Spirit Spell - Glue

[Godlearner]

The last line of the spell description says

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to Glue two objects together, they must be at relative rest to one another

What defines at relative rest. If one is to place a Glue spell on the tip of a ladder and lean it to the side of a building, how long must one wait for it to work? 

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Glue never sticks to any living tissue or living organic material

Can it be used on undead such as Skeletons, Zombies, Ghouls and Vampires or anything else with a spirit in it assuming you can touch them and get them to stay still?

 

[Kloster]

9 minutes ago, Godlearner said:

What defines at relative rest. If one is to place a Glue spell on the tip of a ladder and lean it to the side of a building, how long must one wait for it to work? 

According to the RQ2 Cradle scenario, yes: There was (IIRC) rope ladders with hook and glue used by lunars to board during the Pavis assault.

[Godlearner]

2 minutes ago, Kloster said:

According to the RQ2 Cradle scenario, yes: There was (IIRC) rope ladders with hook and glue used by lunars to board during the Pavis assault.

Yes, that is why I am asking. I wish the timing was stated in terms of strike ranks or something like that. Because otherwise this spell begs to be used as a trap (to be stepped on)

[Kloster]

24 minutes ago, Godlearner said:

Yes, that is why I am asking. I wish the timing was stated in terms of strike ranks or something like that. Because otherwise this spell begs to be used as a trap (to be stepped on)

I've not thought to that. Now, thinking to it, glueing the sole of boots can be fun.

[PhilHibbs]

53 minutes ago, Godlearner said:

Yes, that is why I am asking. I wish the timing was stated in terms of strike ranks or something like that. Because otherwise this spell begs to be used as a trap (to be stepped on)

I think that the last line precludes that use. You use it to stick two things together that are touching and not moving at the time of casting.

[Godlearner]

Just now, PhilHibbs said:

I think that the last line precludes that use. You use it to stick two things together that are touching and not moving at the time of casting.

"rope ladders with hook and glue" are moving as well. How long does something need to be at a standstill for the Glue spell to catch hold?

[PhilHibbs]

9 minutes ago, Godlearner said:

"rope ladders with hook and glue" are moving as well. How long does something need to be at a standstill for the Glue spell to catch hold?

Oh yeah, it's touch isn't it.

Edited December 17, 2020 by PhilHibbs

[PhilHibbs]

This kind of question is why back in the day we would say that RuneQuest isn't a B&D game system. B&D stands for Bondage & Discipline, a set of rules with all the corners described in detail, numbers for this, distances for that, costs, punishments, all prescribed up front. D&D was considered somewhat B&D, and Rolemaster was the epitome of the classification. RuneQuest has never taken that approach. It takes "long enough to stick", that's how long it takes.

Edited December 17, 2020 by PhilHibbs

[Godlearner]

Maybe, but its a matter of consistency. In some cases they publish spells with examples and in other they just drop something vague and let the GM deal with it. Have you seen the new description of the Silence spell? Why mess with something that worked before? Just drives me up the wall.

[Scotty]

First imagine the Glue spell is magical super glue and works pretty much like super glue, except for mysterious reasons doesn't work on living stuff.

In any situation that you need to figure out how glue works, imagine a 5cm square of super glue.

On 12/17/2020 at 2:50 PM, Godlearner said:

What defines at relative rest.

Imagine you are trying to glue two things together. If both parts are on separate horses moving relative each other (and the riders took care not to wobble) you could glue the two halves of an object together. If the riders were charging at each other and only touch the two halves momentarily as they pass it wouldn't work. 

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If one is to place a Glue spell on the tip of a ladder and lean it to the side of a building, how long must one wait for it to work?

Instant. 

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Can it be used on undead such as Skeletons, Zombies, Ghouls and Vampires or anything else with a spirit in it assuming you can touch them and get them to stay still?

Skelleton - Yes, you could glue a broken skeleton bone together.

Zombies & Ghouls - depends what you wanted to glue, I'd let you glue their shoes on to stop them losing them.

Vampire - not sure what you would want to glue on to a vampire, but i'd let you glue a cape on to avoid it dislodging.

Overall, I'm much more interested in your storyline of why you want to glue things onto these creatures.

On 12/17/2020 at 3:07 PM, Godlearner said:

Because otherwise this spell begs to be used as a trap (to be stepped on)

Yes it can be a trap, it's temporal so it lasts for 2 minutes. To work the victim would to to step on and be stationary. They could walk or run over it. Likewise I've had players cast it on door knobs.

Edited December 20, 2020 by Scotty
added living stuff

[Godlearner]

Ok, lets say a PC is being chased by a bare footed undead, whichever type, or guards wearing sandals, and decides to use the Glue spell in a corridor as a trap to slow or stop the pursuit. Would that work or would the creature need to stop, such as to open the door, for that to happen?

[Baron Wulfraed]

5 hours ago, Godlearner said:

Ok, lets say a PC is being chased by a bare footed undead, whichever type, or guards wearing sandals, and decides to use the Glue spell in a corridor as a trap to slow or stop the pursuit. Would that work or would the creature need to stop, such as to open the door, for that to happen?

My interpretation would be that you'd have to cast the spell such that the foot/sandals and corridor floor are both in contact at the moment the spell goes off. One does not cast it on the floor, and then hope someone walks on it and gets stuck. IOWs: it is more like a contact cement (applied to both surfaces, and then sticks when the two surfaces are brought in contact), and NOT like fly-paper or rodent glue traps (in which one object is permanently sticky, and anything making contact will adhere to it)

[Akhôrahil]

Completely different question - what's the in-game reason for why the glue doesn't work on living targets? How does this even make sense? It's not exactly how actual glue works... what kind of glue works on corpses but not the living? You can most certainly superglue yourself, as many modellers will attest.

It feels incredibly "gamey".

Edited December 18, 2020 by Akhôrahil

[French Desperate WindChild]

9 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Completely different question - what's the in-game reason for why the glue doesn't work on living targets? How does this even make sense? It's not exactly how actual glue works... what kind of glue works on corpses but not the living? You can most certainly superglue yourself, as many modellers will attest.

It feels incredibly "gamey".

because the runes

 

[soltakss]

17 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

Completely different question - what's the in-game reason for why the glue doesn't work on living targets? How does this even make sense? It's not exactly how actual glue works... what kind of glue works on corpses but not the living? You can most certainly superglue yourself, as many modellers will attest.

It stops you gluing lips shut to stop the casting of spells, or gluing eyelids shut to stop seeing, that sort of thin.

Soltak Stormspear used to have Glue 9 and a 9 Point Enhancer, so could cast Glue 18, I used to have loads of fun sticking things together and assuming that nobody could overcome the huge STR that it generated. Using it with Extension in RQ2 was good, too.

We had a magic item in one campaign that allowed Glue to be used on living flesh.

[Nozbat]

20 minutes ago, soltakss said:

We had a magic item in one campaign that allowed Glue to be used on living flesh

Was it a Golden Goose?

I was thinking when reading this thread about what strength the Glue spell was in the Brothers Grimm Fairy tale... must have been way more than Soltak's

[Akhôrahil]

1 hour ago, soltakss said:

It stops you gluing lips shut to stop the casting of spells, or gluing eyelids shut to stop seeing, that sort of thin.

Soltak Stormspear used to have Glue 9 and a 9 Point Enhancer, so could cast Glue 18, I used to have loads of fun sticking things together and assuming that nobody could overcome the huge STR that it generated. Using it with Extension in RQ2 was good, too.

We had a magic item in one campaign that allowed Glue to be used on living flesh.

Yes, that’s the balancing meta-game reason, I get that, but what’s the reason people in Glorantha produce for explaining this incredibly weird property of the glue?

[Godlearner]

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Yes, that’s the balancing meta-game reason, I get that, but what’s the reason people in Glorantha produce for explaining this incredibly weird property of the glue?

Not really as this spell requires a touch, and I would require a POW vs POW roll for something like that as well.

[coffeemancer]

1 second

[soltakss]

On 12/17/2020 at 2:50 PM, Godlearner said:

What defines at relative rest. If one is to place a Glue spell on the tip of a ladder and lean it to the side of a building, how long must one wait for it to work? 

Whatever the GM thinks best and whatever works narratively in the game at that moment.

I have use the following.

• Player: I <do something>
• GM: Ok, roll <Skill> but with a penalty as it is difficult
• Player: OK

Instead of

• Player: I want to <do something>
• GM: Hang on, I'll check the rules. No, the rules don't say you can do that.
• Player: Oh

So, the Adventurer wants to stick the ladder to the side of the Cradle, fine, roll POWx5 but make it -20 because the ladder is moving a bit so it is harder to get right.

 

[Godlearner]

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Whatever the GM thinks best and whatever works narratively in the game at that moment.

Sure, that is GM style. It can apply to almost anything in the rules. Why even have rules? Why roll dice? Just freeform and tell stories.

[PhilHibbs]

3 hours ago, Godlearner said:

Sure, that is GM style. It can apply to almost anything in the rules. Why even have rules? Why roll dice? Just freeform and tell stories.

There's a long way between "I prefer slightly more to be detailed in the rules", which is fine as a position, and throwing a "Not everything is detailed therefore why just don't detail anything" tantrum.

[Godlearner]

1 minute ago, PhilHibbs said:

There's a long way between "I prefer slightly more to be detailed in the rules", which is fine as a position, and throwing a "Not everything is detailed therefore why just don't detail anything" tantrum.

Tantrum? I would say more of an extrapolation of "whatever the GM thinks best" as an answer. As a lot of people here, I been role playing for 40+ years and advice of just make it up as you go does not fly well with me. 

[soltakss]

1 hour ago, Godlearner said:

Tantrum? I would say more of an extrapolation of "whatever the GM thinks best" as an answer. As a lot of people here, I been role playing for 40+ years and advice of just make it up as you go does not fly well with me.

But, do we need to know how many Strike ranks it takes to glue two things together? Or, rather, should that be in the rules?

Personally, I don't really care as, to me, it is not really important.

Other people might care and would like it to be in the rules.

[Godlearner]

Maybe not to the strike rank detail, but at least something like "it has to touch for a round"