Chaos Spirit Cults ?

[Agentorange]

You don't see them referred to much and they don't seem to provide large numbers of subcults etc in the way non chaos cults do. But I take there are chaos spirit cults scattered across Glorantha providing rune and spirit spells ?

Would it also be fair to assume if I buy some of the Dorastor series products from the JC that I might see some of the aforementioned cults ?

Edited February 18, 2022 by Agentorange

[Brian Duguid]

Paging @soltakss re the Dorastor books!

[Richard S.]

I think Thed and Mallia's cults are technically just large spirit cults. The line between rune cult and spirit cult is more than a little hazy.

[Brian Duguid]

Some of the small cults at the back of the Lords of Terror would count as chaos spirit cults e.g. Vakalta, Sidana etc.

[Godlearner]

9 hours ago, Agentorange said:

Dorastor series products from the JC that I might see some of the aforementioned cults

Not so much.  There is one in Denarius_the_Minter (which is not technically a Holiday Dorastor supplement) but that's about it at the moment.

[soltakss]

16 hours ago, Brian Duguid said:

Paging @soltakss re the Dorastor books!

Thanks. For some reason I don't get an alert when paged, I'll check the Settings to see what I have turned off.

18 hours ago, Agentorange said:

You don't see them referred to much and they don't seem to provide large numbers of subcults etc in the way non chaos cults do. But I take there are chaos spirit cults scattered across Glorantha providing rune and spirit spells ?

Yes, absolutely.

There were a lot of Chaos Spirits from the Greater Darkness. Some have survived enough to provide spells to those foolish enough to worship them.

They are generally not powerful enough to have established cults, but can be contacted by Shamans and can form Spirit Cults.

18 hours ago, Agentorange said:

Would it also be fair to assume if I buy some of the Dorastor series products from the JC that I might see some of the aforementioned cults ?

Secrets of Dorastor has at least one, Wazhoo. The other Cults described could be worshipped as Spirit Cults.

The rest generally do not have Spirit Cults. However, enterprising Shamans could contact any of the deities described in those supplements and worship them in a Spirit Cult.

As to Cults, we describe the following Cults:

• Secrets of Dorastor: Cacodemon, Dagorma (Non-Chaotic), Dorasta, Golden Eagle (Non-Chaotic), The Great Gorp, Humakt, The Fiery Slime, Primal Chaos, Vivamort, Wazhoo.
• Holiday Dorastor Temple of Heads: Ronobe, First Incarnation of Then, Second Incarnation of Then, Third Incarnation of Then.
• Holiday Dorastor Spider Woods: Great Ancient Mother (Non-Chaotic), Krjalk, Primal Chaos, Temniless (Non-Chaotic), Vipalole (Non-Chaotic), Vivamort, Xentha (Non-Chaotic)
• Holiday Dorastor Seven Hills: Ancestor Worship (Non-Chaotic), Bendaluza (Non-Chaotic), Cacodemon, Dorasta, Dagorma (Non-Chaotic), Krarsht, Krjalk, Malia, Nandan (Non-Chaotic), Primal Chaos, Seseine, Urain (Non-Chaotic).
• Holiday Dorastor Krampuslauf: Krampuslauf (Non-Chaotic)
• Holiday Dorastor Joulupukki: Joulupukki (Non-Chaotic)

All of those could be contacted by Shamans to form Spirit Cults.

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by soltakss

[Godlearner]

12 hours ago, soltakss said:

All of those could be contacted by Shamans to form Spirit Cults

That's an interesting question. I can see that done for some cults, perhaps through Ancestor worship, but others .... I am not so sure. Do you mean perhaps through a spirit or a being associated with the deity? For example, a succubus to access Seseine magic? How do you see that working?

[Akhôrahil]

12 hours ago, soltakss said:

Ancestor Worship (Non-Chaotic),

Depends on your ancestors, though? 🙂

[Shiningbrow]

On 2/19/2022 at 1:20 AM, Agentorange said:

You don't see them referred to much and they don't seem to provide large numbers of subcults etc in the way non chaos cults do. But I take there are chaos spirit cults scattered across Glorantha providing rune and spirit spells ?

That's because no-one in their right mind would worship a chaotic spirit... 

[Agentorange]

1 hour ago, Shiningbrow said:

That's because no-one in their right mind would worship a chaotic spirit... 

Chaotic creatures would. Lunars with their ambivalent attitudes to chaos might, possibly someone who is illuminated might.

Edited February 20, 2022 by Agentorange

[soltakss]

9 hours ago, Godlearner said:

That's an interesting question. I can see that done for some cults, perhaps through Ancestor worship, but others .... I am not so sure. Do you mean perhaps through a spirit or a being associated with the deity? For example, a succubus to access Seseine magic? How do you see that working?

No, I mean a Shaman contacting the Deity and instigating worship for a small community.

Have a look at the Spirit Cult section of Cult Compendium (p28) for more details.

3 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

On 2/18/2022 at 5:20 PM, Agentorange said:

You don't see them referred to much and they don't seem to provide large numbers of subcults etc in the way non chaos cults do. But I take there are chaos spirit cults scattered across Glorantha providing rune and spirit spells ?

That's because no-one in their right mind would worship a chaotic spirit... 

As Agentorange says, chaos creatures are happy enough to worship Chaos Spirits.

So are other people. In Secrets of Dorastor, Wazhoo grants Slay Wolf, which is a useful spell against Telmori, so enemies of Telmori might want to sacrifice for it.

[David Scott]

On 2/18/2022 at 5:20 PM, Agentorange said:

You don't see them referred to much and they don't seem to provide large numbers of subcults etc in the way non chaos cults do. But I take there are chaos spirit cults scattered across Glorantha providing rune and spirit spells ?

Yes. A few chaotic spirit cults have been detailed as mentioned:

Lords of Terror (1994): Vakaha, Sidana the Black Goat, Hungry Jack.

However, the real key is Thed shaman. They can effectively turn any spirit into a spirit cult if they have a shrine at least ten followers. Then it's up to the imagination of the GM to integrate that into their NPCs or storylines.

Also any chaos god can be accessed as a spirit cult, just pick one rune or spirit spell that the shrine gives. As a twist give them a similar name eg:

Keep it simple, just use the chaos rune to cast.

You can get a list of all spirit cults by clicking here

[Godlearner]

6 hours ago, soltakss said:

No, I mean a Shaman contacting the Deity and instigating worship for a small community.

Have a look at the Spirit Cult section of Cult Compendium (p28) for more details.

Quote

 If done successfully, then worshippers can sacrifice Power to the spirit, and in return receive limited, specialized Rune spells

Do you mean this part? It seems to me that that it would require a specialized location, one where a temple to this deity had existed at one time and the initial contact would not be to the deity directly, but rather to an intermediary with full worship only occurring once enough "initiated" are gathered.

I am not sure where I read this, but I believe that one of the reasons that the Lunars were able to win at Moonbrooth was the superiority of the Theology over the Praxian Shamanism. I just do not feel that this would be possible if shamans could access the same level of magic as organized cults.

[soltakss]

1 hour ago, Godlearner said:

I am not sure where I read this, but I believe that one of the reasons that the Lunars were able to win at Moonbrooth was the superiority of the Theology over the Praxian Shamanism. I just do not feel that this would be possible if shamans could access the same level of magic as organized cults.

The Lunars had Lodril Priests who could control the Oakfeds hurled at them by Oakfed Shamans.

Theism is not more powerful than Shamanism, but Shamanic Cults generally have fewer Runespells available that Theistic cults.

1 hour ago, Godlearner said:

Quote

If done successfully, then worshippers can sacrifice Power to the spirit, and in return receive limited, specialized Rune spells

Do you mean this part? It seems to me that that it would require a specialized location, one where a temple to this deity had existed at one time and the initial contact would not be to the deity directly, but rather to an intermediary with full worship only occurring once enough "initiated" are gathered.

That is part of it, but the while article is relevant to establishing ties with Chaos Spirits, and other spirits.

Basically, a Shaman needs to establish a Focus of Power that has a link to the Spirit to be worshipped, must Discorporate and contact the Spirit, convince the Spirit to accept worship, convince the Fetch to accept the Spirit, then have a congregation of at least ten worshippers to maintain the worship.

 

 

[Godlearner]

2 hours ago, soltakss said:

Theism is not more powerful than Shamanism, but Shamanic Cults generally have fewer Runespells available that Theistic cults.

And that is what makes more powerful. Not spell vs. spell, but Theistic cults have more members which is expressed as greater amount of magic and greater variety of Runespells, which leads to flexibility.

[Bill the barbarian]

On 2/20/2022 at 8:30 AM, Godlearner said:

I am not sure where I read this, but I believe that one of the reasons that the Lunars were able to win at Moonbrooth was the superiority of the Theology over the Praxian Shamanism. I just do not feel that this would be possible if shamans could access the same level of magic as organized cults.

Well, do keep in mind that the superiority the Lunars crew about might be a result of a very superior propaganda team!

 

On 2/20/2022 at 10:05 AM, soltakss said:

The Lunars had Lodril Priests who could control the Oakfeds hurled at them by Oakfed Shamans.

 

Ah right, forgot about them.

[Godlearner]

9 minutes ago, Bill the barbarian said:

Well, do keep in mind that the superiority the Lunars crew about might be a result of a very superior propaganda team!

Yes, we should always read what @Nick Brookewrites with that in mind 😈

But, in all seriousness, we are discussing this with RQ sight in mind, so it should not be subject to propaganda or perspective. 

[Nick Brooke]

Quite correct: our propaganda, like our magic, is clearly superior.