Backford Aeolian Campaign

[Joerg]

If you are willing to run with non-canonical Glorantha, The Widow's Tale by Penelope Love (sadly long out of its meagre print run) and its lesser sequel Eurhol's Vale deal with a pass across the Storm Mountains. Strictly fiction, although full of RQ2isms.

[jajagappa]

7 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Seems like the long way but avoids scorpionmen I suppose... in yellow.

That's because the map in the Guide isn't quite accurate vs. the master maps. Stormwalk is actually centered about where your red line is. There's a reason the Bullflood is called the "Bull" flood - it's Storm Bull's river and its headwaters are on Stormwalk Mountain.

The accurate map is what Jeff shared on FB here: Heortland master map

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by jajagappa

[Erol of Backford]

Noticed County of the Isles. Didn't know it had a name or was a thing.

GtG County of the Isles: These islands were traditionally governed by a companion of the Governor-King of Heortland. It is now a pirate stronghold...

but we are starting our campaign at 1600 and Rollo Ortosso will surely be stopping if there is something to trade, sheepskin anyone?

There do not seem to be major settlements on the islands, no named towns or cities.

Are they mostly Orlanthi fishermen with a few headers thrown in, settled in scattered little hamlets with maybe a bootlegger gang or 2 hidden away on the less travelled coastal areas?

With only 2k population average for each island its about 400 inhabitants give or take each. This spread out over about 20-25 square miles makes for a about 32 acres per person. If we guess 6-8 or more Hearths per Steading the rural population density goes down even more. Again if there is good grazing we may have a few sheep or cows being herded here. Less raiding from the neighbors as they are 10 miles away by sea. Could be pirates would be an issue, but not as much an issue say 1600 ~ 1610?

I like the idea of using a take off of the river settlements in Sandheart 01 as a basis. Reading through Seapolis again beckons the add of a few sea trolls, a few groups of newtlings and maybe a turtle nesting area, mermen caves?

Who knows maybe the Baron comes here to find the 

These islands may have some hills but not likely more than a few 100' I am guessing?

Are they like islands in Ireland or more like Mediterranean coast, I am guessing more Mediterranean as several seasons take temperatures to the mid or upper 20's based on Nochet temps and that these islands are a little south of there. 

If a steading is 8-12 persons with anywhere between 50-250 persons at these imaginary hamlets there'd be 2-3 per island in or at the closest thing to a bay for a harbor or so I am guessing. Likely a few small lakes on the islands, again they are about 20-25 square miles each.

The marsh south of Vizel and east of Casino Town likely have giant insects and a few chaos baddies as no one goes there much but newtlings would be there most likely.

Has anyone done adventuring on these islands, I suppose the old scenario Sea Cave could be hidden away on one of these gems easily enough or even Nee-Gatta!? Better call the Mr. Barran!

[Joerg]

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Noticed County of the Isles. Didn't know it had a name or was a thing.

I have been writing, mapping and drawing about these islands for quite a while now as my work load and mood swings allow, planning a release on Jonstown Compendium.

The Isles already sort-of show up in my original Heortland notes in the person of Ashart, the warden of the isles, a subject of the Governor-King in Durengard and responsible for the coastal guard of Heortland (which I based in Leskos - a few biremes and "penteconters" able to run across the tidal flats during medium to high tide).

My old Heortland campaign started in 1615 with the initiation of the characters, and thus started with Belintar still in control. The subsequent shifts in politics and occupation were the metaplot behind the campaign.

 

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

GtG County of the Isles: These islands were traditionally governed by a companion of the Governor-King of Heortland. It is now a pirate stronghold...

I have taken a closer look at them now, for a while in communication with Bill Carley. While that cooperation has stopped, I prepared lots of background notes and have several local gazetteers for the individual islands in the making.

One idea of mine about the Isles before Belintar's death was to treat them as the backyard of the City of Wonders, with villas of officials and other folk in the City providing a retreat from the Godworld atmosphere there, along with a place to grow fruit and other perishables that may be in more demand in Belintar's capital than even magically boosted vinyards and gardens could provide. In short, something of Suburbia for the City of Wonders.

Factoid for my set-up: since a pirate prince has established rule over the isles, the raiding parties carrying off natives have ebbed down, and in 1621 a significant return of Threestep Island slaves taken captive from these isles as followers of the pirate prince who had a series of minor disagreements with Harrek and refused to participate in the Circumnavigation has swelled the population a bit above the numbers given in the Guide. Those numbers are the result of the massive pirate raids following the destruction of the Holy Country fleet, but already incessant raiding of coastal population since 1605 when the Threestep Isles were settled by Yggites (including Gold-Gotti, or a very similar Yggite if the Pavis books in the making give him a different backstory - Gold-Gotti does participate in the Circumnavigation and is not a regular at these isles).

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

but we are starting our campaign at 1600 and Rollo Ortosso will surely be stopping if there is something to trade, sheepskin anyone?

In my version, the six human-inhabited islands are quite distinct in character. Rather than making all of them very low marshy islands, I took a closer look at the vertical scale of the map in the Argan Argar Atlas, which says they don't protrude (significantly) above 1000 feet, or 330 meters. That doesn't mean that they need to be totally flat, and two of the islands in my version scrape at the 1000 feet mark and even exceed it in a few places too insignificant to show up in the AAA.

From the north to the south:

Sober Island (revealed to be two islands in the detail maps re-discovered by Jeff) is mainly inhabited by fisherfolk related to the fisherfolk in Karse and elsewhere on the Isles and the Heortland flats below the cliffs. The newly "discovered" second island is Sober Rock, a low dormant volcano whose flanks are home to a myriad of sea birds, and whose grottos have a birthing cave for a small population of plesiosaurs. The fisherfolk inhabit a major hamlet on the southwestern end of the island and a smaller hamlet on the southeastern end. The two hamlets have two different pods of Ludoch overseeing their fishing activities, and there is a third pod of Ludoch who claim certain fishing grounds as taboo to human fisherfolk. Total population somewhere around 250-350 individuals, depending on the sailing season and whether there were recent pirate raids.

Products of Sober Island include preserved fish and stuff collected from the sea-birds - eggs, feathers, less savory substances of alchemical interest, and some of the yields of ocean fishing for big prey. Due to the distance from the City of Wonders, this island has some of the least influence from Belintar's capital.

New Manor island (the name is my creation, inspired by the five-star shape which reminded me of Numenor) on the other hand is one of two islands with very strong connections to the City of Wonders. There used to be orchards and flower gardens around a number of manors belonging to rich folk from the city, with a population of dependent farmers/gardeners and overseers tending these, as well as two communities of fisherfolk overseeing three coves with deepwater access. When Harrek's Wolf Pirate fleet arrived, a lot of these orchard folk were evacuated to the City of Wonders, for all good it did them, leaving only a few of the gardener households on the islands (who afterwards suffered their strong share of abductions). There are also Heortling shepherds/farmers on the island, making use of the saltweed on the tidal flats at low tide. Both fisherfolk and shepherd households maintain marriage relations with the inhabitants of the coastal flats on the mainland who follow a similar lifestyle.

The deepwater coves were discovered by the pirates as convenient places to resupply, provided they came to an agreement with the remaining islanders, who have since even gained modest prosperity by supplying the pirate ships, a bit like ordinary businesses doing moderately well near criminal biker gangs. (One of my historical parallels was the cordial relationship between the fisherfolk of East Frisia and Helgoland with the Likedeeler pirates harrassing the Hanseatic League.)

Next come the two islands overseeing the Minthos Estuary and the deep water channel of the Bullflood estuary.

Count's Harbor is the main settlement on the Isles, dominating the island at the confluence of the Bullflood and Minthos currents. (In Jeff's re-discovered maps, this is the only of the Isles which shows a settlement of between 400 and 800 inhabitants. With my recent history of immigrations, I opted to a development towards the upper range of that number.) Here we find a few Pelaskite overseas merchant ship owner cooperatives plying the trade with Dosakayo on Melib, the former arsenal and lesser repair yard of the coastal guard ships picking up supplies here, the count's office, and a bit of chandler-oriented crafting supplying whatever ships need replacement ropes, canvas, barrels, amphorae etc.

Other than the locally owned trade, Count's Harbor used to act as the satellite station of Leskos. 

The Isle of Entry is the outer of these two islands, and the most developed so far.

When I discussed residential villas of the early Roman Empire, the Villa of Tiberius on Capri was the logical go-to for inspiration, and Bill pointed out a certain superficial similarity between the outline of Capri (the Goat Island) and this island, so I looked up facts about Capri, liked what I found, and went the whole hog - with a number of alterations. Tiberius's villa became the palace of the Count.

A few other villas (like the famous ones populating modern Capri) were assigned to various active and former dignitaries of the 1616 City of Wonders, including a former Caladraland ambassador to Melib whose research into the mysteries of Solf led to his replacement and drug-addled retirement to this island.

First was to look for another beast than goats, as those aren't really popular with the nearby Theyalans. I settled on pigs instead, with the alternate name for Mralota being Entra, a goddess with strong ties to Kethaa. This also gives me a nice double meaning, as the island also oversees the Choralinthor traffic entering from the Troll Strait.

This fact led me to have a Waertagi lighthouse on one of the 300 foot high cliffs overseeing the troll strait.

And of course there is the Selenic Grotto, with a pulsating glow emitting from a submerged fragment of the Blue Moon.

Finally, there is Kenstone Island, the only other island with a published official name to date. Mostly a low-lying exension of the Leftarm Vulari peninsula, this island has escaped erosion thanks to some volcanic rock towards the Troll Strait giving a slight elevation to the east. It has three settlements, one of Pelaskite fisherfolk, one of Esvulari farmers and fisherfolk, and a larger mixed settlement with the resident Aeolian talar family and their retainers plus Pelaskite fisherfolk.

 

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

There do not seem to be major settlements on the islands, no named towns or cities.

There is one settlement on the detail maps which I christened Count's Harbor, a name which can remain as a title when (or if) the gazetteer to the re-discovered maps becomes availale.

 

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Are they mostly Orlanthi fishermen with a few headers thrown in, settled in scattered little hamlets with maybe a bootlegger gang or 2 hidden away on the less travelled coastal areas?

Yes. Old fisherman families with ancestral ties to Karse, sharing in the fisherman rites and pilgrimages there, and coastal shepherder farmers with in-laws on the mainland. There are numerous families with (now former) ties to the City of Wonders on New Manor, Entry and Count's Harbor in my version, a considerable influx of Wolf Pirate dependants resettled from Threestep Isle, and a small but rapidly growing amount of Melibite in-laws of the captains of the locally owned merchant ships.

 

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

With only 2k population average for each island its about 400 inhabitants give or take each. This spread out over about 20-25 square miles makes for a about 32 acres per person. If we guess 6-8 or more Hearths per Steading the rural population density goes down even more. Again if there is good grazing we may have a few sheep or cows being herded here. Less raiding from the neighbors as they are 10 miles away by sea. Could be pirates would be an issue, but not as much an issue say 1600 ~ 1610?

Prior to 1605, population density would have been at a maximum before raiding for slaves by the Wolf Pirates started to be a major problem here as well as on the Rightarm and Leftarm Isles.

Early on, an Issaries merchant from Count's Harbor started to serve as a go-between for ransoms of such captives with the Threestep Isles, with other rivals in nearby coastal towns, and even in his home town.

Up to the defeat of Belintar's fleet in 1616, the population numbers may have been double what the numbers in the Guide show.

None of the pirate crews, the rowers in the Heortland or Belintar's (successor) navies or on merchant ships are really counted in this headcount, either, although they can swell the population by up to one third (though a lot of both navy and merchantman personnel might winter on Melib rather than here).

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

I like the idea of using a take off of the river settlements in Sandheart 01 as a basis. Reading through Seapolis again beckons the add of a few sea trolls, a few groups of newtlings and maybe a turtle nesting area, mermen caves?

Yes to all, although most of the Ludoch mermen only use such caves as last resort hiding places, preferring to swim in the currents of their shoals and reefs. And more.

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Who knows maybe the Baron comes here to find the 

Incomplete, but I guess you wanted to speculate about a Karse connection? Definitely there, as the main ancestral temple of the old fisherfolk families is located there, and some local trade goes to Karse, too (as does quite a bit of hiring of rowers or sailors). Whether the ruler of Karse has business on one or more of the Isles would be left to your campaign.

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

These islands may have some hills but not likely more than a few 100' I am guessing?

Canonically, 1000' (300+ meters) is the cap when you look at the AAA maps. Entry and Sober Rock scratch at that mark, the rest tops out a lot lower. Entry has a pig myth about one of the plateau rocks wandering off, Sober Rock has a child of Veskarthan.

(Capri is actually twice that high, but also a bit larger than entry. I started some 3D modeling in Sketchup, which gives about the impression I wanted from that island.)

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Are they like islands in Ireland or more like Mediterranean coast, I am guessing more Mediterranean as several seasons take temperatures to the mid or upper 20's based on Nochet temps and that these islands are a little south of there. 

A bit of a mix, with the Channel coast another influence besides the Adria. Water temperatures vary greatly below the surface as ancient currents meet the river currents, joining them on their way back through Troll Strait. There are quite a few springs below the Mirrorsea, some hot and volcanic, others carrying the cold from the Troll Underworld, providing a plethora of variation of underwater habitats.

 

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

If a steading is 8-12 persons with anywhere between 50-250 persons at these imaginary hamlets there'd be 2-3 per island in or at the closest thing to a bay for a harbor or so I am guessing. Likely a few small lakes on the islands, again they are about 20-25 square miles each.

There are wetlands broken with open pools of water on most of the islands (other than Entry and Sober Rock).

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

The marsh south of Vizel and east of Casino Town likely have giant insects and a few chaos baddies as no one goes there much but newtlings would be there most likely.

Several beaches of the Isles are overgrown with reeds, a valuable building material for both human and newtling fisherfolk (if for different purposes).

My version of the Choralinthor Bay has the biggest concentration of Newtlings around Frog Island, but has bachelor groups popping up almost everywhere. After 1613, in my version there are also quite a few durulz in the region, especially across the Marzeel estuary west of Karse.

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Has anyone done adventuring on these islands, I suppose the old scenario Sea Cave could be hidden away on one of these gems easily enough or even Nee-Gatta!? Better call the Mr. Barran!

I have quite a few different scenario hooks or plot-lines under development.

 

Edited September 23, 2023 by Joerg

[David Scott]

On 9/16/2023 at 1:02 PM, jajagappa said:

The accurate map is what Jeff shared on FB here: Heortland master map

or here: https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/heortland-in-the-third-age-ii/

[Erol of Backford]

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

villas of officials and other folk in the City providing a retreat

Any wealthy city has 2nd homes for the wealthy... logical idea and like Capri.

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

deepwater coves were discovered by the pirates as convenient places to resupply

some of my first thoughts, not large settlements but small ones doing smuggling as well as a little bit of coastal raiding...

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

First was to look for another beast than goats, as those aren't really popular with the nearby Theyalans. I settled on pigs instead, with the alternate name for Mralota being Entra, a goddess with strong ties to Kethaa.

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

Entry has a pig myth about one of the plateau rocks wandering off

I will stick with sheep, pigs belong in Ockless, near Ivory Plinth or by Red Eye's haunt for me. Recall some pig-broo in Troubled Waters, they can stay in Prax?

Where does the pig myth come from?

This is great information, add some scenarios and NPC's and the book is ready!

 

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

Incomplete

Sorry, was falling asleep I think! It was Mr. Barran the Monster Killer I was saying could be looking for Nee-Gatta Norican Giant - Gnydron

I like the idea that the PC's meet up with Mr. Barran before the Strangers in Prax scenarios. These islands could be the palace and the Norican Giant could be related to the Sea Cave unpublished portion somehow, was tainted there and it happens to be near Karse and or these islands, hidden away. The location is still TBD for this campaign.

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

Waertagi lighthouse on one of the 300 foot high cliffs

This is a nice add.

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

there are also quite a few durulz in the region

I keep wanting to turn them into halflings but my childhood reading always goes back to Bilbo's parents drowning so it doesn't fit with as a duck substitute... unfortunately.

3 hours ago, David Scott said:

or here: https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/heortland-in-the-third-age-ii/

This map seems cleaner, more clear than some others of the same vintage, thank you Mr. Scott! Would be nice to be able to get a full composite map to date. Would be nice mounted on some foam board and hung on the wall...

[Joerg]

34 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

I will stick with sheep, pigs belong in Ockless, near Ivory Plinth or by Red Eye's haunt for me. Recall some pig-broo in Troubled Waters, they can stay in Prax?

 

I did consider to replace the goats with sheep, but that felt a bit cheap (no pun intended). I like the mythical grounding with Choralinthor's mother's Earth, and I wanted to avoid another Storm place, especially atop the Blue Moon/tidal place.

Pigs belong to Ernalda wherever she shows up, much like earth serpents do. (And no, a serpent island did not work fr me.) Pigs also belong to Kethaa, the old goddess of Kethaela (the Holy Country). Maniria has the Entruli, some of which lived in Esrolia in the Silver and Dawn Age. Aram came from the southwest, too. Thunder Rebels named the sow goddess Entra, a female form of Entru (the name-giving founder of the Entruli tribes). 

34 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

Where does the pig myth come from?

My variation on the "ambling hill" myth of Mt. Passant, or on the Boldhome myth about the Thorgeir's Cow peak of the Quivin Mountains. Not original at all, but the shape of the island also reminds me of a special breed of domestic pig from my home area,

34 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

This is great information, add some scenarios and NPC's and the book is ready!

Feel free to use this rudimentary summary in your campaign. I thought I'd use this opportunity to tease what I have come up with so far, but this is far from finished, even as partial releases focussing on single islands or even hamlets.

I have a number of cameos written or at least outlined, but not RQ-ready. Not even quite HQG/Questworlds-ready. There are a lot of NPCs and sample PCs for the various factions that need work. Each of the islands will need mapping, as will the surrounding waters, and the encounter sites.

And then there are illustrations to find or to create. Or at least graphical art direction. And someone keeping my written ramblings in check.

34 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

 

I have Sober Rock on the northeast of Sober Island rather than its southwest, after discovering that the one island in the AAA and the Holy Country map is actually two islands separated by a rather narrow channel in the new map linked by David. Otherwise yes, that's how I started this exploration of the Isles. Sober Rock also is well situated as the location of my (German language) RQ3 scenario in Free INT #5, at least as it played out in my Heortland campaign. A RuneQuest dungeon crawl, really.

Exploring the Choralinthor Bay around the isles - tidal flats, shallows and deeper trenches/currents is part of this project, too. The Sober Island bits contain some of my ideas about interaction with the Ludoch.

34 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

I like the idea that the PC's meet up with Mr. Barran before the Strangers in Prax scenarios. These islands could be the palace and the Norican Giant could be related to the Sea Cave unpublished portion somehow, was tainted there and it happens to be near Karse and or these islands, hidden away. The location is still TBD for this campaign.

I had not really linked the Strangers in Prax version of Ahab to the Choralinthor Bay.

Getting a Gnydron into these shallows would be a major abduction, too - easier to use some Waertagi submersible as a fake monster. Not necessarily crewed by Waertagi (or at least not necessarily crewed by living aquatic Waertagi... which now is yet another scenario idea I want to insert).

 

34 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

I keep wanting to turn them into halflings but my childhood reading always goes back to Bilbo's parents drowning so it doesn't fit with as a duck substitute... unfortunately.

Wrong tribe of the halflings. Smeagol fits the durulz lifestyle quite well.

 

[Erol of Backford]

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

Pigs belong to Ernalda wherever she shows up, much like earth serpents do.

OK, I can work with that.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

but the shape of the island also reminds me of a special breed of domestic pig from my home area

I don't see it, I suppose looking at clouds does that, some people see the pig and others do not... (I am laughing as I know what you mean but...)

 

It's a weird pig or at from what I know of pigs in the US Midwest.

 maybe not, but this one  might be a snail or a turtle, a VW Bug?

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

And then there are illustrations to find or to create. Or at least graphical art direction. And someone keeping my written ramblings in check.

LOL, I am still using your early stuff from when you started writing for Glorantha.

1 hour ago, Joerg said:

easier to use some Waertagi submersible as a fake monster.

Waertagi submersible sea dragon car...

Thank you for a great detailed (as always) outline as at the start of this thread we had 2 names and a rough population.

[Joerg]

The pig shape comes from the side view of the elevations of the island. This is a very rough experimental representation of the region in Sketchup with only Sober Rock and Enry modeled vertically:

Entry has a saddle between the eastern and western tips of the islands, both of which have cliffs of significantly more than 200 meters (700') above average high water.

The pigs in question would resemble the Turopolje pig (a highly endangered domestic pig race from Croatia that loves to swim and can actually dive to get to its food). These pigs should be popular all around the Choralinthor bay where there is brackish marshland too wet for sheep.

The topography in the image above was taken from these detail maps.

There need to be quite a few maps of the region showing the different situations at different tides, or at least a bathymetric representation of the Mirrorsea Bay to make that information available beyond the vague (and not very exact) hints at trenches and shallows in the AAA map of the bay. Jeff has provided the rough picture in this map which is lacking the fine structure of the naturally occurring drainage channels that allow the rather sudden ebb of the waters (although the falling tide is not much shorter than our world's ebbing tide, it is the incoming tide which comes in slow motion).

The intertidal zone is where a lot of the life of both the fisherfolk and even the shepheds of the Isles happens. The area between Leskos, Entry, Sober Rock and the southern bank of the Syphon Estuary is one of the shallowest parts of the bay, much of which will fall dry regularly, and occasionally completely missing out a flood. There are salt-tolerant plants thriving in the calm of Choralinthor's area of influence which will provide good pasture for the hardy sheep of both the islanders and the dwellers of the coastal flats, allowing a short term transhumance before the flood slowly creeps back over the course of at least one day, but up to seven days from the last moment of high water.

Such salt pasture is a godsent for ungulants.

I have calculated possible tidal effects in a (yet very rough) spreadsheet on google docs taking into account the effects of the weekly tide reflecting the red phase of the Red Moon overlaid with the randomized Annilla tide of the Blue Streak. The inhabitants of Choralinthor Bay know the normal tides, and they have ancient experience with tidal waves (in-rushing bodies of water) such as used by the Waertagi, tsunami-like events sometimes caused by sorcery, sometimes caused by capricious currents branching off from the Doom Currents. The humans build their homes and work-places accordingly, and the marine inhabitants of Choralinthor Bay use their access to the intertidal zone to harvest their part of the dry lands.

Apart from the sails, this final scene from the first season of Wheel of Time almost perfectly depicts the initial stage of a Waertagi raid on a coastal region:

Already happened to the Quinpolic League, but soon a possibility on these shores.

[mfbrandi]

5 hours ago, Joerg said:

These pigs should be popular all around the Choralinthor bay where there is brackish marshland too wet for sheep.

Although sometimes one gets sheep in salt marshes or on the beach (eating seaweed — there is a wall to keep them off the main body of the island):

https://www.slowfood.org.uk/ark-product/romney-salt-marsh-lamb/

https://inews.co.uk/inews-lifestyle/food-and-drink/north-ronaldsay-sheep-orkney-island-seaweed-dyke-warden-303941

[Joerg]

42 minutes ago, mfbrandi said:

Although sometimes one gets sheep in salt marshes or on the beach (eating seaweed — there is a wall to keep them off the main body of the island):

https://www.slowfood.org.uk/ark-product/romney-salt-marsh-lamb/

https://inews.co.uk/inews-lifestyle/food-and-drink/north-ronaldsay-sheep-orkney-island-seaweed-dyke-warden-303941

Yes - well aware of that practice, which is another support for my idea of grazing areas that regularly get flooded by largely waveless higher tides.

[jajagappa]

18 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

pigs belong in Ockless

Pigs are sacred animals to the Earth deities, particularly Ernalda. They are ubiquitous to all of Dragon Pass and the Holy Country. 

[mfbrandi]

1 hour ago, jajagappa said:

Pigs are sacred animals to the Earth deities, particularly Ernalda.

After too long in the company of Orlanth, they remind her of the possibility of intelligent beasts.

[Erol of Backford]

12 hours ago, Joerg said:

The pig shape comes from the side view of the elevations of the island.

Of course, I see it as possible the way you explain it now! 3D helps a lot. Mr. Scott referenced the maps earlier. It'd be great to have a large on for a wall hanging! Marinated pork loin with Korean Hoisin Sauce and garlic slowly grilled is quite nice..

12 hours ago, Joerg said:

Jeff has provided the rough picture

I think the maps are great, but I'd not get much more detailed beyond say that which is explained in the Sea Cave scenario. High, low and medium tides... something simple.

Curious the min max on the tides in feet or meters. More so the idea of what the tides would do at say Nochet, Sklar, Karse and Leskos...

Don't like Waertagi or Shan Chan.

 

[Erol of Backford]

On 9/24/2023 at 12:48 AM, Joerg said:

Apart from the sails, this final scene from the first season of Wheel of Time almost perfectly depicts the initial stage of a Waertagi raid on a coastal region:

Speaking of Waertagi, wasn't aware they were salvers but I am planning on possibly Sober Island housing a slave smuggling base, underground entered via some hidden grotto. This slave and goods smuggling operation supports some well-to-do families of Nochet.

The premiss is that there is a Troll Slave Mine in the foothills of the Stromwalk Mountains and there are Troll slave pens in the ruins of Jisteel or Lylnet.

If you think another island is more suitable or already has in your campaign this sort of base please let me know.

[Joerg]

6 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Speaking of Waertagi, wasn't aware they were salvers but I am planning on possibly Sober Island housing a slave smuggling base, underground entered via some hidden grotto. This slave and goods smuggling operation supports some well-to-do families of Nochet.

The premiss is that there is a Troll Slave Mine in the foothills of the Stromwalk Mountains and there are Troll slave pens in the ruins of Jisteel or Lylnet.

If you think another island is more suitable or already has in your campaign this sort of base please let me know.

Sober rock has grottos that smugglers might have to share with plesiosaurs, but that might be used as an extra protection if they are crafty and bring some bait to access their hideout.

[Erol of Backford]

Where might this be along one of the Heortland Plateau River Valleys? I wish to go there!

[Erol of Backford]

Where along the Heortland coast might we see settlements like this? (Kopanyi Thailand)

I assume numerous ones by say Seapolis but what about the western coast of the Heortland Plateau and or the islands Joerg detailed earlier?

Would the areas by Keystone and Landwall have some of this?

[jajagappa]

52 minutes ago, Erol of Backford said:

Where along the Heortland coast might we see settlements like this? (Kopanyi Thailand)

I assume numerous ones by say Seapolis but what about the western coast of the Heortland Plateau and or the islands Joerg detailed earlier?

Would the areas by Keystone and Landwall have some of this?

Looks like Caladraland and the Manirian coast to me. 

This type of setting looks like rivers carving through old volcanic rocks, then subsequent sea-level rise hiding the deeper canyons.

Note that in Heortland there's really only a few river valleys through the plateau, and until you reach the Bandori River, where the plateau merges with Prax, there aren't any significant south-flowing rivers that might bleed into the Left Arm Islands.

[Erol of Backford]

4 hours ago, jajagappa said:

there aren't any significant south-flowing rivers that might bleed into the Left Arm Islands

I don't disagree but was imagining waterways moving through the marshes near Keystone and Landwall maybe like the mangroves in Florida with a few larger rock outcroppings or cap sandstone rock formation.

When will the Heartland book be out?! Can't wait. (My hard copy of Nochet shipped... ty for that.)

 

[jajagappa]

9 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

I don't disagree but was imagining waterways moving through the marshes near Keystone and Landwall maybe like the mangroves in Florida with a few larger rock outcroppings or cap sandstone rock formation.

Yes, very much what I picture for that region. The long peninsula is likely similar to more inland Florida with regular thunderstorms, heavy rains, but still solid land. But as you get to outlying areas you get into mangroves and then huge mats of floating grass "islands".

9 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

When will the Heartland book be out?! Can't wait. (My hard copy of Nochet shipped... ty for that.)

Hope you enjoy reading through Nochet when it arrives. As for Heortland - I can't tell you that as it's in Chaosium's hands, not a JC work.

[Joerg]

Not sure about mangrove monocultures in the marshes - not really compatible with bloodbirds and guardian cranes.

While I personally am utterly unfamiliar with the landscape, Chesapeake Bay offers a good parallel for the types of terrain from what I read.

[Erol of Backford]

Counted dozens of cranes in the mangroves north of Key Largo over Christmas... yes smaller but the bigger ones would eat larger fish in deeper water maybe, not sure about bloodbirds though?

[Erol of Backford]

So the PC's goes to the Century Tree (RQA 06 p.04) and somehow, Hero Quest possibly, comes back with a Shanassee Tree seed and yes of course one is half-elven and a Gardener in training...

Likely this happens after numerous pro-elf quests (working on gathering a list now) to make them worthy. Earlier I had posted some notes on elves possibly reforesting an area in southern Sun County along the Zola Fel Valley...

They are looking to plant it at or near the hamlet by the red arrow on the Heortland map a bit up stream from Backford (see clip below).

Is this village named in the Heoltland book and yes the river or stream is slightly extended to make the village on a water way, minor that it is. Was thinking the elven forest would help stem (this word keeps popping up today) the tide of the Jab Hills invasion much later in the Backford Campaign.  Again this is being developed as a 1600 start date campaign.

Is there a better location near Backford not on the Syphon in your mind to enact the ritual of growth (or whatever its called - what is it called where the elves want to reforest all of Glorantha) associated with the rebirth of a new elven forest?

There were scenarios about protecting elven groves one near Arrowmound I think and some others... does anyone recall where they were? (not Tarndisi’s Grove) There is also the scenario The New Grove on p.111 of the Eldar Races book which has good background but IIRC there were other scenarios, maybe in the new Rune Quest books protecting or assisting Elves?

Any thoughts - input appreciated!

  

[jajagappa]

4 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Is this village named in the Heoltland book and yes the river or stream is slightly extended to make the village on a water way, minor that it is.

Yes, it's called Newspring (as in a spring of water, not the season).

"Previously called Whitespring, the Pure Water clan renamed the town after a new spring opened in a nearby fissure after the Great Winter and the clan was blessed by its healing powers."

4 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Is there a better location near Backford not on the Syphon in your mind to enact the ritual of growth (or whatever its called - what is it called where the elves want to reforest all of Glorantha) associated with the rebirth of a new elven forest?

Note the village just to the right of the base/south end of your arrow. It is called Greenwood, probably a good choice.

"Greenwood is noted for its eponymous woods which remain green year-round, and for a nearby copper mine."

5 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

There is also the scenario The New Grove on p.111 of the Eldar Races book which has good background but IIRC there were other scenarios, maybe in the new Rune Quest books protecting or assisting Elves?

It's in the Smoking Ruins book: "The Grove of Green Rock".