Star Captains?

[Wheel Shield]

Star Captain

I have heard the words before. Thirty years ago a GM, Doug,  mentioned them and I asked what they were. I was told “sky people.” Doug was big into learning Glorantha by playing Runequest, so he never elaborated further and we drifted in different directions..

These days, I hear the term occasionally. I saw that a recent Jonstown Compenium scenario features a Star Captain. Cool. I might get it. That said, I started digging for what has been established in canon about star captains. There is surprisingly not much. I checked all the references in the Guide to Glorantha. Star Captains are almost always defined by their actions alone. For example, “Star Captains descended to help the tribes and look for followers in the Great Darkness.” That’s mostly it, but it’s repeated in different contexts. Nothing in the Index of The Glorantha Sourcebook. The Prosopaedia references folks being star captains, but doesn’t define them. I checked the Well of Dalaith and there were some very vague references that didn’t amount to much.

Sartar: Kingdom of Heroes (interestingly enough, since that is off the canon path) describes them very briefly as “minor Sky deities who descended to help out..” That’s a paraphrase not a quote, but it describes them as minor gods and everything else about them is based upon their actions only. Often times in these various brief references it doesn’t mention where they descended from, but I assume the Sky Dome. I’m not trying to be obtuse just making the point there is very little detail. And I’m not name dropping these books to be cool, but to say “I made the effort to try to find out myself.”

Finally I did a search here. I didn’t go back years and years, but the most recent discussion was a footnote in a conversation about Polestar’s cult presence in Sartar and very little of that pertains to star captains-except Polestar could be one. Just want to head that tangent off at the pass.

Sorry, long post. What can anybody tell me about these mysterious entities?

And I don’t want to tag Jeff, but would star captains be worthy of a few words or paragraphs in a future Solar Cult book? Or a Facebook post that becomes archived?

[Nick Brooke]

Polaris is more of a Star General, IYSWIM.

Think: heavenly warriors, descending from their celestial strongholds on high in the Darkness to defend mortals against the untold horrors of the Storm Age, when all of those unleashed trolls and water gods and barbarians and chaos gribblies were rushing around causing so many problems.

Shining armour, blazing weapons, and a fearless dedication to the fight. (No Prime Directive, that’s something else.)

They fought the good fight, they saved their people, and that’s why we still pray to them every night. (Other opinions exist.)

[Wheel Shield]

Well cool. They strike me as a good topic for an adventure or a heroquest. Get one as an ally, or to obtain some specialized power or rune spell. And obviously the initiative was taken to write a Jonstown Scenario.

[Nick Brooke]

Definitely pick up The Queen’s Star, it’s great stuff. A little pocket of the Other Side, smouldering away in the Cinder Pits since before Time began. I loved it!

[JRE]

Glorantha being as it is, I am surprised more people have not tried to repeat Kallyr's "get a cool star on your brow" quest. Maybe it is because she has always been an ambiguous figure, or that the sky is not always seen as friendly by the Orlanthi, but I am sure some people must know about it. Her actions fit with Nick's description, including the "other opinions exist" sidenote. Honestly I do not know if she embodies part of a star, or if she is the lover of one, and whether he (being the Sky as it is, I will dare say that all the Star Captains are male) is Rigsdal, Polestar, Polaris or some unnamed Star Captain.

[French Desperate WindChild]

1 hour ago, JRE said:

Glorantha being as it is, I am surprised more people have not tried to repeat Kallyr's "get a cool star on your brow" quest. Maybe it is because she has always been an ambiguous figure, or that the sky is not always seen as friendly by the Orlanthi, but I am sure some people must know about it. Her actions fit with Nick's description, including the "other opinions exist" sidenote. Honestly I do not know if she embodies part of a star, or if she is the lover of one, and whether he (being the Sky as it is, I will dare say that all the Star Captains are male) is Rigsdal, Polestar, Polaris or some unnamed Star Captain.

I m not surprised at all 🙂

I don't know why, maybe I missed some book, but :

 

- I see in enough details what could be Orlanth's hall  and how natives are (and I may be wrong -from canon-, don't, know, but I have an idea)

- I have no clear idea at (h)all what could be Yelm's palace and the sky in general, and how natives are. (Will the cults book answer ? I hope so)

 

So I understand @Wheel Shield

The only things I know (or I believe, do not hesitate to correct me) :

- they were sky's citizen,

- they saved some orlanthi people (culture),

- they took opportunity to enjoy orlanthi women (culture). How cold should be the sky for them

- and then they found orlanthi tribes. (culture and pantheon)

[M Helsdon]

Several cities have such entities as protectors, the most famous being Orlanth's birthplace, Whitewall, where Garan the Low Star, married Serias. One of the gates of Storos is guarded by another Star God.

[jajagappa]

15 hours ago, Wheel Shield said:

Finally I did a search here. I didn’t go back years and years, but the most recent discussion was a footnote in a conversation about Polestar’s cult presence in Sartar and very little of that pertains to star captains-except Polestar could be one.

As Nick noted above, Star Captains are stars (from the Sky Dome) who fell to the earth to save some remnant population during the Great Darkness. Pole Star, as the General of the Sky and choreographer of the Great Dance of the Sky, sometimes directs them. If you have the Red Book of Magic, check out the Call Shanasse and Summon Luxite spells. Luxites are more the common sky beings (remember atop the Sky Dome is a whole world of sky people), Shanasse are more powerful (think angelic beings). Star Captains are the next level up from that: demigods or minor gods.

[Wheel Shield]

5 hours ago, JRE said:

Glorantha being as it is, I am surprised more people have not tried to repeat Kallyr's "get a cool star on your brow" quest. Maybe it is because she has always been an ambiguous figure, or that the sky is not always seen as friendly by the Orlanthi, but I am sure some people must know about it. Her actions fit with Nick's description, including the "other opinions exist" sidenote. Honestly I do not know if she embodies part of a star, or if she is the lover of one, and whether he (being the Sky as it is, I will dare say that all the Star Captains are male) is Rigsdal, Polestar, Polaris or some unnamed Star Captain.

I didn’t think to look harder at Kallyr. Duh. Which I guess is missing the forest for the trees cause she’s got a star on her forehead. It never occurred to me that she could be the lover of a Star captain or Rigsdal / Polestar.

it might be that I had a masculine orlanthi mindset of “go to the Hero Plane and steal someone’s powers.” Interesting. As you’ll see a post I plan to make, looking at Kallyr leads me to some lore disclosed in 2020.

[Squaredeal Sten]

3 hours ago, M Helsdon said:

Several cities have such entities as protectors, the most famous being Orlanth's birthplace, Whitewall, where Garan the Low Star, married Serias. One of the gates of Storos is guarded by another Star God.

?  I thought Orlanth's birthplace was Kero Fin.  That's his mother, but she is also a mountain and mountains don't travel around.

[Wheel Shield]

4 hours ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

- I see in enough details what could be Orlanth's hall  and how natives are (and I may be wrong -from canon-, don't, know, but I have an idea)

- I have no clear idea at (h)all what could be Yelm's palace and the sky in general, and how natives are. (Will the cults book answer ? I hope so)

 

So I understand @Wheel Shield

The only things I know (or I believe, do not hesitate to correct me) :

- they were sky's citizen,

- they saved some orlanthi people (culture),

- they took opportunity to enjoy orlanthi women (culture). How cold should be the sky for them

- and then they found orlanthi tribes. (culture and pantheon)

I share the feeling that I could imagine Orlanth’s Hall but have a much more vague (or nonexistent) notion of what exists in the Sky. I guess I jump right to Yelm’s throne. I dunno, I guess I find the idea of heroic star heroes at some lower point in solar hierarchy to be intriguing. Hence my interest in star captains. Truth be told I haven’t been as interested in the Sky pantheon until I started pulling on this thread.

 

@all Solar Tribe and Sky Tribe (euphemisms) are the same thing, right? There’s no difference, right?

[Wheel Shield]

5 minutes ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

?  I thought Orlanth's birthplace was Kero Fin.  That's his mother, but she is also a mountain and mountains don't travel around.

I share the same question Sten!

Martin’s comment about Star entities being guardians of Orlanthi cities is interesting too. The references in the Guide about star captains fall to Golarion to save people.. why I assumed that meant people / folk friendly to the Sky.

[M Helsdon]

10 minutes ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

?  I thought Orlanth's birthplace was Kero Fin.  That's his mother, but she is also a mountain and mountains don't travel around.

Yes you are correct.

[M Helsdon]

4 minutes ago, Wheel Shield said:

Golarion to save people.. 

Wrong game.

[Wheel Shield]

1 hour ago, jajagappa said:

As Nick noted above, Star Captains are stars (from the Sky Dome) who fell to the earth to save some remnant population during the Great Darkness. Pole Star, as the General of the Sky and choreographer of the Great Dance of the Sky, sometimes directs them. If you have the Red Book of Magic, check out the Call Shanasse and Summon Luxite spells. Luxites are more the common sky beings (remember atop the Sky Dome is a whole world of sky people), Shanasse are more powerful (think angelic beings). Star Captains are the next level up from that: demigods or minor gods.

While catching up on this thread I discovered some interesting lore about Kallyr that you helped archive, jajagappa. At least, your comment led to it. Some Jeff notes (and I assume not formally published yet). It doesn’t say a lot about Star captains but it does give insights.

 

Jajagappa points to Jeff’s FB notes on Kallyr

why not just quote FB directly? Not everyone wants to go on FB, so I used an available alternative

[Wheel Shield]

5 minutes ago, M Helsdon said:

8 minutes ago, M Helsdon said:

Wrong game.

Yeah yeah. I used to freelance for that game. That’s likely to happen with me for a long time. Be assured I know we’re talking about Glorantha.

[Darius West]

In the Preview Edition of Gods of Glorantha, the Polaris cult has the ability to summon Luxites, who are Star People, and also mentions that Star Captains include the likes of Marble Phalanx and Granite Phalanx, being the regimental deities and perhaps wyters of those organizations.  The Star Captains are listed as being subservient cults to Polaris.  The Star Witches of Prax also have some ability to summon Luxites at least I suspect.

[jajagappa]

2 hours ago, Wheel Shield said:

I share the feeling that I could imagine Orlanth’s Hall but have a much more vague (or nonexistent) notion of what exists in the Sky. I guess I jump right to Yelm’s throne. I dunno, I guess I find the idea of heroic star heroes at some lower point in solar hierarchy to be intriguing. Hence my interest in star captains. Truth be told I haven’t been as interested in the Sky pantheon until I started pulling on this thread.

 

@all Solar Tribe and Sky Tribe (euphemisms) are the same thing, right? There’s no difference, right?

The constellations (as noted in the Guide v.2) give you a sense of the "big" landscape of the Sky World. There's a great celestial river (the Sky River) that goes across it. There's the central "City" where Pole Star resides (and is above the zenith of the Sun's arc). There's a Forest, there's Fields, there's a Desert, and some other sites. If you traveled there you'd likely find some other features invisible to the world below. All is very ordered of course. And Shargash and his allies scout the land for signs of rebels/troublemakers. And higher up there is the Celestial Choir singing endless praises to Dayzatar who is at the peak of the dome above the Sky Dome.

Note that the Sun does not enter the Sky World but travels just below it.

Generally, Solar Tribe most commonly refers to various mortals on the surface world, not in the Sky. It would include the Dara Happans, the Pentans, the Grazelanders, Teshnos, and usually Kralorela. 

Sky Tribe usually refers to denizens of the Sky World.

[Wheel Shield]

@Darius West this preview edition, was it a convention special release?

[Wheel Shield]

Thank you Jajagappa! I’ll check that section!

[Scotty]

2 hours ago, Wheel Shield said:

Jajagappa points to Jeff’s FB notes on Kallyr

why not just quote FB directly? Not everyone wants to go on FB, so I used an available alternative

Note that Jeff's Facebook notes are archived on the Well of Daliath and as such are searchable or just go to Latest posts and browse.

eg: https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/kallyr-starbrow/

23 minutes ago, Wheel Shield said:

@Darius West this preview edition, was it a convention special release?

There were a few convention special releases.

 

[Darius West]

On 7/22/2023 at 12:59 AM, Wheel Shield said:

@Darius West this preview edition, was it a convention special release?

Yes it is.  I expect the forthcoming release to be similar but not necessarily the same.