Handling Non-Human PC's

[svensson]

How do some of you folks handle non-human Player Characters? Several threads have focused on one aspect or another, but I'm interested in a more general treatment.

RQ is very different than most standard fantasy milieux because non humans are not familiar presences in most societies. There isn't a nice dwarvish family down Waterdeep Way or a friendly half-elf who lives on Greyhawk's Promenade. ALL non-human societies in Glorantha keep to themselves and are the subject of more myths and outright lies than any kind of facts.

So, what do you guys do when you've got a player bound and determined to run an Aldryami, Mostali, or Uz character? Or for that matter how do you handle Beast Men? My own personal bias would limit that to Centaurs and Minotaurs if I allowed them at all.

[Note: IMG, nobody gets to play dragonewts. They're reserved as the DM's weirdness gun 🤣]

[Bill the barbarian]

20 minutes ago, svensson said:

How do some of you folks handle non-human Player Characters? Several threads have focused on one aspect or another, but I'm interested in a more general treatment.

 

Well, you must have noted by now that I prefer an open table with less tyranny from the game master... but hell, I am just human (see what I did there, did ya see that?). That being said, I limit players to baboon or ducks (good call on the centaur) or similar critter that act like humans 'cept with feather, fur, or 4 legs and a harp. Those intrepid players who must have the truly odd usually will have difficulty enough dealing with the culture around them, and the cultures they should be portraying (but probably are not) but what of poor little ol' moi? I have to run the nightmare of a fish out of water or an Elf in Torkan's Last Fort. "Say aintcha a dwarf, shorty!" If the player has no respect for the amount of trouble they are causing themselves in the name of MGF they can at least think of the poor bastard who has to try to come up with encounters, and reactions in the situations they will cause. That would be "ME"!

A better GM will than I will have the skills to have a solution for all problems they will encounter with such situations: fer example; a dwarf, an elf and a hobbit turn into a bar*... Me, not so much. I would not even know how to enforce the cultural tropes they should be bound by to avoid such a quandary in the first place. 

I am interested as well to see how others will answer... so let me get my popcorn and sit back... that's my two bolgs worth.

*they were lycanthropes! 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Bill the barbarian

[Arcadiagt5]

I have two key problems with non-Human characters, one of which is admittedly self-inflicted. 🙂

The general issue is character background. One of the best bits of RQG character creation is the three generations of family history because of how it grounds the adventurer in the world. I have no idea how to adapt that to the non-human races, especially when their lifespans don’t align more or less to human lifespans. 

(The self-inflicted one is that I use an 18-16-16-14-14-12-12 array for characteristics and that doesn’t adapt neatly to non-human characteristics that aren’t all 3 - 18)

[svensson]

Good point on the Ducks and Baboons, especially since Baboons seem to have more of a presence in RQG than in previous editions.

Now, I have a personal repugnance for artificial cuteness. A litter of puppies or a child's laughter are wonderful, soul-redeeming things that no adult should be without. But Hello Kitty or a grown adult who insists on wearing cat ears or fairy wings is about as authentic as Strawberry Quik. I'm the guy who happily advertises himself as the unapologetic Tolkien honk and I think of hobbits as 'ratlings', and DON'T get me started on the portrayal of Radagast in the movies. But actual, authentic innocence is something that I love. I love watching a child meet a horse for the first time, or the wonder on the face of someone who's never been in the woods and hears a wolf's howl, for example. All that said, I've had to get used to Ducks in a game... mostly because my first exposure to them left a bad first impression [power-gamer player doing Daffy Duck imitations]. But I can definitely see the addition of a Duck to a party.

[Andrew M]

For my current game I have required everyone be human and teenagers from the same clan,

In general it would depend on the game I was going to run and I would allow anything which from the game background fitted that game. This includes Homelands and cults as well as none humans.  There is a second filter that some none humans are unbalanced to allow in a group with human characters and I would be very careful with them.

Probably allowed if it fits the setting(Some of these are unlikely), Aldrymi(Green Elf), Ducks, Dark Trolls, Trollkin, Morokanth, Newtling, Baboon, Telmori, Tusk Rider , Foreign Human

Probably not allowed for Balance: Centaur, Minotaur, Great Troll, Agimori, Fox Woman, Dryad, Brown Elf(Hibernation), Cave Troll

Probably not allowed as I can;'t imagine them fitting my vision of the setting as pc's.: Dwarves, Chaos Creatures, Dragonewts

[svensson]

1 minute ago, Arcadiagt5 said:

I have two key problems with non-Human characters, one of which is admittedly self-inflicted. 🙂

The general issue is character background. One of the best bits of RQG character creation is the three generations of family history because of how it grounds the adventurer in the world. I have no idea how to adapt that to the non-human races, especially when their lifespans don’t align more or less to human lifespans. 

(The self-inflicted one is that I use an 18-16-16-14-14-12-12 array for characteristics and that doesn’t adapt neatly to non-human characteristics that aren’t all 3 - 18)

Well, there is the 'Skip Family History' part on pg. 29 of the RQG.

 

[Arcadiagt5]

Just now, svensson said:

Well, there is the 'Skip Family History' part on pg. 29 of the RQG.

 

Technically, yes. 

But I like the way that it shapes adventurers and I definitely want something similar before I allow non-human PCs 

[Andrew M]

Just now, Arcadiagt5 said:

Technically, yes. 

But I like the way that it shapes adventurers and I definitely want something similar before I allow non-human PCs 

For the Beast people of Beast valley and the Ducks you can probably use the normal early life with some modifications, maybe even for Aldrymi who live in one of the Homelands and are weird enough to be dealing with humans (Talnistris grove in the Colymar Lands for instance or the Big Rubble in Pavis), Trolls from the Shadow Plateau could use a modified Esrolian origin and Morokanth can use the standard Praxian homeland .

I think another requirment is that I would have to trust the player to play a Gloranthan version of that race so no tolkien elves

[Bill the barbarian]

1 minute ago, Andrew M said:

Trolls from the Shadow Plateau

Damn, forgot entirely about the best non-human race to play... our friends the trolls! Thanks Andrew!
and trollkin too!

[Baron Wulfraed]

1 hour ago, svensson said:

DON'T get me started on the portrayal of Radagast in the movies. But actual, authentic innocence is something that I love. I love watching a child meet a horse for the first time, or the wonder on the face of someone who's never been in the woods and hears a wolf's howl, for example. All that said, I've had to get used to Ducks in a game... mostly because my first exposure to them left a bad first impression [power-gamer player doing Daffy Duck imitations]. But I can definitely see the addition of a Duck to a party.

Considering who portrayed Radagast anything was possible (Seventh Doctor went from comedic to rather dark at times -- including a hint that in one timeline, he /was/ Merlin).

At least one can understand Daffy... Imagine a bad Donald impersonation...

 

Edited November 15, 2022 by Baron Wulfraed

[svensson]

38 minutes ago, Baron Wulfraed said:

Considering who portrayed Radagast anything was possible (Seventh Doctor went from comedic to rather dark at times -- including a hint that in one timeline, he /was/ Merlin).

At least one can understand Daffy... Imagine a bad Donald impersonation...

 

I'm not a huge Who fan, but isn't Sylvester McCoy replacing Jodie Whitaker as the Doctor? Or is that David Tennant?

And yes, the player did cross over into Donald quite a bit... especially in the temper tantrums.

[g33k]

I've got a duck-PC in mind.
Alas, I fear she may have to become an NPC.

She's an ex-Lunar, physically based upon the Common Merganser:
https://www.allaboutbirds.org/guide/assets/photo/302113651-1280px.jpg

I've designed her without any "comic relief" elements at all (almost).
I've burdened the poor gal with a somewhat comical name (see the image linked above):  She is  L'Orange Razorbeak

What??!?
Don't look at me that way!

She's so named because her head is so orange, of course !!!

Edited November 15, 2022 by g33k
With an extensive (and tragic) backstory, including an "it's complicated" with no less than the Razoress herself!

[Baron Wulfraed]

1 hour ago, svensson said:

I'm not a huge Who fan, but isn't Sylvester McCoy replacing Jodie Whitaker as the Doctor? Or is that David Tennant?

I think that was just a guest appearance in the latest installment, in line with prior story lines in which prior incarnations appear (I'm some 13 episodes behind on the DVR). They've never reverted to an earlier incarnation in the past 30+ years. Per Wikipedia

Quote

In 2022, he reprised the role of the Doctor in the episode "The Power of the Doctor".

EEK! He played Igor in a prequel to the 60s "The Munsters"

1 hour ago, svensson said:

And yes, the player did cross over into Donald quite a bit... especially in the temper tantrums.

Oh dear... My condolences.

We had a player attempt a Duck back in the days of RQ2 (when I was active)... Mostly it turned into jokes about having to clean up yellow stains, and not being allowed into some villages.

On the other side, the GM had us encounter a Duck village, and the joke for that was that many of the party could /step over/ the village walls.

[Baron Wulfraed]

13 minutes ago, g33k said:

I've designed her without any "comic relief" elements at all (almost).
I've burdened the poor gal with a somewhat comical name (see the image linked above):  She is  L'Orange Razorbeak

What??!?
Don't look at me that way!

She's so named because her head is so orange, of course !!!

Duck a L'Orange?

No worse then the three ducks I generated as an exercise.

• Hua'rd (Howard the duck) Orlanth initiate, noble, with 100% broadsword, and Cowardice at 60%, 9HP [might explain the cowardice}
• Drake Anatidae Orlanth initiate, chariot driver, broadsword 95%, 12HP
• Akn'Ard (a canard) Humakt initate, warrior - lt. inf., 100% short sword, 100% dagger, 17HP

[ffilz]

I made the mistake (for my campaign) of allowing an elf in my RQ1 campaign. The player rolled near perfect attributes and rich noble background. The character had to do hardly anything to qualify for Rune Priest of Aldrya, and was quickly on the road to Rune Lord (and with near perfect DEX was at no risk of losing skills...).

I had a pixie in another campaign. That wasn't too bad and a good healer as an Aldrya Initiate. That same campaign also had a Newtling.

Other characters in my current campaign have included a couple Baboons, a couple Ducks, and a Dwarf. For this campaign I decided on heresy and my dwarves are more like D&D dwarves...

Someday I could see running a Troll campaign.

In another non-Gloranthan campaign I do have a Centaur which has been fun and interesting, though it does restrict the types of adventures the PCs can do. Otherwise I find the Beast Men not really appropriate for PCs.

A major limiting factor outside of Trolls is enough cults and other background. That's one nice thing about Ducks is that they work nicely as Humakti and can work OK as Orlanthi. Baboons will usually be Daka Fal but we also had a Storm Bull which made for a fun character. Newtlings can easily follow a river cult.

[Ali the Helering]

Rootless Aldryami can be interesting to have in a group, but only in the hands of an experienced and capable player.  If not, they're a complete disaster.

[Bill the barbarian]

Just now, Ali the Helering said:

Rootless Aldryami can be interesting to have in a group, but only in the hands of an experienced and capable player.  If not, they're a complete disaster.

Exactly. If the player is advanced and the GM is advanced... magic!

 

[Andrew M]

I think most None-Humans work best in a group of their own kind as that cuts out the cross cultural problems so a group of Trolls, Elves or even dwarves may be a fun campaign. Otherwise you have to be able to fit your none humans into a human centric campaign which probably works best for Ducks and Morokanth(In Prax) otherwise you risk the who is this weird creature factor becoming a major issue in the campaign and getting in the way of telling the more interesting story.

But I am sure it can work and when it does it can add a lot to the game and make it uinque

[dumuzid]

My current campaign has had one of each of the main Elder Races as player characters, a Pavis Mostali (rock caste), a Pavis Garden Aldryami (green, Aldrya/Halmalao initiate), and a Shadow Plateau Dark Troll (Gorakiki/Subere shaman).  The Aldryami and Uz are still active players.  Our campaign is focused on a big globe-trotting quest, we're currently deep in the terminal phases of the War Against War in Fronela.  The campaign began as a story about one of the first cadres of Argrath's Eaglebrown Warlocks, which provided a ready explanation for strange and usually inimical people being bound into a shared magico-military unit.  As the campaign shifted into a ship-based world traveling story we've had the quest (restore the crippled god Artmal) to keep everyone's interests focused in at least complimentary directions.

In terms of supporting Elder Race player characters mechanically, it took a certain amount of porting forward older cult rules (Flintnail, Gorakiki and Subere specifically), and some spitballing around results in the Character Histories that didn't make sense, but I've found there's enough material in the Bestiary to ease that process considerably.

My own first time playing an Elder Race character was as the sole troll in a human PC group, and I really enjoyed playing into both the differences and similarities between my troll and the surrounding human society.  I'm pleased to be able to give my players the opportunity to do the same.

[Puckohue]

All new players in my campaign start as Ernaldori humans. After a year and a half ingame (two and a half years RL) I'm about to allow a dwarf PC (iron). I quickly made up a "Family" Histoy table based on a thread somewhere here, and the player has read the Mostali info in the Bestiary and the Sourcebook, and we've discussed the heresies and how the dwarf could become an "adventurer", or at least become part of the PC group. The introduction to the group will be well motivated (the Ernaldorian group is currently at Dwarf Mine).

I hope (and think) it will be fun, and not cause any (unfun) problems.