RQG Cults for Human Shamans

[Beoferret]

Hello all. So, the core rulebook for RQG lists Daka Fal, Waha, and Yelm as possible cults for assistant shamans (pg. 64). My main question is: are there other cults (from the ones listed in the core rules) that a shaman could potentially be associated with, especially in Sartar and/or Tarsh? I'm certainly interested in shamans as mediators between the living and ancestral spirits, but also in shamans who are primarily mediators between people and the natural world/nature spirits. So, to ask a more specific version of the above question, are there cults that would be especially linked to nature spirit-oriented shamans? Odayla? Ernalda? Foundchild? I know Aldrya is only listed in the Bestiary, but could one imagine human shamans dedicated to her (though Jeff has said before that humans who become initiates to Aldrya have to go through a process that essentially turns them into Aldryami)?

[Richard S.]

Hykim & Mikyh / Korgatsu is the big shaman cult for the various animal peoples of Glorantha - the Hsunchen - but there aren't too many of them in the Dragon Pass save the Telmori, and I don't know how many shamans they have. Actually, I'm not sure if shamans worship Korgatsu directly or if they join the animal totem cults like the rest of their tribe. In any case, that'd probably be the best for a "nature shaman", though it really only focuses on beasts. If you want a plant shaman, Aldrya is pretty much the choice, yeah, but as you noted it's difficult for humans to be more than lay members. The other one option, of course, is having a shaman of a regular large shaman cult like DF or Waha and just have them join spirit cults for nature-y spells.

[Goldennose]

Enkala of High Llama Tribe in Jeff´s White Bull Campaign is worshipper of Storm Bull and a shaman.

 

[Goldennose]

Salissa Three-Husbands in Red Cow campaign is a shaman, but in secret... I have no idea how that works, but she is seen as Ernalda worshipper to many in the clan. Salissa is a member of the Serdrodosa the Earth Witch tradition.

 

Edited September 11, 2020 by Caras

[metcalph]

Dragon Pass Rune Cults with Shamans

Kolat, Aldrya (Gardener subcult), Thed,, ,Malia, Telmor, Gorakiki, Aranea, Kyger Litor Bagog, Basmol, Earth Witch, Jakaleel,.

 

[Goldennose]

So can Salissa be initiate/godtalker/priestess of Ernalda AND Earth Witch? I quess so.

[metcalph]

14 minutes ago, Caras said:

So can Salissa be initiate/godtalker/priestess of Ernalda AND Earth Witch? I quess so.

An initiate of Ernalda and a Shaman of the Earth Witch?  Yes.

A god-talker of Ernalda and a Shaman of the Earth Witch?  No (unless the Shaman joined it as an associate cult).

A priest of Ernalda and a Shaman of the Earth Witch, No.

[Westnovote]

My question is would it be considered likely or even possible that an assistant shaman also becomes an initiate of a major Orlanthi cult, such as Orlanth himself?  Or are they limited to lay membership?

I'm aware that Kolat is considered the Orlanthi shaman tradition cult, but we don't have an RQG writeup for him yet.

[Westnovote]

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Edited September 11, 2020 by Westnovote
Duplicate post

[Richard S.]

2 hours ago, Westnovote said:

My question is would it be considered likely or even possible that an assistant shaman also becomes an initiate of a major Orlanthi cult, such as Orlanth himself?  Or are they limited to lay membership?

I'm aware that Kolat is considered the Orlanthi shaman tradition cult, but we don't have an RQG writeup for him yet.

Earth Witch and Kolat are spirit cults in RQG so you could be an initiate of both Kolat and Orlanth, or a priest of Orlanth and an initiate of Kolat. It doesn't look like priests of spirits can be initiates of gods though.

Edited September 11, 2020 by Richard S.

[David Scott]

2 hours ago, Westnovote said:

My question is would it be considered likely or even possible that an assistant shaman also becomes an initiate of a major Orlanthi cult, such as Orlanth himself?  Or are they limited to lay membership?

I'm aware that Kolat is considered the Orlanthi shaman tradition cult, but we don't have an RQG writeup for him yet.

Kolat is a simple spirit cult. You can be shaman and an Orlanth initiate. It doesn't say that orlanth initiates can't be shaman or assistant shaman. You couldn't be a rune level though.

You could be

assistant shaman & orlanth initiate

shaman & orlanth initiate

however as an initiate you are then beholden to the Orlanth priests.

assistant shaman & Kolat initiate

shaman & Kolat initiate

As a Kolat initiate you are beholden to Orlanth priests.

Orlanth Rune priest & Kolat initiate

Orlanth Rune lord & Kolat initiate

You would be the person that the Kolat shaman is beholden to

assistant shaman & orlanth initiate & Kolat initiate

shaman & orlanth initiate & Kolat initiate

you'd have access to more rune magic as an Orlanth initiate but your life would be more restricted.

 

[PhilHibbs]

2 hours ago, David Scott said:

You could be

assistant shaman & orlanth initiate

shaman & orlanth initiate

Assistant shaman and Orlanth rune level?

I don't see why not, you don't have a fetch to impede your Allied Spirit development, you aren't distracted from your sacred duties by miscellaneous Spirit Plane nonsense, it's just an occupation that you used to have.

[g33k]

6 hours ago, David Scott said:

Kolat is a simple spirit cult. You can be shaman and an Orlanth initiate. It doesn't say that orlanth initiates can't be shaman or assistant shaman. You couldn't be a rune level though.

You could be

assistant shaman & orlanth initiate

shaman & orlanth initiate

however as an initiate you are then beholden to the Orlanth priests.

assistant shaman & Kolat initiate

shaman & Kolat initiate

As a Kolat initiate you are beholden to Orlanth priests.

Orlanth Rune priest & Kolat initiate

Orlanth Rune lord & Kolat initiate

You would be the person that the Kolat shaman is beholden to

assistant shaman & orlanth initiate & Kolat initiate

shaman & orlanth initiate & Kolat initiate

you'd have access to more rune magic as an Orlanth initiate but your life would be more restricted.

Would you see a similar suite of options for Ernalda / Serdrodosa?

[Beoferret]

Thanks for the replies, everyone! I'm trying to stick with the cults that are described in the core rules (plus Aldrya); and I'm trying to stick to cults found in Sartar, Esrolia, or Prax. I only found one mention of Kolat (pg. 359), so I suppose I'll simply stick with Daka Fal, Waha, Yelm (for Grazelanders), along with Orlanth, Ernalda, and Aldrya (maybe Eiritha and Storm Bull, as well?). I'm starting to recruit folks for a game and don't want to overload them, though I'm pretty sure that one player is interested in a shaman-type character (either that or a Eurmal worshipper), so that's why I've been thinking about how to link shamans to the cults described in the core rulebook. I suspect that this player might be interested in playing a nature-oriented shaman (D&D druid-style) character, so that's why I've been considering Aldrya as well. Perhaps I'll steer her towards Ernalda worship as a starting point for taking the shamanic life path. In my opinion, I'd assume that once a character had achieved status as a full shaman the authorities for any cult they belonged to would a) automatically moderate any claims they made on the PC, but would b) turn to the PC first for any shaman/spirit word related problems they had (due to the initial cult connection.) I suppose this would be less of a problem if PCs didn't start out as initiates of a cult (not just socially initiated into adulthood, while remaining laypeople of a cult), but I'm not really interested in starting the players out at a lower power level (the transition from D&D to RQG will be hard enough.)

[French Desperate WindChild]

My advice if player is new : let she become a regular shaman, without cult. a nature oriented shaman  manages nature spirits, not ancestors (daka fal) so you can explain it. And there is no issue to initiate her to a cult later

It is a deal to understand everything a shaman can do, and shaman are already very powerful. 

there is no need to be shaman and initiate, except in two ways :

great rp, but it needs some lore to explore it

great munchkin

 

if your table is between both, you will risk to favor too much the shaman (already so powerful) than others

 

[HreshtIronBorne]

3 hours ago, Beoferret said:

Thanks for the replies, everyone! I'm trying to stick with the cults that are described in the core rules (plus Aldrya); and I'm trying to stick to cults found in Sartar, Esrolia, or Prax. I only found one mention of Kolat (pg. 359), so I suppose I'll simply stick with Daka Fal, Waha, Yelm (for Grazelanders), along with Orlanth, Ernalda, and Aldrya (maybe Eiritha and Storm Bull, as well?). I'm starting to recruit folks for a game and don't want to overload them, though I'm pretty sure that one player is interested in a shaman-type character (either that or a Eurmal worshipper), so that's why I've been thinking about how to link shamans to the cults described in the core rulebook. I suspect that this player might be interested in playing a nature-oriented shaman (D&D druid-style) character, so that's why I've been considering Aldrya as well. Perhaps I'll steer her towards Ernalda worship as a starting point for taking the shamanic life path. In my opinion, I'd assume that once a character had achieved status as a full shaman the authorities for any cult they belonged to would a) automatically moderate any claims they made on the PC, but would b) turn to the PC first for any shaman/spirit word related problems they had (due to the initial cult connection.) I suppose this would be less of a problem if PCs didn't start out as initiates of a cult (not just socially initiated into adulthood, while remaining laypeople of a cult), but I'm not really interested in starting the players out at a lower power level (the transition from D&D to RQG will be hard enough.)

If you are interested in emulating some of the powers a D&D Druid can put together I would look towards multiple spirit cults. A shaman has the flexibility to found/follow many spirit cults. I don't see any reason a Daka Fal, or any flavor of Shaman couldn't worship many nature spirits and elemental spirit cults. 

[David Scott]

14 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

Assistant shaman and Orlanth rune level?

I don't see why not, you don't have a fetch to impede your Allied Spirit development, you aren't distracted from your sacred duties by miscellaneous Spirit Plane nonsense, it's just an occupation that you used to have.

While I agree in concept, practically there's complexity. An assistant shaman has a loyalty to a shaman who teaches them with the goal of them becoming a shaman. You'd likely need to be a member of the Kolat spirit cult. Then you are subject to the priesthood's orders. So who is the shaman. You might be the person in charge of them. Time wise you need:

Quote

An assistant shaman must spend 90% of their time with their mentor shaman. They may take a Loyalty (Shaman) Passion starting at 60%.

Quote

A Wind Lord must donate 9/10 of their time and income to the cult.

While I'd not let this be a barrier, the loyalties part I would.

[David Scott]

11 hours ago, g33k said:

Would you see a similar suite of options for Ernalda / Serdrodosa?

Yes, but Serdrodosa is the Earth Witch, commonly called just Earth Witch (For example in Prax she is Helpwoman, not Serdrodosa). Ignore the HW cult (overly complicated HW era unfinished/unedited write up) and use the description in Sartar KoH page 141 instead and of course Heortling Mythology.

[Revilo Divad Of Dyoll]

12 hours ago, David Scott said:

Yes, but Serdrodosa is the Earth Witch, commonly called just Earth Witch (For example in Prax she is Helpwoman, not Serdrodosa). Ignore the HW cult (overly complicated HW era unfinished/unedited write up) and use the description in Sartar KoH page 141 instead and of course Heortling Mythology.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree.  The original write-ups of Kolat and Serdrodosa were very evocative.  If you can find them (I think they were online only), they are worth a look, for color if nothing else.  [I agree that they are no longer canon (Serdrodosa is a full shamanic path and is not an aspect of Asrelia [I think])].

 

Thanks,

David.

[g33k]

Serdrodosa (as she appeared on Glorantha.com) was a "hidden path" to Ernalda, I think.

Of course, by some views Ernalda and Asrelia are one...

 

Which rather begs the question as to whether "Earth Witch" is an entity, per se, or a common cultural role/trope... Ernalda and Helpwoman are very differently-scoped deities!

[David Scott]

15 hours ago, Revilo Divad Of Dyoll said:

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree.  The original write-ups of Kolat and Serdrodosa were very evocative.  If you can find them (I think they were online only), they are worth a look, for color if nothing else.  [I agree that they are no longer canon (Serdrodosa is a full shamanic path and is not an aspect of Asrelia [I think])].

You'll find the unfinished write ups here: 

https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/home/catalogue/publishers/issaries/issaries-heroquest-1-products-2003-20xx/heroquest-1-archive/heroquest-1-support-material/heroquest-1-sample-keywords/

I've recently put them back up in case people find them helpful. The full version of Kolat is in the Sartar Companion.

Serdrodosa the Earth Witch is still a full path as a shaman can still join as a spirit cult. Earth Witch can be viewed as the fetch of the Earth Goddesses.

 

Edited September 13, 2020 by David Scott

[Zit]

Considering the probable origin of shamanism in our World, hunter cults should definitely be open to shamanism. OK, Glorantha is not our World, but stil...

[Beoferret]

4 hours ago, Zit said:

Considering the probable origin of shamanism in our World, hunter cults should definitely be open to shamanism. OK, Glorantha is not our World, but stil...

I like this idea. I can imagine that an Odayla-oriented shaman be kind of like Creb in Clan of the Cave Bear, except more of a loner. Playing a Yinkin-oriented shaman could be a thoroughly good time.

[Beoferret]

9 hours ago, David Scott said:

You'll find the unfinished write ups here: 

https://wellofdaliath.chaosium.com/home/catalogue/publishers/issaries/issaries-heroquest-1-products-2003-20xx/heroquest-1-archive/heroquest-1-support-material/heroquest-1-sample-keywords/

I've recently put them back up in case people find them helpful. The full version of Kolat is in the Sartar Companion.

Serdrodosa the Earth Witch is still a full path as a shaman can still join as a spirit cult. Earth Witch can be viewed as the fetch of the Earth Goddesses.

 

Many thanks for providing this!

 

[David Scott]

18 hours ago, Zit said:

Considering the probable origin of shamanism in our World, hunter cults should definitely be open to shamanism. OK, Glorantha is not our World, but stil...

Virtually anyone can join spirit cults, shaman can join Foundchild. I actually think that there is the occasional hunting shaman in some communities. They certainly exist amongst the Balazarings.