Time to Republish Dorastor

[soltakss]

5 hours ago, Godlearner said:

8 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Also, what year are you going with? The 1617 of Dorastor or the 1625 of "modern" time?

Its not any year specific, but in my mind I would say closer to 1625

Probably options for both.

I need to remember when the events from Cults of Terror were and build around those.

There is a lot of fun and games with Argrath and the Lunars in faraway Dragon Pass and that can have an impact in Dorastor.

[Akhôrahil]

5 hours ago, soltakss said:

Probably options for both.

I need to remember when the events from Cults of Terror were and build around those.

I checked up on this recently and did the timeline, and the main events are Hahlgrim’s War ongoing 1623-1625, the deaths of Bolthor and Hahlgrim in early 1625 and the subsequent crowning of Oddi, and victory and the slaying of Ralzakark in summer/autumn (most likely) of 1625. The Tower of Lead likely falls in 1624, which is a big deal for anything Spider Woods related.

Presumably the Sartarite transportation stops with the Windstop in 1621 and is never taken up again. I personally think The Windstop has serious but non-catastrophic effects on the weather in Talastar as Orlanth is weakened but not bound.

Edited May 28, 2021 by Akhôrahil

[Agentorange]

On 5/26/2021 at 11:53 PM, Godlearner said:

soltakss and I have also published Holiday Dorastor: Temple of Heads  https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/356993/Holiday-Dorastor-The-Temple-of-Heads?affiliate_id=66807

as further adventures in Dorastor. That does not have additional Riskland campaign stuff, but the one we are working on Holiday Dorastor: Spider Woods will and could be integrated with an existing Riskland campaign. After that we are working on Holiday Dorastor: Seven Hills. We are considering more, but got enough on our plates as is. 

All sounds like good stuff - being old fashioned I'll probably hang on for if you do some kind of POD/PDF combo. I know soltakss is working on a POD version of Secrets of Dorastor which I keep checking on in case it's become available.

[Akhôrahil]

10 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

I checked up on this recently and did the timeline, and the main events are Hahlgrim’s War ongoing 1623-1625, the deaths of Bolthor and Hahlgrim in early 1625 and the subsequent crowning of Oddi, and victory and the slaying of Ralzakark in summer/autumn (most likely) of 1625. The Tower of Lead likely falls in 1624, which is a big deal for anything Spider Woods related.

Presumably the Sartarite transportation stops with the Windstop in 1621 and is never taken up again. I personally think The Windstop has serious but non-catastrophic effects on the weather in Talastar as Orlanth is weakened but not bound.

Oh yes, and in 1625, after the war, there is colonization along the Sludgestream. The Oxhead temple is sending priests there to support settlement.

[soltakss]

22 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

I checked up on this recently and did the timeline, and the main events are Hahlgrim’s War ongoing 1623-1625, the deaths of Bolthor and Hahlgrim in early 1625 and the subsequent crowning of Oddi, and victory and the slaying of Ralzakark in summer/autumn (most likely) of 1625. The Tower of Lead likely falls in 1624, which is a big deal for anything Spider Woods related.

I am not too keen on moving time forward to after those events and having them in the background.

It is much better to have the Adventurers take part in those events and drive some of them.

Moving to 1625 means that these events have already happened, perhaps the Adventurers parent was involved in them. maybe we need an amended Family History that included being exiled to Dorastor and involvement in Hahlgrim's War.

22 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Presumably the Sartarite transportation stops with the Windstop in 1621 and is never taken up again. I personally think The Windstop has serious but non-catastrophic effects on the weather in Talastar as Orlanth is weakened but not bound.

The Windstop might enhance the transportation, as Orlanth can be worshipped in the Risklands, as it is out of the Windstop's area. Also, Orlanth is weak and the Lunars are strong, so they can exile more people.

12 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Oh yes, and in 1625, after the war, there is colonization along the Sludgestream. The Oxhead temple is sending priests there to support settlement.

Again, should be Adventurer-led and the Sludgestream needs to be cleansed.

16 hours ago, Agentorange said:

All sounds like good stuff - being old fashioned I'll probably hang on for if you do some kind of POD/PDF combo.

It needs to sell a lot more to get to that point.

16 hours ago, Agentorange said:

I know soltakss is working on a POD version of Secrets of Dorastor which I keep checking on in case it's become available.

It should be being carried by the Emperor's Couriers as we speak. I need to get it past the Guardian of the Door Who Sees All, though, so that I can check it. 

So, all being well it should come out in early June.

Edited May 29, 2021 by soltakss

[Akhôrahil]

37 minutes ago, soltakss said:

Moving to 1625 means that these events have already happened, perhaps the Adventurers parent was involved in them. maybe we need an amended Family History that included being exiled to Dorastor and involvement in Hahlgrim's War.

I was thinking the winter makes travel difficult and curtails Lunar activities (although they won’t be starving), and that the Lunars assume they’ve just won and don’t need to do anything except watch the population starve and freeze to death. 
 

On the other hand, it is reasonable to imagine that it could happen along better lines of communication, and the ”push” factor is immense. Extra-crappy conditions for anyone travelling, I’m sure.

[Akhôrahil]

I know it’s stated in LoT that Hahlgrim makes peace with Chief Renekot (who is Hakon’s son) and pays wergeld at some point, and that Renekot participates in the war and wins glory.

I’m picturing that the PCs in my 1617 campaign will be local small-h heroes and top-notch local experts and guides/advisors when the war arrives, and a valuable resources to Hahlgrim’s side.

Edited May 29, 2021 by Akhôrahil

[Godlearner]

One if the things we are doing is including previous experience for Spiderkin  in Spider Woods and Ogres in Seven Hills just in case you want to play something different or from a different angle.

[Akhôrahil]

12 minutes ago, Godlearner said:

One if the things we are doing is including previous experience for Spiderkin  in Spider Woods and Ogres in Seven Hills just in case you want to play something different or from a different angle.

Telmori for Risklands then, perhaps? Or is that in some other product?

Edited May 29, 2021 by Akhôrahil

[svensson]

I think that of all the 'Renaissance RQ3' material, 'Dorastor: Land of Doom' translates the best into this 'post-Dragonrise' history.

Almost nothing needs to be changed to fit the new political paradigm of the rise of Argrath. The Lunars still control Tarsh and still want access to the Homeward Ocean [although that's been put on the back burner as the Red Emperor has to deal with the renewed Sartarite threat], so none of that is really changed.

The two major plot-points in the overall scheme of Dorastor are:

a] answering the question, 'Is Ralzakark permanently dead' and what effect that might have

b] the effect of the Bilini War upon Renokot's Clan.

But the VAST majority of the book is perfectly usable once you account for rules changes, most importantly the Passions and Runic inspirations and accounting for changes in Rune magic.

And seriously, EVERY Rune Master needs to meet Adull Headshrinker and Mistress the Last...

[Godlearner]

4 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Telmori for Risklands then, perhaps? Or is that in some other product?

Not on the planning board ... yet.

[Agentorange]

8 hours ago, soltakss said:

It should be being carried by the Emperor's Couriers as we speak. I need to get it past the Guardian of the Door Who Sees All, though, so that I can check it. 

So, all being well it should come out in early June.

Excellent news !

[Nick Brooke]

On 5/29/2021 at 6:48 AM, Agentorange said:

All sounds like good stuff - being old fashioned I'll probably hang on for if you do some kind of POD/PDF combo.

We ask Jonstown Compendium creators not to make unnecessary work for DriveThruRPG staff with their pricing schemes. Our experience has been that if you offer a Print & PDF discount, early-bird PDF buyers may (reasonably enough) contact Customer Services asking for a discount or a refund on the printed book when it comes out (NB: they may or may not have bought it already), and those discounts and refunds are time-consuming to process, and have irritating knock-on effects on royalty statements (sales retrospectively vanishing, prior month totals changing, etc.). This is why we no longer offer Print & PDF discounts. Sorry to be a downer. Pretty sure Simon knows this already.

tl/dr: don't hold your breath waiting for a Print & PDF combo deal.

[soltakss]

9 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Telmori for Risklands then, perhaps? Or is that in some other product?

That would be in another supplement.

We are trying to keep each one in the 100-150 page range.

5 hours ago, Godlearner said:

Not on the planning board ... yet.

It's on my planning board, but not on yours, yet ...

8 hours ago, svensson said:

The two major plot-points in the overall scheme of Dorastor are:

a] answering the question, 'Is Ralzakark permanently dead' and what effect that might have

Yes, of course Ralzakark is permanently dead. Until he comes back or is brought back, of course.

8 hours ago, svensson said:

b] the effect of the Bilini War upon Renokot's Clan.

Yes, we should be covering this in more detail in future supplement. Also, waiting for the official take, which will be good to see.

For me, the Renekotlings could side with Bolthor, Hahlgrim or both, neither is not really an option due to the ties they have with the Bilini Clan. My guess is that some side with Bolthor and some with Hahlgrim. The ones that side with Bolthor will claim that they didn't know that he was a chaos-loving ally of Ralzakark.

In any case, when Hahlgrim and Oddi the Keen start the war against Ralzakark in earnest, the Renekotlings and Adventurers will be able to take part.

 

[soltakss]

2 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

This is why we no longer offer Print & PDF discounts. Sorry to be a downer.

It also denigrates the idea of Jonstown Compendium being primarily for PDFs.

"I am selling a PDF for $20, but will bring out a POD version soon". 

"Great, so are you going to offer your PDF for free when the POD comes out?"

"Er , no, because it costs $20.00".

"Everyone else throws in the PDF for free, why don't you?"

It implies that the PDF is worthless and the print edition is all that counts.

2 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

Pretty sure Simon knows this already.

I do indeed.

2 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

tl/dr: don't hold your breath waiting for a Print & PDF combo deal.

Exactly.

However, I am thinking that if someone sends me proof that they have bought the PDF and the POD version (Maybe in the form of a screenshot of the email from DTRPG acknowledging the order(s)) then I might send a small gift certificate out. 

That way, all the admin is down to me, I can vet each email for potential abuse and can stop it at any time if I feel that it is being abused. No extra work for DTRPG and, maybe, everyone is happy.

[Akhôrahil]

33 minutes ago, soltakss said:

Yes, of course Ralzakark is permanently dead. Until he comes back or is brought back, of course.

Fun thing is, the second (or is it third? I think it's third) time Oddi kills Ralzakark in maybe 1630, the text says "Final Death". Which means that either final death isn't really final, or there's something odd about the Unicorn Emperor of the Monster Empire and he's not - or at least not exactly - Ralzakark.

[svensson]

1 hour ago, soltakss said:

Yes, of course Ralzakark is permanently dead. Until he comes back or is brought back, of course.

Yes, we should be covering this in more detail in future supplement. Also, waiting for the official take, which will be good to see.

For me, the Renekotlings could side with Bolthor, Hahlgrim or both, neither is not really an option due to the ties they have with the Bilini Clan. My guess is that some side with Bolthor and some with Hahlgrim. The ones that side with Bolthor will claim that they didn't know that he was a chaos-loving ally of Ralzakark.

In any case, when Hahlgrim and Oddi the Keen start the war against Ralzakark in earnest, the Renekotlings and Adventurers will be able to take part.

 

Do we have a solid date for the Bilini War /Hahlgrim's War? Given that Cults of Terror's original pub date was way back in the RQ2 era [1981 to be exact], or ca. ST 1610-13 or in the timeline, my impression is that this occurred sometime between ST 1615-20. This places it before the current RQG ca. ST 1625 period. The latest solid date that I see in the 'Dorastor: Land of Doom' RQ3 supplement is the death of Hakon the Swimmer in 1611. This seems to support my rough ST 1615 estimate for the Bilini War.

[metcalph]

1 minute ago, svensson said:

Do we have a solid date for the Bilini War /Hahlgrim's War?

Lords of Terror gives Bolthor becoming King in 1622 ST.  There is a period of neglect which lasts several years until he's forced inot Halhgim's war which lasts three years.    A future history section, which is stated as one historian's version, says that Oddi provoved Ralzakark into invading the Empire in 1629 with him joining it.  He then kills Ralzakark after the failure of the invasion and the demise of the Bilini.  I think the 1622 date is kinda tight myself as for Bolthor to have drifted for many years and a three years Halhgim's war plus whatever years oddi ruled, we are blowing well past 1629 ST.

The Guide has Bolthor launching Halhgimr's war in 1623 (Guide p344) which gives Oddi ample time for a reign at the expense of Bolthor supposedly letting things drift.  

[Thoror]

I'm all down for republishing Dorastor as part of Runequest Classic. Also Sun County. They are important milestones in the history of Glorantha, more than interesting, and deserve the chance to be reborn for everyone who missed out.

[Agentorange]

5 hours ago, Nick Brooke said:

tl/dr: don't hold your breath waiting for a Print & PDF combo deal.

tl/dr ?

[Godlearner]

Quote

 9 hours ago, Godlearner said:

Not on the planning board ... yet.

It's on my planning board, but not on yours, yet ...

 

Ok, twist my arm, but at this pace you are never getting out of Dorastor.

 

[jajagappa]

1 hour ago, Agentorange said:

tl/dr ?

Too long; didn't read.  A shorthand for saying "and here's the short version".

[Agentorange]

8 hours ago, soltakss said:

"It also denigrates the idea of Jonstown Compendium being primarily for PDFs."

At risk of being exiled to garrison duty in Dorastor, I've never understood that decision - going by the number of requests and comments both here and at DTRPG it's clear that many people love a print version of a product, surely if there's a market there and you can turn a profit why not go for it ?

"It implies that the PDF is worthless and the print edition is all that counts."

I certainly wasn't expecting a free copy of the PDF and to be honest I don't think anybody should expect to get such a thing, , but a sort of combo deal where you get a SLIGHT discount for buying both ( but still allowing the author to turn a coin ) might encourage people to open their wallets a bit more. After all Chaosium themselves offer combo deals on some of their products at DTRPG.....

"However, I am thinking that if someone sends me proof that they have bought the PDF and the POD version (Maybe in the form of a screenshot of the email from DTRPG acknowledging the order(s)) then I might send a small gift certificate out. 

That way, all the admin is down to me, I can vet each email for potential abuse and can stop it at any time if I feel that it is being abused. No extra work for DTRPG and, maybe, everyone is happy."

Sounds like a possibility.

EDIT I really haven't got to grips with the multi quote function have I ?

 

 

Edited May 30, 2021 by Agentorange

[Nick Brooke]

DriveThruRPG is a digital seller, with a small sideline in outsourced print-on-demand. The PoD side of things is already more work for them, for less profit, so if anything happens that tips the scales further against print (like: a badly-printed book comes out and disappointed customers want refunds/replacements, or a badly-conceived bundle deal comes out and their customer support staff end up being overworked), they could withdraw it altogether. They have done exactly that to other community content programmes.

Chaosium does not want to do anything that might endanger its long and successful partnership with DriveThruRPG. That’s why we tell creators how it works, so they can conform to our partner platform’s reasonable requirements, and we tell customers how it works, to help manage their expectations.

[Agentorange]

9 minutes ago, Nick Brooke said:

DriveThruRPG is a digital seller, with a small sideline in outsourced print-on-demand. The PoD side of things is already more work for them, for less profit, so if anything happens that tips the scales further against print (like: a badly-printed book comes out and disappointed customers want refunds/replacements, or a badly-conceived bundle deal comes out and their customer support staff end up being overworked), they could withdraw it altogether. They have done exactly that to other community content programmes.

Chaosium does not want to do anything that might endanger its long and successful partnership with DriveThruRPG. That’s why we tell creators how it works, so they can conform to our partner platform’s reasonable requirements, and we tell customers how it works, to help manage their expectations.

All of which seems reasonable. Just for the sake of argument if DTRPG went " Argghh ! enough of this POD business a curse upon it all "  and said they they were only going to do PDF's would Chaosium allow people to do POD etc via someone like Lulu ? It's clear there is a market for POD products, so far I've bought:

Six Seasons in Sartar
The Duel at Dangerford
The Rostakori Clan
Sandheart Vol 1
Treasures of Glorantha Vol 1
Valley of Plenty

The deciding factor for me was that there was a POD product for each of these. I've gone straight PDF for some of my shorter purchases: Monster of the month, Petty Spirits etc etc