Gloranthan Food

[Michael Hopcroft]

Just p[icked up the PDF for HQG (very impressive book -- I want the hardcover now) and while it's a simple overview there's a lot of fascinating stuff. It occurs to me that Gloranthan campaigns are all about flavor and the players and GM immersing themselves in societies and even ethical and thought patterns that are almost alien to the modern mind. As I was reading  through the culot descriptions I started to wonder about food, oddly enough. And when I found that the equipment list did not contain any references as all to it other than the prices for "meat animals", I became even more curious.

If you were a guest at a clan feast or cult intitation ceremony, what food and drink would you be served?

What do travelers eat on the road, and does anyone make a living preparing food for them at resting places on their journeys?

What did you eat growing up, and what will you feed your children when you have them?

The answer depends on your culture, and since there are a multitude of cultures there will not be a single answer. One could ask when it will come up in a game, but it's the sort of nice, light touch that adds to the immersion of the setting.

 

[Noita]

Several of the players in my Prax game cook in character, collect spices and ask npcs about styles etc.

When they stayed with some river folk the food was quite alien to them. Lots of spiced crab and fish stews.

We generally play out most night stops and camps, so food and the conversations around the fire are a big part of our game. Stories are told, plans made and problems solved....sometimes with anger and threats!

Edited January 30, 2016 by Iskallor

[soltakss]

What I normally do is to look at the Grain Goddesses and see what they produce, that would be the staple crop. Then other things follow from that. For other cultures, the food derives from how they live.

 

Praxians live by the Survival Covenant, so they eat lots of stews, roast meats, beast eyes, strips of meat; they drink the blood of their beasts, milk, yoghurts, koumiss; they flavour with different grasses, herbs, roots and so on, picked up as they travel.

Pentians have similar tastes to Praxians, but they eat cattle and horses.

Orlanthi have a lot of stews and roasts, based on the grain goddess worshipped in the area. They drink mead, beer and ale. Bread and biscuits can be made of wheat, barley, oats, rye and so on, but they rarely mix their grains.

Dara Happan peasants eat a lot of rice-based food, with a lot of fish and farmed animals; I see them eating gumbos from the swamps of the Oslir.

Dara Happan nobles eat more refined food than the peasants; I can't see them eating anything that is rice-based for example, as that is for peasants, nor maize based as that is for Lunars. I can see them eating mythically important food, for example eggs. Pela is the goddess of barley, so barley-based foods would make mythic sense.

Lunars eat maize-based meals, with bread made of maize, roast/boiled corn on the cobs, plus the food of Peloria.

[Jon Hunter]

I also think there will be a lot of local variations too, food will be also be seasonal.

However earth magic will mean the food will be more abundant and of a higher quality than in our World.

Due to limited preservatives salting, drying and magic will be very common

[TRose]

 For most of history meat and fish was a luxury item for the lower classes. A peasant might eat chicken, fish or perhaps a hare he caught. once a week. For most the population a bland porridge made out of local grain and a little vegetable would be standard fair.

[Michael Hopcroft]

2 hours ago, TRose said:

 For most of history meat and fish was a luxury item for the lower classes. A peasant might eat chicken, fish or perhaps a hare he caught. once a week. For most the population a bland porridge made out of local grain and a little vegetable would be standard fair.

Sounds dreadful. I imagine you could use honey to sweeten the porridge, or butter to add flavor and protein to it. But it can't be fun living off that.

But why porridge? Why not bread?

[TRose]

 Porridge , bread and rice(Depending on where you lived) where the basis of most people meals. Most spices where what you grew or grew wild in the area.

 Even salt which is cheap today was valuable enough to be included in the pay in Rome.

 My wife grew up in the Philippines and although not considered  poor there as her family owned two acres on which they grew Vegetables and strawberries on and they sent several of their children to  various Universities  . But her mom would buy a chicken on Sunday and make three meals out of it,, the bones going into a soup. That was their meat for the week.

[TRose]

 But one thing I did in my world was have the Oasis  People in Prax brew beer.

  Its almost impossible for Nomads to brew beer, and so part of the tribute the Oasis people pay the Nomads is in beer. I set the tribute as two gallons of beer per Oasis person per season.

 So one of the reasons the Nomads don't kill off the Oasis people is if they did , no more free beer. At least in my game.

[soltakss]

in my games, the Oasis people are lazy, for the oasis provides enough food for them to live without having to work. each Oasis has a different type of fruit, nut or whatever and has a lot of it. Sure, it isn't at Green Age levels of dropping a fig and a fig tree appears laden with fruit, but it is along the lines of the Oasis provides enough figs for all the Oasis people to eat and then more for the nomads to take as tribute.

The diet of the oasis people is, therefore, 90% based on the produce of their Oasis. So, 90% of the diet of the Fig Oasis is figs. The Oasis people don;t suffer any ill effects of this kind of diet.

Most oasis people think that everyone eats like this and are amazed if they travel to another oasis and see them eating dates, plums or ground nuts.

 

 

[Joerg]

In the original PC/Apple version of King of Dragon Pass, assigning the harvest could be an important step in the spring activities, balancing wheat, rye and barley. It also made you track your herds of swine and sheep more closely than the current version. Pork (and poultry) appears to be commonly used throughout the year, while beef and horse meat gets consumed in sacrifices or in feasts. Dairy wasn't measured, but is the way to feed from the herds without slaughtering.

While that game missed the importance of the hay harvest and autumnal slaughter, I think that the basic foods for the agricultural Orlanthi are pretty much covered by this.

I am a bit un-decided about the relation between bread consumption to porridge consumption to dairy soup consumption (like the butter soup I read about that appears to have been the staple of heroic Age Ireland). The Pater Noster emphasizes daily bread as the staple food for any (but possibly the richtest) status, but then wheat was the main source of protein (!) in the Roman Empire during which this prayer was created.

All storm-descended cultures (Orlanthi, Praxians, Malkioni) appear to be lactose-tolerant. The Doraddi rely on the Tanuku milk antelope, too. The East Isles might not, and have fishing for their source of animal nourishment. Not sure about the rice farming cultures (Peloria, Kralorela, Teshnos). Plowing implies the use of cattle or water buffaloes, both of which are sources for dairy. But then, as noted above, dairy consumption can be about butter (which is pretty poor in lactose or other carbohydrates) or cheese (another staple in a carbohydrate-free diet). Someone will consume the milk sugar products, though, whether whey or butter milk, and I don't think that they went into feeding cattle or pigs. They might go into feeding the children.

Strange stray thought - could adulthood initiation have been defined by the point when the children in lactose-intolerant herding cultures had to go away from lactose-based child feeding?

What to travelers eat? For the most part, whatever their hosts offer them whenever accepting hospitality, supplemented by bread or cheese or pemmican or dried fruits if the hospitality is restricted to use of water. Cooking porridge with earthware vessels is a 24 hour job (according to the people in the Danish experimental archaeology sites I talked to) which cannot be done on a journey. From yesterday's production of pea soup, the same goes for legume from the dried (transportable) stuff, unless you grind it up. Grinding requires stone implements like the quern, or possibly an earth ware mortar, neither of which are the most comfortable travel utensils.

Hunting and gathering takes up valuable daylight time that could be used for traveling. So does foraging.

How do marching armies cope with the problem of having a porridge after a day's march? IMO most likely by having a fresh porridge from a metal cauldron the morning before the march, and cold and stale leftover porridge from the morning with some more savory addition like meat in the evening after the march. The train is essential for warfare, without it, you cannot move armies away from their bases. Water logistics are incredibly important here, too - preparing a meal out of grain, lentils or similar transportable staple stuff requires a lot of water.

Making bread requires an oven, unless you count stick bread or flatbread prepared on heated stones. For a marching army, that would mean that bread produced by their train would require a camp of two or three days (at least) to get the ovens into operation,

[Jeff]

Barley is the staple grain of the Orlanthi, supplemented by wheats and oats. Beer is the staple beverage, wine is the drink for festivals, feasts, and ceremonies. Apples, berries, cherries, and grapes are common.

Lamb is the most common meat, followed by pork. Wild game is common. 

So with that in mind, let's look at your questions:

If you were a guest at a clan feast or cult intitation ceremony, what food and drink would you be served?

Depends on your status at that feast! But let's say you are a member of the community in good standing or a favored guest. Then you'd likely eat meat from the sacrificed animal (depends on the god), drink wine from a communal dish, eat flatbread, and have whatever fruits and vegetables are in season. Feasts are important times to show off the wealth of the community, honor the gods, and so on. They aren't how people eat every day! 

What do travelers eat on the road, and does anyone make a living preparing food for them at resting places on their journeys?

Flatbread, dried or cured meat or fish, fruits, cheese, etc. In Sartar, most towns and many villages have designated places where travelers are hosted.  Generally, if you travel a day on one of Sartar's Royal Roads, you will find a place where you can rest and eat.

What did you eat growing up, and what will you feed your children when you have them?

Your daily diet is going to depend on your status and occupation - the household of a priest eats better than the household of a tenant farmer! Priests and thanes have access to pretty much everything that is grown or raised in a region. Free farmers eat what they grow or raise, plus what little they can trade for with whatever surplus they have. Tenant farmers and herders eat from their share of the crop.

[soltakss]

2 hours ago, Jeff said:

What do travelers eat on the road, and does anyone make a living preparing food for them at resting places on their journeys?

Flatbread, dried or cured meat or fish, fruits, cheese, etc. In Sartar, most towns and many villages have designated places where travelers are hosted.  Generally, if you travel a day on one of Sartar's Royal Roads, you will find a place where you can rest and eat.

in Sartar you have Geo's, which is a chain of inns and a cult honouring Sartar's Chamberlain. I see them having a big pot of stew bubbling away all day, with flatbreads and ale, almost like Baltis were supposed to be but not as spicy.

[TRose]

I think we just gave away one of the secrets of of the Lunar army success.

  For an army that travels by foot its hard to beat rice as the ration of choice as its light and easy to cook.

  I know in WWII the Japanese army also added barley in with the rice for extra nutrients and I can see the Lunar army doing the same. pickled beets and cabbage where also standard ration in Japanese ratio0n

 In the American west where beans where a common food, I know the beans where put in a pot on the  chuckwagon the evening before and left to soak for about 20 hours  and cooked for dinner the next day. Caravan and a military unit might have specialized wagons for cooking, but there nothing to stop a party from putting a pot full of dried beans in a wagon  to soak. But you will need a wagon and strap the pot down good.

[D]

I always thought the lunar army gave their soldiers 'Ever lasting Waktapus biscuits'  

[Charles VA]

Last I heard "Ever-Last wafers" were a Dorastan Broo supply. Or at least that's the last place I read of them. In the Dorastor source book.

[TRose]

 I have  always considered the everlasting biscuit  a very rare item. You have to kill a walktapus I understand which are both rare and tough, then use some sort of spooky magic to make them. I see them as being issued to Lunar scouts and Special units but not to everyone.

[Noita]

You just need to cut the tentacle off of one, take it home, grow a new creature, keep it secure and then shave off what you need.

*speaks from experience *

[Joerg]

How do you keep a walktapus secure? Pickle it in gorp?

The problem I see with everlast biscuits is casualties. As soon as the host stomach stops producing juices, you get a baby walktapus in a feeding frenzy. That's ok if you send a forlorn hope unit into enemy territory (let them get raped by broo and infected by Mallia before the action, too, for double measure), but icky if your soldiers are in a defensive situation.

[Jon Hunter]

I am liking the idea of different communities in a culture having different recipes they are famous for within the area, this may be due to game or crop type, tradition, knowledge of spices or even magic.

So Clan 1 make great bread with cheese.

Clan 2 have magic apple trees, which tasty produce apples and cider that gets you drunk but doesn't give you a hangover

Clan 3 has a secret spice which means that there dried meat tastes like sweet fire. 

Clan 4 have great hunters and lots of warrens so make the best rabbit pie you have ever tasted.

Not important for gameplay but adds color variation and stops every clan being a food copy of the other, and is an excuse for trade and interaction which can lead to plot. ( stealing the magic cider being a great starting level character plot)

Edited February 7, 2016 by Jon Hunter

[jajagappa]

On 2/5/2016 at 7:53 AM, Jon Hunter said:

So Clan 1 make great bread with cheese

Hence the Cheese secrets of the Imtherian clans.  Here's a bit from my old Imther material.

Selections of Imtherian Cheeses, from A Guide for the Temple Cook

This small, slim document was found at the Temple of Hwarin Victorious in Hortugarth.  It was supposedly penned by one Bibishar, formerly a temple cook. The cheeses of the Zarkon clan were particularly well noted and praised.  The following are excerpts from this small guide:

Blackwall Amber: A soft amber cheese encased in black rind from the vicinity of Blackwall.  Though called bland by villagers of the Southlands, this cheese keeps well and rarely varies in flavor.  It is popular with innkeepers as a result.  Blackwall amber is not a cooking cheese being best used as an accompaniment to a meal.

Mountain Marble: Another notable cheese from the Zarkoni ridges, this soft white cheese is mixed with the crumbled flowers of the fireweed.  As it ages, the cheese develops a fiery red marbling and sharpens in taste.  It stands up well with ground meats and stews, adding a richness to the flavor and a thickness to stews, though it can certainly be served alone.

Salt-crust Cream: “The Zarkoni herders only use the top cream from their goat’s milk in making this cheese.  Once the creamy cheese is sufficiently thickened into long rolls, it is cut into segments the length of a hand and rolled in quarried Serpent Salt, the last remains of a water god slain by Daga.  It stays wonderfully fresh with a rich salt tang even after long journeys.”

Zarkoni Ice Rind: “A fermented goat's milk cheese infused with silverblossom flowers, wrapped in cloth and aged on the high slopes of Giant Top Mountain in the icy crusts favored by Inora, it is usually considered one of the Three Finest Cheeses of Imther.”

Northern Flower: Made from the milk of cows fed on wild onion and wild blackfire, this very soft and fresh cheese has an extremely tart taste.  Serve it with a hearty black bread and an aged cider, but never cook with it or serve it with sweets.

 Rhynon's Gold:  A golden, buttery-flavored cheese from the Northern Plains around Rhynopolis.  This rich cheese is preferred as a marriage gift in the north, ostensibly to show the richness of the giver, though it is commonly served in local inns on a daily basis with bread and ale.

And a little bit on food in Hortugarth from New Lolon Gospel #2

Delicacies of Hortugarth

These foods can be purchased at many of the local inns and taverns of the city of Hortugarth.  Many can also be purchased from street vendors in the Central Market. (L= lunar; c = clack)

Apples:  1/2 c in season; 1c otherwise

Applesauce Bread:  1c

Blackbird Pie:  5c

Cider Paste:  1L 5c per wheelweight

Crow Wings:  1c for 4; 1c for 3 if spiced

Fire Grapes:  2c per bunch

Fish Tails (roasted): 1c for 5

Honeyed Apple:  2c

Panbread:  1c

Pork Rind:  1L for bag of 10

Sausage Bun:  5c

Spiced Oat Cakes:  2c

Squirrel Legs:  5c for 2

Edited February 6, 2016 by jajagappa

[jajagappa]

And one more old bit from NLG #2

The Start of the Great Cheese War (1)

It all started after Ilsandor was cast out of the Ronon clan for one year for failure to uphold his guestright (2).  After a series of disastrous encounters and his luck nearly gone, Ilsandor stepped into the kettle and was taken hostage by the dwarfs.  But Ilsandor was not yet cooked and he somehow won the Eversharpening Blade.  The dwarfs were most upset, but Ilsandor demanded his release and they had to assent.

On his way out of the dwarf fortress, though, a wily dwarf offered Ilsandor a deal. In return for the Eversharpening Blade, the dwarfs would give Ilsandor the Silver Key to a cave of great magical treasures. Ilsandor was torn, but greed won out and Ilsandor took the bargain. (3)

With the Silver Key, Ilsandor went to the cave and opened the door. Only after the dwarfs closed the door behind him, did he realize that the key only worked one way.  He was stuck with the treasure of the cave--a marble statue of a laughing man covered with green mold.  He searched all through the cave, but all he found were bags producing the most hideous stench.  The smell was so strong that Ilsandor had to plug his nose.

Realizing that he had been duped, he did the only thing he could--he took the statue, hoping that it would prove of some use.  In its place he left the cattle goad that he had stolen from the Valusi clan.

Ilsandor eventually returned to his clan, the Ronon, after his year was done.  He still had the statue and he presented it as his token of goodwill, though he knew not its use.  The Keepers and Seekers knew otherwise.  For this was Renurdas the Green Veined Spirit and from him the clan gained the secret of cheesemaking.

The Polan clan had honored this spirit and held the cave as sacred.  When they found their spirit gone, their cheeses gone bad and a cattle goad where the statue should be, they blamed the Valusi for their woes.  Thus began the Great Cheese War. (4)

[Noita]

I loved your version of Imther. Lost my copies somewhere in Oz, many moons ago.

[TRose]

 There are two times I had fun with drink in Glorantha.

 

  The first was when they got their  hands on some Dwarf Alcohol . Now in my version of Glorantha Dwarves don't believe in wasting times during their once a decade day off so what they drink is similar to rectified spirits like Everclear , about 95% alcohol, which  its great for removing a few layer of cells in your throat if you drink a straight shot.. The players of course all took a straight shot of it an had to make con first to speak and then to stand.

  The second time was when they went to a newly opened Cadraland restaurant in Pavis.

  Now for some reason Cadraland has always seemed  a little like Meso America to me so I had Cadraland cuisine similar to Mexican food. So Our Urox hero goes in and sees a bowl of these slices of pickled vegetable on his table and figure Im hungry  so I will eat them in one gulp as a snack. Ever try to gulp down a bowl of jalapeno peppers? Good thing there was a small bottle of red vegetable juice also on the table for him to drink.:=)

[Noita]

I laughed out loud at the Urox part.

[Michael Hopcroft]

On 2/8/2016 at 5:47 PM, TRose said:

 There are two times I had fun with drink in Glorantha.

  The second time was when they went to a newly opened Cadraland restaurant in Pavis.

  Now for some reason Cadraland has always seemed  a little like Meso America to me so I had Cadraland cuisine similar to Mexican food. So Our Urox hero goes in and sees a bowl of these slices of pickled vegetable on his table and figure Im hungry  so I will eat them in one gulp as a snack. Ever try to gulp down a bowl of jalapeno peppers? Good thing there was a small bottle of red vegetable juice also on the table for him to drink.:=)

I wonder what the response of the local observers was to those scenes. I imagine it would depend on how xenoiphobic they were. Any chanced of passing as a local vanished with Urox' adventure with the peppers, so I hope he wasn't in a situation where he would have had to. In some especially bad situations, it could be that inability to enjoy the local cuisine could get a visitor killed as an obvious outsider in a situation where outsiders are despised, hated and feared.