Sir_Godspeed

That was sort of my point above. I could imagine Dara Happan nobles having something akin to debutante balls (religious ceremonies of some kind) where eligible bachelors can show off their... eligibility. Poetry recitals, religious hymn-singing, dancing (maybe as a group, maybe that whole thing where all the debutants switch partners every x minutes as a group, or maybe something else). Maybe it involves acting in the stead of gods in some theatric reenactment, (arguably possible for girls too, depending on just how sexist you view Dara Happans to be). All ways to impress a girl's parents - with the support of your parents, of course (your parents sponsoring training, costume, gifts, etc. for the occasions). Now, whether this would be how most of the courting takes place I can't tell - but somehow I can't imagine young Yelmite noblemen meekly sitting around until their dad makes a deal with his cousin or whatever. While Yelmite culture is patriarchal, it also does seem to have a little machismo in it. Hell, it might even be EXPECTED for young noblemen/citizens to go through a period of rowdyness to "get it out of their system", as it were. Taking the chariot out for a joyride. Dad'll be upset, of course, but implicitly it's a "boys will be boys", and "he does show a fine fiery spirit, and in marriage it will be tempered", sorta thing. Just spitballing. Having some character agency is fun. (Unfortunately for the Dara Happan girls there's less of it... good thing the Seven Mothers are around these days. Although pleading to dad through mother or possibly mother's brother might be possible even in a pre-Lunar context, even if ultimately marriage is a business- and dynastic tool rather than having anything to do with personal fulfillment.)

As a tangent, I suspect that the Dara Happan notion of courtly behaviour involves as much "courting" of the parents as the main interest themselves.

Maybe Yelm? Granted, he is presented as being on the receiving end of the Wedding Contest, but he does play an instrument, and I believe he also dances in the contest with Orlanth - even if that is an Orlanthi story. Maybe that aspect would be put on someone else within Dara Happan mythology proper. Arraz, Murharzarm, etc.

For organization of trade-based cities, it might be worth looking up stuff like the Cinque Ports of England (and their increasingly arcane government forms), the Hansa League (although I realize both of these examples are maritime) and of course stuff like the Arab trading towns and the Silk Road cities (although I know less about these). I think the clue is that unification attempts would be less warfare and conquest-based, and more something like personal unions galore, or the rise of one city as a regional hegemon with a network of tributaries beneath it. Possible competing hegemons with interwoven tributaty systems, like in Southeast Asia mandala-style states. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandala_(political_model)). Maniria also strike me as a potential place for republicanism to arise and fall (aristocratic, of course). This is a prime place for something like a Magna Carta or other equivalent, a treaty guaranteeing certain rights to traders and aristos/citizens across city-state boundaries, for example (and obviously as fragile as any such treaty is IRL).

Sure! I was more addressing the community organization aspect of it, to be honest. I believe there was a thread a way back that had art references for Orlanthi settlements from the Vingkotling to the modern age, and they included both cyclopean dry masonry and other techniques. Also, there's the Ernaldan square house, which is going to be the canonical basic template of Orlanthi steads going forward (although they already exist in artwork from Pavis), and those can be made in all sorts of ways, including wattle-and-daub, brick and mortar, logs and dry masonry.

I think it's just a case of author interest/knowledge versus reader interest/knowledge An author who knows a lot about lingustics will painstakingly worldbuild around etymologies, language families, sprachbund, etc. (Tolkien), and author who is interested in phenotypes, for example, might delve into population migrations and such (Tekumel has a bit of this, even if I realize it's potentially provocative, and he is more notable for linguistics as well), and an author who is interested in myths will paint their maps and inject their character motivations with mythic themes (ie. Greg). I see several posters in this forum who are *deeply* knowledgeable about all sorts of things, and Jeff has talked about how agriculture varies, the very real demographic and logistic constraints of the Lunar army, etc. so it's not like Glorantha is alien to material realism. It might just be that no one at Chaosium or otherwise have truly had the expertise/knowledge to get down and dirty with mining extraction and distribution: the manpower needed, the infrastructure required, maintenance costs, the fuel consumption, the price fluctuations, the trading networks, the tonnage consumption per year, etc. etc. This also applies to a potentially infinite number of topics that people might find interesting. It's a bit like how doctors find medical dramas completely idiotic, or police find crime procedurals insulting, but police might enjoy a good medical drama, and a doctor might love a good crime procedural, or how engineers have debated for decades over how all the Ewoks didn't die during the Death Star's explosion, or how a population demographer absolutely gutted A Song of Ice and Fire's maps as ludicrously lopsided. Sometimes, when it comes to enjoying fiction, ignorance can be bliss.

That's all well and good, but we know that Heortlings have had cities for centuries, both in Hendrikiland and in Kerofinela itself. Orlanthland had cities. Hendrikiland had cities. Orlanthi were the prime drivers of urbanization in Dorastor and in Prax (and Ralian and Fronelan Orlanthi have also urbanized independently), and founded and pushed for urban consolidation in southern Peloria as well, where notable urban centres existed even before Lunar expansion (and probably had for centuries, though I am not an expert on the nitty gritty chronology there), and this is not even taking into account their neighboring Esrolians who, despite cultural differences, have mingled with Heortlings enough geographically, politically and culturally (Colymar supposedly claims to be from Esrolia, but was culturally Hendriki, and the whole marriage unions and Adjustment Wars and Heortling sections in Nochet, and Esrolian architectural and artistic styles dominating in all of Kethaela and Kerofinala, etc. show that there's no magical line between the two groups) and is literally the most densely populated place in the whole world, with its single largest city since the Opening, and an urban civilization going back to the Green Age. My point is: it's complicated. IMHO, Orlanthi society is not predicated upon urban organization, but Orlanthi have a long, long history of building and organizing towns. However turbulent they might be. As Jeff has pointed out quite a few times, we might like to think of Orlanthi as rustic, rural people, but they have a history of creating fortresses, towns and cities in lots of places. EDIT: I should add, I don't disagree with the idea that Sartar was an innovator (all texts seem to agree there). It's just a little unclear what exactly he innovated *specifically*, and how that contrasts to other Orlanthi cities, historically.

What's the difference between the white routes and the grey ones? White is river and sea while grey are roads? EDIT: In comparison to the Silk Road, keep in mind that Maniria is about the size of Kansas or Belarus something.

That's another way to look at it, no problem. I understand that the association given between elements and music instruments and weapons, among other things, is kind of a staple of RQ/Glorantha, although personally I tend to view it as kind of a neat detail/quirk that is given a weirdly large significance and shoe-horned in wherever any of these things appear. But opinions differ.

That's a stretch. The Heortlings (and Orlanthi in general) have a surprisingly long history of urban organization and construction. However, it's true that their civilization does not center around the city or city-state as the natural unit (which arguably Malkioni and Pelorian civilizations do).

In Revealed Mythologies, Mostal is separated from Latsom. While Mostal is in some way seen as a world-maker and active agent, Latsom is seen as a kind of personification of stone (and possibly all the Earth, but seemingly primarily stone). Latsom is also seen as Mostal's brother. When people talk about Stone dying to the Elves, it is likely that it's Latsom's death they are talking about. However, this is likely a human and theistic take on it all, as Mostali/Dwarves do not actually anthropomorphize Mostal as much as you'd think, with references in the Sourcebook, iirc, pointing out that to the Mostali, Mostal is less an ancestor and personage, and more a term for the collective systems and processes of all of Glorantha. He is the World Machine, ie. effectively cosmos. If it is a god, it is a Pantheos. (This might be worth discussing in its own thread, but that's my take on it). So, basically, the notion of a god of stone is often linked to Dwarves, yes, but this is a human notion, not a Dwarven one.

I appreciate the elemental themes that instruments in Glorantha have, but the purpose of the drums in a music band is to dictate rhythm, and little dictates life's rhythm as much as the agricultural cycle, hence my choice of Esrola. Also I was dicking around.

If anyone here has worked in an intense, but close-knit group, look out for that person who seemingly managed to make interpersonal drama dissipate, who knows what people to put together, which people to keep more apart, knows which topics to bring up, which topics to avoid, knows how to make everyone feel like a part of the team effort, knows how to emphasise the work each person does and validates it, and in general acts as the grease in the gears without which the group would lose cohesion and possibly break out into conflict. That's the Ernaldan. That's what Ernalda's Harmony is in the most prosaic sense, imho. And that's probably what makes it hard to spell out, because when it works, it's like it's not there at all, like a good supporting bass line to a rock band. (Yes, I just called Ernalda a bass player, though she's probably the drummer too. Or maybe that'd be Esrola.).

Holy moley that shield is absolutely gorgeous.

Getting some serious "Give me back my Legions, Tatius!"-vibes from this. Interestingly, in researching North Pent for my own little project, I read about the Pentan invasion of the Redlands and Oraya, but given how it's stated that Jar-Eel goes up against Dranz Goloi (no mystery who wins of the iconic fan favorite character intensely involved in the main plotline of the Hero Wars and the largely unknown dude coming in sort of from nowhere) I kind of dismissed it. It's interesting to see this other angle on it, and see how big of a deal it is, and how, at least for the moment, it is a much bigger deal than that vagrant Argrath mucking about in Prax.

It might not overlap completely, but according to @Jeff's comments, cottar is subsumed under the more general term "semi-free".

I'm not sure if this was mentioned explicitly, but "half-free" aren't slaves, they're tenant farmers, or in older terminology, cottars, basically. I'm not sure if stickpicker fall under this as well, though I'm guessing so.

I was thinking: maybe the mountain is a volcano to the "cold Underworld" (as opposed to Lodril's magma-y one), as it were, and that is why it's cold. This also makes it a potential route to travel to Hell.

Got some inspiration from this conveniently released video. It's mainly on linguistics, which I'm not quite up to the task of tackling yet (and which I'll only loosely handle anyway), but it provides a good summary of relevant peoples in addition to those I'm already loosely familiar with (I mean, I was aware of a few of these already, but not in a systematic way).

Netta?

Don't underestimate the degree to which Entru was integrated into the Earth-complex, I'd say.

I guess they might also be blaming a freak accident on their perennial enemies? Happens all the time IRL. EDIT: I do know that's a boring explanation. But if one is so inclined, one could spin further on it with some kind of commentary on public opinion in times of war and crisis or what have you.

I'm not familiar with Blood over Gold or Ashara. Would anyone be up to just give me a little primer or something on it? I understand it's no longer in line with Chaosium's vision, but hey, I'm curious.

I was loosely of the impression that the Trader Princes themselves (and their families) were basically Talars (possibly self-styled, but who is going to dispute that?), and they ruled over Orlanthi commoners in lieu of Horali and Dronari. I'll admit, I had not considered how the Solanthi and Ditali confederations played into the urbanized trader towns. I hadn't considered that there was a continuity between them, I always got the impression that they were separate entities, at least politically (ie. the Solanthi and Ditali were more hinterland "rubes", if you will, compared to the caravan-aligned trader city-states, but that they at least were independent of the Princes). But I could be way off here.

Well, they have the cultural background of Entruli, which are tied to the pig god/earth husband Entru. A contrast to the cattle/sheep-herding Heortlings might be a greater focus on pigs, either together with sheep or cattle or some other combination. A closer relation to the Aldryami, and thus Aldrya & Flamal might also be applicable, but whether that would be region-wide or just for the tribes residing close to the forest itself I don't know.