Runeblogger Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 Does anybody know who created the Wind Children (Stafford or Perrin) and what was the main inspiration for them? 🤔 The same goes for the other three species. Wind Children and Newtlings first appeared in RQ1 and RQ2, but where did the Waertagi and Triolini first appear? 1 1 Quote Read my Runeblog about RuneQuest and Glorantha at: http://elruneblog.blogspot.com.es/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajagappa Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 15 minutes ago, Runeblogger said: Does anybody know who created the Wind Children (Stafford or Perrin) and what was the main inspiration for them? Wind children exist in WB&RM, so I think they predate RQ (and thus would be Greg) 20 minutes ago, Runeblogger said: where did the Waertagi and Triolini first appear? You can find both in Wyrms Footnotes #8 in the Spirits of the Sea article. RQ was out by then, but did not yet include either, so would also be Greg's creations. Possibly those date to much earlier stories about the west? Maybe @scott-martin knows? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eff Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 29 minutes ago, Runeblogger said: Does anybody know who created the Wind Children (Stafford or Perrin) and what was the main inspiration for them? 🤔 The same goes for the other three species. Wind Children and Newtlings first appeared in RQ1 and RQ2, but where did the Waertagi and Triolini first appear? The Newtling Renegades first appeared in Nomad Gods (1977), and Wyrms Footnotes #4 (1978), if I recall correctly, describes them in more detail. 1 2 1 Quote  "And I am pretty tired of all this fuss about rfevealign that many worshippers of a minor goddess might be lesbians." -Greg Stafford, April 11, 2007 "I just read an article in The Economist by a guy who was riding around with the Sartar rebels, I mean Taliban," -Greg Stafford, January 7th, 2010 Eight Arms and the Mask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott-martin Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 I wasted precious minutes flipping through my "cursed" copy of WBRM (someone laminated it 50 years ago so the thick plastic pages stick together like old corduroy) so missed my chance to beat @jajagappa to the punch. Wind Children ("Children of the Wind" are indeed in there. As @Eff notes, Newtling "Renegades" are in Nomad Gods, which is I think pre-Perrin. The children of Waertag and the children of Triolina are about as old as it gets. In terms of where they all come from, we should ask Sandy if he remembers hearing anything. There are textual simularities between the Wind Children writeup and some of Greg's musings about relationships between earthy mortals and airy spirits but the early art feels more like someone saw a Led Zeppelin logo. They're cool looking! 1 1 4 Quote singer sing me a given Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eff Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 12 minutes ago, scott-martin said: I wasted precious minutes flipping through my "cursed" copy of WBRM (someone laminated it 50 years ago so the thick plastic pages stick together like old corduroy) so missed my chance to beat @jajagappa to the punch. Wind Children ("Children of the Wind" are indeed in there. As @Eff notes, Newtling "Renegades" are in Nomad Gods, which is I think pre-Perrin. The children of Waertag and the children of Triolina are about as old as it gets. In terms of where they all come from, we should ask Sandy if he remembers hearing anything. There are textual simularities between the Wind Children writeup and some of Greg's musings about relationships between earthy mortals and airy spirits but the early art feels more like someone saw a Led Zeppelin logo. They're cool looking! I want to know more about Yena Wambla now. 1 1 Quote  "And I am pretty tired of all this fuss about rfevealign that many worshippers of a minor goddess might be lesbians." -Greg Stafford, April 11, 2007 "I just read an article in The Economist by a guy who was riding around with the Sartar rebels, I mean Taliban," -Greg Stafford, January 7th, 2010 Eight Arms and the Mask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runeblogger Posted April 16 Author Share Posted April 16 21 minutes ago, scott-martin said: I wasted precious minutes flipping through my "cursed" copy of WBRM (someone laminated it 50 years ago so the thick plastic pages stick together like old corduroy) so missed my chance to beat @jajagappa to the punch. Wind Children ("Children of the Wind" are indeed in there. As @Eff notes, Newtling "Renegades" are in Nomad Gods, which is I think pre-Perrin. The children of Waertag and the children of Triolina are about as old as it gets. In terms of where they all come from, we should ask Sandy if he remembers hearing anything. There are textual simularities between the Wind Children writeup and some of Greg's musings about relationships between earthy mortals and airy spirits but the early art feels more like someone saw a Led Zeppelin logo. They're cool looking! Wow, what is that document, exactly? 1 Quote Read my Runeblog about RuneQuest and Glorantha at: http://elruneblog.blogspot.com.es/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott-martin Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 Yena is apparently an air wife in the way of the children of Aerlit. All four caste fathers and the caste mother are hers. Phlia vanishes at the moment the vadelites emerge and her children also vanish from the narrative (or are transformed), which is suggestive. The children of Malkion have three mothers. The children of Vadel have three fathers. 1 2 Quote singer sing me a given Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott-martin Posted April 16 Share Posted April 16 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Runeblogger said: Wow, what is that document, exactly? That is known as "Genealogy, the Brithini," found in the Seshnegi Book of Foreigners (both states). I haven't gotten around to dating it internally but maybe 1967-8? Obsessives will note the "engrion" title. Edited April 16 by scott-martin also in the first state, to be fair 2 2 Quote singer sing me a given Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfbrandi Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 (edited) 10 hours ago, scott-martin said: If the names at this early stage are not deceptive — I know! I know! — then maybe: Aerlit Kolate = Air Warera Triolina = Sea Air + Sea = Foam -> Aphrodite Malkion = Aphrodite? (Even Malkion = Milky Foam, the patron of frothy coffee) Sorry, couldn’t resist. 😉 Edited April 17 by mfbrandi 1 Quote NOTORIOUS VØID CULTIST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metcalph Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 There is an early unfinished Stafford tale "Aftal the Waertag" which was printed in Missing Lands and indicated to have been written in the mid-60s. It also mentions the Deri which appeared in the Guide and the Little People of Jrustela, who are probably now Timinits. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joerg Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 Winged hardly-dressed (female) humanoids were a staple in fantasy illustrations in the late sixties, and some of those appear in the early Wyrm's Footnotes and IIRC also in the APA Zines. I suppose that is sufficient grounds for inspiration.  The Waertagi receive explicit mention in the sea voyage of the father of Mimtak (the last serpent-legged king of Seshnela) to the east in the Serpent King history, and they show up again as foes of one of the first Hrestoli kings following the Serpent King dynasty. That text collection dates from around 1967. Triolini appear in the surname of Warera Triolina but receive little direct mention in the land-bound adventures of Froalar's descendants.   10 hours ago, scott-martin said: Yena is apparently an air wife in the way of the children of Aerlit. All four caste fathers and the caste mother are hers. Air wives are rare in the extant Gloranthan myth - we have Brastalos (wife of Magasta) and Molanni (mistress of the Evil Emperor). Given the identification of the Evil Emperor as Malkion in Dawn Age western Genertela, this gives a possible identification of Yena Wambla... Elsewhere (Hrestol's Saga genealogies, Serpent Kings history), the caste ancestors Talar, Zzabur, Menena and Holar (rather than Gwymir) are children of Phlia Tilnta, and Dronar is the child of Kala (not surnamed Likita, but a hill goddess of Brithela) rather than her husband. The marriage partners of Talar, Menena (and Neleos) are their twin siblings of the opposite sex - probably born as a couple destined to be wedded already from birth. Other than Waertag (and presumably Vadel), none of the six tribal ancestors so prominent in Revealed Mythologies seem to be mentioned in these older texts. 2 1 1 Quote Telling how it is excessive verbis  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius West Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 While I don't know of anything canon on the topic, I have generally played that Newtlings are what happens to Crested Dragonewts when they accidentally leave the Dragon Path, in the same way that Magisaurs are dragonewts who left the Dragon Path due to an obsession with magic, and allosauruses had an obsession with food and aggression, while Triceratopses were doctrinally obstinate and wrong etc. This is why Newtlings are prepared to apparently be voluntarily enslaved by dragonewts; they can rejoin the Dragon Path if they do. That is my 2 cents. YGWV. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runeblogger Posted April 20 Author Share Posted April 20 But how can you accidentally leave the Dragon Path? 🤔 Quote Read my Runeblog about RuneQuest and Glorantha at: http://elruneblog.blogspot.com.es/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius West Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 (edited) On 4/20/2024 at 8:43 PM, Runeblogger said: But how can you accidentally leave the Dragon Path? 🤔 Very easily. It is about as easy as a medieval peasant falling into heresy because they didn't understand a sermon properly. For example: "Oh, you wanted me to form a charity to feed starving widows and orphans... I thought you said you wanted me to start a charity FOR STARVING widows and orphans... Should I unchain them and let them out of the shed then? Give them some bread?" Edited April 21 by Darius West 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ynneadwraith Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 23 hours ago, Darius West said: Very easily. It is about as easy as a medieval peasant falling into heresy because they didn't understand a sermon properly. For example: "Oh, you wanted me to form a charity to feed starving widows and orphans... I thought you said you wanted me to start a charity FOR STARVING widows and orphans... Should I unchain them and let them out of the shed then? Give them some bread?"  2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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