencies. Historically, it was there, but it could have been removed. Removing it means that some details have to be adjudicated as special cases ("Roll against STR-10 to move the guard's body - it was a dwarf after all!") but it can work without SIZ.

In my opinion, a simplified RPG should only have four stats, with the following significances:

STR (Strength, Length, Mass)

DEX (Agility, Speed, Constitution)

INT (Reasoning, Concentration, Perception)

POW (Willpower, Spirituality, Charisma)

[Trifletraxor]

There are a couple of things I don't understand about removing SIZ.

Let's say you're sneaking into some lair or temple steal some things or slay the bad guy, and you accidentally kill the dwarf (str 24) who was in your party while you were fignting a guard (str 14). Now, to avoid calling attention to your self, you decide it would be best to hide the bodies in the snake pit, but you are not very strong yourself.

There is no size, so you must go by strength - it will take two people to move the small dwarf, but only one to move the big guard. Is that correct?

The dwarf will no longer be small. He might be shorter than an average human, but with a STR of 24 he'll be wide as a warhammer dwarf, packed with heavy muscle. He would be much harder to carry than the guard, but he could be dragged over to the snake pit. But then I would have to clean up all the blood to. Better to just loot and move on. :cool:

What about objects - do they have strengths now instead of sizes, too? What mechanic is used to roll a big boulder out of the way?

Roll a STR vs. X resistance roll. X just being a number. Handled in almost the same way as before, except the resistance table is replaced by a simpler d20 roll (follows the same mechanics as the resistance table).

Well then score another one for drools. With the doomed trollkin that is 2 for 2.

It's not doomed! It can still make it! :mad:

Is APP(eal) used for more skills bonuses, etc. as well?

It's much more important than old APPearance in how people relate to you, and APPeal rolls are commonly included when you try to influence someone one way or another. It can also go up and down during the course of your adventurers life.

SGL.

[Rurik]

Both having and not having SIZ is open to quirks and inconsistencies. Historically, it was there, but it could have been removed. Removing it means that some details have to be adjudicated as special cases ("Roll against STR-10 to move the guard's body - it was a dwarf after all!") but it can work without SIZ.

In my opinion, a simplified RPG should only have four stats, with the following significances:

STR (Strength, Length, Mass)

DEX (Agility, Speed, Constitution)

INT (Reasoning, Concentration, Perception)

POW (Willpower, Spirituality, Charisma)

I have considered axing CON before, but would have rolled it into STR or POW rather than DEX. Why would you roll it into DEX (is it that being 'healthy' is tied to perception/reactions?).

The problems I had were that it is quite possible to have a strong immune system and not be a big strong goon, which would have me lean towards POW. In the end rolling CON into STR or POW seemed to make that characteristic a bit too potent.

I like keeping CHA/APP as a separate Characteristic, though I kind of like PREsence in it's place. I see it as a kind of strength of personality. Someone with a very high Charisma can dominate the personalities of those around them through their personality, wit and charm, but the way I see it not everyone with a strong personality is necessarily a likable or 'charismatic' personality. It needed to be separate back in RQ where POW was used as currency for Divine Spells (I have a hard time picturing the Humakti Runelord learning Sever Spirit and somehow becoming 3 points less 'imposing' after learning such a bad-ass spell), so maybe my reasoning is tainted by one particular magic system (though I suspect that Triff may have a magic system that strongly resembles said system in drules...).

[Rurik]

It's not doomed! It can still make it! :mad:

Well there is only one way to settle this - a POLL!

[GianniVacca]

In my opinion, a simplified RPG should only have four stats, with the following significances:

STR (Strength, Length, Mass)

DEX (Agility, Speed, Constitution)

INT (Reasoning, Concentration, Perception)

POW (Willpower, Spirituality, Charisma)

A very simplified RPG would have no stats at all... Ooops, I have been illuminated by HeroQuest :eek:

[frogspawner]

But "illumination" is not a good thing - beware!

Riddle: "What system has no stats?" Answer: "No system" (Skill: Roleplaying)

[Atgxtg]

A very simplified RPG would have no stats at all... Ooops, I have been illuminated by HeroQuest :eek:

"Please phase that in the form of a question."

Now you know why the call it Jeopardy.

More seriously, getting rid of stats, or even treating them as ADS/DISADS are possibilities. Like any other change, it has good points and bad points.

I've got a simplified RPG that I'm making for a 6 year old and it only uses two stats (Brains, Bod) with an optional third stat for magic (optional in that I might roll in into Brains). A bit more diversity is worked in with traits (giving a bonus to a stat for a particular purpose like being strong, quick, healthy, charming, etc.). Its workable, but isn't exactly RQ.

[jursamaj]

Well, that's almost exactly how it will be in d100rules. APP will still be called APP, but it will be short for appeal (stolen from RQ4), which is basically the same as chararisma.

I dunno. I've always thought charisma/appeal (beyond appearance) is more skill than stat. <shrug>

[jursamaj]

In my opinion, a simplified RPG should only have four stats, with the following significances:

STR (Strength, Length, Mass)

DEX (Agility, Speed, Constitution)

INT (Reasoning, Concentration, Perception)

POW (Willpower, Spirituality, Charisma)

A bit over-simplified for my taste. How does constitution in any way relate to dexterity? How does spirituality relate to charisma? Or perception to reasoning?

[jursamaj]

The dwarf will no longer be small. He might be shorter than an average human, but with a STR of 24 he'll be wide as a warhammer dwarf, packed with heavy muscle. He would be much harder to carry than the guard ...

Hmm... in some games, dwarves have been described as denser than humans (in more than one sense ). Magic throws a kink in the strength = mass = size idea.

[despistado38]

I'm very interested in.

The basic magic rules are coming in BRP Glorantha?

[Trifletraxor]

I'm very interested in.

The basic magic rules are coming in BRP Glorantha?

I'm not sure what you refer to with BRP Glorantha, as the BRP rules and the Glorantha settings don't have any formal ties anymore.

I have not worked that much on the magic rules for D100rules yet. I have some ideas on the mechanics, but have not yet decieded whether to include full magic systems or just the rules for various systems.

The Combat & Injury chapter is the one receiving the most attention at the moment.

SGL.

[despistado38]

I speak about D100 Rules.

For your answer, I suppose the magic rules are not prepared. O.K.

We must wait for it.

Thank you

[frogspawner]

Hey! Shouldn't d100Rules be on the Home page, under Works In Progress, with an estimated publication date and all? :confused:

[Rurik]

Hey! Shouldn't d100Rules be on the Home page, under Works In Progress, with an estimated publication date and all? :confused:

This is a fansite for Chaosiums BRP. Savage North for OpenQuest isn't being pushed on the main page, only official BRP products.