Bows, elves and strikes ranks

[JustAnotherVingan]

10 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Perhaps not, did you recall adding 5 SRs for spell prep. I believe a multimissile or a speeddart focus can be carved into the bow alleviating the need for the 5 SR prep/change hand time, but the rules are a little hazy on that. It also says shields and swords can can have foci and that time will be saved as a result. Still a bit hazy, if I recall correctly.

Having the focus on your weapon saves you having to scabbard your sword, get the focus out, cast the spell, put the focus away again, draw your sword etc.

Thats my interpretation anyway.

Spells I use often like Heal or Befuddle I'd want the focus tattooed on my wrist or whatever, much handier than a wand.

[Bill the barbarian]

Agreed, but that is still hazy, what is the mechanism to achieve all that? If that is all that one had to do, why are there still SR penalties. Why are not all foci tattoos located near the hands, you know, for ease of use. Why limit it to spell you often use like befuddle and heal?

Hazy...

[jajagappa]

12 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Why are not all foci tattoos located near the hands, you know, for ease of use.

Hands can be removed...

Perhaps the size/patterns of the tattoos conflict (i.e. overlapping might destroy the foci for each, or seeing one distracts from the other).

[Bill the barbarian]

23 minutes ago, jajagappa said:

Hands can be removed...

Perhaps the size/patterns of the tattoos conflict (i.e. overlapping might destroy the foci for each, or seeing one distracts from the other).

Thanks jajagappa, but again, hazy, I would love some actual rules? Surely I am not the only one.

Edited March 2, 2022 by Bill the barbarian

[SevenSistersOfVinga]

4 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

And again, hazy, I would love some actual rules? Surely I am not the only one.

__"The 
adventurer touches their focus, concentrates on the spell, and begins their chant"_ p256

From there, maybe influenced from other games, we assumed that spirit magic has verbal, somatic and material(foci) components. 

So we use the "Do you have a free hand for that?" logic, all spirit spells require you to talk (no casting beffudle under the table) and gesticulate. 

If the spell is a buff on what you have on your hand, go for it, no +5. (Speeddart+arrow), you move the arrow around and say speeddart in spirit speech.

If you have a sword and shield.... what hand do you use for heal?

We don't spend too much time on foci but if you are carrying a body there is no Disruption attack for you, if you know fireblade probably you know how to make it work with a blade on your hands. 

[JustAnotherVingan]

1 hour ago, jajagappa said:

Hands can be removed...

Perhaps the size/patterns of the tattoos conflict (i.e. overlapping might destroy the foci for each, or seeing one distracts from the other).

If someone removes your hands having the focus on a wand won't help 😄

[Kloster]

4 hours ago, SevenSistersOfVinga said:

We don't spend too much time on foci but if you are carrying a body there is no Disruption attack for you,

You can RAW. It is just longer, except for the few spells that explicitly requires a focus (of which disruption is not part).

[JustAnotherVingan]

5 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Agreed, but that is still hazy, what is the mechanism to achieve all that? If that is all that one had to do, why are there still SR penalties. Why are not all foci tattoos located near the hands, you know, for ease of use. Why limit it to spell you often use like befuddle and heal?

Hazy...

We've never had a strict rule on this, just played that people put their focus on something convenient like weapons, rings or wrists.

The only people who suffer are those relying on an item such as a matrix. 1 of my group's characters started out with a spear with a bladesharp-2 matrix. Fine until she decides she wants to use a different weapon or the spear breaks.

[Manimati]

18 hours ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Perhaps not, did you recall adding 5 SRs for spell prep. I believe a multimissile or a speeddart focus can be carved into the bow alleviating the need for the 5 SR prep/change hand time, but the rules are a little hazy on that. It also says shields and swords can can have foci and that time will be saved as a result. Still a bit hazy, if I recall correctly.

Indeed, I would rule that this is limited to spells relevant for shooting, for which foci can be carved on the bow (ex: firearrow, speedart, multimissile) and not other spells like heal, countermagic, fanaticism...

For spells like coordination or mobility, which could be relevant for shooting, i would also probably allow it.

[Bill the barbarian]

As would I, similarity in magic. Maybe as Jajagappa has suggested,

6 hours ago, jajagappa said:

Perhaps the size/patterns of the tattoos conflict (i.e. overlapping might destroy the foci for each, or seeing one distracts from the other).

so, perhaps a limited number of tatties on the hands. One would work of me... So, a bladesharp focus on a sword, A protection or a dull blade spell on a shield and

 

8 hours ago, JustAnotherVingan said:

Spells I use often like Heal or Befuddle I'd want the focus tattooed on my wrist or whatever, much handier than a wand.

maybe JAV’s idea of Heal and Befuddle on hands and wrist! 

 

5 hours ago, SevenSistersOfVinga said:

We don't spend too much time on foci but if you are carrying a body there is no Disruption attack for you, if you know fireblade probably you know how to make it work with a blade on your hands. 

and it looks like SSoV likes common sense and does not won’t to worry abut it too much. Common sense rules here. 

I don’t know. This is something that has bothered me for about 40 years. Maybe I am overthinking it. Thanks SSoV for allowing a little thread drift. And thanks for joining in!

 

1 hour ago, Kloster said:

You can RAW. It is just longer, except for the few spells that explicitly requires a focus (of which disruption is not part).

Yep, no need for a focus (with a few exceptions) if you wish to take you time...

[g33k]

I understand "5 SRs" to just be a default delay for everything, so that people don't have to stop in the middle of combat to look up a table of SRs-per-Action.

A games-design play-at-the-table meta-consideration.

Rationalize it in-world however suits you... up to and including HR'ing other than "5 SR's for whatever, no matter what."  Personally, I find "5 SR's" unsatisfyingly generic, but (like the designers) an acceptable compromise vs. having to stop the game to lookup on another table.

If I was going to HR it, I'd probably aim it at differentiating characters rather than actions... for example, 3SRs + DEXmod SRs (instead of flat 5 SRs); +/- SRs for high/low skills; etc.  This would, broadly speaking, be something each player would know about their own PC, and wouldn't often need to crack the rulebook for lookup (except it's a HR, so no rulebook anyhow).

When considering spellcasting, I think of it as more mental than physical:  pulling your mind out of the intense bodily experience of swordsmanship or archery, or etc, to the abstract ways of Spirit teachings (and then back again) ...

Edited March 3, 2022 by g33k
Divvil in tha details

[Shiningbrow]

14 hours ago, g33k said:

When considering spellcasting, I think of it as more mental than physical:  pulling your mind out of the intense bodily experience of swordsmanship or archery, or etc, to the abstract ways of Spirit teachings (and then back again) ...

That's exactly what I was about to write, as i was going through the above!

You've been focussed on doing X (swinging a sword, firing an arrow, etc), and now you want to cast a spell. It's not merely enough to look at or touch (or both) your spell focus and start casting - you've got to spend a bit of mental time to put yourself in the right state of mind. For me (in RL), that can be as short as a single breath... so, about 5SR.

[Dragon]

On 3/2/2022 at 6:08 AM, jajagappa said:

Hands can be removed...

Perhaps the size/patterns of the tattoos conflict (i.e. overlapping might destroy the foci for each, or seeing one distracts from the other).

Hands can be covered. Frequently in combat they tend to be covered by gauntlets or gloves. Maybe you should embroider your glove or score your leather gauntlet. Tie an arm band with foci around your lower arm over whatever armor you wear at the time.