How your Glorantha varies?

[Topi.242]

While going through stuff about Jonstown and other nearby locations I began to think how much our Gloranthas actually vary? Already when it comes to Heortling/Sartarite culture there are so many different things to emphasize when describing various locations, not to mention many of the lesser described cultures like Fonriti, Doraddi or other Pamaltelan areas. So, especially the gamemaster, would be interesting to hear how you all would describe Jonstown for player characters stepping into the city for the first time. Jonstown of course is the obvious choice here thanks to the Starter Set. So, here is how I see that city:

"As you leave the gates of Jonstown and enter the city, you are shocked by how hectic and full of life the city is. Even compared to Nochet or Dunstop, though much smaller, it is just as or even more hectic and busy. The streets are surrounded by sturdy looking stone buildings with blue murals running across them and many of the buildings have stone or just wattle and daub additions build next to- or on top of them. Clotheslines hang in the alleyways between the houses and there are small paper lanterns hanging by the sides of the building lighting the streets as the sun begins to set. There is a strong intoxicating smell of incense, spices and roasting food floating around you. The streets are full of people in the move, coming or going to markets, temples or other gathering places. As some of the people walk past you or bump into you they stop to say something in Heortling, but most of them don't even bother to stay put and listen your response. There are also small groups of Lhankor Mhy scribes and philosophers gathered in small groups having lively debates while Issaries traders peddle their wares and Eurmali tricksters perform circus tricks and illusions for coins. There is also an old man sitting by the side of the road, completely nude and covered in blue body paint lifting his arms towards heavens in ecstatic prayer. Constant chatter, shouts, music, sizzling of roasting food and various indescribable noises fill the air with relentless cacophony. Livestock wander the streets freely, with herders occasionally nudging them forward towards the city gates.
Even with all of the dizzying scents, sounds and movement there seems to be a kind of comfortable unspoken order amid all the chaos in the city. Just like the independent and unruly nature of the Heortlings inhabiting the city, this city is very much alive and full of energy."

So yeah, to me Jonstown (and Wilmskirk and Svenstown) is kind of like a bronze age Heortling Varanasi. An unruly, disorderly, but at the same time very much sacred city constantly full of movement and change. In my Glorantha all of the four cities built by prince Sartar are sacred places of the Sartar (and thus Orlanth Rex) cult and similar apart from Boldhome because of its locations and the fact that it is the seat of power in Sartar.

So yeah, how does your Jonstown look and feel like?

(Sorry if there's mistakes since English isn't my first language...)

[Squaredeal Sten]

My Jonstown is not described so well.  But neither is it so crowded and busy.  I don't think there is a Canon description of those aspects ,  just descriptions of the city's size, major buildings, architecture in general, and leading personalities. 

My own impression of small cities in the 2000-5000 population range is less busy and crowded, even though my experience includes at least one that has changed little since the Middle Ages.  Perhaps I am biased by seeing so many modern American and European places in that range.  Even though I know that our streets are wider and our density lower than most ancient cities.

Of course my games' first descriptions of Jonstown were under Luar occupation, the one I remember best being in winter, so I was also inclined to describe it as dreary and cold.  The PCs being mostly fugitives it was desirable for them to minimize contacts.  And the skyclad Orlanthi would not have been there.

It does not bother me that your imagination is different from mine.  You do cool descriptions. More power to you.

Edited July 4, 2022 by Squaredeal Sten
Adding; then looked at spelling, my semesis.

[Topi.242]

Yeah, the lunar occupation in the previous editions of Runequest (or at least in the official material) would definitely have given the place a very much different feel. And yeah, the fact that there isn't really any description what it feels like standing in one of these places is where I guess most of the differences would come up.

[Scornado]

5000 people is a large village by UK standards these days, so not very big.  If the population were densely packed it really would not be large.

[svensson]

@Topi.242 Everyone's Glorantha varies from everyone else's. No individual referee and group of players is going to approach Glorantha the same way.

In my Glorantha, I'm very careful to have some 'reality checks' about pre-Renaissance life. I remind everyone that food is seasonal, for example. Roads are not straight and easy to travel... they're easier than trails certainly, but they're not paved highways.

I'm a historical reenactor. I did medieval for many many years and I do American Civil War now. So I bring out some of my old gear to show new players. I have a cuirboulli helm I made and show them what bull hide impregnated with oil and wax feels like. I show people who are used to polyester and fleece what a linen and wool tunics feel like. I show them how heavy a 'campaign weight' blanket is. I show them what a Civil War daily ration looks like and how that would translate into Bronze Age food.

Then I tell them, 'We can do encumbrance two ways. You can respect how heavy and bulky your gear is and not argue when I say that you're  tired, or I can make you account for ever single quarter-ENC point and we can do this mathematically. You're choice.'

As for the Jonstown clans specifically, well, it's complicated. Jonstown has had a mixed to slightly positive relationship with the Lunars. Some clans appreciate the work the Lunars put into to killing the Telmori werewolves. Some clans tried to stay neutral through their connections with Argan Argar and the Uz clans of Dagori Inkarth. Some were in outright rebellion, but without even the limited success that the Colymar of Clearwine had. So as I see it each clan ring is going to have a different view of Lunar converts and 'collaborationist' families based on the clan experience.

Two references that I highly recommend is the "RQG Starter Set" [the Adventure book fully details the city of Jonstown] and the HeroQuest book "The Coming Storm" [this book goes into the clan politics of the Jonstown Confederation tribes, especially the Red Cow Clan].

Edited July 5, 2022 by svensson

[Squaredeal Sten]

I believe the Starter Set gives the size of Jonstown both in population ( more in winter) and in area.   Yes, book 2 p.27; pop 2500 permanent plus 500 in winter.  Area about 25 hectares within the walls, 9 of which is in Upper City.

So about 100 people  per hectare = 100  square meters of ground  per person, or 10000 per square kilometer = 25900 per square mile.  Including housing, temples / public buildings, and roads.

Just to give us a feeling for it, compare this with modern RW cities:

New York NY. 27748 per square mile;   San Francisco CA 18790;   Chicago IL 11846;  New Orleans LA 12302 ; JerseyCity NJ 17775 per square mile;  Oxnard CA. 7574 per square mile;  Cambridge MA 19602 per square mile.

Source The Buffalo News web site which references the American Community Survey and US Census Bureau.

However the US is not particularly dense.  And we use a lot of our area for roads.  and almost as much for parking including driveways, garages, shopping center parking lots.  To understand our lack of density you have to ask what the population is in cars, not in people.😃

Let's look at cities in the rest of the world:

Mumbai, India 76,790 per sq mile;  Bogota Colombia 35 000 per Sq mile;  Manila, Phillippines 27 307 per Sq mile; St. Petersburg RU 22069 per Sq mile;   Monterrey Mexico 17303 per square mile;  London UK 13210 per square mile; Athens Greece 13963 per square mile 

Source, USAToday web site.

More Jonstown description:

Buildings mostly 1 or 2 stories.  Houses 15 meters on a side are common and 1/3 of the ground floor may be a shop.  Typically 3 ground floor rooms, upper floor indeterminate.   The poorest may sleep 8 to a room.

I visualize it as a house 15m x 15m, next to a street 3m wide.  A total of 270 square meters.  At 100 square meters per person that means 2.7 people live there!

If half the city's area is taken up with temples, the library etc. (where IMG some people do live) as well as the rocky slopes under the merchants' quarter, they let's say about 5 people live in that house.  On average, not describing  the spacious quarters of the rich and the crowded quarters of the poor.

 

 

Edited July 4, 2022 by Squaredeal Sten
house and street description

[svensson]

@Squaredeal Sten is absolutely right.

I live in the very West of the US, Washington State, and we get a lot of international travelers here. The VERY FIRST thing a visitor comments on is how much space the US has. How much space is allotted to each individual and each household is a source of amazement. And this is especially true for people from high population density countries... Japan, Indonesia, most of Western Europe... but it I hear it from people from PR China, and even Russia as well.

The best comparisons on population density in a Bronze Age context is to look at the City of Rome during the Republic, Thebes or Memphis of Pharaonic Egypt or one of the metropolises [metropolii?] of Han China. Over 300,000 [and at times a solid *million*] people jammed into the city with entire regional provinces devoted to feeding that city. This is the best comparison to this for a major urban area in Glorantha would be Glamour or Nochet.

Sartarite cities are much smaller by comparison and much less sophisticated in terms of roads, taxation, and other systems to support high-density living. Boldhome might have as many people as Athens or Alexandria in Egypt. And Jonstown and Clearwine might be equivalent to Knossos in Minoan Crete or perhaps Petra in its heyday.

Yes, I realize I'm playing fast and loose with the examples... they cover the vast majority of human history from the advent of agriculture to beginnings of Humanism. But I'm trying to hit the touchstones of places we've all heard of, rather than being exact with obscure references.

Edited July 5, 2022 by svensson

[JRE]

An interesting source, which a cursory search shows that only one is available in English and extremely expensive, is the work of Jean-Claude Golvin. I have a couple of his books and they are great. They really bring the cities to life, although you only need to visit some existing old quarters to feel it. Algiers, for instance. 

Check the example images in Amazon. 

[Kloster]

10 hours ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

Mumbai, India 76,790 per sq mile;  Bogota Colombia 35 000 per Sq mile;  Manila, Phillippines 27 307 per Sq mile; St. Petersburg RU 22069 per Sq mile;   Monterrey Mexico 17303 per square mile;  London UK 13210 per square mile; Athens Greece 13963 per square mile 

Paris (France, not Texas) is 53,188 hab/sq mi  (20,544 hab/sq km in 2021).

10 hours ago, svensson said:

The best comparisons on population density in a Bronze Age context is to look at the City of Rome during the Republic, Thebes or Memphis of Pharaonic Egypt or one of the metropolises [metropolii?] of Han China. Over 300,000 [and at times a solid *million*] people jammed into the city with entire regional provinces devoted to feeding that city. This is the best comparison to this for a major urban area in Glorantha would be Glamour or Nochet.

Imperial Rome was said to be 1385 ha for 300,000 to 1,000,000 inhabitants (depending on sources, Marc Bloch giving 255,000). That gives us 21,600 hab/sq km or 56,000 hab/sq mi (for 300,000 hab). This is equivalent to current Paris (that has lost 1,000,000 inhabitants in 1 century), and required a whole country and part of an empire to be fed.

10 hours ago, svensson said:

Boldhome might have as many people as Athens or Alexandria in Egypt.

Around 400BC, Athens was roughly 160,000 inhabitants (including slaves) for roughly 3.5 sq km for 45,700 hab/sq km or 118,350 hab/sq mi. This is more than twice as densely populated as current Paris, and required whole Attica to be fed.

[Squaredeal Sten]

4 hours ago, Kloster said:

Paris (France, not Texas) is 53,188 hab/sq mi  (20,544 hab/sq km in 2021).

Imperial Rome was said to be 1385 ha for 300,000 to 1,000,000 inhabitants (depending on sources, Marc Bloch giving 255,000). That gives us 21,600 hab/sq km or 56,000 hab/sq mi (for 300,000 hab). This is equivalent to current Paris (that has lost 1,000,000 inhabitants in 1 century), and required a whole country and part of an empire to be fed.

Around 400BC, Athens was roughly 160,000 inhabitants (including slaves) for roughly 3.5 sq km for 45,700 hab/sq km or 118,350 hab/sq mi. This is more than twice as densely populated as current Paris, and required whole Attica to be fed.

More food than that.  I've read that they imported grain from thr Black Sea area. Yes, modern Ukraine.

[svensson]

Well, gents, I'm trying to limit my example to pre-Renaissance cities.

My reason for this is simple... they had primitive supply systems. Dirt roads, no longitudinal navigation for sea travel, information travels at the speed of horses and isn't always accurate, etc. etc. etc.

I grant you that the supply network of Knossos isn't going to be as sophisticated as Memphis Egypt at the same comparative level of development. Knossos relied on a fairly infertile island and what came in from the sea, whereas Memphis had an incredibly fertile river valley and an entire caste of professional bureaucrats to manage the yield. But that's the point... Some societies in Glorantha are more sophisticated than others and are capable of greater things because of it.

[Qizilbashwoman]

22 hours ago, Squaredeal Sten said:

A total of 270 square meters.  At 100 square meters per person that means 2.7 people live there!

In a lot of bronze-age communities, and even into the premodern era, many of the things we associate with a personal home was actually focused in communal space. Some of what was described for these communities might be our modern bias.

For example, cooking was often done on a large scale. Sometimes an entire community ate at one location, meaning that homes had only small food preparation areas for fresh items, snacks and the like. A couple ways this was arranged was a professionally paid staff, which is why the "barmaids are mentioned unusually frequently" is an entire mood. In fact, these were not servers per se, they were the (predominantly women, because of bacteria...) workers who prepared food and drink for everyone. This might either be at what we call "taverns" or at a temple. People slept in the taverns on beds, either with partners or alone, and beer and similar beverages (like kvass) were crucial as a source of clean water. The alcohol levels of most beers or wines was naturally or artificially reduced to a tiny percentage. Even Muslims largely permitted (and permit) drinking kinds of weakly alcoholic beverages, because they were just antibacterial techniques, not intended to inebriate.

Sumer gives us examples of large-scale social mobilisation where individual homes were just for sleeping and taking private time. The rest of the time you'd literally sleep and live in the temple or "tavern". This freed up the vast majority of women and men for other kinds of work: educated, shepherding, grain work, child management, caring for the ill and disabled, and construction. If you want literacy and art, you need people with free time. The idea of the individual family is a super alien one to almost all of human history, it's terribly inefficient to have everyone cooking their own meals and living alone. Cooking and laundry would take massive effort; easier to have laundry and food service workers than each "household" do their own.

And even in the modern era, as I've discussed in the past, communities lived in communal settings like longhouses all over the entire world, from China to the Caucus to the the entire New World.

[Squaredeal Sten]

The canon Sartarite norm for rural clans / villages  appears to be a multi-nuclear-family  longhouse.  They are going to be relatives, essentially you live with your brothers, sisters, and cousins throughout your life.  When the population of your stead grows enough you build a second longhouse.  So I can see your division of labor happening there.  The family will decide who cooks. Who weaves. Who watches the children. Etc.  Also who is plowing, who herds the sheep, who does carpentry.

Cities appear to me to be a different matter.  With a shop on the ground floor of an urban dwelling, a crafter may indeed live with extended family if they work in the same or related trades. But unrelated or distantly related apprentices or employees may also live in that house.   As for cooking, you might - but don't have to- follow the Roman pattern of an insula without family cooking and street shops where the cooking is done. That is in the Citizens of the Lunar Empire book for Glamour, not Canon but might as well be.  I have no idea whether Babylon or Ur followed that pattern.  I would like to hear from an archaologist.

Another RW pattern that would put more people living in that 15x15m house is outbuildings fior cooking as well as privies.  Even just an outside fire or fireplace.  Because those buildings take space.  In that case my estimate goes up from 5 to 8-10 in the house.  Anyway in the 1800s outbuildings for cooking were common  in Texas where I live because in summer you don't want to heat the house.   I can imagine a similar pattern in Pavis or Sun County.

But the Jonstown description referenced above indicates unrelated laborers living many to a room.  A more mobile society where poorer laboring members  are renters.  I will believe a division of labor for cooking but is it the boarding house model?

[Joerg]

Cooking with clay pots is a time-craving procedure - a clay pot next to a hearth fire takes about 24 hours to prepare a porridge. Metal pots or pans can be put closer to the flame or embers, though not to the extent cast iron or steel implements can, with copper taking higher temperatures than bronze.

If you don't mind significant losses, a skin cauldron can be used to boil water.

Orlanthi farm houses are built around the hearth fires. You get the most use of your domestic fuel by combining cooking and heating. Urban architecture may vary.

Baking is a communal thing, with a Gustbran fire rather than just a hearth fire. Having a separate baking house, with warm space for yeast to do its magic prior to baking, is the norm, usually shared between several households. In a city, bakeries may serve food stalls or they may take "commissions" of household cooking.

Fire is a hazard in cities, no matter how much masonry or clay is used in the construction, there will be flammable building material. Fire control is essential.

The fuel logistics probably make up a good part of urban transport. Charcoal is voluminous, but probably offers the best heat for mass ratio.

Edited July 6, 2022 by Joerg

[Squaredeal Sten]

11 hours ago, Joerg said:

Cooking with clay pots is a time-craving procedure -...

Baking is a communal thing, with a Gustbran fire rather than just a hearth fire. Having a separate baking house, with warm space for yeast to do its magic prior to baking, is the norm, usually shared between several households. In a city, bakeries may serve food stalls or they may take "commissions" of household cooking.

There are two alternatives to the oven:

First, flatbreads.  These just require a griddle of some sort, which may be a flat stone over the fire. 

Second, baking bread in a covered pot.  I have read that the Egyptians baked this way, which accounts for their drawing bread as conical loaves.  The pot was set in coals.  In the archaeological report I first saw,  was said that they made a low walled enclosure and set several pots in that fire.  But i see no reason that someone couldn't bake in one or two pots, at a lower scale of production.  Here are two references: 

https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/ancient-egyptian-bread/   scroll down to the picture of the pot and conical loaf.

  https://www.persee.fr/doc/paleo_0153-9345_1990_num_16_2_4530

And, by the way, you don't need a baking house for your oven.  I have seen outdoor ovens made of mortared stone, dating from the 1700s-1800s, at mission San Juan in San Antonio TX.  About waist or chest high, depending on how tall you are, and  open at one end.  I would guess that they could be blocked up in use to get the most from your heat.

[Baron Wulfraed]

12 hours ago, Joerg said:

Cooking with clay pots is a time-craving procedure - a clay pot next to a hearth fire takes about 24 hours to prepare a porridge. Metal pots or pans can be put closer to the flame or embers, though not to the extent cast iron or steel implements can, with copper taking higher temperatures than bronze.

That feels a bit on the long side. After all, what is a modern "slow cooker"? A clay pot surrounded by the equivalent of 3 100W incandescent light bulbs. They cook at around the boiling point of water. A fired clay pot should be able to take sitting fairly close to a fire -- after all, depending upon the clay, refractory pots are used to hold/transport MOLTEN METAL. However -- thermal shock is a concern. Don't splash a hot clay pot with cold water.

If one has to be concerned with metal pots being damaged by a fire, one is also going to be out of favor as cook as the contents will be hard/charred and inedible. So long as the pot contains water, the pot shouldn't get much above the boiling point of water.

[svensson]

There are a lot of alternatives to enclosed ovens.

Ember-baking was popular, as was 'sack-cooking' [putting the ingredients of a stew into a clean grazer [usually cow] stomach and boiling it in a green bark pot.

You can find A LOT of primitive cooking hints in any 'Rendezvous' or 'fur trader' how-to website or book. Mother Earth News has published a lot of old techniques and Native American folkways cooking techniques.

In addition, Townsend and Co. [a Colonial era store with extensive how to videos on youtube] is worth a look. They use every technique imaginable for open fires, semi-hearth survival fires, full hearths, enclosed ovens and a great deal in between. I highly recommend them for their intelligent, easy to follow, and non-political content. The only axe Townsend's has to grind is the history in and of itself and they do a wonderful job as historical technicians.

[Joerg]

Communal baking houses, or bakers allowing the community to submit commissions to the oven, are more fuel efficient than firing up baking fires everywhere. With a Gustbran cultist overseeing the structure the dangers of causing runaway fires ought to be minimized, too.

[JRE]

For many centuries in Spain each village had a baker, which not only baked bread, but also made roasts for all the neighbours as nobody had their own oven.  Having your own oven was a signifier of wealth, and increased the divide between rich and poor. That continues now, as many bakers still can be contracted for long roasts that are better handled in such a big oven, and the ovens are usually idle after the daily baking. Normally they used wood, holm oak or savin. 

In an Orlanthi settlement, I would expect the baking oven to be part of a temple, probably Ernalda, with her mastery of Gustbran. Some will require you to bring fuel, though rich temples may provide the service for free. When there is an "independent" oven, I expect that it is the centerpoint of an inn or tavern, as bread is the main foodstuff sold to travelers. Formal thanes may have also one and offer bread as part of their client network. Properly risen and baked bread is better and more digestive than flat or unleavened bread, so a clear benefit of larger settlements. 

[Squaredeal Sten]

6 hours ago, JRE said:

...... Properly risen and baked bread is better and more digestive than flat or unleavened bread, so a clear benefit of larger settlements. 

Re. "  more digestive" my experience differs.  Flatbread seems to get stale and hard or brittle a little faster, but when fresh it is very "digestive".  

I think the difference between cuisines that use a lot of flatbread vs more risen and thicker loaves is both cultural and the availability of ovens.  Flatbreads are quick and ovens are slow. It's a matter of which technique you learn from Mama as well as the time and capital invested in oven baking.  A crossover is Naan, a Flatbread made in a tandoori.

I do agree that oven baking is more suited to centralized large scale production.

 

 

[soltakss]

On 7/7/2022 at 7:58 AM, JRE said:

For many centuries in Spain each village had a baker, which not only baked bread, but also made roasts for all the neighbours as nobody had their own oven.  Having your own oven was a signifier of wealth, and increased the divide between rich and poor. That continues now, as many bakers still can be contracted for long roasts that are better handled in such a big oven, and the ovens are usually idle after the daily baking. Normally they used wood, holm oak or savin. 

My Mum remembers her Dad taking the Sunday Dinner down to the Bakehouse, then popping into the pub. She used to go and fetch the cooked dinner and pick him up from the pub on the way back. So, the same applied to rural England in the 40s.

 

[Monty Lovering]

You did ask…

OK I treat canon as the myths of the Greeks about the world and gods were to the real world. Except of course the gods are real.

So my Glorantha might be round. Myths say it isn’t. Mountains definitely disappear below horizon but there’s a theory that explains that on flat worlds. 

Gods are immensely powerful but might be part of a continuum of Runic and magical adeptness rather than a different class of being. Might be. But they’re not omnipotent or omnipresent. They don’t know you do wrong unless your guilt or someone else give you away.

My Glorantha is IronPunk. Just like SteamPunk has anachronistic technology in a Victorian setting, IronPunk has anachronistic technology in a Bronze Age setting. Dwarves have gunpowder and steam power, hell humans got that advanced in the Clanking City. But anachronistic items are rare and viewed as magical.

Iron is common place and forging low quality iron article possible. But it’s not better than bronze in that state. And any more than the weight of a spear head in close proximity to your body and you can’t cast magic. Trolls and elves don’t take double damage from it but can have allergic reactions to it. Enchantment stops iron disrupting magic, and the secret of forging and tempering iron so it’s better than bronze is a guarded secret. It does mean you can slap an iron collar on someone if they’re your prisoner and they can cast magic. Only way slave economies with magic work in my head.

There’s more but I need to sleep. 
 

[svensson]

Well, here's where the manifest presence of magic seriously changes everyday life...

Firstly, few Orlanthi households have a problem getting a fire lit, as every initiate of Ernalda gets the Ignite spell for free. I point this out because as a reenactor I've only ever gotten a bow-and-friction-board fire lit twice, and I've NEVER gotten a flint and steel fire to go. Just don't have the knack [or 'knap' maybe 😆] for it. And it takes quite awhile to get a friction fire lit in shelter and a heck of a lot longer in weather.

Secondly, fuels are less of an issue, though not totally absent as one. Because of the Gustbran subcult's influence, seasoned cured wood and charcoal are not as vital in getting food cooked. This does NOT mean that these issues aren't important, however. Glorantha is still 'a world lit only by fire', to paraphrase William Manchester's book title. 'Cooking' requires heat and the Gustbran cult can't supply that by itself. Gustbran makes fires more efficient, using less fuel for greater heat, but that's all. You still need people out in the woods lumbering to support the needs of thousands of people. While most Orlanthi don't have a good relationship with the Aldrya cult, it can safely be assumed that Ernalda demands that trees are planted to replace those taken. So there is a basic forestry ethos in Sartar /Esrolia. Grazelanders and Praxians, hmmm -- not so much.

[BTW, yes, I'm fully aware that there are Light spells. The Manchester quote was just a turn of phrase]

[Darius West]

On 7/4/2022 at 5:46 AM, Topi.242 said:

While going through stuff about Jonstown and other nearby locations I began to think how much our Gloranthas actually vary?

Fazzur's Duck Hunt was 100% effective.  There was a terrible massacre at Lookout Island with the help of Delecti who voluntarily became a Lunar client as a result.  Those ducks who sought refuge among the Beast Folk were hunted and lured out by contrived methods that came close to starting an all-out-war with the Beast Folk and the Lunars, but Ironhood demurred. Subsequently the price for ducks was raised, and the last of the ducks was exterminated in the Big Rubble in 1616.  Duck feather eiderdowns became a rare and sought-after commodity in Glamour thereafter.  Some Sartarites lamented the passing of the ducks and railed against this Lunar genocide, but others of a more mercenary bent actively participated in the pogrom and became rich on Lunar silver in a time when Sartarites were poor.  Some say the extermination of the Ducks began the inexorable path to the Hero Wars in earnest, and the gods themselves were revolted by the atrocity.

Edited July 10, 2022 by Darius West