Building a Clan from scratch

[HeartQuintessence]

So as I learn about Glorantha from the tribe, I began to do an exercise and began building a clan.

This folder contains the ramblings of my  feverish mind, I present the piecemeal forming of The Glimmerstone Clan.  Everything is a work in progress and I'd love advice.

 They've got a few unique things to them:

1. The Koza/Koska (?) - They're Sheep, they act more like Goats(intelligent, curious, but have a strong sheep like herding instinct and are unique)
2. The original group of Women were from clans broken or destoryed in Starbrow's Rebellion ins 1613. As a result the Women turned to Vinga and became Red Women, for nearly 3 years.
3. in 1615 the Aranwyth granted them a small section of undesirable Tula, and the group made a small shanty-town. It was then the women began to realize that they were a clan, forged by their experiences. Some men, old and young come to work with the women. Pure Horse, folk, Lunar castaways, and Orlanthi all leaving together because survival outweighs their cultural grudges. Heler is invoked to hold the group together.
4. 1618 - The Koza/Koska are Quested for by priestess of Nevala the Ewe, who had been with the women.

 

1625 - The land the people have been living on can no longer support their growing number of people, animals and land. The Earth Priestess Umeka calls on the Gods, to show them way. One of the girl's who has now reached Ten years old is used as a  living conduit in an attempt to find Voria's Garden- a hopeful place for a new Tula, even if it is outside Dragon Pass.

It's me mostly musing, but also wanting to try and do something distinctly differently. I am considering making their Tula outside Dragon Pass (I know strange), but a clan this small would stand no chance of holding their own or taking land from a bigger clan.

In my head I see their Tula as 'Hidden',  it's distinctly a place that has never seen humans before (or it's been a long long time).

It's visually a cross between a alpine Austrian valley maybe. Rivers and lakes should feed it..

Or does one just literally make such a place up, and how does one find a place to put it in on the map?

 

Are there Heroquests for Wyters and making Clans? (Its something I wanted to write about, but I think most of the things I have read only reference it.)

I do want to write about hte Heroquest for the Koza- which in of itself would be New Quest

 

Anyone want to point me in the right direction or guide me in coming up with how these things should be written?

[Sir_Godspeed]

23 hours ago, HeartQuintessence said:

Are there Heroquests for Wyters and making Clans? (Its something I wanted to write about, but I think most of the things I have read only reference it.)

I do want to write about hte Heroquest for the Koza- which in of itself would be New Quest

Certainly. I don't think there's a standard quest for this, as each instance of forming a clan would be unique. 

 

It's a shame you haven't got more feedback, as this seems like a cool story. 

 

For a place to put Voria's Garden there are others here who know the geography much better than me, but I was thinking that there might be some kind of magically isolated valley in Dagori Inkarth, a mountain massif located to the east of Dragon Pass. It has a lot of Trolls in it, though, so some story regarding them might have to be spun. 

The unique livestock sound interesting too. Having them serve as a symbol of the group, and maybe the Wyter taking the shape of one of them could be interesting.

Edited May 5, 2020 by Sir_Godspeed

[jajagappa]

22 hours ago, HeartQuintessence said:

I am considering making their Tula outside Dragon Pass (I know strange), but a clan this small would stand no chance of holding their own or taking land from a bigger clan.

Quite reasonable.

22 hours ago, HeartQuintessence said:

It's visually a cross between a alpine Austrian valley maybe. Rivers and lakes should feed it..

Or does one just literally make such a place up, and how does one find a place to put it in on the map?

Yes, we pretty much make it up if there's not an obvious place to put it. 

As to where, alpine valley indicates high mountains, rivers and lakes indicate enough rainfall.  

Skyreach Mountains would fit, though that also includes the Green Dragon Vale (but it's been sleeping for centuries, so why not!). As you go northwest from there you pass the Forest of Wondrous Beasts, and then the Dryad Woods.  Very little human settlement, very good chance of a Hidden Valley.  And not overly described so a lot to play around with.  But it would be a trek if they were coming from the region near the Aranwyth - nothing wrong with that, but that should become a significant part of clan origin story as they would have had to pass hostile tribes (e.g. Malani, Colymar), the Upland Marsh, cross the Dragonspine, cross the Grazelands, and then find their way into the deeper woods and mountains.

The Indigo Mountains might work (on the southern/western side), but that is into heavy troll territory (but close to where people from clans from the former Maboder, Torkani, or Aranwyth would naturally end up).  Not far to go, but need to figure out how/why the trolls don't capture and eat them.

Within the Vale of Flowers up against the Rockwood Mountains.  Still troll territory (they have giant bees pollinating the giant flowers in that vale), but maybe something remote and hidden against the mountains.  It's not that far from the Stinking Forest either, so tusk riders and elves both might be present (and dwarves from the Rockwoods).  Similar issue in getting past the trolls and finding a way to open up a settlement.

A further option is to find the pass over the Rockwoods and come into Balazar.  Then you could take advantage of the Griffin Mountain book and find some obscure place in the wilds near the mountains.  Have to clear land to raise the flocks, and avoid varied predators (still including trolls), but much more remote as they would effectively be beyond regular communication with Dragon Pass.

22 hours ago, HeartQuintessence said:

Are there Heroquests for Wyters and making Clans?

Yes to both (though they can be somewhat/largely synonymous). There's a discussion of making wyters in the RQG book.  SKoH provides a clan generator and you could use the mythos section to walkthrough/identify key elements of the quest to "form" the clan.

[HeartQuintessence]

This sounds line an interesting way to figure out where they're going to set up shop.

I originally wanted it close enough to Dragon Pass, Esorilia, and the Grazelands to allow for a mix of people to flow from any of those places. But maybe Dagori Ikarnth is a good place to start.

I mean I can make up a place easily enough. I guess calling it Voria's Garden and making actually kind of inaccessible to the general 'public' would make sense in protecting the small clan, their boundary is marked by the mountains, which is still a very long and large valley, I'd imagine, that the amount of land they have is 'similar' in size to the Colymar's, providing them with room to grow, graze and protect their crops,livestock and people.

They're going to need a place to their initation for female and males, which I imagine are designated spaces for their tribe.

 

I did start thinking about the things I know about this tribe, what I am creating and what I want.
It occurs to me, that their clan Wyter probably should be a Koza, instead of a antlered horse (mare). Though looking at the Red Cow Clan, building a /new/ tribe is going to be awkward, as the bloodlines, wouldn't have formed yet. No would a clan hero have emerged, as the group/proto-clan has only been around for 10 years. Though doing this at the very start of the Hero Wars is a great way to draw on that energy.

 

Edited May 5, 2020 by HeartQuintessence

[HeartQuintessence]

As I do more reading on the Red Cow Clan, I realize how interesting it will be to plot the Glimmers tone clan's journey.

 

They may no long be the Glimmers tones after all this is said and done.

Their clan's women circle and Ring is made up of mostly women. I'd like you all to help me create some male characters or even female ones to help me flesh out this soon to be tribe.

 

There are skme Seven Mothers Priestesses and the like amoungst the tribe.  The clan simply took any who needed protection and showed skills and resources. And the few Lunar folk who are now apart of the tribe form almost a bloodline. They bring the flavor and wealth  of a city. Along with the Esrolian derived folks they bring polish to the tribe.

[Sir_Godspeed]

8 hours ago, HeartQuintessence said:

They bring the flavor and wealth  of a city. Along with the Esrolian derived folks they bring polish to the tribe.

That can be a challenge for them as they move into hidden wilds, where the access to trade in diverse resources (metals, clays, textiles, color pigments, etc.) will be much more limited. 

Not an impossibility, just something to spin a story on further.

[HeartQuintessence]

That is something I realized, that if your used to living the Lunar Empire, or in someplace like Esroia then living effectively int he back hills like an Orlanthi would just throw you off your game.
But since the group has been together for 10 years now, I imagine that while not a clan, persay, they have tried to maintain ties and community bonds with others places, mostly Esrolia  and Lunar Tarsh... maybe even as far away as Dara Happan.

[Runeblogger]

On 5/4/2020 at 4:05 AM, HeartQuintessence said:

Or does one just literally make such a place up, and how does one find a place to put it in on the map?

I would make up the place. The only conditions are to be outside the territories of other clans and have enough hills marked on the Argan Argar Atlas maps for hidden valleys to be plausible. Iif you want to have Esrolians and Grazelanders in it, then it would make sense for it to be close to these kingdoms and Sartar.

This hidden valley thing reminds me of The Smoking Ruins supplement for RuneQuest Glorantha. I haven't read it yet, but one of the scenarios involves a group of people living in a valley between Sartar and the Grazelands. I think it's Longhome in the map below (NB: I toggled the colors). So another option would be to substitute the description of that group of people with your Glimmerstone clan.

On 5/5/2020 at 2:34 AM, jajagappa said:

Skyreach Mountains would fit, though that also includes the Green Dragon Vale (but it's been sleeping for centuries, so why not!).

This could also be an excellent option. Nobody goes there in fear of the Green Dragon, so it is perfect for the Glimmerstone clan. Also, since True Dragons create dream dragons, they could potentially also create other lasting illusions, which would make an entire hidden valley feasible. 🙂

[Sir_Godspeed]

The little valley just northwest of Green Dragon Vale could be a candidate. Perhaps the priestesses conduct a Heroquest/Ritual that makes Voria reveal to them that it actually is deeper and more welcoming than others saw it as. 

[g33k]

One caution I'd offer:  it's very possible to have your clan TOO hidden, TOO cut-off.

Just as new PC's -- going through character-generation -- are embedded in their cultures, make sure your new Clan is embedded in the world, with allies and rivals (and yes, even enemies!) in the larger world of Glorantha, and the region where you live.

It's far too easy (sometimes even automatic/default) to fall into the clannish version of the "lone wolf PC" trope.

 

[HeartQuintessence]

3 hours ago, g33k said:

One caution I'd offer:  it's very possible to have your clan TOO hidden, TOO cut-off.

Just as new PC's -- going through character-generation -- are embedded in their cultures, make sure your new Clan is embedded in the world, with allies and rivals (and yes, even enemies!) in the larger world of Glorantha, and the region where you live.

It's far too easy (sometimes even automatic/default) to fall into the clannish version of the "lone wolf PC" trope.

 

That was some thing I was thinking of. I want them to be close to be able to have allies and enemies in Sartar, to be able to Trade with Esrolia, and Tarsh, and maybe even Darra Happan somehow.
They're too small a group to survive like this  on their own so they'd have to depend on allies and ties to other places built up over the past decade. From the Esrolian contingent they trade and welcome their sisters and cousins. From the Sartar, they can forge new alliances with clans, and the like.
But you all are right, I can't have it too well hidden., though for such a small group the hidden nature of the value is a boon, until they can be strong enough to protect it on their own.

[g33k]

2 hours ago, HeartQuintessence said:

That was some thing I was thinking of. I want them to be close to be able to have allies and enemies in Sartar, to be able to Trade with Esrolia, and Tarsh, and maybe even Darra Happan somehow.
They're too small a group to survive like this  on their own so they'd have to depend on allies and ties to other places built up over the past decade. From the Esrolian contingent they trade and welcome their sisters and cousins. From the Sartar, they can forge new alliances with clans, and the like.
But you all are right, I can't have it too well hidden., though for such a small group the hidden nature of the value is a boon, until they can be strong enough to protect it on their own.

Maybe some of the folk they came from, places from which they are refugees, are angry at being abandoned, or feel their choices were somehow "betrayals."

Maybe some of them were -- maybe some of the grievances have (at least some) merit.

Edited May 7, 2020 by g33k

[Sir_Godspeed]

Is there some trade traffic through the gap by the Green Dragon Vale?

[HeartQuintessence]

Not that I am aware of, but I am sure we could make some. The Valley's been hidden, but now that the clan will claim it, people will see it. the land scape will change.
That should bring some trade, I can image them setting up tiny outposts, smaller than Apple Lane, but just as important. Their newly discovered glimmer fruit which makes their sheep's wool all different colors.

[Alex]

On 5/6/2020 at 5:43 PM, Runeblogger said:

Nobody goes there in fear of the Green Dragon, so it is perfect for the Glimmerstone clan. Also, since True Dragons create dream dragons, they could potentially also create other lasting illusions, which would make an entire hidden valley feasible. 🙂

Or the Green Dragon is a somewhat restless sleeper, and turned over mid-siesta a few years ago, radically changing the internal topography of the valley.  If you're a knowledgeable local, yet another reason not to go near it, but if you're none the wiser, or a desperate refugee...

[Ironwall]

On 5/4/2020 at 8:35 PM, HeartQuintessence said:

Though looking at the Red Cow Clan, building a /new/ tribe is going to be awkward, as the bloodlines, wouldn't have formed yet. No would a clan hero have emerged, as the group/proto-clan has only been around for 10 years. Though doing this at the very start of the Hero Wars is a great way to draw on that energy.

There could be proto-bloodlines formed around important members of the clan and their family and followers and/or cult affiliation

[soltakss]

On 5/4/2020 at 3:05 AM, HeartQuintessence said:

In my head I see their Tula as 'Hidden',  it's distinctly a place that has never seen humans before (or it's been a long long time).

It's visually a cross between a alpine Austrian valley maybe. Rivers and lakes should feed it..

Or does one just literally make such a place up, and how does one find a place to put it in on the map?

Make it up and put it on the map.

On 5/4/2020 at 3:05 AM, HeartQuintessence said:

Are there Heroquests for Wyters and making Clans? (Its something I wanted to write about, but I think most of the things I have read only reference it.)

Yes, there are several.

Each founding clan or tribe has a HeroQuest that they used to found the clan/tribe.

I think there are "Founding the First Clan" and "Founding the first tribe" myths.

Many myths can be used to found a clan. Anything where a group of people come together or split off from another group can be used to found a clan. Anything where groups of clans group together can be used to found a tribe.

If you have a lot of spare time, have a look at Resurrection: Ertugrul, it shows how clans can join and separate to found a new clan.

On 5/4/2020 at 3:05 AM, HeartQuintessence said:

I do want to write about hte Heroquest for the Koza- which in of itself would be New Quest

If it a clan already in existence, that would be the founding HeroQuest/Myth.

If you are going to create a clan in gameplay, that would be the HeroQuest that the Adventurers do to form the clan.

[HeartQuintessence]

Whoo hee, necro necro thread .

 

I started down that road, but ran into the weird road block of how do I mix the Lunar wedding party survivors into that bloodline setup.

Then it kinda hit me :

1) What if it a matrilineal descent, these despirate women claim various ancient women in the past, but give them some connector to each other.

I had originally figured that  Green Age sisters who settled in Dragon pass, the Carmine empire( Lunar) and future Dara Happen lands would allow for a good mix of women.
but how to go from those to full formed bloodlines?

 

 

[Alex]

44 minutes ago, HeartQuintessence said:

Whoo hee, necro necro thread .

Yeah, apparently I'm a serial necromancer, and am on the naughty step.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm-4FmsfUAc

 

44 minutes ago, HeartQuintessence said:

1) What if it a matrilineal descent, these despirate women claim various ancient women in the past, but give them some connector to each other.

I had originally figured that  Green Age sisters who settled in Dragon pass, the Carmine empire( Lunar) and future Dara Happen lands would allow for a good mix of women.
but how to go from those to full formed bloodlines?

IMO bloodlines aren't especially important in the first instance.  They don't have the same sort of legal status that clans and tribes do, they just sort of exist in custom and practice.  Largely because you have to track 'actually' too-related-to-get-married as against 'theoretically exogamous', and because every Theyalan clan is a 1000-person argument, so you get your second cousins to gang up on your sixth cousins.  Give it a few generations, you'll have bloodlines.

If a clan forms from a merger of a small number of refugee bloodlines or clan-remnants, it makes things simpler in the sense in the "“Karallan’s Plight" sense -- simpler compromises to make between the smaller number of different magical and mythic options.  But it's possible to do with any group of people, if their will, need, wisdom and magic is strong enough.  Just imagine an 300-player "session zero" doing the Clan Questionnaire by committee -- easy-peasy!  And as you say, what that'd likely look like it picking out common themes.  Women of the lozenge, oppressed since always, everywhere.  Recent history they have to agree to recognise a multiplicity on.