Size characteristic versus Height and Weight

[French Desperate WindChild]

How do you manage a character 1.70 meter tall (size 11) and 140 kg (size 20) ?

What size will you use as the "official one" ? (to calculate skill bonus/malus, etc )

 

My first intent is to choose the height size  (for strike rank) but I see some issue with hp and stealth bonus.

The last thought I have is mixing them :

- height size for strike rank

- max(height size and weight size) for stealth bonus

- average size for hp

- the appropriate size in situation of charactristic roll (watch beyond the wall : height, break the bridge: weight)

and I may miss other impacts.

 

I m not challenging the rules, one size characteristic is enough, that is not my point. I m cleary focus on house rule to solve a very very local issue

 

 

Edited January 18, 2021 by French Desperate WindChild

[Brootse]

7 minutes ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

How do you manage a character 1.70 meter tall (size 11) and 140 kg (size 20) ?

What size will you use as the "official one" ? (to calculate skill bonus/malus, etc )

 

My first intent is to choose the height size  (for strike rank) but I see some issue with hp and stealth bonus.

The last thought I have is mixing them :

- height size for strike rank

- max(height size and weight size) for stealth bonus

- average size for hp

- the appropriate size in situation of charactristic roll (watch beyond the wall : height, break the bridge: weight)

and I may miss other impacts.

 

I m not challenging the rules, one size characteristic is enough, that is not my point. I m cleary focus on house rule to solve a very very local issue

 

 

I'd use height for strike rank, and mass for everything else, if the character's density is the same as humans'. But if the character is eg. made from stone, I'd use the height for armor price too (I'm using the older edition's rules where larger armors cost more.)

[Akhôrahil]

This seems like it would work, if you think it's worth the effort. 

It will get weird if you try to apply it to non-humanoids, though, but you could just use simple "regular" size for a wolf or a brontosaurus

[French Desperate WindChild]

48 minutes ago, Akhôrahil said:

This seems like it would work, if you think it's worth the effort. 

this is for @Brootse or for mine ?

52 minutes ago, Akhôrahil said:

It will get weird if you try to apply it to non-humanoids, though, but you could just use simple "regular" size for a wolf or a brontosaurus

for sure, it is only for a main character, i m fine with the rules for  99.99% of pc/npc

[Akhôrahil]

4 minutes ago, French Desperate WindChild said:

this is for @Brootse or for mine ?

Yours.

[Kloster]

According to RQG p52, if you increase (or decrease) the SIZE of x for extra height range, you should lower (on increase) it of same amount for weight range. A 13 SIZ character is supposed to be 76 to 80kg and 175 to 178cm, but he can be fat and be 86 to 90kg (SIZ 15) and 166 to 170 cm (SIZ 11). Your proposal goes further and is more precise. Is it interesting, yes. Is it worth it, I don't know. It depends on the level of details you want in your game.

[soltakss]

I would take an average and use that as SIZ.

In my Legend SciFi hack, I have LEN and MAS as characteristics to simulate the long and lithe shape of Low/Zero-G spacers and the short but heavy shape of high-G people.

[SDLeary]

15 hours ago, soltakss said:

I would take an average and use that as SIZ.

In my Legend SciFi hack, I have LEN and MAS as characteristics to simulate the long and lithe shape of Low/Zero-G spacers and the short but heavy shape of high-G people.

Wouldn't a bonus or penalty to SR be easier to apply, or are you using LEN for something else as well?

Also, how are you rating it? Other Suns has LEN, but it rates it based on cm.  And this combine with Build to yield SIZ.

SDLeary

Edited January 19, 2021 by SDLeary

[AndreJarosch]

I (my real life Me) is according to RQG  SIZ 15 (height) and SIZ 18 (weight). 
I don´t see myself as THAT tall... also not THAT fat. 

[soltakss]

10 hours ago, SDLeary said:

Wouldn't a bonus or penalty to SR be easier to apply, or are you using LEN for something else as well?

Some things, such as SR, use LEN, other things use MAS.

10 hours ago, SDLeary said:

Also, how are you rating it? Other Suns has LEN, but it rates it based on cm.  And this combine with Build to yield SIZ.

LEN is roughly based on cms, but might stretch at the ends. It is really for people-sized adventurers and not for planet-sized giants.

 

[Akhôrahil]

10 hours ago, AndreJarosch said:

I (my real life Me) is according to RQG  SIZ 15 (height) and SIZ 18 (weight). 
I don´t see myself as THAT tall... also not THAT fat. 

This should be easy to check factually - both weight and a 2d6+6 roll are normal distributed, so all that’s necessary is to see if the weights given in the table are the ones you would expect from actual normal distribution of weight (with the caveat that we as modern people are very likely more overweight than Gloranthans).

[Stephen L]

23 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

2d6+6 roll are normal distributed

2D6 is a saw tooth (straight line up to average, straight line down from average).

You need at least 3 dice before you start to approximate a normal distribution.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Stephen L
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[Stephen L]

On 1/19/2021 at 10:14 PM, AndreJarosch said:

I (my real life Me) is according to RQG  SIZ 15 (height) and SIZ 18 (weight). 

Me, I'm SIZ 13 Size and Weight.  And I'm pretty average in real life.

[Kloster]

6 minutes ago, Stephen L said:

Me, I'm SIZ 13 Size and Weight.  And I'm pretty average in real life.

I hadn't noticed I am so unaverage: 15 as Height and 16 as Weight

[Shiningbrow]

On 1/19/2021 at 5:20 AM, Kloster said:

Your proposal goes further and is more precise. Is it interesting, yes. Is it worth it, I don't know. It depends on the level of details you want in your game.

"You find an enchanted Iron breastplate to fit a Siz 16... no, not that Siz 16, the other Siz 16..."

 

I'd say it's worth it

[PhilHibbs]

9 hours ago, Shiningbrow said:

"You find an enchanted Iron breastplate to fit a Siz 16... no, not that Siz 16, the other Siz 16..."

I'd say it's worth it

Some games don't even have a SIZ stat. I'd say no, not worth it. 

[Akhôrahil]

1 hour ago, PhilHibbs said:

Some games don't even have a SIZ stat. I'd say no, not worth it. 

The only reason RQ needs SIZ, really, is in order to model large monsters.

[PhilHibbs]

6 hours ago, Akhôrahil said:

The only reason RQ needs SIZ, really, is in order to model large monsters.

Yeah I guess, if you want to derive HP from stats. STR doesn't quite cut it, but CON would probably do. It seems to scale more or less linearly with SIZ if I recall. I guess D&D manages by just having arbitrary monster hit dice as a primary characteristic. I can't think how other games do it that don't have SIZ, I haven't played one for so long. L5R is similar to D&D in that it just has a number of wound box lines for creatures.

[Shiningbrow]

5 hours ago, PhilHibbs said:

Yeah I guess, if you want to derive HP from stats. STR doesn't quite cut it, but CON would probably do. It seems to scale more or less linearly with SIZ if I recall. I guess D&D manages by just having arbitrary monster hit dice as a primary characteristic. I can't think how other games do it that don't have SIZ, I haven't played one for so long. L5R is similar to D&D in that it just has a number of wound box lines for creatures.

D&D also has Small, Medium, Large, etc... And, one of the downfalls (in my more simulationist opinion) is that a tall bulky STR-based human can wear the same gear (loot) as a short slim DEX-based elf... all Medium!

[Brootse]

On 1/23/2021 at 6:46 AM, Shiningbrow said:

D&D also has Small, Medium, Large, etc... And, one of the downfalls (in my more simulationist opinion) is that a tall bulky STR-based human can wear the same gear (loot) as a short slim DEX-based elf... all Medium!

Iirc there are rules for plate armors that must be fitted for new owners in D&D.

[Monty Lovering]

I like crunchy.

This extends to SIZ too.

For me, SIZ of an anthropoid is the presented target area and won't change appreciably if it gains strength. I'm a little shorter than most Running Backs, but 20kg lighter, but it's gonna be about the same chance of hitting me or the Running Back if we'd just stand there and take the hit.

But if you have a higher or lower STR than average you gain or lose weight. That impacts things like knockbacks.

But here are my house rules.

Anthropoid SIZ height and weight.

All characters are considered to live active life-styles and have an ideal weight for their height if they are average STR for their species, as per the standard SIZ/weight/height table.

For the occasional sedentary character who has put on weight, add a +x (where x is the number of SIZ's they are overweight) as a subscript to the character record, and a - x as subscript to CON of the same amount on the record.

For characters that are underfed for long periods, the subscript would be -x n SIZ and CON.

As a rule of thumb, +1 is mildly overweight, +2 is overweight, +3 is obese, +4 is morbidly obese. Mildly overweight carries no penalties. Overweight reduces MOV by 1 and ENC to 80%. Obese has the same penalties as overweight plus the addition of the character always being Fatigue 1. Morbidly obese reduces MOV by 2, limits ENC as before, and means the character is always at least fatigue 2. Negative values for undernourished characters carry the same penalties.

Characters with above average STR will be heavier than average for their height - see below for details as this varies by species.

Elves are lightly built and will be the height of a human 1 SIZ larger than their weight would indicate. An elf will be 1 SIZ heavier for every point of STR above 11.

Baboons are 1 SIZ shorter than a human of the same weight, but cannot really stand fully erect, choosing to walk on all fours almost all the time. Baboons over SIZ 13 are 2 SIZ shorter than a human of the same weight, Baboons over SIZ 15 are 3 SIZ shorter than a human of the same weight. A baboon will be 1 SIZ heavier for every point of STR above 20.

Humans will be 1 SIZ heavier for every point of STR above 12. Agimori will be 1 STR heavier for every point of STR above 20. Tusk Riders should be treated as humans for the purposes of this calculation.

Many Mostali are heavily built compared to humans. Those of SIZ 2-3 are as tall as indicated, but those from SIZ 4-5 are 1 SIZ less in height than indicated, from SIZ 6-7 are 2 SIZ less in height than indicated, from SIZ 8-9 are 3 SIZ less in height than indicated, from SIZ 10-11 are 4 SIZ less in height than indicated, and at SIZ 12 are 5 SIZ less in height than indicated. Mostali will be 1 SIZ heavier for every point of STR above 18.

Dark trolls are heavily built and will be the height of a human 3 SIZ less than their SIZ would indicate, but any lack of height is compensated for by breadth when considering SIZ for the purposes of resolving a hit.  They will be 1 STR heavier for every point of STR above 17. Great Trolls will be 1 STR heavier for every point of STR above 26. Trollkin will be 1 STR heavier for every point of STR above 10.

Any other anthropoid species, including those with tails, will be 1 STR heavier for every point of STR above the average of the species.

Characters who are below average STR will have lose weight at half the rate for each point of STR below the above given figure. So if they would be one SIZ heavier for every point of STR above average, they will be one SIZ lighter for every two points of STR below average.

Any excess or deficit of weight for the characters SIZ due to STR should be noted as positive or negative superscript to the characters SIZ