Shooting from Llamas!

[ChrisWentWhere]

I am now in the marvellous situation where my group includes a fairly inexperienced Humakti riding a Llama with a yellow baboon as a passenger. It makes me smile whenever I think about it. 

Obviously if the Humakti were to try to shoot at someone from his Llama his attack chance is limited to his Ride skill. What about the baboon? I'm assuming that the main reason for limiting it to the ride skill is because the person in chance is having to control the mount. The passenger is just a passenger after all. But it is also not a completely stable platform to fire from. Perhaps limit it to DEX x 3?  

He is also trying to use a sling for this purpose... I reckon there is always the risk of him inadvertently clonking the Humakti which would probably not be a good idea! Just standard chance of a Fumble? Or higher?

Cheers 

Chris   

[Darius West]

There is no Kuschile High Llama Archer skill.

[ChrisWentWhere]

No, I didn't think that there was. Which is why the person in charge of the mount has their skill capped at their ride skill. I'm just wondering it the other person on the back of the High Llama would be similarly capped at the rider's Ride skill? Or their own ride skill? Or something else? Or not at all...     

[French Desperate WindChild]

1 hour ago, ChrisWentWhere said:

capped at the rider's Ride skill? Or their own ride skill? Or something else? Or not at all...     

If I had to manage it, I would say the minimum between their own ride [high llama] skill and the riders ride[high llama] skill.

the rider's because more skilled is the rider more stable is the mount (I think)

the passenger's because the passenger has to adapt his body and his shoot to the llama movement.

I would probably offer some bonus if the mount is trained as a war mount.

 

[g33k]

I'd cap a passenger's missile-skill at the rider's skill -10% I think.
The passenger is experiencing all the bouncing & jouncing that limit the rider's own missile weapons...

... but without the communication & feedback the rider has, the "feel" for what the mount *is* doing, is *about* to be doing. 

[Ian Absentia]

5 hours ago, ChrisWentWhere said:

I'm assuming that the main reason for limiting it to the ride skill is because the person in chance is having to control the mount. The passenger is just a passenger after all. But it is also not a completely stable platform to fire from.

I believe the challenge is almost as much a matter of remaining mounted as it is guiding the mount.  Being a passenger on a horse isn't a passive affair.  I'd apply the same limitation for somewhat different reasons, but for functionally the same abstract effect.

You're also onto something with the stability of the firing platform, though I'd underscore how crowded it is, chest-to-back or even back-to-back.  Lots of elbows busy with competing tasks.

!i!

[Jens]

Probably makes sense to cap the bow skill at the LOWER of the firer and the rider's Ride skill- an inexperienced rider would make it extra bumpy, while an inexperienced passenger would just be bouncing around. Of course many Praxians or Pentans have ride skills as good if not better than their weapon skills, so not much of an issue for them, but would hamper others.

That's why the preferred platform for missile (and magical) troops outside of people born on their mounts is the chariot. Much smoother ride.

[Rodney Dangerduck]

I'm still wrapping my head around the idea of slinging from horseback with another rider 

Actually, change that, I'm wrapping my sling around the head of the other rider.

[g33k]

4 hours ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

I'm still wrapping my head around the idea of slinging from horseback with another rider 

Actually, change that, I'm wrapping my sling around the head of the other rider.

I'm pretty sure that the circle the sling passes through can operate vertically -- alongside the mount & rider(s) -- and thus not endangering any of the 3.

[Rodney Dangerduck]

3 minutes ago, g33k said:

I'm pretty sure that the circle the sling passes through can operate vertically -- alongside the mount & rider(s) -- and thus not endangering any of the 3.

Maybe?  Even if true, that really limits the angle of fire to basically straight ahead or behind.

[ChrisWentWhere]

17 hours ago, Jens said:

Probably makes sense to cap the bow skill at the LOWER of the firer and the rider's Ride skill- an inexperienced rider would make it extra bumpy, while an inexperienced passenger would just be bouncing around. Of course many Praxians or Pentans have ride skills as good if not better than their weapon skills, so not much of an issue for them, but would hamper others.

That's why the preferred platform for missile (and magical) troops outside of people born on their mounts is the chariot. Much smoother ride.

Well, the passenger is a baboon so I guess they will need to go down the 'mounted infantry' route. 

 

 

[Jens]

11 hours ago, ChrisWentWhere said:

Well, the passenger is a baboon so I guess they will need to go down the 'mounted infantry' route. 

Who wouldn’t want a baboon dragoon?

Edited November 24, 2023 by Jens

[Akhôrahil]

7 hours ago, Jens said:

Who wouldn’t want baboon dragoon?

They are less useful for gorilla warfare?

[Jens]

12 minutes ago, Akhôrahil said:

They are less useful for gorilla warfare

You clearly put your gorillas on boats, not mounts- then you have a gorilla flotilla.

[Darius West]

On 11/22/2023 at 11:03 PM, ChrisWentWhere said:

No, I didn't think that there was. Which is why the person in charge of the mount has their skill capped at their ride skill. I'm just wondering it the other person on the back of the High Llama would be similarly capped at the rider's Ride skill? Or their own ride skill? Or something else? Or not at all...     

I suspect that the passenger is limited by their ride skill.  They won't control direction, but they can scythe their dagger ax at enemy heads as they pass by.  Considering the implacable speed of High Llamas and the +10 to hit location leading to 60% of their hits being head hits, you will inevitably begin to make a series of increasingly rude and politically incorrect jokes about the outcome.

[soltakss]

On 11/22/2023 at 11:26 AM, Darius West said:

There is no Kuschile High Llama Archer skill.

Why not? If a Yelmalian High Llama Rider, who cannot ride a horse due to taboos, gained a Kuschile Archery skill, why wouldn't it apply to a High Llama?

On 11/22/2023 at 11:24 AM, ChrisWentWhere said:

Obviously if the Humakti were to try to shoot at someone from his Llama his attack chance is limited to his Ride skill. What about the baboon? I'm assuming that the main reason for limiting it to the ride skill is because the person in chance is having to control the mount. The passenger is just a passenger after all. But it is also not a completely stable platform to fire from. Perhaps limit it to DEX x 3?  

I would limit the shot to the Humakti's Ride skill and keep it simple.

[metcalph]

4 hours ago, soltakss said:

Why not? If a Yelmalian High Llama Rider, who cannot ride a horse due to taboos, gained a Kuschile Archery skill, why wouldn't it apply to a High Llama?

Because then he would be a really shit mounted archer compared to other high llama riders.

 

Edited November 25, 2023 by metcalph

[Rodney Dangerduck]

5 hours ago, soltakss said:

Why not? If a Yelmalian High Llama Rider, who cannot ride a horse due to taboos, gained a Kuschile Archery skill, why wouldn't it apply to a High Llama?

Because it is Kushile Horse Archery?

[soltakss]

11 hours ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

Because it is Kushile Horse Archery?

Griffin Mountain has Kuschile Hawk Archery, so it is already adapted to other mounts.

 

[Rodney Dangerduck]

5 hours ago, soltakss said:

Griffin Mountain has Kuschile Hawk Archery, so it is already adapted to other mounts.

Horse and Vrok are both Yelmalian animals.  High Llamas aren't.

This is RQ, so I guess there could be an unusual heroquest.

Edited November 26, 2023 by Rodney Dangerduck

[Akhôrahil]

21 hours ago, Rodney Dangerduck said:

This is RQ, so I guess there could be an unusual heroquest.

Or, and hear me out here, just learn to Ride the bloody thing in the first place! 🙂

[Jens]

8 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

just learn to Ride the bloody thing in the first place

As MOB has pointed out, the beauty of Kuschile is you don’t need an animal to practice, but your skill works if you ever find yourself on one. It’s like how the Canadian army has almost no attack or transport helicopters, but trains our troops to use them in case we ever “borrow” some from the US. 

[Akhôrahil]

17 hours ago, Jens said:

As MOB has pointed out, the beauty of Kuschile is you don’t need an animal to practice, but your skill works if you ever find yourself on one. It’s like how the Canadian army has almost no attack or transport helicopters, but trains our troops to use them in case we ever “borrow” some from the US. 

One has to wonder exactly how you practice horse archery without a horse... and exactly how you're supposed to use a cavalry force that can't in fact ride.

[Jens]

1 hour ago, Akhôrahil said:

One has to wonder exactly how you practice horse archery without a horse... and exactly how you're supposed to use a cavalry force that can't in fact ride.

Kuschile is a cult secret, likely discovered on a heroquest by the Yelmalian hero Kuschile, which allows you to practice without a horse. It lets your normal infantryman become a mounted skirmisher if there's a horse available during a campaign- borrowed from allies, captured, etc. They ride badly so wouldn't engage the enemy with a charge, but can stay far away and shoot arrows at them, encouraging the enemy to bring the fight to your phalanx.