A Look a Reed Boats, more impressive than you think.

[Videopete]

So I was looking at the article on wikipedia on Reed Boats, and there is a link to the Natives of Lake Titicaca who live and base their lives around reeds.  They build elaborate Reed Boats and floating Islands made of reeds. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed_boat Such a fascinating subject, I often thought of Ducks living on elevated platforms with just reed bundles with goods strapped to them, these Reed wonders make me want rethink of the presentation of the Ducks. Perhaps a combination of the two groups.  With Floating Humakti Temples, that are constantly moving due to the need to counter the undead of Delecti.

[EricW]

Kon tiki expedition https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kon-Tiki_expedition

Azores expedition - https://m.dw.com/en/trans-atlantic-voyage-in-a-reed-boat-falls-apart/a-2772793

primitive boats have made impressive journeys

[Bill the barbarian]

44 minutes ago, Videopete said:

So I was looking at the article on wikipedia on Reed Boats, and there is a link to the Natives of Lake Titicaca who live and base their lives around reeds.  They build elaborate Reed Boats and floating Islands made of reeds.

12 minutes ago, EricW said:

primitive boats have made impressive journeys

Joerg and I were doing some research in this field so I totally agree! Fascinating stuff and do have a look at Lake Titicaca. 

Now if I may I add:

The SS Minnow!

 

No scratch that!

 

 

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, Videopete said:

They build elaborate Reed Boats and floating Islands made of reeds

Probably a common thing in both the Right Arm and Left Arm Islands of the Holy Country given the considerable variability in tides.  There may be a good reason the Gathering Marsh between Heortland and the Left Arm Islands is called that.  Such may be very useful in avoiding Wolf Pirates too.

[JanPospisil]

The Nogatendites (who are called Weeders in Six Ages) have large "feathered" temple boats. Although they are not seen in the game, I think they'd be reed boats.

[Joerg]

2 hours ago, JanPospisil said:

The Nogatendites (who are called Weeders in Six Ages) have large "feathered" temple boats. Although they are not seen in the game, I think they'd be reed boats.

The Guide corroborates that. P.711

Quote

Nogatend:  The  Feathered  Boats,  these people  lived  on  several  large  temple  boats that  plied  the  Oslira  and  Black  Eel  Rivers. They were called the Nogatendites and lived by  fishing  and  gathering  wild  plants.  They worshiped  Jadarenasa  the  Mother  Loon  and maintained  an  ancient  pact  between  their goddess and the Black Eel. When needed, the Nogatend  boats  became  huge  living  loons, capable of defeating even the great Black Eel. The boats were made of reeds and ornately decorated with many types of feathers. The population was approximately 1,000 humans.  

I misremembered them having sailed on actual birds. I wonder how and why they disappeared.

Edited March 11, 2021 by Joerg

[jajagappa]

5 minutes ago, Joerg said:

I misremembered them having sailed on actual birds. I wonder how and why they disappeared.

They could transform their boats into living loons as noted.

They haven't disappeared.  They are still part of the Weeder population of river folk along the Oslir and Black Eel in Saird.

[Qizilbashwoman]

3 hours ago, jajagappa said:

They could transform their boats into living loons as noted.

They haven't disappeared.  They are still part of the Weeder population of river folk along the Oslir and Black Eel in Saird.

These are descendants of the Ratites, right? There's a large number of Solar bird divinities worshiped by some Weeder groups and that's a whole Ratite remnant thing unless I'm mistaken.

One of the Red Emperors, V Venerabilis, got ett by the pre-eminent Weeder deity, SurEnslib, during an orgy-ritual in 1546.

Originally, a Weeder was blessed to make the Moon-Boats, which were Reed Boats. That's been retconned; Moon-Boats are now, I believe, like top-of-the-line wooden boats.

Edited March 11, 2021 by Qizilbashwoman

[jajagappa]

8 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

These are descendants of the Ratites, right?

I don't know if it indicates that anywhere or not.  Greg provided me with his Weeder writeup years ago, so would need to check and see if he noted anything there or not.  But there's a number of Weeder groups all along the Oslir and Black Eel including the Nogatendites with their Loon boats, and the worshippers of the Heron goddesses in Darjiin and Henjarl.

[Joerg]

 

3 hours ago, jajagappa said:

They haven't disappeared.  They are still part of the Weeder population of river folk along the Oslir and Black Eel in Saird.

Leaving their floating homes sounds like a major change in lifestyle. Are you suggesting that the feathered boats were just a survival trick?

 

8 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

These are descendants of the Ratites, right?

Loons aren't exactly ratites, and neither are the stilting birds of the marshes (heron, stork, ibis, crane ..)

2 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

I don't know if it indicates that anywhere or not.  Greg provided me with his Weeder writeup years ago, so would need to check and see if he noted anything there or not.  But there's a number of Weeder groups all along the Oslir and Black Eel including the Nogatendites with their Loon boats, and the worshippers of the Heron goddesses in Darjiin and Henjarl.

I wasn't aware that all the weeder groups were descended from aquatic birds. The Yuthuppan area weeder (Greya?) did not appear to have any ties to a bird mother goddess. Still, a loon (as a swimming/diving bird) is quite different from those stilting ambush hunters.

The weeders extend beyond the Yolp Mountains towards the Ezel River, as the rise of those volcanoes in the Storm Age separated the western part of Suvaria from the Oslir catchment area.

I would have put down the Henjarli and Darjiinite bird-goddess spawn as wet farmers rather than subsistence hunter-fisher-gatherers, too. Especially the Surenslibites of Henjarl.

8 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

There's a large number of Solar bird divinities worshiped by some Weeder groups and that's a whole Ratite remnant thing unless I'm mistaken.

I thought the Ratites were the plains nomads of the Golden Age, living like the Praxian Ostrich and Bolo Lizard folk, and occasionally going on a mongolian-like show of strength towards the sedentary folk (hence "Ratite Empire").

The Suvarians have been put down as the Heron Hegemony of the south-west. The Sourcebook puts one Heron Hegemony southwest of the Footstool - which describes Suvaria/Darjiin quite well.  The God Learner maps in the Guide take the "southwest of the center" to mean southwest of the Spike, and place them somewhere near Slon, without much later evidence for there ever having been lots of herons in that area.

 

8 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

One of the Red Emperors, V Venerabilis, got ett by the pre-eminent Weeder deity, SurEnslib, during an orgy-ritual in 1546.

What is more interesting is that he did not return as the same mask from that experience.
The Red Emperor is a capital H Hero, with his own backdoor path out of Hell, which usually means that a violent end to his physical form, even in the digestive tract of someone else, doesn't mean he cannot return with his body intact from such an experience. Belintar underwent a similar re-appearance during his struggles with the Only Old One and his allies, after having been eaten, and without requiring anything like a Tournament of the Masters of Luck and Death (his equivalent to the Red Emperor taking on a new mask).

8 minutes ago, Qizilbashwoman said:

Originally, a Weeder was blessed to make the Moon-Boats, which were Reed Boats.

until they reversed to the earlier wooden ship model. This was a postulation made in the Imperial Lunar Handbook (part 1, IIRC). Overall, that book does a better job describing the Pelorian cultures of an earlier age than the Lunar Empire.

[Qizilbashwoman]

On 3/11/2021 at 2:55 PM, Joerg said:

What is more interesting is that he did not return as the same mask from that experience.

Half of the Red Emperor's horcruxes, called egi, hence his title Taken Egi "Leader of the Egi", were murdered by Sheng Seleris in 1446 when he invaded the Moon.

After this time, the Red Emperor began to be labeled by number and name: the first "new" mask was II Magnificus. The original is just called Taken Egi and he did just reappear normally like a Hero some interminable period after His death.

Edited March 12, 2021 by Qizilbashwoman

[pachristian]

On 3/8/2021 at 1:16 PM, EricW said:

Kon tiki expedition https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kon-Tiki_expedition

Azores expedition - https://m.dw.com/en/trans-atlantic-voyage-in-a-reed-boat-falls-apart/a-2772793

primitive boats have made impressive journeys

You missed the important ones:

https://www.kon-tiki.no/expeditions/ra-expeditions/

Ra I did not quite make it across the Atlantic, but Ra II did.

https://www.kon-tiki.no/expeditions/tigris-expedition/

[Bill the barbarian]

2 hours ago, pachristian said:

You missed the important ones:

 

Let me check, no, SS Minnow, got it!