Using Legend/Mythras Combat Maneuvers with BRP?

[Tywyll]

Has anyone tried using the Combat Maneuver system from Legend/Mythras with standard BRP? If so, did you make any chances to it and how did it work out?

I was thinking that if I did use it, I wouldn't give maneuvers on normal successes, but you would gain one on a special and 2 on a crit. I don't like the idea of giving a maneuver on a regular success...it seems weird that every successful attack should allow you to choose your hit location. 

[lawrence.whitaker]

That isn't quite how they work. 

You need to score a level of success better than the opponent, with each level gaining an additional effect.

Thus, if A and B both attack and parry at a normal success, there is no effect awarded. If A scores a regular success, and B fails, then A gains an effect.

Mythras has Fumble>Fail>Success>Critical as its succession path; Specials aren't used. 

[g33k]

9 minutes ago, lawrence.whitaker said:

That isn't quite how they work. 

You need to score a level of success better than the opponent, with each level gaining an additional effect.

Thus, if A and B both attack and parry at a normal success, there is no effect awarded. If A scores a regular success, and B fails, then A gains an effect.

Mythras has Fumble>Fail>Success>Critical as its succession path; Specials aren't used. 

One is perhaps unsurprised that Loz can sum it up so elegantly!

😉 

Quick question, as I'm away from my books:  if I roll a Fail but my foe rolls a Fumble, what happens and does it differ from had I rolled a Success vs. the foe's Fail?

[lawrence.whitaker]

Quote

Quick question, as I'm away from my books:  if I roll a Fail but my foe rolls a Fumble, what happens and does it differ from had I rolled a Success vs. the foe's Fail?

Nothing happens. Both sides failed. Effects are only awarded for success.

[olskool]

I run a modified "skill tree" where Special Effects (hereafter SEs) are awarded at the following "success levels..."

1/2 Skill Level (rounding up) which I call a Special Success.

Outstanding Success which is 1/10th Skill (rounding up) and is the old Impale/Slash/Crush or Special Success. 

Critical Success (which is the same term I use) which is any DOUBLES rolled (counting 00 as zero, zero and not 100) that are under the Skill in question.

Fumbles are DOUBLES OVER the Skill roll needed (excluding 00 which is counted as zero, zero).  

If both parties roll an SE, I allow the option for BOTH SEs to apply in order to "spice up" my combats a bit.  Losing players (the one with the higher roll) also have the option to "reduce" the opponent's SE by a grade instead.   My SEs are divided into 3 tiers of "effectiveness" based on how damaging the results can be.  Criticals are reserved for the largest effects (sunder weapon/armor, compel surrender,  bypass armor) and the 1/2 Skill level is for the weakest (change range, press advantage, increase parry size).  This method of doing SEs works just fine and breaking down the SEs into 3 steps reduces "analysis paralysis" during play.  I have had zero issues implementing this system.

 

[g33k]

17 hours ago, lawrence.whitaker said:

Nothing happens. Both sides failed. Effects are only awarded for success.

Wait, but the one guy Fumbled.

Isn't there a "Specially Bad" Effect...?  I had thought there was.  Am I just misremembering?

 

[lawrence.whitaker]

There are effects that can be used against an opponent who fumbles, but you still have to have generated a success to trigger it. 

[g33k]

7 hours ago, lawrence.whitaker said:

There are effects that can be used against an opponent who fumbles, but you still have to have generated a success to trigger it. 

Ah.  I may have misunderstood that then.

In any case:  thanks, as always, for your excellent presence online!

[Tywyll]

On 4/9/2019 at 10:55 PM, lawrence.whitaker said:

That isn't quite how they work. 

You need to score a level of success better than the opponent, with each level gaining an additional effect.

Thus, if A and B both attack and parry at a normal success, there is no effect awarded. If A scores a regular success, and B fails, then A gains an effect.

Mythras has Fumble>Fail>Success>Critical as its succession path; Specials aren't used. 

Yeah, I know that. But since successful hit is blocked by successful parry/dodge, what I meant was every unblocked hit, or every successful hit in the normal sense of the word rather than the game term. 

It also didn't really help answer my OP. Anyone try it?

Edited May 13, 2019 by Tywyll

[lawrence.whitaker]

2 hours ago, Tywyll said:

Yeah, I know that. But since successful hit is blocked by successful parry/dodge, what I meant was every unblocked hit, or every successful hit in the normal sense of the word rather than the game term. 

It also didn't really help answer my OP. Anyone try it?

That's fair enough. The way you'd phrased things, it seemed you may have misunderstood the way differential levels work; we've had the question a couple of times before, hence my wanting to clarify.

[Runeblogger]

On 4/8/2019 at 6:46 PM, Tywyll said:

Has anyone tried using the Combat Maneuver system from Legend/Mythras with standard BRP? If so, did you make any chances to it and how did it work out?

I was thinking that if I did use it, I wouldn't give maneuvers on normal successes, but you would gain one on a special and 2 on a crit. I don't like the idea of giving a maneuver on a regular success...it seems weird that every successful attack should allow you to choose your hit location. 

I've been thinking something very similar to what's been mentioned, but maybe making a special be 1/3 or 1/2 of your skill.

[RogerDee]

If you wanted to add extra bits to it you could adopt Gumshoe's skill improvement system where once you reach (8?) in a skill you can pick a set of special abilities. This would allow you to incorporate arete from BRP Advanced Magic. So for evel x% after 75% you can pick a particular arete ability, e.g. Oliver Queen shooting three arrows at once.

[RosenMcStern]

13 hours ago, RogerDee said:

If you wanted to add extra bits to it you could adopt Gumshoe's skill improvement system where once you reach (8?) in a skill you can pick a set of special abilities. This would allow you to incorporate arete from BRP Advanced Magic. So for evel x% after 75% you can pick a particular arete ability, e.g. Oliver Queen shooting three arrows at once.

Actually, this is Revolution D100 slot system, too. For each 10% you have in a skill, you can learn a new "thing".

[RogerDee]

4 hours ago, RosenMcStern said:

Actually, this is Revolution D100 slot system, too. For each 10% you have in a skill, you can learn a new "thing".

Coolio, still slowly digesting Revolution but slow going due to work and exercise are killing me.(in that order).

It is good know tthis is included though. 

[soltakss]

8 hours ago, RosenMcStern said:

Actually, this is Revolution D100 slot system, too. For each 10% you have in a skill, you can learn a new "thing".

We use the Tens Unit for the number of slots, so someone with 47% in a skill has 4 slots. Nice and easy.

When we tried using the Mythras Combat Maneuvers in RQ3, our players were hit by Analysis Paralysis and didn't like them.

We are using an adapted form of Revolution and suddenly the players get them and use them all the while. It helps that I have just said that they get 1 Effect per Success Level above the opponent, with Failures getting none and an opponent's Fumble giving them one. It also helps that I have abandoned the idea of some having to score a Critical, which makes it easier to use. They tend to choose Ignore Armour, Ignore parry or Maximum Damage, but have used Drop Fie and Trip. One of the PCs has gained a Shillelagh which gives an Automatic Knockback, which he discovered in the last combat.