Attacks/round house rules or other options besides using strike ranks.

[Zit]

Thanks guys. I know now that it has nothing to do with accessories for cats I'm getting cleverer everyday

[Thalaba]

Thanks guys. I know now that it has nothing to do with accessories for cats I'm getting cleverer everyday

A Sandbox has nothing to do with cats. Around here, anyway, the box intended for cats is a Litterbox.

A sandbox is a toy for children (and the young-at-heart) which is basically an area filled with sand for play, often bordered by a wooden frame (hence the 'box').

A sandbox game in RPG terms is a game where, like in the toy sandbox, the players can participate in and perform any thing they want. The adventure is a blank slate and the players drive its direction. There is no set adventure path. A sandbox world feels like a living, breathing world. The player characters can interact with it and change it, but it doesn't rely on the PCs initiating those changes. This way, the players 'build' the adventure themselves through their own decisions. It is the opposite of 'railroading'.

Sandbox purists will have a very detailed world. The idea is that the world runs rather independantly of the players, and that there are many things going on. The players will eventually find out about some of these and will decided to interact with them (or not). Since the GM must be equally prepared if the players decided to go to Obraxas-by-the-Sea to the east or the village of Saint-Plestinians to the west, they are often highly prepared environments. Whatever events that were going to happen in one place will still happen in the PCs go there or not. Of course, many GMs will work ad-lib, as well, but prepared sandboxes are usually considered to be more impartial.

[vagabond]

A Sandbox has nothing to do with cats. Around here, anyway, the box intended for cats is a Litterbox.

A sandbox is a toy for children (and the young-at-heart) which is basically an area filled with sand for play, often bordered by a wooden frame (hence the 'box').

A sandbox game in RPG terms is a game where, like in the toy sandbox, the players can participate in and perform any thing they want. The adventure is a blank slate and the players drive its direction. There is no set adventure path. A sandbox world feels like a living, breathing world. The player characters can interact with it and change it, but it doesn't rely on the PCs initiating those changes. This way, the players 'build' the adventure themselves through their own decisions. It is the opposite of 'railroading'.

Sandbox purists will have a very detailed world. The idea is that the world runs rather independantly of the players, and that there are many things going on. The players will eventually find out about some of these and will decided to interact with them (or not). Since the GM must be equally prepared if the players decided to go to Obraxas-by-the-Sea to the east or the village of Saint-Plestinians to the west, they are often highly prepared environments. Whatever events that were going to happen in one place will still happen in the PCs go there or not. Of course, many GMs will work ad-lib, as well, but prepared sandboxes are usually considered to be more impartial.

Some examples of very detailed "sandbox" worlds:

Jorune

Tekumel

Talislanta

Ian

[Atgxtg]

Glad you like it. I had decided that if I were to run a CODA Trek campaign, I7d have run a CODA LOTR campaign in the holodeck. a "live" FRPG in the holodeck worked really well in Trek games. In fact, the players seemed to enjoy theholodeck adventures more than the regular ones. Perhaps due to the safety net/do over quality.

BRP has a few hurdles as far as adapting it to SciFi. Primaily the fact that being designed for a lower tech setting, it lacks rules to handle the usually ScI Fi trappings. Not that adding such would be all that hard, just that it would be a lot of work. It's not just the laser guns and spaceships, it's all the other fiddly bits of technojunk that are ubiquitous in a SciFi setting. Comm gear, emergency medical packs, handheld scanners, handheld computers. All the piddling stuff that makes the setting feel futuristic (and would probably be left behind or thrown out when people moved).

It's tedious to write up, but important in setting the right mood and feel for the campaign. It makes it feel SCiFi ish and not RQ, or COC ish.

[vagabond]

Glad you like it. I had decided that if I were to run a CODA Trek campaign, I7d have run a CODA LOTR campaign in the holodeck. a "live" FRPG in the holodeck worked really well in Trek games. In fact, the players seemed to enjoy theholodeck adventures more than the regular ones. Perhaps due to the safety net/do over quality.

BRP has a few hurdles as far as adapting it to SciFi. Primaily the fact that being designed for a lower tech setting, it lacks rules to handle the usually ScI Fi trappings. Not that adding such would be all that hard, just that it would be a lot of work. It's not just the laser guns and spaceships, it's all the other fiddly bits of technojunk that are ubiquitous in a SciFi setting. Comm gear, emergency medical packs, handheld scanners, handheld computers. All the piddling stuff that makes the setting feel futuristic (and would probably be left behind or thrown out when people moved).

It's tedious to write up, but important in setting the right mood and feel for the campaign. It makes it feel SCiFi ish and not RQ, or COC ish.

Ringworld? IIRC, it did BRP Sci-Fi fairly well.

[rust]

Ringworld? IIRC, it did BRP Sci-Fi fairly well.

It did, and there are also the science fiction versions of Call of Cthulhu

(Cthulhu Rising, etc.), which also work quite well. I am looking forward

to the Open Quest science fiction setting by the same author, John Os-

soway, which will basically be Cthulhu Rising without the mythos, and

should be very easy to convert to standard BRP.

[frogspawner]

... but what do you all mean with "sandbox" ?

Thanks for asking that - I wanted to but didn't dare.

[Atgxtg]

Ringworld? IIRC, it did BRP Sci-Fi fairly well.

No it didn't.

It pretty much bypassed most of the elements of SciFi, and set everything up on the RingWorld which wasn't much more than a blank slate. And it was RingWorld in a vaccuum, since we didn't get enough info to do anything off of the ring,or even give us a way to do so.

It is just a wilderness setting with laser guns.

Cthulhu Rising does a better job of providing a setting and SciFi trappings, inclduing spacecraft, but it chucks in a bunch of Cthulhu Mythos stuff that most gamers don't want with their SciFi. I don't bllame the peoplebehind CR for doing so. It's a nice extension to CoC, but how many people who want a SciFi game are buying CR and removing the mythos stuff?

As has been pointed out many times, BRP is lacking in the SciFi genre. Compare it to any other "generic" RPG system. Yes it is something that can be fixed with a good supplement, but it hasn't happened yet.

[rust]

It pretty much bypassed most of the elements of SciFi, and set everything up on the RingWorld which wasn't much more than a blank slate. And it was RingWorld in a vaccuum, since we didn't get enough info to do anything off of the ring,or even give us a way to do so.

I think this is not quite true, because the Ringworld RPG included informations about

all human colonies of the Known Space, several detailed starships, descriptions and

game stats for several alien species from other worlds than the Ringworld, and some

rather good equipment and weapons, so it was quite possible to run adventures off

the Ringworld, too. Unfortunately the Ringworld RPG was never completed as planned,

so it only offered a very small selection of the various science fiction elements - just

enough for a few adventures, but without the design systems a true campaign would

have required.

[Atgxtg]

I think this is not quite true, because the Ringworld RPG included informations about

all human colonies of the Known Space, several detailed starships, descriptions and

game stats for several alien species from other worlds than the Ringworld, and some

rather good equipment and weapons, so it was quite possible to run adventures off

the Ringworld, too.

Not enough to really flesh out the setting. I remember having the RPG and wishing that they gave more I felt like I would had to pick up a half dozen Ni ven books to get a good enough grasp of the setting to run a campaign. Ringworld was a sandbox without much sand.

Unfortunately the Ringworld RPG was never completed as planned,

so it only offered a very small selection of the various science fiction elements - just

enough for a few adventures, but without the design systems a true campaign would

have required.

Exactly. It wasn't a complete game. The either should have fleshed it out enough so you could run a campaign, or take out what setting there was so it could be more generic.

SciFi doesn't have a "default" setting the way FRPGs tend to. So any SciFi RPG setting needs to be explained.

[vagabond]

No it didn't.

It pretty much bypassed most of the elements of SciFi, and set everything up on the RingWorld which wasn't much more than a blank slate. And it was RingWorld in a vaccuum, since we didn't get enough info to do anything off of the ring,or even give us a way to do so.

It is just a wilderness setting with laser guns.

Cthulhu Rising does a better job of providing a setting and SciFi trappings, inclduing spacecraft, but it chucks in a bunch of Cthulhu Mythos stuff that most gamers don't want with their SciFi. I don't bllame the peoplebehind CR for doing so. It's a nice extension to CoC, but how many people who want a SciFi game are buying CR and removing the mythos stuff?

As has been pointed out many times, BRP is lacking in the SciFi genre. Compare it to any other "generic" RPG system. Yes it is something that can be fixed with a good supplement, but it hasn't happened yet.

That isn't what you complained about. You specifically brought up the following as problems with BRP doing Sci-Fi:

It's not just the laser guns and spaceships, it's all the other fiddly bits of technojunk that are ubiquitous in a SciFi setting. Comm gear, emergency medical packs, handheld scanners, handheld computers. All the piddling stuff that makes the setting feel futuristic (and would probably be left behind or thrown out when people moved).

which it did pretty well.

Ian

[Atgxtg]

That isn't what you complained about. You specifically brought up the following as problems with BRP doing Sci-Fi:

which it did pretty well.

Okay, granted CR did-at least good enough to handle it's setting. . But that doesn't help BRP very much, and my comment was directed against BRP. If somebody took CR, got rid of the Cthulhu Mythos, and printed the tech stuff as generic SciFi add on for BRP we'd all have something to work with. But as it stands, SciFi is poorly supported in BRP.

[pansophy]

Don't know. I find the Operation Ulysses adventure is pretty enough to provide needed SciFi equipment. p131-154 covers equipment, guns & vehicles. From there on you find many different species a PC can play until the chapter ends on p177.

To me this is a lot and can keep me going for a long time. True, ONE Monograph is nothing compared to the many Fantasy stuff that is around, but I find it very exhaustive. Yes, no starships, no tanks, etc. but these are plot devices anyway or are on a different sheet altogether.

BTW: is the person who wrote that monograph active on the forum ?

@Atgxtg: what's the status of your vehicle construction kit that you had in planning? That would be a further step towards SciFi support for BRP.

[Eric L. Webb]

BTW: is the person who wrote that monograph active on the forum ?

im active...sometimes

[SDLeary]

im active...sometimes

Bwa Ha Ha Ha Ha!

SDLeary

[Atgxtg]

Don't know. I find the Operation Ulysses adventure is pretty enough to provide needed SciFi equipment. p131-154 covers equipment, guns & vehicles. From there on you find many different species a PC can play until the chapter ends on p177.

Is Operation; Ulysses a CR adventure?

To me this is a lot and can keep me going for a long time. True, ONE Monograph is nothing compared to the many Fantasy stuff that is around, but I find it very exhaustive. Yes, no starships, no tanks, etc. but these are plot devices anyway or are on a different sheet altogether.

I think BRP needs a genric SCFi sourcebook. MAybe the stuff the O:U or CR could be ported over sans setting. And I do think something is neeeded for starships and that they are more than just plot devices. Plently of SciFDi setting have starship combat, and we need somee sort of rules to allow that in an RPG. The rules could be an entension of the BRP vehicle rules, the old RQ ship ruules, and extension to the BRP Mecha rulees, or something else entirely. But BRP needs something.

Over the years Chaosium just didnt cover ScFi as well as they covered Fantasy and modern day and it left a blank spot in the toolkit. A GM wanting to set up a ScFi game is not going to find much help in the BRP Gold Bopk.

@Atgxtg: what's the status of your vehicle construction kit that you had in planning?

Unfortunately, like me it is stuck in limbo. Due to ecomonic difficulties I'm in the process of moving and most by notes are packed away.

That would be a further step towards SciFi support for BRP.

Yes, it would. At ;east as far as vehicles go. And to a certain extent, weapons. But until I can stabilize some things in the real world, I doubt I7ll get much chance to work on the vehicle stuff.

[vagabond]

I think between Ringworld/Ringworld Companion, Cthulhu Rising, Operation Ulysees, and End Time, you can pull out enough info to get a good generic Sci-Fi supplement. Might also be worth looking at the 2300AD conversion.

Ian

[rust]

I think between Ringworld/Ringworld Companion, Cthulhu Rising, Operation Ulysees, and End Time, you can pull out enough info to get a good generic Sci-Fi supplement.

Not really, partially because those systems are not compatible (the Ringworld tech-

nology is significantly different from the Cthulhu Rising technology, etc.) and partial-

ly because there would still be no design systems for starships, vehicles and all the

other stuff. Unfortunately technology is a key element of science fiction, and in or-

der to attract science fiction gamers a game therefore needs a much better treat-

ment of technology than the various versions of BRP can currently offer. Right now

an attempt to sell BRP as the system for science fiction campaigns is similar to try-

ing to sell a fantasy roleplaying game without a magic system.

[King of Old School]

I think (hope!) River of Heaven will do a pretty good job of bringing SF into the BRP fold.

KoOS

[vagabond]

Not really, partially because those systems are not compatible (the Ringworld tech-

nology is significantly different from the Cthulhu Rising technology, etc.) and partial-

ly because there would still be no design systems for starships, vehicles and all the

other stuff. Unfortunately technology is a key element of science fiction, and in or-

der to attract science fiction gamers a game therefore needs a much better treat-

ment of technology than the various versions of BRP can currently offer. Right now

an attempt to sell BRP as the system for science fiction campaigns is similar to try-

ing to sell a fantasy roleplaying game without a magic system.

While I agree that the lack of vehicle design is an issue, the differing technology isn't since technology should vary. After all, we cannot expect uniform technological breakthroughs throughout the universe.

However, a nice Sci-Fi supplement would be nice.

Ian

Edited April 30, 2012 by vagabond

[pansophy]

To an extend all Technology in a SciFi setting is generic. The Tech Level only defines how small things are and how more advanced some things are. A First Aid kit will still do the same at all Tech levels. So will a weapon. You simply need to change the name and maybe add some fluff how it works.

The major problem with SciFi is, it cannot be generic. Some people want magic in it, others a hard SciFi setting, and then some want Space Opera where everything is over the top. Generic can only be "generic" to a point. The rest is fluff which has to be added by the GM.

So, yes, when you use O:U as a core (there is NO setting in the book), you can easily create an other setting with it's help. It is mostly generic. Rename the races, add something to it - done! It's not that hard.

If you say there is not much available you can play right out of the box: I agree. There are a hand full of settings available, some out-of-print, and they do not cover all types of styles. But it is still more than in 1980, where ONE book of Star Frontiers gave you the frame for a whole world ... sure, time has moved on, but saying BRP does not offer enough out of the box for SciFi is not right. It offers the framework, and the GM has to add to it.

I never had any problem with "things are not defined" when running a BRP SciFi setting. Mostly the players came up with stuff they are looking for, and I simply allowed them to look for that. After finding it, we jotted down some outlines how it works and what is special about it, and then moved on. Each player had a different perception of the setting anyway ...

Sometimes I think people feel constricted by "what is printed down" and fail to use their imagination for what "is not in the book". I do not want to offend anybody with this, but in a world where you can buy well thought out settings with a dozen of setting books, this simply limits our imagination and we forget to use it, we forget to be creative.

For BRP, in my opinion, the rules are there, all that is missing is a bit of fluff which can be created on the fly. Biggest problem is a good setting that sets the frame. There is no big picture that people can imagine and later work out the details by themselves. Even in the original three Star Wars movies technology is not well thought out - it is simply there and after the movies made a fan base, people sat down and tried to explain the underlying technology. But for the movie, stuff simply worked and fulfilled a purpose. No need for details.

These days everybody is using the Internet, but nobody really knows how it works in detail. And there is no need for it. Use it, move on with the story - that's important. In a Fantasy setting this works and nobody complains. You just say "the machine is run by magic" and all is good. No questions. No explanations. But when running a SciFi setting, people come up with "my character should know how this works in detail". Fact is: No. He knows how to use it, but not how it is created. He might know how to fix it, which parts do what, but he will not have a clue how it works in detail.

Anyone trying to proof me wrong explain me the function of a finger print scanner in detail. Or a bluetooth dongle.

What I want to say: come up with a setting, frame it and leave the details to the players. They decide how the world looks like and functions on a tech level. Create a plot, move along, keep flying.

Yes, no vehicle rules and stuff for starships. Use boardgames for that if you feel the need. It's a nice break from RPG's anyway.

Edited April 30, 2012 by pansophy

[NickMiddleton]

...What I want to say: come up with a setting, frame it and leave the details to the players. They decide how the world looks like and functions on a tech level. Create a plot, move along, keep flying...

This. A thousand times this.

Cheers,

Nick

[rust]

While this works well with an experienced referee and proactive players, you

only have to take a look at any one of the science fiction game forums and

to read the newbie questions there to see that a lot of people are convinced

that they need the details of a comprehensive system to run the game, like

the range of missiles, the speed of vehicles, the mass of that piece of equip-

ment, and so on, because this is what their players ask them for. It is easy

to decide such things on the spot, but without experience and foresight it is

also easy to run into inconsistencies and contradictions within a rather short

time, and these in turn tend to lead to lots of debates and a damage of the

suspension of disbelief. So, yes, one can design and play a campaign of any

genre with a minimum of published material, or even completely without it -

but do not expect a newcomer or someone with some experience with a de-

tailed system only to succeed at it and have fun with it.

[Mankcam]

Sometimes I think people feel constricted by "what is printed down" and fail to use their imagination for what "is not in the book". I do not want to offend anybody with this, but in a world where you can buy well thought out settings with a dozen of setting books, this simply limits our imagination and we forget to use it, we forget to be creative.

Yes, this is getting back to the basics of 'role-playing' over 'rule-playing'. Characterisation and narrative play is what interests me, not all the fiddly specy stuff. I can get that spec fix from MMOs and PC games, and it's not really what I look for in the role-playing hobby.

There is certainly a charm in the 'less is more' approach. I really like having my Cthulhu 6E and BRP BGB, but a part of me misses the simplicity of the slim rulebooks of the earlier Call of Cthulhu editions over the current Cthulhu and BRP tomes of today. They just seemed much more freeform than the current editions, which actually encouraged lot of creativity. Maybe it's just a 'limbic' thing though

Despite this, I do see an opening for a very detailed BRP SciFi supplement with equipment lists and whatnot, and Hard SciFi is probably the only setting I'ld want to have nutted out at this level. Hard SciFi without all the techie stuff is, like Rust said, like Fantasy without magic, well High Fantasy in any case. It just goes like Peaches n Cream. If it ain't Hard SciFi then its just Pulp Space Adventure and its more flavour than detail, and you wouldn't need to look much beyond the BGB to portray this.

I certainly wouldn't want to run or play in ANY setting where equipment and stats overtook the emphasis of actual role-playing. It's just not what I signed up for.

Edited May 1, 2012 by Mankcam

[Atgxtg]

To an extend all Technology in a SciFi setting is generic. The Tech Level only defines how small things are and how more advanced some things are. A First Aid kit will still do the same at all Tech levels. So will a weapon. You simply need to change the name and maybe add some fluff how it works.

No, not at all. As technology improves things are invented that can do things that simply weren't possible before. It is more that just speed and miniaturization. And there are lots of ramifications that go along with all that.

A first aid kit from 1000 years ago simple does not do the same things that such a kit does today. Today such kits contain things designed to keep a wound from going septic.

Similar ramifications exist in setting where magic or superpowers exist. The ability to raise the dead, halt aging, or cure the plague have major effects upon a setting beyond that of just being a better band-aid.

The major problem with SciFi is, it cannot be generic. Some people want magic in it, others a hard SciFi setting, and then some want Space Opera where everything is over the top. Generic can only be "generic" to a point. The rest is fluff which has to be added by the GM.

No. That's no more true of SciFi than it is of any other genre. You can't have generic Fantasy or Generic Modern Day either. Any setting needs to be detailed by somebody if it is going to be worth a damn, no matter what genre it covers.

But a game system needs the components tools to make it work. If you are going to cover melee combat then you need weapons and weapon stats. if the game is going to cover magic, then it needs some magic rules. A generic RPG system that is supposed to cover SciFi needs to cover those things that go with SciFi.

So, yes, when you use O:U as a core (there is NO setting in the book), you can easily create an other setting with it's help. It is mostly generic. Rename the races, add something to it - done! It's not that hard.

If you say there is not much available you can play right out of the box: I agree. There are a hand full of settings available, some out-of-print, and they do not cover all types of styles. But it is still more than in 1980, where ONE book of Star Frontiers gave you the frame for a whole world ... sure, time has moved on, but saying BRP does not offer enough out of the box for SciFi is not right. It offers the framework, and the GM has to add to it.

Bull. BRP offers practically nothing for SciFi. Sure any GM can write thier own rules cover thing like stars, planets, spacecraft, aliens and so on. But they can do that for any system or even create their own.

BRP, as a toolkit, gives practically no tools or help towards such.

As far as Star Frontier goes. It was crap. And it belongs in the trash bin of RPGs. Lousy mechanics, lousy setting. All it was was a way for TSR to try and move into a part of the RPG field where they had no presence.

I never had any problem with "things are not defined" when running a BRP SciFi setting. Mostly the players came up with stuff they are looking for, and I simply allowed them to look for that. After finding it, we jotted down some outlines how it works and what is special about it, and then moved on. Each player had a different perception of the setting anyway ...

That is silly. Does somebody just define a cliff for the bad guys to fall off?Or do they redefine a bow, the impale rule, weapon ranges, or healing magic whenever they want to? No, you define those elements that are important to the game. You don't just ignore them.

Sometimes I think people feel constricted by "what is printed down" and fail to use their imagination for what "is not in the book". I do not want to offend anybody with this, but in a world where you can buy well thought out settings with a dozen of setting books, this simply limits our imagination and we forget to use it, we forget to be creative.

Bull. By that reasoning we should all dump BRP and play MUSHES where we don't have any rules to worry about because they might limit our creativity. I don't see you campaigning against having weapon stats or crusading for the removal of the magic rules because they limit and restrict. our options to use and portray magic in our games.

Let's not cover something for fear that it might restrict us?What utter crap. First off, no RPG would ever seen print with such thinking, and secondly, any GM can always ignore, alter or replace any rule, system or game mechanic.

That is precisely why BRP has so many different options. The original authors at Chaosium were not afraid to define stuff, and to replace stuff when they wanted to. All RPGs restrict out choices to some extent. It is a necessity. We all accept limits to what we can do, and how things work in order to have a shared RP expereince in a given setting and campaign.

For BRP, in my opinion, the rules are there, all that is missing is a bit of fluff which can be created on the fly. Biggest problem is a good setting that sets the frame. There is no big picture that people can imagine and later work out the details by themselves. Even in the original three Star Wars movies technology is not well thought out - it is simply there and after the movies made a fan base, people sat down and tried to explain the underlying technology. But for the movie, stuff simply worked and fulfilled a purpose. No need for details.

But an RPG isn't a movie. In a movie you don't need to know what sort of damage a lightsaber or proton torpedo does, since they will always work the way the creative staff wants them to. In an RPG you do, because the GM doesn't have that sort of control over the course of events. A player might be on the giving or receiving end of such a device and you are going to need a way to resolve the effects.

These days everybody is using the Internet, but nobody really knows how it works in detail. And there is no need for it. Use it, move on with the story - that's important. In a Fantasy setting this works and nobody complains.

Bull. In fantasy setting we have rules to cover things that characters do. BRP has several different magic systems. And people still complain.

Even going with your Internet analogy for a moment. To use the Internet somebody has to have some understanding of it, and what it can and can't do. And for somebody to run the Internet as a tool in a game, he has to be aware of what sort of functions it can be used for by a character, and how likely it is to do so, and what pitfalls might exist in doing so. Things like finding completely erroneous information, or having your credit card information stolen, or as BRP Central fans know, having your website hacked. To run the net a GM has to have some understanding of it.

. You just say "the machine is run by magic" and all is good. No questions. No explanations.

Maybe if you are running a bunch of drooling idiots who never do anything. Most players get kinda nosy about the ins and outs of something that just flash fried a PC. At the very least they want to figure out how to do it themselves. Have you read any of these BRP games? If somebody takes 1500 points of damage from a spell I guarantee you every player at the game is going to want a very good explanation as to how that is possible in BRP or any of it's variants.

But when running a SciFi setting, people come up with "my character should know how this works in detail". Fact is: No. He knows how to use it, but not how it is created. He might know how to fix it, which parts do what, but he will not have a clue how it works in detail.

How do you know he won't? That would depend on the character and what skills and abilities he has. And it has nothing to do with SciFi. Of somebody knows how to make a sword, bow, or a pair of shoes, it s because they have some knowledge about such things. They don't just pop up out of thing air. Somebody has to understand how the things work or else they would never exist.

Anyone trying to proof me wrong explain me the function of a finger print scanner in detail. Or a bluetooth dongle.

Why? It isn't important that you understand how they work in detail. But is is important that some people know how they work in detail.

But to use these devices you do need to have some understanding of what the devoices are, what they do, and how to use them. And that is precisely what BRP lacks for SciFi.

What I want to say: come up with a setting, frame it and leave the details to the players. They decide how the world looks like and functions on a tech level. Create a plot, move along, keep flying.

In light of Nick's response.

No, Not this, a million times not this.

Why? Because what makes one setting more interesting than another are those details. That's why most DD setting feel the same. What makes RPGs good is a combination of rules and setting. If the GM ignores both and leaves everything up to the players then you can wind up with a bunch of campaigns where everything is the same. Just look at how many D&D campaigns are essentially the same despite being run by different GMs each with their own "world".

I don't see anybody jumping up and complaining that BRP spolis the whole combat process for them by having detailed rules for things like attacks, parries, armor, and tracking injuries.

Yes, no vehicle rules and stuff for starships. Use boardgames for that if you feel the need. It's a nice break from RPG's anyway.

You're being rude and condescending. BRP covers things like cars, sailing ship, magic, and armor, yet that's okay. Talk spaceship and suddenly it's not an RPG anymore?

That's unfair and uncalled for. SciFi RPGs are just ad valid as FRPGs. A fantasy setting and magic rules do not hold some sort of moral high ground as far as roleplaying goes. I don't make fun of you for playing in setting that have elves, magic and dragons. I don't tell you to go stick you head back into your FRPG sandbox, pull out you magic wand and play with your dice, as a break from RPGing.

Take a look at games like D&D 4E and Decipherer's Star Trek RPG and tell me which one is the board game and which is the RPG.

Edited May 1, 2012 by Atgxtg