Tigerwomble Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 The Glorantha Sourcebook states the following concerning Dragonewts - The dragonewts appear in several different shapes, although they claim all of them are one species. It has been generally agreed that the various forms of dragonewt are different stages of development, but this is unproved. The article then goes on to describe the dragonewts as if the different stages are the truth. The ambiguity is completely discarded. Are the descriptions of the different stages, EWF text making the assumption that their conclusions are correct? Whilst the sentence stating development stages to be 'unproved', is the game narrator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psullie Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Current thoughts on Dragonewts is a theory accepted by most as truth, but like all theories is open to challenge once more data is collected I'm sure Glorantha has it's dragonewt deniers along with the round earthers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonh Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 The Dragonewts believe they reincarnate through the stages enough that they will even commit Utuma in order to aid their personal progress. Also humans have met dragonewts of later stages that seem to have clear memories and personality traits of dragonewts they had previously met in earlier stages. Most humans who have experience of dragonewts accept this theory and simply proceed on the assumption that it is true, so the game is mainly written from that point of view. Quote Check out the Runequest Glorantha Wiki for RQ links and resources. Any updates or contributions welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joerg Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 I don't think there are many humans who saw a dragonewt spawning from their egg even once. To prove this progression as a fact, you would need to observe all the re-spawnings from a given egg until the next stage dragonewt emerges. That might take several human lifetimes... According to Sandy Petersen, the majority of lesser stage dragonewts around at this point in history are the slowpokes and non-achievers. Those who progressed through their stages at a good pace are all full dragons now. But anyway, YGWV, your Glorantha will vary. In my Glorantha, the dragonewts don't hatch, but dream up a body which carries their consciousness for a while. The egg is only destroyed either by outside forces or by the birth of the dragon. 2 Quote Telling how it is excessive verbis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Scott Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 3 hours ago, Tigerwomble said: The dragonewts appear in several different shapes, Empirical evidence - these different shapes are not obviously the same creature. 3 hours ago, Tigerwomble said: although they claim all of them are one species. They (the dragonewts) when asked what they are, say they are all the same species (dragonewts) 3 hours ago, Tigerwomble said: It has been generally agreed that the various forms of dragonewt are different stages of development, We try to explain how the different shapes are the same species, we know things like tadpoles to frogs, caterpillars to butterflies, etc most knowing that can understand they are at different stages of development. 3 hours ago, Tigerwomble said: but this is unproved. as it's a rebirth/reincarnation process, it's not possible to prove that x dragonewt became y dragonewt, even though they may say they are the same dragonewt, we can't prove it. a number of experiments to prove this have been tried. several dragonewts have been killed and a part of their body kept with the idea that they would return to get it. This never ends well as dragonewts turn up with a vengeance to recover the item and none want to be interviewed. 2 Quote ----- Search the Glorantha Resource Site: https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com. Search the Glorantha mailing list archives: https://glorantha.steff.in/digests/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soltakss Posted June 29, 2018 Share Posted June 29, 2018 Dragonewt rebirth and evolution takes a long time, centuries even. How many Inhuman Kings have there been? A Handful, I think. Most Priests have always been priests, or at least to human eyes. Some immortals might have been able to track a single dragonewt through the various stages, but that would mean keeping a relationship with a dragonewt that was capable of progressing over many centuries. Back in our RQ2 days, we faced a necromancer who was guarded by hundreds of dragonewt zombies, some Crested, some beaked and some Tailed Priests. It turned out that he had slain and skinned a dragonewt and it kept coming back, only to be made into a zombie each time it died. We helped it return again and kill the zombies and get its skin back. OK, it was RQ2 and perhaps the GM didn't have the nuances that we now know, but it was a good idea at the time. 2 1 Quote Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. www.soltakss.com/index.html Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joerg Posted June 29, 2018 Share Posted June 29, 2018 3 hours ago, soltakss said: Back in our RQ2 days, we faced a necromancer who was guarded by hundreds of dragonewt zombies, some Crested, some beaked and some Tailed Priests. It turned out that he had slain and skinned a dragonewt and it kept coming back, only to be made into a zombie each time it died. We helped it return again and kill the zombies and get its skin back. OK, it was RQ2 and perhaps the GM didn't have the nuances that we now know, but it was a good idea at the time. Impressive that it could advance despite this very serious entanglement... or did it regress to scout stage? Quote Telling how it is excessive verbis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
styopa Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 4 hours ago, soltakss said: Back in our RQ2 days, we faced a necromancer who was guarded by hundreds of dragonewt zombies, some Crested, some beaked and some Tailed Priests. It turned out that he had slain and skinned a dragonewt and it kept coming back, only to be made into a zombie each time it died. We helped it return again and kill the zombies and get its skin back. OK, it was RQ2 and perhaps the GM didn't have the nuances that we now know, but it was a good idea at the time. Actually, a charming scenario idea. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soltakss Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 12 hours ago, Joerg said: Impressive that it could advance despite this very serious entanglement... or did it regress to scout stage? As I said, in the RQ2 days, we didn't have the nuances that we later had. If you played it with the knowledge we have today it probably wouldn't work. No such things as dragonewt mysticism or entanglement in the RQ2 days, until WF12, and even then not many people had WFs so didn't know about it. Quote Simon Phipp - Caldmore Chameleon - Wallowing in my elitism since 1982. Many Systems, One Family. Just a fanboy. www.soltakss.com/index.html Jonstown Compendium author. Find my contributions here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joerg Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 15 minutes ago, soltakss said: As I said, in the RQ2 days, we didn't have the nuances that we later had. If you played it with the knowledge we have today it probably wouldn't work. No such things as dragonewt mysticism or entanglement in the RQ2 days, until WF12, and even then not many people had WFs so didn't know about it. Sure. Trying to make this idea work with the information we have here and now, not to shoot it down. Actually, there was some information on the 'newts and their weird ways even before RQ, hinted at in the Dragon Pass/ WBRM background for the dinosaurs and how they could cocoon up to emerge as pteranodons in some form of atonement. Quote Telling how it is excessive verbis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g33k Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Joerg said: Sure. Trying to make this idea work with the information we have here and now, not to shoot it down. I think it might work almost exactly as presented: each successive incarnation of the 'newt will be a little bit further off the true Draconic path, a little less close to enlightenment. So the very-oldest zombie'Newt will be that Tailed Priest, with more-recent ones being less and less advanced (and/or with dinosaurian features instead of Draconic). The actual living Dragonewt, who the PCs are assisting, being the most-devolved of all ... Quote C'es ne pas un .sig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard S. Posted June 30, 2018 Share Posted June 30, 2018 18 minutes ago, g33k said: I think it might work almost exactly as presented: each successive incarnation of the 'newt will be a little bit further off the true Draconic path, a little less close to enlightenment. So the very-oldest zombie'Newt will be that Tailed Priest, with more-recent ones being less and less advanced (and/or with dinosaurian features instead of Draconic). The actual living Dragonewt, who the PCs are assisting, being the most-devolved of all ... Hm... Maybe the dragonnewt isn't even on the path anymore. That much wrong action could be cause for the Inhuman King to banish it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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