Joerg

The Glorantha Source Book has another take on the deities of Darkness, as the God Learners understood them. It is possible that you'll find some angles there that may add to the picture. If you have the pdfs, do a text search for "Argan Argar", "Only Old One", "Ezkankekko" and "Kitori" in the Stafford Library books (History of the Heortling Peoples, Esrolia, Heortling Mythology), the Sourcebook, the Guide, King of Sartar, and any other source in the region to maybe find a new angle, or to reconfirm or inter-connect known ones. From memory, not that much in KoS, although in connection with History of the Heortling Peoples, Esrolia and Heortling Mythology some connections turn up. That's RQ2 Troll Pak. RQ3 excised all troll cults except Kyger Litor from the Troll Pak box and placed them in the Troll Gods box, and placed some of the Argan Argar encounters in "Into the Troll Realms", another excerpt from RQ2 Troll Pak reprinted as a separate RQ3 product. As far as I can make out, each of the RQ3 products contains some additional information vs the RQ2 original, but not enough not to label them as partial reprints. That said, with the description of the Shadow Plateau and the history of uzdom, RQ3 Troll Pak retains some crucial info on AA. A short take on AA is also in Uz - the Trolls of Glorantha. HeroQuest 1 may have tidbits - if you have the pdf, do a word search for the terms above, and the inversion Argar Argan (p122 has his cult description). The different sequence of the name is intentional, to set the human cult a bit apart from the troll cult. A shorter version of this in in Sartar: KIngdom of Heroes p.105, which also has plenty mentions for his importance in the Torkani tribe. Arcane Lore has four mentions which might have small amounts of additional info. Dragon Pass: A Gazetteer to Kerofinela (aka Land of Thunder) has a few locations on Shadow Plateau tied to the cult, but I think those were already listed in the Troll Pak description of the plateau. The RQ2 Companion has an older description of the Shadow Plateau, the first using the canonical date for the arrival of Belintar (1313) rather than the one in Troll Pak (1258). I don't recall any pertinent info on the cult in the Holy Country text (which I studied very closely). In the Guide, there are a few Dawn survival sites mentioning AA as the major deity. Did a search in the Cult Compendium (combination of Cults of Prax, Cults of Terror, and the other cults published in long format for RQ2). Yelorna has ancient enmity, and it has the RQ2 troll pak version of the AA write-up that is missing in the RQ3 version. The Big Rubble has more on shared enmity between Yelorna and Argan Argar, and has him as important deity for some of the rubble trolls. (New) Pavis has a human and trollkin temple to the god, possibly worth a look, too. These are all the more or less canonical sources I would look for information. If you are fine with fan-created material, have a look at kethaela.free.fr (in case of doubt, at web.archive.org) or browse through your copy of Book of Drastic Resolutions: Volume Darkness.

Don't your Muskox People live north of the Crater, and thereby the Red Moon? To them, that's a feature of the southern sky, not the northern sky.

There is a possible connection between the Western earth-cult -ket cities (Old Seshnela, but also in Ket-Turos) and the -chet in and around Saird. Possibly a sound change along a consonant combinatiion. This might be an element of Earth-tongue for city, palace, or temple site.

Out of morbid interest, what hinders the bad guys masking their real weapons with such red tips that can be removed at a moment's notice?

I don't think that's the case. For ritual spells, or at least this ritual spell, the number of magic points you can pour into the ritual is not limited by the number of points you have learned the spell at. RQG p.265, 267 Comparing with other ritual spirit spells (e.g. Binding, Magic Point or Spell Matrix Enchantment), I don't see any indication that they are learned as variable spells, either. Summon rituals use magic points rather than permanent POW to call forth the specified entity from beyond the veil. The summon <specific species> spell takes up one point of CHA, but doesn't limit the number of MP poured into this spell. The MP must be available to the caster, but can come from MP storage items (enchantments, crystals) or bound spirits, or from a temporary pool of MP exceeding the character's long term capacity to contain MP. (The Absorption rune spell is the only published source of such surplus MP for human non-sorcerer characters. Sorcerous Tapping, or draining abilities like those of vampires or ghosts are usually not available to human or troll spirit magic users.) But even with such MP reserves, in practice you would prefer to team the summoner with a second magician who takes control over the summoned entity. Divine magic is pretty useless for commanding summoned entities other than cult spirits or cult entities. There isn't any deity that grants spells to control the minions of its enemies. If you want to deal with potentially hostile spirits, you either need a shaman or some other magician able to discorporate and attack the summoned entity in spirit combat, beat it down to zero MP and then bind it into a (prepared) Binding Enchantment for an entity of that kind, or a sorcerer who has a spell to enslave that more or less specific kind summoned entity. The shaman's ability to jump into spirit combat more or less at will is at a big advantage as there is no need to prepare for a specific enemy. Disease spirits have no volition, and will attack any potential infection candidate without regards for odds or its own safety. A prepared infection candidate with spirit screen or similar active

Basically, there is a strip of the Underworld sky around the northern Jumper star (Kalikos) which only appears in winter, when the sky tilts soutwards. These lights are only seen in the north, when the sky has its greatest tilt (with the Sunpath and Pole Star wandering significantly south of the former Spike, now Magasta's Pool). The winter southward tilt (which re-creates the Fire-spill that keeps the Nargan dry) is stronger than the summer northward tilt. I find it a bit ironic that the quest is sent out to aid Kalikos. Kalikos pushing the sky dome back too strongly is what causes the fire spill and the cold in the north. I feel that the Lunar "aid" brought to Kalikos is a distraction to keep him from pushing the dome too far and too fast in the summer.

It was 111 S.T., within history. Of the Jenarong dynasty, the second emperor Gerruskoger/Horse on Table was the one who greeted the Dawn. This wasn't so long after the Bridling of Kargzant, an event that involved Orlanth(i). Perhaps Queen Philekka might have been involved with that, before?

There will be a simple contest to determine the magnitude (if any) the augment will have on the player's roll. This can be a supporting skill the character uses to improve her chances, or it could be some other party member creating a better environment for the character to succeed in.

Death of Orios, his unmarried son. Yarandros died in 1440, and Quivini led by the King of the Colymar raid the city of Bagnot, stealing the Ivory Throne. Probably after Yarandros' death rather than causing it, but the sources don't say anything in detail. I wonder whether that is a twist of numbers. Destruction of Talfort in the 1538 rebellion, aided by the Shaker's Temple, gives a context for the Exiles being active this far north of their remaining lands.

Each of the ascended human deities has a quest that put them in their place on the Red Moon (after it had been raised from where now the Crater gapes). For the Seven Mothers, the birth of Teelo Estara through the sacrifice of Teelo Norri is a common element. The conspirators tread new paths in Godtime to resurrect Sedenya, and those changes are now established patterns in Godtime and can be used as heroquest paths. If the seven mothers did some creative (myth-altering or myth-defining) heroquesting before joining Deezola's cabal, those paths may be available for followers of that specific mother, too. Yanafal's duel with the wasp-headed Humakt of Carmania may have occurred before he joined the cabal. Danfive Xaron's crimes surely occurred earlier, too, though I have no idea whether creative heroquesting was involved. Jakaleel likely was conversant with the underworld from before her teaming up with Deezola, too. Valare Addi opened the vast realm of ancient Pelorian myths to Lunar heroquesting. While many of those paths aren't exactly Lunar in nature, they are open to heroquesters trained in Lunar "Traveling and Journeying" and chronoportation (jumping between greater cycles of Godtime on a single quest).

Tatius was given command over the Siege of Whitewall in addition to overseeing the New Lunar Temple in 1619, after the Bat was repelled. Fazzur was busy securing Karse as a real sea port for Tarsh and the Empire, and then making inroads into Nochet by courting Queen Hendira (politically at least). The exact consequences of taking Whitewall must have suprised even Tatius, as the New Temple site appears to have been as unprepared for the winter side-effects of the WIndstop as the rest of the affected region. While news from the triumph might have made it to Glamour within less than a week and demotion letters probably having been prepared in advance, there would have been some delay to get the seals and dates added to those letters to relieve Fazzur from the governorship and top command. King of Sartar (Hardcover pdf p.138) makes it clear that while imperial orders forced Fazzur to send most of his assembled invasion force to Whitewall, he still was in overall command over the rest of the troops, and that he had the authority to send a corps of specialists to Nochet to take it from within with a "hearts and minds" approach. p.140 makes the failure to deliver a specific winter beer to an orgy in Glamour the last straw that ended Fazzur's governorship. Given the mood swings of Argenteus (imitated by a certain orange- if not ruddy-skinned head of state in the Real World) I won't say that this course of events would be improbable. The events 12 days ago... Anyway, Sea Season 1622 fits with the Fazzur narrative in King of Sartar, which has only the tiny little flaw of naming Moirades as King of Tarsh in 1613, three years after his official demise, and is otherwise fully compatible with canon.

Those aren't usually undead. While the Esrolian dead are ambulatory on what is effectively Ancestor Day, that's just taking a dead body (or the idea of it) for a walk. The rest of the time these dead spend on their side of the veil. The dead ones from Necropolis are a lot less restful than the denizens of the Antones Estates outside of Nochet (those outside the Blackmaw, at least). These dead were more or less imprisoned by damming up the river so it formed a lake around the Necropolis, preventing them from roaming the land and causing trouble. The dead in the lands of the Heortlings appear to have been a lot less trouble in the Silver Age than those of Esrolia, even though the living among the Heortlings would have been as outnumbered by their dead as the Esrolians. Something to do with King Heort being a shaman?

That's something I keep struggling with. When you go on the Sword Story heroquest as Eurmal or Humakt, you will encounter The-Guardian-afterwards-known-as-Vivamort (let's call him Morty) as a Darkness entity, without any powers of undeath etc. yet. Before his encounter with Wakboth, Morty found shelter (from vengeful darkness spirits) with Malia. As Death spread around, Nontraya gathered his horde of the dead and went to visit the land goddesses. Tada hid Eiritha under her Hills (the temple at the Paps was built or at least heavily re-designed at this occasion, and the other landmarks of the hills, too). Morty was still in possession of his soul at this time, just an underworld demon leading a host of other underworld demons and shambling dead. At some point before Wakboth's fight with Storm Bull, Morty was captured by Wakboth and traded his soul to oblivion for an ongoing existence. He became Vivamort. All those hunger and theft powers came to him at or after his transition. Having his soul devoured taught him how to devour souls. Any time in Godtime is present. Only those bits that were annihilated by Chaos aren't accessible or present. The rite to become a rune lord of Vivamort - a full vampire - is basically the heroquest where Vivamort confronts the Devil, loses his soul but gets powers of hunger and theft. Now, does this mean that all encounters with Morty will result in meeting a soul-deprived opponent rather than the normal darkness demon he was throughout most of his career? If you have a nemesis in league with Nontraya or Vivamort, nine times out of ten that nemesis will crop up whenever you encounter Malign Death. What if your nemesis is a revenant like one major NPC in TSR? Sure, that NPC has a different source for their undeath, but IMO there are bound to be servants of Nontraya who never underwent the "Meet Wakboth" quest. They may still be part of the walking dead, and inimical to the living, just not bloodsuckers. And they might display powers formerly common to Morty and his followers that the blood-suckers have lost. But then, maybe the vampires lose the ability to access the events when Morty still was sort of complete when they undergo the procedure.

Sorry if this came across as needless grumbling. I meant to admit defeat with my "Vargast Vargastson" post above. In fact I have complained about the lack of repetition in those king lists long ago. The ruler lists we have (Kings of the Heortlings, Hendriki kings, Sartar Princes, Tarsh kings, Colymar kings, to name a few) are our main source for male names, and we have a much reduced set of names for females. There appears to be a Glorantha-wide trend to have similar multi-syllabary names in a dynasty, but introducing variations. As if those names are written in a syllabary where each syllable has something like a runic meaning. Denesiod, Dismesiod - Elmexdros, Karmexdros - Dismanthuyar, Urvanyar, Karvanyar. This is reminiscent of Michael, Gabriel, Uriel, where "-el" is short for "elohim", which probably translates as "the Lord" or "God". We get quite similar names for close cousins, like Valinyr and Valina of Nochet. Now there is a chance that something like this is only done for posh names, and that low status people get to have names with fewer syllables. There are only a few known cases where a leader takes on a different name than his birth name - the masks of Moonson, Sheng Seleris, and I think one or two of the Kralori Emperors are documented as having done so. Getting a handle on how names are generated in the setting is part of the character creation in any fictional setting.

On the other hand, there is hardly any name repetition in the names of rulers in Glorantha, anywhere. While single name elements are repeated in the Fortunate Succession, we don't get numbered sets of Rhamesis or Tutmosis. The kings of the Heortlings have maybe three names that appear more than once, and similar for the governors of Heortland. Only the Bailifides introduce repeat names into the list of Seshnegi kings.

Darkness is the element to look for when you want to frighten someone, so yes - a Shade's fearshock (might require a really large shade if you need to envelop the entire beast, though) or even just the shade clouding its vision may be sufficient to make an elephant at least unsure. Madness or even Berserker may cause the beast to ignore any mahout control. But then it is likely that "Command Elephant" replaces the spike and hammer carried by real world mahouts to stop their beast in their tracks. From the titles of the noteworthy people in Teshnos, it looks like Somash may be the cult with Command Elephant. The Praxians love visiting Teshnos, and the souvenirs they can bring back, but they loathe the Fever Woods they have to traverse before entering. The God Learners fell in love with the place, too, and so did the Holy Country merchants with Melib. Haragalans are regular visitors, too. Oh, and Argrath and Harrek enjoyed their stay, too. Argrath figured out how to deal with the pachyderms - " He discovered they were not so fierce if their noses were cut off." Easy peasy. We know that the Loper mounts did reasonably well prior to the God Learner occupation. I don't know how canonical this is any more, but the annual combat between a huge (draconic) serpent and a war elephant at pass across the Shan Shan suggests that the Teshnans distrust reptilian beasts. If they used avilry (bird-like beasts), something like bolo lizards or small (birdlike) gazzam, I think we would have heard. OTOH they might use Beast Riders as mercenary cavalry. Ttrotsky's "No space on the Ark" lists gaur bovines as native to Teshnos, possibly in addition to the water buffaloes that it mentions for the Kralori. Not as steeds, but as draft beasts.

I don't think that pachyderms trained by the Teshnan fire worshipers are that easily scared by fire. The topology of Teshnos isn't that friendly for any grazing beasts, whether horses or Praxian beasts.

While I agree that both the Enerali and the Enjoreli are likely to be pastoralists rather than hunter-gatherers, and thus culturally not Hykimi/Hsunchen, I am a lot less convinced that they don't share the same ancestors as the shape-changing Hykimi all around them. There is a definite Bullbarian belt stretching from the Ozur Bay at least into Brolia, but I don't see that much evidence for Tawar being responsible for every single moo west of Kahar's Sea of Fog. Modern East Ralios have semi-nomadic cattle herders in Keanos and Saug, converts do Lightbringer ways some time in the Dawn Age, but possibly only later than the Enerali of Hrelar Amali. Would the ancestors of the people in Keanos and Saug have been cattle hykimi? Would they have been a splinter group of the Galanini not belonging to any of the four Enerali tribes? Would they have been immigrants from the Pelorian bull belt coming in through Karia? Possibly in the aftermath of the Battle of Eleven Beasts? Cattle sacrifice in Dara Happa may have only been introduced as the local gazzam faded into extinction. For all we know, the Dara Happan gazzam could have been giant Moas - Rinliddi with its ancient avilry is just around the river bend. Cattle shouldn't have been present prior to Umath's (and possibly Storm Bull's) birth. Elementally, mammals are beasts of Storm. But then, there are exceptions - the earliest humans predated the birth of Umath if the God Learners weren't completely wrong, and the ancestral Hsunchen beasts are claimed to have witnessed the birth of the universe at the deeds of Earthmaker. While the four standard beasts (of the Ancient Beasts Society in Ralios) all are somehow water-related, Otter was a mammal the last time I checked. The absence, then raising of the Nidan Mountains is a milestone in the history of the Hykimi in both Ralios and Fronela. I wonder whether there were two land goddesses before the Vadeli rebellion, or whether the two regions were united under a single goddess. With Seshna, they met a land goddess oriinally from the Enjoreli portion of Danmalastan, but probably uninhabited by any ancient Malkioni prior to the founding of Neleoswal, Frowal and the Arolanit city states (Laurmal et al). I am still somewhat hesitant to posit a rivalry between tectonic and plant goddesses of the land. In Hrestol's Saga Hrestol has a friendly and almost romantic encounter with a plant goddess (daughter of Jorestl, the forest lord of southern Seshneg) on his way to slaying Ifttala Likita, and prior to that he meets a diminutive crone who offers him a bite of one of the apples of Flamal, aka the fruit of Immortality, which elevates his status from mortal to (at least temporary) god-like status. Ifttala apparently doesn't know about this upgrade, or she would have used her dwarf bodyguard against Hrestol rather than daring him to thrust his sword at her, relying on her innate magic to protect herself from this upstart mortal. Both these benefactors of Hrestol are earth entities. In Hrestol's subsequent confrontation with an enraged and grief-struck Seshna, he receives no reply why that greater goddess had done nothing to prevent him from performing is assassination. I wonder whether that crone passing the Apple of Flamal to Hrestol may have been Seshna herself, in a disguise or different guise, compelled by some greater mythic cycles to aid and abet the death of her daughter. Both the great western forest and the bones of the land are what creates the notion of home for the western Hykimi. The Nidan uprising separates the northern Hykimi frm the southern ones. In both places, pastoralism and early agriculture create a people apart, possibly before the arrival of the Kachasti, possible triggered by contact with these Logicians. Seravus the Enchanter knows the secret of communicating with the Hykimi and their beasts, and he extends the magic of that secret to the livestock of the Vingkotlings in the prequel to the Plundering of Aron. This event occurs late enough in the Vingkotling era that the Nidan Uprising ought to be over and done with. There is this "shapechange into beast form" myth of the western hill barbarians in Anaxial's Roster. They are facing an evil sorcerer (or a nation of those). Identification of the evil Logicians remains hard - could have been any out of the Akemites of the Citadel of Brass, the Kachisti allies of Brithos, their Vadeli hostages (later overloards and slave masters), or the riverine Waertagi who create the Janube, Poralistor and Oronin rivers and the Sweet Sea and Lake Oronin. Myths about this are all over Entekosiad and in the Guide description of the origin of Sog City. Note the parallels between the creation of the Citadel of Brass in Sog and the origin of Lake Oronin and Castle Blue in Pelanda. The peoples who retain their Hykimi status past their encoutner with the Bright Empire don't seem to have either hostile or friendly myths about the Enchanter, at least not north of the Nidan range.

I am willing to bet that there are sheep and cattle who could trace their lineage to Orlanth himself, and that's not meant as a joke about sodomy among the hill barbarians (at least not originally). There are a number of myths in which the otherwise humanoid deities took on beast shape, and in all likelihood mingled with other beasts of that shape and produced offspring. Look at the types of clouds myth which has Orlanth fathering the cloud hawks on Heler (as Tarhelera). Dragonewt entanglement is one typical cause for dinosaurism, and there is a good chance that Maran could be an attractive entanglement for certain types of 'newts. It is possible that dinosaurism is endemic to the Dragon Pass population, and virtually unknown to the Kralori 'newts. Or to the Teleosan ones. It is possible that the presence of a strong draconic dream may reduce the dangers of entanglement for the 'newts, which may be why they tolerated the EWF antics for as long as they did. According to Sandy Petersen, any dragonewts still in dragonewt shape are the slackers of their species. This is even more true for the victims of dinosaurism. Dragonewts themselves are the hatchlings from eggs laid by immature dragons (or at least one immature Mother of Many who produced thousands of neotenic offspring). While dragonewts are mostly immortal as long as their egg remains intact, destroying that egg is a way to kill an individual for good, and apparently that happened to thousands of Pelorian 'newts in the build-up to the Dragonkill War. The 'newts in Ralios, the Elder Wilds and Dragon Pass escaped that destruction.

A stranger marked with a huge death rune covering much of his face approaches the Varmandi village and demands "Come forth, Vargast Vargastson of the Vargasting bloodline, and answer for your crimes in a honest one-on-one duel!" More than a dozen Varmandi emerge from the fort.

True, I was a victim to that myself when I was one of three Jörgs in my class in high school - however, out of a pool of more than 10,000 people sending their kids to that high school. Taking the average age pyramid, the 25 year-olds (give and take two years to make it an initiation group) will be about 40 people, males and females, making that 20 males. Sure, there could be two Vargasts or three in that group - although then they would be known by their distinctive nick-names, by which their followers would address them, too. (Even my teachers addressed me as "Baumi"...) What was the name of the fourth son of Vingkot? His (soon defunct) tribe is known as the Lastralgortelli, but his birth name was Janard, not Lastralgor. That's the power of nicknames.

Duplicate post.

There are 450 Varmandi in total. How many 25 year-old Vargasts who are leaders do you expect in that clan?

Also works with calcinated limestone - if you add some oil and a couple of logs above, you can start a fire that way. The run-off is rather caustic, however, and can turn you into soap. Well, precipitated chalk soap, but you wouldn't appreciate the difference much. Another possibility is to use powdered calcinated zeolith. Same effect, less clumping, and lower reconstitution temperatures.

That's a situation similar to that of humans - there are humans whose ancestors were shaped from clay, there are humans whose ancestors were animal spirits, and there are humans whose ancestors were deities or demigods. Yet they all are considered the same species, and interbreed just fine. Maran had furred and feathered (or at least downy) shaker beasts, too. Size (and force of the footsteps) is what matters. They are the trollkin of dinosaurkind, then. But I don't see any scaled or feathered small dinos inhabiting known Glorantha (i.e. the Dragon Pass region). The demibird steeds of the 'newts are the smallest ground-dwelling dino-like critter I know about if you don't count Scout 'newts or their degenerate kin, the magisaurs. (BTW, are the trachodons of the DP boardgame truly dinosaurs, or are they ancient and huge magisaurs?) Only the dinos who have the size advantage over most of their predators are extant in the known parts of Glorantha. True, there are bound to be small, juvenile specimen of the large ones somewhere, but I don't see evidence for any saurians smaller than a demibird other than the magisaurus crested 'newts. The Pteranodons are presented in the Dragon Pass boardgame as an ascended reincarnation of the other types of dino. Basically, a dragon-descended dino can weave a cocoon around itself resembling a dragonewt egg, and emerge from that as a pteranodon. No idea whether there are pteranodons born to pteranodon parents in Dragon Pass - possibly yes. The Dragon Pass rules say this about Triceratops: "The Triceratops resulted from deliberate breeding and mutation of dragonewts and trachodons to form a beast well-suited for combat." Now the statements in that hoary source needn't be 100% canonical any more, but this indicates that cross-species breeding is possible for dinos, at least inside the dragon dream that also creates/enables the nest cities of the dragonewts and emanates from them. Other than the fact that Shaker's Temple is a functioning entry point into the dragonewt road running across it. This suggests a special arrangement between the temple and the Pass 'newts. The EWF only worked because of the shared experiences of the Unity Battle and I Fought We Won which linked all the survivors of the Greater Darkness in Dragon Pass to one another. (The Elder Wilds had a similar but separate all-species bonding, though.) There was a lot of draconic hybridization going on in the core lands of the EWF (as described in Middle Sea Empire), but I don't think that that was the origin of the dinosaur aberration of the Dragon Pass nest. (Are there any dinos on the Kralorelan islands that hold the dragonewt cities there? I don't think there are.) All other dragonewt nests west of the Shan Shan appear to be descended from the Dragon Pass one, except possibly for the Elder Wilds presence of nomadic 'newts. Both the Ralian and the Ryzel nests were transplanted there in historical times, Ryzel under Palangio in the Bright Empire, Ormsland under the EWF. (The Ormsland 'newts do seem to have rebirth abilities, even without their own Inhuman King. But that's another mystery.) There used to be dragonewt nests in Peloria, but those can be explained as resettlement after the Dawn. The prequel to the Dragonkill War eliminated all nests north of the Crossline. But then, Sandy representing the Solar Emperor as a dragon in The Gods War board-game may explain the gazzam used in Murharzarm's empire via the draconic route, although I like the idea of fluffy proto-birds covered in down shuffling along the Dara Happan river valleys better than the Flintstones meeting Mesopotamia. Anything feathered has some sort of sky connection...