Is the 6th edition Call of Cthulhu officially out of print? (edit: update—yes, it is)

[Travern]

While physical copies of the 6th edition Call of Cthulhu rulebook have been out of stock for a bit, its PDF version is now 404’ed on Chaosium’s web store and on DriveThruRPG.

Chaosium’s 6th edition landing page continues to advertise it for sale, however (and 6th edition supplements and scenarios are still available).

As there hasn’t yet been any official announcement about this title’s current status one way or another, is the 6th ed. CoC rulebook now officially out of print?

Edited September 16, 2021 by Travern

[Travern]

Chaosium has just updated the landing page for 6th ed. CoC: “Call of Cthulhu 6th Edition is now officially out-of-print.”

(And the link to the old free adventures is now dead, too.)

[Mark Mohrfield]

Does anyone know why this was done?

[ThornPlutonius]

1 hour ago, Mark Mohrfield said:

Does anyone know why this was done?

7th edition was published.

Edited September 16, 2021 by ThornPlutonius

[Mark Mohrfield]

33 minutes ago, ThornPlutonius said:

7th edition was published.

Yeah, but that was some time ago.

[TrippyHippy]

39 minutes ago, Mark Mohrfield said:

Yeah, but that was some time ago.

6th edition went out of print some time ago.

[Travern]

On 9/16/2021 at 2:44 PM, TrippyHippy said:

6th edition went out of print some time ago.

Although physical copies of the 6th ed. rulebook have been unavailable for some time, Chaosium and DriveThruRPG were selling PDFs until quite recently.  The formal notice that 6th edition is officially out of print went up just now.

What we don’t know yet is the business rationale for this, though perhaps we may learn more at GenCon (where any last physical copies from Chaosium’s warehouse may be for sale…).

Edited September 18, 2021 by Travern

[TrippyHippy]

Oh, well, in that case, maybe it is due to an update or an imminent PDF release of an earlier edition?

[ThornPlutonius]

It makes no business sense, to me, to continue to sell an older edition when the focus is on the newer edition.  7th ed. is the current version and the edition for which content is being written and updated.  I think 6th ed fans have been lucky to have been able to access digital content for so long after the physical content went out of print and was replaced.  I am surprised the older content has been available for so long after 7th Ed. was released.  I suspect that this may just be a case of dealing with things in an order of priority wherein killing 6th Ed. content has just not been as important as publishing new content.  They just finally reached a point where someone could devote the time and energy needed to take care of these loose threads.

[Travern]

2 hours ago, ThornPlutonius said:

It makes no business sense, to me, to continue to sell an older edition when the focus is on the newer edition.

Chaosium’s recent Kickstarter for the 1981 anniversary boxed set attracted over 150% of the backers from the one for 7th edition.  That would suggest a healthy extant market for earlier editions of CoC.

Perhaps the anniversary 2nd edition is now the official legacy CoC line.  Once the Kickstarter’s fulfillment is finished, its assorted remastered titles will be available for sale to the regular market.

Maybe Chaosium will announce more remastered legacy titles at GenCon or additional 6th edition books to be converted to 7th edition.  (Or @Mike M or @MOB could join in this discussion to let us know.)

Edited September 17, 2021 by Travern

[ThornPlutonius]

I hope they keep some pre-7th Ed. edition available.  I know there is dissatisfaction among some regarding changes made for 7th Ed.  We'll see.

[TrippyHippy]

It makes total business sense to maximize the market and if the previous versions of the game still have an appeal, then they are still an asset worth selling. 

It doesn’t undermine 7E sales to have earlier editions still available. Many gamers own both, some only one or another, but they wouldn’t necessarily buy CoC products at all if their preferred version wasn’t there. 

Regarding dissatisfaction regarding 7E, I would regard myself as a critic (not going to bring up why again here), but still a customer of it. However, the re-release of the Classic 2E box is not really figured into that criticism as much as I love the idea of having it, but it isn’t a replacement of the current edition. That is, my criticism is more in the line of ‘I think they could have done some things in 7E differently’ rather than hankering over the past. 

 

 

[Mike M]

We continue to update and redevelop older scenarios in balance with new material. 

Converting older material remains an easy option for scenarios that have not yet been updated. And vice versa  

7th edition continues to be a very popular edition and is bringing new folk to Call of Cthulhu everyday of the week. 

It’s great to see the love for the game from old and new players alike. Thanks to you all for continuing to support Call of Cthulhu and Chaosium. 

Best regards and Cthulhu F’tagn!
 

 

[Simlasa]

4 hours ago, TrippyHippy said:

It makes total business sense to maximize the market and if the previous versions of the game still have an appeal, then they are still an asset worth selling.

Agreed!
I want nothing to do with 7e, but I would be a customer for 'official' PDFs and POD copies of the earlier stuff... which is why I went all-in on the Kickstarter despite already owning all of it.

It's similar to how I don't own D&D 5e, but I appreciate that WOTC has put up a lot of the older materials that I and others might have an interest in.

Edited September 18, 2021 by Simlasa

[oldschooltommy]

Almost everything is available as PDFs on the Chaosium website or DrivethruRPG and all the 6th edition era are OEFs although they’re not bookmarked except for a couple (the rulebook was updated with bookmarks before they pulled it) and the ones that came with maps come with excellent hi-res ones the only exception being the Tales of the Miskatonic Valley adventure is missing it’s Lovecraft Country map (please make this available Chaosium please). I know because I’ve bought most of them and the only one that isn’t available and it came with a large map that I really want is the dual-stat Kingsport sourcebook. And I wish there were a way for Chaoasium to let us that buy the PDFs know when they have been updated and what the latest version is. There is a update date on Chaosiums website when download the PDF but it always stays the date I bought it even if the file is updated.

Edited September 18, 2021 by oldschooltommy

[Travern]

15 hours ago, Mike M said:

We continue to update and redevelop older scenarios in balance with new material. 

Converting older material remains an easy option for scenarios that have not yet been updated. And vice versa  

Many thanks for your info - it’s good to hear old scenarios will return in some form.  

Does Chaosium have a short list of currently unavailable classic CoC supplements that it’s considering for either revising and updating to 7th ed. or remastering as with the expanding Runequest classic line?   

And do you plan to release more currently unavailable classic CoC titles in remastered editions?

For instance, are there any plans, one way or another, for The Fungi from Yuggoth or Curse of Chthonians campaigns (these were not part of the anniversary boxed set, although the later Trail of Tsathoggua and the Fragments of Fear were included in it).  There are perennial requests for new CoC GMs looking for shorter campaigns but who aren’t ready for Masks of Nyarlathotep.

Thanks again for the information!

 

P.S. And out of curiosity, what was the business rationale for declaring 6th ed. officially out of print?

[MOB]

1 hour ago, Travern said:

P.S. And out of curiosity, what was the business rationale for declaring 6th ed. officially out of print?

It was on the list of things to turn off, and we finally got to it.

[Travern]

25 minutes ago, MOB said:

It was on the list of things to turn off, and we finally got to it.

Interesting - is there anything else on this list of things to turn off?

[MOB]

13 minutes ago, Travern said:

Interesting - is there anything else on this list of things to turn off?

Achtung! Cthulhu.

[Travern]

13 minutes ago, MOB said:

Achtung! Cthulhu.

Isn’t that Modiphius? Is there anything from Chaosium?

[TrippyHippy]

I think the biggest shame is that there isn’t any edition of the game in print that still includes the full Call of Cthulhu short story by Lovecraft anymore. 

[MOB]

23 hours ago, Travern said:

Interesting - is there anything else on this list of things to turn off?

HeroQuest

Achtung! Cthulhu.

23 hours ago, Travern said:

Isn’t that Modiphius?

Which had been produced under license from Chaosium.

As is usual when a license winds up, there's a lengthy grace period in which remaining physical stock can be sold – you may have noticed Modiphius has been selling AC at a steep discount for some time. And they can continue selling the Call of Cthulhu version in PDF during this time too. This all ends on September 30th. Then final royalties are calculated and both parties walk away happy.

Modiphius are continuing with AC, but will be using their own in-house rule set (2d20).

[Travern]

On 9/19/2021 at 10:22 AM, MOB said:

Achtung! Cthulhu.

Which had been produced under license from Chaosium. As is usual when a license winds up, there's a lengthy grace period in which remaining physical stock can be sold 

Sure, and those details are typically set out in the original license agreement.  Licenses expire all the time, for any number of reasons - sometimes the licensees choose not to renew them when their original terms end, sometimes the licensors cancel them unilaterally, sometimes negotiations between the two parties don’t work out, etc., etc.  Plus RPGs licensed from other parties’ IP fall out of print with regularity.  (We’d have to hear Modiphius’s side of the story of their decision to switch to their in-house system for Achtung! Cthulhu for a complete picture.)  In the meantime, it’s interesting that the decision to formally declare 6th ed. CoC out of print coincided (roughly) with the launch of 2d20 Achtung! Cthulhu, on the eve of GenCon, before the end of the quarter.

It would also be interesting to hear more about Chaosium’s business rationale for declaring 6th ed. CoC OOP, particularly since this runs against the grain of current industry trends in the era of electronic publishing and “the long tail”.  WotC, for instance, keeps all its editions electronically in print, along with tons of adventures and supplements from its hefty backlist.  One can also find practically every ruleset for Traveller and Vampire: The Masquerade for sale as PDFs, and even smaller RPG like Unknown Armies or Space: 1889 keep their old editions around.  But while Chaosium offers older Pendragon rulebooks available electronically (except for the second, AFAICT), that’s no longer the case for CoC.

In the meantime, we eagerly await specifics on Chaosium’s plans to release more currently unavailable classic CoC titles, whether as remastered editions or updated conversions to 7th edition - at least once everyone’s recovered from GenCon!

Thanks again for the all information!

[Rick Meints]

2 hours ago, Travern said:

Sure, and those details are typically set out in the original license agreement.  Licenses expire all the time, for any number of reasons - sometimes the licensees choose not to renew them when their original terms end, sometimes the licensors cancel them unilaterally, sometimes negotiations between the two parties don’t work out, etc., etc.  Plus RPGs licensed from other parties’ IP fall out of print with regularity.  (We’d have to hear Modiphius’s side of the story of their decision to switch to their in-house system for Achtung! Cthulhu for a complete picture.)  In the meantime, it’s interesting that the decision to formally declare 6th ed. CoC out of print coincided (roughly) with the launch of 2d20 Achtung! Cthulhu, on the eve of GenCon, before the end of the quarter.

It would also be interesting to hear more about Chaosium’s business rationale for declaring 6th ed. CoC OOP, particularly since this runs against the grain of current industry trends in the era of electronic publishing and “the long tail”.  WotC, for instance, keeps all its editions electronically in print, along with tons of adventures and supplements from its hefty backlist.  One can also find practically every ruleset for Traveller and Vampire: The Masquerade for sale as PDFs, and even smaller RPG like Unknown Armies or Space: 1889 keep their old editions around.  But while Chaosium offers older Pendragon rulebooks available electronically (except for the second, AFAICT), that’s no longer the case for CoC.

In the meantime, we eagerly await specifics on Chaosium’s plans to release more currently unavailable classic CoC titles, whether as remastered editions or updated conversions to 7th edition - at least once everyone’s recovered from GenCon!

Thanks again for the all information!

Suffice it to say the decision was the end result of a lot of deliberation and not done on some whim. It had nothing to do with Gen Con timing or the release of any other game, or the end of the business quarter.

PS: Chaosium offers older Pendragon things because we inherited them from Nocturnal, who used to sell them.

PPS: We don't have any immediate plans to release more older CoC titles right now. We are devoting our energies to fulfilling the current Classic Kickstarter and working on other current 7th ed. products. After the kickstarter has shipped we'll start getting other older titles back into print. We got HotOE and BtMoM back into print, as well as CoC 2nd ed and 5 classic supplements. That's not bad for the last year or so.

Edited September 20, 2021 by Rick Meints