King Rikard the Tiger-Hearted

[Erol of Backford]

From the GTG King Rikard the Tiger-Hearted: This redoubtable adventurer, freebooter, and heretical Hrestoli exile from Tanisor... Noncanonical, TT05 .p15 it says he's the younger son of the count of Estaurenic and is accodmpaied by Montanmpein who isn't mentioned anywhere that I am able to find... 

Is there any other information on Rikard prior to his coming to the Heortland Plateau? We assume he speaks Seshnegi which is spoken in the Kingdom of Tanisor. His family would have been traditionally enemies of Seshnela and its noted that the Rokari rule Tanisor and Seshnela.

The kings of Tanisor have titled themselves King of Seshnela since 1413 (GtG) how is Rikard related to any royal family and why was he exiled as the TT 05 says only that he got into hot water in Tiskos?

Also, I thought he was betrayed by Mularik but the GTG rewrites the Trade Tak 05 history of Ricard's by saying that after being defeated by the Lunars, Wideread offered Rikard the kingship, but rather than accept Rikard destroyed his crown and went into hiding and no one knows where he is now?

Lots of good stuff in Trade talk 05 on the Heortland Plateau but not canon...

Would love to know more.

[metcalph]

The story of Rikard breaking the crown into four pieces comes from King of Sartar p122 (2nd edition, was present in first).  The Guide did not rewrite anything and asking questions about the tradetalk article just wastes time.  

Why would his family have been traditional enemies of Seshnela?  All that is said that he comes from Tanisor which is the current heart of Seshnela!

Given that the Guide p249 describes him as a "heretical Hrestoli exile", he is not necessarily related to the Royal Family and may not even be a noble at all.  If there was a Tiger warrior society in Seshnela (created by Teshnan immigrants during the Imperial Age), then he could have been a horali leader who decided to seek his fortune aboard.  That would fit in better with the description of him as an adventurer.

The Lost Chapter (KoS p138) has Rikard accepting rule over all Heortland but breaking his oaths and escaping shortly afterwards.  

[jajagappa]

3 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Is there any other information on Rikard prior to his coming to the Heortland Plateau?

Generally, no. However, this is the short writeup from the Heortland book: "Born 1587 in Tanisor, this redoubtable opportunist founded the short-lived kingdom of Malkonwal. Exiled from his homelands for heretical views, Rikard was a wandering mercenary until entering the service of Governor Orngerin. When Belintar disappeared, and the governor died, Rikard proclaimed himself King of Malkonwal and married an Esvulari noblewoman, Igraine Dosavalan."

Also, have a look at the Pharaoh's Gazette section in the Stafford House Campaign. King "Uther" became Rikard in subsequent works. His betrayer there is noted as "Marshall Kayan" - an otherwise unknown figure, but presumably is the warrior champion who accompanied him from the west.

The reference to his fight with the Lunars is also in the Glorantha Sourcebook. Also of relevance there is:

Sir Narib: An adventurer from Pithdaros, Narib was once a sorcerer in the service of King Rikard of Malkonwal. When his king fled from the Lunar Empire in 1620, Narib formed a “company” with the surviving sorcerers; Sir Narib’s company found its way to Esrolia. He entered Argrath’s service after the Battle of Pennel Ford.

Mularik has a totally separate origin (as per Glorantha Sourcebook p.44).

3 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

the GTG rewrites the Trade Tak 05 history of Ricard's by saying that after being defeated by the Lunars, Wideread offered Rikard the kingship, but rather than accept Rikard destroyed his crown and went into hiding and no one knows where he is now?

The Guide doesn't "rewrite" Rikard's history as there is no prior work to rewrite. Tradetalk 5 is fan-published, so entirely non-canonical.

Guide and Sourcebook note Rikard's defeat by Fazzur. Fazzur does attempt to cement Rikard as a Lunar puppet, which per the story Rikard rejects.

What my Heortland work concludes with is: "The Esvulari celebrated Rikard as the Philosopher King, but in 1620, he was betrayed, defeated, and captured by the Lunar Army, and taken to Boldhome. General Fazzur hoped that Rikard might be a useful puppet in Heortland, but Rikard refused. Most believe that Rikard was sent as a prisoner to Glamour.  His fate is unknown."

The general consensus is that Rikard is sent as a prisoner to the Lunar Empire, most likely Glamour (but possibly Furthest), and is specifically sent to the Monster Coliseum to fight as a gladiator. Likely he simply meets his death there. But... MGF for your game may dictate otherwise. Overall, though, after 1620 he is irrelevant for Heortland. There are those after 1625 who may still seek to forge a New Kingdom of Malkonwal with a Philosopher King, but they'll have to survive Gagix to do so.

 

[Nick Brooke]

In our 1994 freeform How the West was One, Richard the Tiger-hearted turns up in 1625 among the imperial Lunar delegation sent to liberate Malkionism via the Seventh Ecclesiastical Council in Sog City, because we like putting these loose ends to work. (Sir Gerard de Montampein was another character from that freeform, whose details and indeed spelling elude me for the moment, but from memory he may have been doing a Blondel for his lost King to tie our Heortland/Aeolian, Seshnegi/Rokari and Lunar/Carmanian threads together). Tradetalk #5 came out in 1998. This is, of course, part of a massive body of non-canonical works exploring the mediæval Malkioni West that long predates the Guide to Glorantha.

[Erol of Backford]

18 hours ago, metcalph said:

Rikard breaking the crown into four pieces

I like that, never heard before.

18 hours ago, metcalph said:

The Guide did not rewrite anything and asking questions about the tradetalk article just wastes time. 

YGWV, I love Joerg's article which we gamed for several years in the 90's. We'll will keep Ironeye as the one who turns Rikard over to the Lunars even not canon.

17 hours ago, jajagappa said:

Uther

I read this when I received it but didn't know Uther was Rikard, makes sense now after changing his name. PHARAOH’S GAZETTE - rereading now, good stuff in there...

17 hours ago, jajagappa said:

fight as a gladiator

Just like Cormac the Pict but he escapes... maybe Rikard will as well and reappear down the road in our campaign in 5 real life years!?

Edited September 15, 2023 by Erol of Backford

[Erol of Backford]

11 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

Sir Gerard de Montampein was another character from that freeform

You forgot our favorite champion of orphans (YGMV) and protector of Aeolian rights, Gwydion of Sklar. It was noted by Joerg IIRC, again not canon, that he went with Sir Gerard de Montampein to the Council and that Montampein might have been Rikard's companion from childhood, I'll have to look again at that...

Another add from that article is that Rikard and the du Tumerine's don't like the Aeolians or at least steal their pagan ornamentation from the shrines... this along with other things sends Gwydion to the hills for a bit...

This is all great stuff for us. (I wonder if he's wearing one of those plastic samurai haircut caps the Japanese comedians wear?)

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by Erol of Backford

[M Helsdon]

There are speculations about Rikard's fate (only a sentence or so) in my latest Jonstown Compendium book.

[Nick Brooke]

I sometimes worry that Joerg has never forgiven us for borrowing the name “Sir Gui de Liombard” from MPHG without telling him.

[Jeff]

I hate to disappoint folk but Rikard falls into the Roussel de Bailleul category. Rikard was a mercenary and adventurer who took advantage of the collapse the Holy Country to carve out his own little principality, which he enthusiastically called the Kingdom of Malkonwal (after the legendary city founded by Malkion after his expulsion from Brithos). His rule lasted from 1617-1620 and I strongly doubt it established deep roots. I seriously doubt that there are folk just waiting for his return five years later. 

Rikard can be an inspiration for players who want to carve out their own kingdoms, like some sort of Proto-Conan. An inspiration and a cautionary tale. Things in the Holy Country are pretty unstable for years, and there will be principalities to carve out of Tarsh and the Lunar Provinces.

[Erol of Backford]

23 hours ago, Jeff said:

I hate to disappoint folk

No disappointment, I never liked Rikard, just curious what drove him from his homeland, What's going on in Rinland and Tiskos and with his family say 1600-1605 as if the PC's were to meet him before he travels east there could be some good plot building for future... maybe they meet him and see his pompous demeaning attitude and side against him early on only to see him come to the Heortland, exile some of their own family and steal the holy of holies from their temples!?

Wonderful foreshadowing especially if they are in or near Istakax or the Sun Dome to its northeast... maybe the sword Trollbiter surfaces, maybe the characters do a scenario similar to Growing Pains...

Not an inspiration but an antagonist... its good campaign material. Thank you Mr. Richard.

On 9/15/2023 at 1:16 PM, Nick Brooke said:

I sometimes worry that Joerg has never forgiven us

Again some of his writing in the 90's only strengthened our resolve that Rune Quest was the best, canon or not, its strength was that it was always open to personal interpretation.

Edited September 16, 2023 by Erol of Backford

[Joerg]

11 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

I sometimes worry that Joerg has never forgiven us for borrowing the name “Sir Gui de Liombard” from MPHG without telling him.

 

Why do you think I never noticed? But I guess I missed including a Star Captain vessel in my Vita Broyani.

 

There seems to be at least one lasting consequence of RIkard's reign - the name Malkonwal seems to have stuck on southern Heortland.

Edited September 16, 2023 by Joerg

[Erol of Backford]

23 hours ago, Jeff said:

Rikard can be an inspiration for players who want to carve out their own kingdoms, like some sort of Proto-Conan. An inspiration and a cautionary tale. Things in the Holy Country are pretty unstable for years, and there will be principalities to carve out of Tarsh and the Lunar Provinces.

The lead PC whom is the daughter of a Caprati and the Erol of Backford is set to take over as things settle down, she is a Larnsting, not completely sure how this will work but she has a birthmark...

She'll end up leading the Company of the Dragon, of course she has red hair and will end up riding in on a dragon that roasts Gagix which will increase her popularity and help her unite the various province/regions/clans of the Heortland Plateau as one New Malkonwal when things cool off after Gagix or so we are thinking but this is a long term campaign which will take several years...

[metcalph]

On 9/16/2023 at 5:15 AM, Erol of Backford said:

Another add from that article is that Rikard and the du Tumerine's don't like the Aeolians or at least steal their pagan ornamentation from the shrines... this along with other things sends Gwydion to the hills for a bit...

I don't think this is plausible.  Rikard didn't bring an army with him and for him to persecute the Aeolians doesn't make much political sense and more importantly, the modern understanding of Malkioni (ie not Christians), he really wouldn't care about such things.  His wizard(s) might grumble but Rikard can take an indugent view of their differences.

[Joerg]

For a while, Greg was talking and writing about the Army of Tomorrow, a regimental order of men-of-all with ten chapters in total, one of which (of about 100 core members, and up to 10 times the number of mercenary followers) active in the Holy Country and Dragon Pass. The rest probably roaming Ralios and Maniria.

[Erol of Backford]

12 hours ago, metcalph said:

Rikard didn't bring an army with him and for him to persecute the Aeolians doesn't make much political sense and more importantly, the modern understanding of Malkioni (ie not Christians), he really wouldn't care about such things. 

He brought an "enlarged company" of knights with him which from 1615 to 1619 grew in size or so we suppose over those years as sides are chosen due to the power vacuum and with exiles from Sartar.

One thing not asked was when is he first reported in the Holy Country, Trade Talk 05 shows him with his Seshnegi knights being sent the Praxian Marches of Heortland in 1615 via Nochet... where was he based from say 1615 before the power vacuum...

So he and his company goes to the Marches, (not canon but again gives him a starting point) guessing to be Knight Fort but not sure as it could be Exile Stead as well? At Knight Fort He grows his company further with exiled Sartaites and then comes back to the Plateau when the time is right to set up New Malkionwal.

He does care about filling his coffers to fund New Malkionwal... and to that point we like the idea that Rikard begins confiscating "pagan" idols, etc. made of gold, silver, gems, thus being able to hire more mercenaries, likely some displaced Sartarites and anyone who is roaming or not wishing to be left out. Really what are Orlanthi serfs doing with all that money anyway?

6 hours ago, Joerg said:

Army of Tomorrow, a regimental order of men-of-all with ten chapters in total, one of which (of about 100 core members, and up to 10 times the number of mercenary followers)

Ricard's "enlarged company" of knights is about 100 plus their squires/attendants, whatever with hired mercenaries under their command they could easily total 1,500. If he continued to add to his numbers from 1615 to 1617 when he seizes control.

GtG 1617 (7/46): The Governor of Heortland dies performing a ritual, resulting in civil strife. Malkioni adventurers invade. We are guessing they come from the Marches?

So he proclaims himself “King of Malkonwal” with the Esvularings backing him. He defeated the rebellious Uroxi Bullmen of the Footprint and a series of indecisive skirmishes are fought with Broyan.

In 1619 

Lunars and than battles with them, as I understood, having great losses on both sides, so he must have had a formidable force, easily enough to ride into smaller town and even larger one's, enter temples and confiscate such valuable items. If he didn't have a few thousand how did he manage to fight all those battles?

Anyone guess as to the size of the forces that skirmished on the Plateau prior to the Lunas arriving?

I had to add this... after hearing he destroyed his crown...

Edited September 17, 2023 by Erol of Backford

[metcalph]

15 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

He brought an "enlarged company" of knights with him which from 1615 to 1619 grew in size or so we suppose over those years as sides are chosen due to the power vacuum and with exiles from Sartar.

An enlarged company is what 100-200 fighters.  The Esvularings are something like 100K (History of the Heortling Peoples p86) and would have at least a thousand professional warriors.  If Rikard is recruiting exiles from Sartar, then those exiles would be unlikely Malkioni purists willing to trash Aeolian shrines.  Moreover the Guide actually points out the Aeolians supported Rikard (p247) which is something they wouldn't do if he was oppressing them).

 

15 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

So he and his company goes to the Marches, (not canon but again gives him a starting point) guessing to be Knight Fort but not sure as it could be Exile Stead as well? At Knight Fort He grows his company further with exiled Sartaites and then comes back to the Plateau when the time is right to set up New Malkionwal.

Knight Fort is upriver from the Monkey Ruins (RQG p135).  Since it is not present in the Guide, it's not around as of 1621 and probably was established later.

 

15 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

He does care about filling his coffers to fund New Malkionwal... and to that point we like the idea that Rikard begins confiscating "pagan" idols, etc. made of gold, silver, gems, thus being able to hire more mercenaries, likely some displaced Sartarites and anyone who is roaming or not wishing to be left out. Really what are Orlanthi serfs doing with all that money anyway?

Who is we?  Also you are shifting from the original notion of cleansing *Aeolian* shrines of pagan idols to seizing idols of the Orlanthi (ie non-Aeolians).  Which the big problem is this: according to you, Rikard has recruited Orlanthi exiles from Sartar whose attitude towards pagan shrines would be rather reverential.  So I'm not really seeing any looting the temples to pay for mercenaries.  

 

15 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

In 1619  Lunars and than battles with them, as I understood, having great losses on both sides, so he must have had a formidable force, easily enough to ride into smaller town and even larger one's, enter temples and confiscate such valuable items. If he didn't have a few thousand how did he manage to fight all those battles?

There's circular reasoning going on here.  Rikard must have a formidable force to loot the temples.  But if he didn't loot the temples, he doesn't need such a formable force does he?

But a better way of looking at this would be to look at the Holy Country army.  Heortland has a population of 300k people.  Assuming 1% professional warriors and another 9% tribal militia, that gives 3k professional warriors and another 27k militia.  Rikard is King so can command these troops using the traditional methods (he's got the support of the Aeolians who used to run Heortland for Belintar).    Even allowing for dissatisfaction with his rule and other commitments (guarding against Praxian raiders etc), he should still be able to muster an army of 20k without needing to loot any temples.

 

[M Helsdon]

On 9/15/2023 at 6:15 PM, Erol of Backford said:

Another add from that article is that Rikard and the du Tumerine's don't like the Aeolians or at least steal their pagan ornamentation from the shrines... this along with other things sends Gwydion to the hills for a bit...

And thereby incites much of the population of his 'kingdom' against him, given that in the local culture the Invisible God is depicted as a crowned god with thirteen heads. Of the heads, Lhankor Mhy is represented among the eight Powers, and Orlanth (deemed His most imperative emanation) and Ernalda among the four Elements. 

[Picture by Katrin Dirim from my latest JC book.]

Edited September 18, 2023 by M Helsdon

[Jeff]

So it is probably worth starting from what is actually published about Rikard the Tiger-Hearted in the Guide to Glorantha:

King Rikard the Tiger-Hearted: This redoubtable adventurer, freebooter, and heretical Hrestoli exile from Tanisor briefly became King of Malkonwal by conquering the various Orlanthi tribes of southern Heortland, taking advantage of their terrible disorder after the loss of both Belintar and the governor of Heortland. Few of the Orlanthi favored the foreign conqueror, and he was recently defeated and captured in battle by the Lunar Provincial Army. Fazzur Wideread offered Rikard the kingship, but rather than accept Rikard destroyed his crown and went into hiding. His current whereabouts are unknown.

And elsewhere in that chapter:

That same year (1617), the foreign mercenary captain Rikard the Tiger-Hearted proclaimed himself “King of Malkonwal” with the aid of the Esvularings. Once king, Rikard defeated a rebellion by the Uroxi Bullmen of the Footprint and he and Broyan fought a series of indecisive skirmishes.

So what we know is that he was a Hrestoli, not a Rokari - a heretic that was exiled from Tanisor and became an adventurer and freebooter, and then exploited the disorder of 1616 to carve out a new (and very short-lived) kingdom with the support of the Esvularings. The Aeolians, despite being no more than about 10% of the population, had prospered under Belintar's rule and feared the instability of Orlanthi tribalism and Lunar conquest - and so they were amendable to having Rikard and his followers as a strong-man protector. But without the Esvularing support, Rikard would have gotten nowhere.

The Storm Bull cultists of the Footprint quarrelled with Rikard (less a theological quarrel and more the fact that the Storm Bull cult are violent fanatics who care only about fighting whatever is in the Footprint - making them an obvious threat to the nascent kingdom), and Rikard dispersed their camps (which of course meant that the Print was no longer sufficiently guarded). He quarrelled with the chief of Whitewall who was making his own bid for tribal leadership. And most importantly, he was defeated in battle in 1620 by the Lunar Army and captured. And that was the end of his kingdom. He failed the Esvularings and actually brought about exactly what they feared - I don't expect there is any nostalgia for his return.

If we now look at Heortland in the post-Dragonrise era, there is a political vacuum after the death of King Broyan (who was the leading figure 1621-1625). Scorpionmen bands ravage the villages and towns around the Print. Whitewall looks to the Sartarites for leadership. The Wolf Pirates are able to raid and plunder at will. 

[Erol of Backford]

14 hours ago, metcalph said:

Moreover the Guide actually points out the Aeolians supported Rikard (p247) which is something they wouldn't do if he was oppressing them).

We looked at that and decided that the rural Orlanthi who may/may not be Aeolians would be the ones relieved of their golden idols for the most part... we got this from Trade Talk 05 p.13. Gwydion is declared outlaw after protesting a royal decree (assumed to be made by Rikard) to remove all pagan ornaments from Invisible God churches. (YGMV)

This pits some of the Aeolians along with the disgruntled Orlanthi and any remaining Storm Bulls in the mountains against the forces of Rikard. Maybe its only a few hundred but they likely join forces with Broyan against Rikard possibly?

Regardless Rikard invaded (GtG p.240) which could be paralleled with the Nazis moving into Czechoslovakia or something similar, Rikard is an usurper. Sure some Czech were German but did they all want the Nazis there, did some object or flee? Sure they did. We can easily see where some Aeolians that have objected, were slighted or that had been close to their neighbor-Orlanthi objected and even revolted...

Of course we'll have to work on it a bit more but it's shaping up nicely as a hybrid of the GtG and old zines which we cherish as Gloranthian Dogma!? LOL

15 hours ago, metcalph said:

Who is we?

Our RQ group from the 90's... mostly me for now but with some old timer input from afar.

15 hours ago, metcalph said:

Also you are shifting from the original notion of cleansing *Aeolian* shrines of pagan idols to seizing idols of the Orlanthi (ie non-Aeolians). 

Not shifting, still thinking Rikard takes pagan idols, especially from rural areas, basically looting. Also Orlanthi from Sartar who'll work for a Meldek are not religious high rollers, they'll basically be bandits. Those true Orlanthi patrons would be at Whitewall or somehow engaging the Lunars in or on the fringes of Sartar.

15 hours ago, metcalph said:

There's circular reasoning going on here.  Rikard must have a formidable force to loot the temples.  But if he didn't loot the temples, he doesn't need such a formable force does he?

He grows his forces from 1615 and when the time is right "Invades" to fill the power vacuum, makes the decree to loot the pagan idols, etc. and continues to grow with the loot, if not how did he obtain so many mercenaries to fight the Lunars... yes filling in some blanks and still have not read everything related on line.

15 hours ago, metcalph said:

Heortland has a population of 300k people. 

Just over double that: Heortland... 628,000 GtG.

15 hours ago, metcalph said:

Rikard is King so can command these troops using the traditional methods (he's got the support of the Aeolians who used to run Heortland for Belintar). 

He made himself king and so the question is would all the 10-20k troops suddenly say "he's are man" and pin a medal on him? Not all of them like him as noted above (YGWV) again he's a usurper. We are using Gwydion which I hope is included in the upcoming Heortland Book (I thought Jaja was working on one) as the Caprati were included in the Nochet publication! Gwydion (not canon of course) is declared outlaw and it all works out.

15 hours ago, metcalph said:

Even allowing for dissatisfaction with his rule and other commitments (guarding against Praxian raiders etc), he should still be able to muster an army of 20k without needing to loot any temples.

I'd say half that would fight if all of them agreed to him being king. They still need to garrison, protect from the Print, Jab Hills and of course can't leave the coasts unprotected and what about the troops massing south of the border? Some troops need to be there to check invasion plans... others to skirmish with Bryon Evidently there were not enough troops deployed there as there was still an invasion from there as well. IIRC only the bandori were left alone by the Lunars, they I may not have that right... so maybe the Aoelian/Orlanthi/Storm Bull dissidents in the Storm Walk Mts. number no more than 1-2,000 they need to reckoned with as Rikard's forces are divided or so I believe they would be?

Possibly he only loots the temples of the areas not giving him support?

11 hours ago, M Helsdon said:

And thereby incites much of the population of his 'kingdom' against him

Per discussions above and comments made by Mr. Metcalph it wouldn't be much/most it'd be the unsupportive dissidents. I do like the illustration, what is the title?

10 hours ago, Jeff said:

The Aeolians, despite being no more than about 10% of the population, had prospered under Belintar's rule and feared the instability of Orlanthi tribalism and Lunar conquest - and so they were amendable to having Rikard and his followers as a strong-man protector. But without the Esvularing support, Rikard would have gotten nowhere.

This is fine and works for me... and so am saying only a small group of dissidents are hiding up in the hills/mountains.

GtG p.249 Few of the Orlanthi favored the foreign conqueror... and so this gives good evidence that there was some rebellion against Rikard... not unlike Sartar.

In my Glorantha the Aeolians were benevolent administrators up until 1617 or so when things began to crumble. 

Steps in Rikard, declears Orlanthi serfs (non canon) and wants to purify the Malkioni temples at the urging of the De Tumerine Bishop in Nochet. (all non canon but have so much potential for subplots with one of the PC's being a Caprati and 2 other PC's raised in an orphanage sponsored by Bishop Gwydion who is in 1618 declared outlaw. Trade Talk 05 p.15. yes again non canon but if someone writes him into a future publication well then...

I really appreciate all the input here, canon or not lots to think about.

 

 

 

 

 

[Nick Brooke]

YGWV. Your story sounds like fun, so roll with it and don’t engage with quibblers. (My own Malkioni are still mediæval, just like Greg’s.)

[M Helsdon]

8 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Per discussions above and comments made by Mr. Metcalph it wouldn't be much/most it'd be the unsupportive dissidents. I do like the illustration, what is the title?

In Glorantha, despoiling shrines would be quite hazardous due to temple guardian spirits. Even the Lunars seem to have tended to close temples rather than wreck them, with some obvious exceptions. Unless a shrine or temple is very rich, whilst a cultic statue might have some precious decoration, most will be of wood, stone, or terracotta, and a rural shrine in Heortland won't be very rich.

The results would very likely be similar to what happened to Brennus when he attempted loot the rich treasury of the sanctuary of Apollo at Delphi, but worse.

This is the Aeolian depiction of the Invisible God.

[Joerg]

When the idea of orthodox Malkioni was introduced, it was riffing of the waves of iconoclasm that made the ostentatious orthodox-catholic church tremble, or the similar movements during the Reformation era, or the re-design of Christian churches into mosques. The latter with its offerings of calligraphy of the holy text in place of previous idols probably is the best approach, a replacement of sacred foci by a different type of sacred focus.

There must have been something similar going on in the temples of Seshnela following the victories of Bailifes - forceful removal of idols of ascended masters from the temples to the Invisible God, the editing of Abiding Book scripture in the ornamentation - whether written or pictorial - down to the licensed selection from the holy text as extracted by Rokar. In recently re-conquered city-states of Safelster this may have been less of an issue after Ulianus II had extended the Bailifide domain enforcing the philosophy of Leplain to its maximum extent.

The upcoming seventh Ecclesiastical conclave seems to target the wizards rather than their places of worship, but those may simply follow.

[jajagappa]

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

Regardless Rikard invaded (GtG p.240) which could be paralleled with the Nazis moving into Czechoslovakia or something similar, Rikard is an usurper.

You can't really look at it in that light where there were defined national boundaries.

Most of Heortland was under the direct rule of Belintar and his governors for 3 centuries - that's all of Heortland, though with occasional Volsaxi rebels in the north. There were no tribes, no borders, or similar within. Belintar as a god-king could appear in each and every temple on the holy days simultaneously - all of Heortland was close to the God Plane up until 1616.

Then Belintar is slain/disappears. In the magical backlash of the Tournament, Governor Orngerin dies. It is into this vacuum that Rikard enters, as does Broyan. They both try to fulfill the role of the governor, but neither succeeds at this point.

There is no usurpation as there is no one to usurp, no tribes to conquer. What both Rikard and Broyan attempt to do is position themselves as Rex/King of the land - and there are old ways of doing so that pre-date Belintar.

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

We are using Gwydion which I hope is included in the upcoming Heortland Book (I thought Jaja was working on one) as the Caprati were included in the Nochet publication! Gwydion (not canon of course) is declared outlaw and it all works out.

No Gwydion, no bishops, etc. That's all part of a tangent that did not fit the development of the Aeolian culture. 

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

In my Glorantha the Aeolians were benevolent administrators up until 1617 or so when things began to crumble. 

Belintar certainly favored the Aeolians as governors on the whole, and likely within for the collection of tribute and the like. 

16 hours ago, Erol of Backford said:

yes again non canon but if someone writes him into a future publication well then...

As Nick also notes, YGWV, so adopt what works for you. 

7 hours ago, M Helsdon said:

despoiling shrines would be quite hazardous due to temple guardian spirits

This is the danger of trying to gather up items from temples - temple wyters, guardians, and spirits all kick into play. And do you have wizards (who are the priests of the Invisible God - and in the Aeolian school, they steadfastly accept the Lightbringers and main Storm deities as emanations of the Invisible God) who would actively support and attempt to suppress such? While Rikard could theoretically invoke his position as Talar to command obedience, it would be far easier to simply take over the palace treasury of Durengard if you need loot (and loot in quantity) than trying to get little bits of loot here and there across Heortland. 

 

[Erol of Backford]

14 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

My own Malkioni are still mediæval, just like Greg’s.

Chainmail and kite shields, what's not to like!

9 hours ago, M Helsdon said:

a rural shrine in Heortland won't be very rich

Ok we'll change it to cow taxes, stolen virgins, press-ganged sons, whatever reason, its to set up Rikard as a noble with little thought for Orlanthi and there use besides being a serf. I think there was even a sword hunt he conducted in one old fan zine and so we may throw that in there as well...

8 hours ago, Joerg said:

Reformation era

Wittenberg's Castle Church, I'll have it that Gwydion nails his protest of Rikard's policies on the Cathedral at Mt. Passant!? What fun! (I know it doesn't look like that in bronze age Glorantha but it could be adjusted to be more Mediterranean? What do the Aeolian temples/shrines look like on the Plateau and in say Nochet? (new thread...)

1 hour ago, jajagappa said:

This is the danger of trying to gather up items from temples - temple wyters, guardians, and spirits all kick into play.

As stated above, cow taxes, stolen virgins, press-ganged sons... avoid the wyters, guardians and spirits, simple enough.

Thank you again everyone.

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, Erol of Backford said:

its to set up Rikard as a noble with little thought for Orlanthi and there use besides being a serf.

It's not a matter of being a serf - remember that the Aeolians don't have serfs either, but one Commoner caste which includes the warriors, and as the Aeolian Commoners choose their noble lord (ostensibly), they might equally be unlikely to go along with something that freedom restricting (and doesn't seem to fit the Hrestoli model that Rikard comes from).

What could well be different, though, is that Rikard is a Talar (and all that implies). And the Aeolians recognize this, even though he is from a noble family outside the Aeolian heritage. Rikard simply has to consider/show himself as: 1) a Talar; 2) the natural successor to Governor Orngerin (and I think he does this in the Tournament of Luck and Death by gaining pieces of the regalia of the King of Heortland - Broyan does, too, though, hence their conflict). That largely gets Aeolian support.

What Rikard then can do is: 1) simply find that no one in central Heortland is of the Talar caste; 2) declare himself both King of Heortland (he has the regalia which the Heortland clans recognize) and Talar over those clans; and 3) require the tribute due to the Governor for himself.  Who that most prominently impacts is not the Commoners of Heortland, but the clan leaders! They aren't "noble Talars" and therefore may be stripped of their leadership in the Orlanth cult (because under the Aeolian model, IMO, only Talars can be Rune priests/lords of Orlanth).