French Desperate WindChild

seems to me the most important thing to keep in mind when we read the compatibility chart. People don't follow only one "chart" to decide what they do for example there are a lot of very different motivation to join Argrath and attack Pavis - you hate Lunar because some of them attacked you/your family: a good lunar is a dead lunar, not just the real criminals - you are just loyal to Argrath/your chief/your khan, you have nothing against lunars but if your loyalty commands to kill them, well you kill them - you think Lunar is chaos and you hate chaos, remove lunar from Pavis - you are devoted to you god and consider the red goddess as an enemy so kill her worshippers (of course the chart is useful !) - you hate the red emperor (you even may be a seven mother worshipper !) and any attack against the empire is an opportunity. Join his opponents. - you see Pavis as an issue because it is growing with so many migrants. You know they will take your ancestral pasture. You must stop them by killing / deporting / frighten the lunars AND the sartarites (don't care their gods, the point is the resource) - you see Pavis as an opportunity of plunder, but the walls and the guards are difficult for a little raid. Argrath propose something efficient, a very big raid ... etc... and of course some praxians may have personal reason to like Pavis for business, or even to live in Pavis. - conflict into your clan, you must leave the plains, you have no social ally in the clan and the tribe. Other tribes will of course enslave or kill you. Pavis is the nearest place to start a new life - Pavis provides confort you need (other praxians will probably see you as "weak"...) Maybe you have some issue with your cult or god (no more devotion) and you ask yourself why they say another way of life than nomad should be so bad - Pavis provides business you like (escort, trade, ...). Stay there (a week per season, or definitively) gives you more opportunities - there is some loyalty in Pavis (a love, a mentor, a master...) . Loyalty stronger than any other in the plains. So you stay in Pavis ... etc ....

I agree, there is no reason shamans would not be able to awake animals (or trees, or ...) but the "standard" equivalence between 2 RP = 4 MP is based on temporary spells : 1 RP divine spell, 15 min = 2mp spirit spell 2min here we have something different: 1) the spell is "for ever" 2) the spell is one use (aka you lose for ever 2RP/POW) which is, imo, really normal, as it is "for ever". So that cannot be just the same cost than a bladesharp 4. it must be sacrifice pow, as it is like an enchantment. (imo, of course Our glorantha may vary 🙂 ) the other issue, more a background issue, is the alter creature spell works only on Waha covenant creatures, so based on a specific mythic event. and that's not because you are a shaman that you cannot cast rune spell. You have access to rune spell by spirit society, bargain with a great entity, and of course cult membership then there are three options: - gm considers there are other myth events in the same vein. And a cult/spirit society/entity provides the same spell for a specific creature (for example Telmor might provide Alter Wolf ,Yinkin Alter Alynx, etc...) - gm considers there is no need of myth events to do that, just sacrifice 2POW to your god/great entity and it will send one of its minion, a spirit, in the creature. Something like an allied spirit, but a non initiate spirit - gm considers there is no spell to do that but there are animals born awakend (like the fish priest of Zola Fel) and in all case, there are the "joker" heroquest. Enter a heroplan with a beast (or without any beast), do what you do, and you leave it with an awakend beast

a very good question. here my thoughts, without clear answer, sorry 😛 I use spoiler tag to develop my opinion on each point I think. when you are heroquesting, are you visiting the "only one" god plan/ hero plan or an echo ? for me it is an echo but that is my own conclusion, I don't have any reference, just I cannot understand how it could work in another way If it is an instance, is there, at one mundane moment, only one instance of hero plan or are there as many instances than there are heroquestors taking the same role ? the white bull campaign shows that people (the pc) are able to enter hell (so it seems to me it is a heroquest) to meet Kalyr working on her heroquest . So we can conclude that people on the same mundane moment are able to meet themselves (if they recognize the mundane people behind the mask of gods) in an instance of hell. That doesnt demonstrate if it must be only one or it can be several but at least we know the possibility that two "teams" can meet. so let's imagine the different hypothesis: H1) they MUST be in the same echo. So we have two people who want to start to be the same god (let's say Orlanth just because I m more confortable from a knowledge perspective). several options: - One takes the role of Orlanth, the other one fails to enter in the god plan (heroquest can fail from the very begining, maybe because the place is "occupied", of course no participant can know that, they just witness the failure) - One takes the role of Orlanth, the other a related role (a thunder brother, ...). the second one doesn't do what was expected but at least is in the myth - Both take the role of Orlanth, their souls are both in the same "shell" and at each station, there is a kind of duel to determine who "leads" and decides what to do. - Both take the role of Orlanth, their souls merge, and a new temporary entity leads. Something like the fusion between Vegeta and Goku in dragon ball (you don't see one or the other, you see something new) they CAN be in the same echo. following the previous options: - One takes the role of Orlanth, the other one maybe fails, maybe.... takes the role of Orlanth in another echo, and there are two heroquests at the same mundane time - One takes the role of Orlanth, the other a a thunder brother. But, at any "time", we know a heroquester can "explore" the myth. So maybe during the station two, the thunder brother does something "weird", and following a new path, becomes Orlanth, creating another echo of the myth (one with the first Orlanth, one with the old thunder brother who is a second Orlanth). And maybe in two or three stations, the echos will merge and again,one will be Orlanth, and the other a thunder brother. - Both take the role of Orlanth, but there is no merge, and there are two echos of Orlanth in two different heroquests. they CANNOT be in the same echo. easy, they are in two different heroquests, and that's fine now my conclusion : from a game perspective, the answer of your question is not very important (but I like your question !) : the point is: do the pc start the heroquest, and if yes, are they in the right role (what they wanted). For any reasons, they can fail, or they can start but not in the expected role, or they may change the role during the quest (for any reason). And maybe they will recognize who is behind Orlanth shell, or maybe not. What I would manage is (but would like to see the rules to be more accurate) to determine a success or not (Are you in Orlanth shell ?) ? If not, if any player asks why (after hearing the soft sound of the dices - or not) , I would answer: "your characters cannot answer this question. they may ask themselves, ask some wise people but there are so many reasons. If it is important for your character, roll a devotion test, if you fail, your characters will consider the gods differently, and lose 1d6. if you succeed, your characters will keep their faith, if critical, they will work hard to succeed next time, add +1d6. That s a personal choice, a pc can succeed, another can fail, and a last one doesn't care at all but from a background perspective, we need an answer !!! 😛

who is guilty ? the chalana cultist : - was she aware of the plan ==> guilty.CA +10 - did she know the wind lord and how he manages CA taboos => guilty.CA +5 - did she know there was an eurmali ==>guilty.CA +1 if guilty.CA > 5 (not >=5 , but > aka 6+) then she must sacrifice something (time, POW, status) to stay in the cult if guilty.CA > 9 then she is not member any more of the cult, she loses any spell (spirit or divine) she learnt in the cult. She loses any % of cult skills (not the full knowledge, only what she get during her time in the cult, by experience, training or study) the eurmal cultist : - did she know the victim was protected by the CA cultist => guilty.EU + 0 (+ zero) - did she know it was a taboo => guilty.EU +1 (+ one) if guilty.EU > 5 (six or more, no typo) then depending on her subcult she may stink the next d6 weeks the windlord - did he know the victim was incapacited => guilty.OR +5 - did he know the victim was protected by the CA cultist => guilty.OR + 10 if guilty.OR > 1, even if it is a fumble, if the windlord has honour passion, -1d6 in honour if guilty.OR >9, the windlord loses the honour passion, and maybe gain some curse like [ any heal spell/skill will work at 50% on him ], for a season, a year, or until some stuff is done that's from the world/gods and personal perspective. Not what could believe/understand the witnesses (so it happens even if the windlord succeeds any fast talk) and if there is any divination spell or if the windlord fails to convince (even if he is not guilty) , add +1d6 in reputation, and note the event: "hey look I recognizes this guy, he is a bad one, he betrayed one of his companions, a healer of CA ! Don't work with him, or you will be curse..." so some penalty in social skills with anyone who has honor passion, who is a healer or a friend of the CA cult (so a lot of people 😛 ).

from a game design perspective, you can research or be trained (p417) the easiest way is as @Squaredeal Sten says, go to to your temple . However, your temple provides probably rune training in runes you already have improved. If you want to be trained in other rune, you have to find another temple (or shaman, for spirit rune for example). Then that is more a gm /player discussion/roleplay. Will the temple require something ? Will the shaman ask the character to become an assistant ? or just "few" cows will be enough ? As a gm I will require: - be known from the temple or the shaman (I don't mean reputation, but your family, clan, yourself, is welcomed by) - at least be/become lay member for a cult/spirit society or at least do/ have done something important (= loyalty) for the shaman or the priest - if the rune is the opposite face of what you are (for example you have 90% in truth and you want to improve illusion - you have 10% then before any training - ) that would be hard : - if your 90% rune is part of one of your cult, some priests may ask themselves (or yourself) why you, a near "holy" initiate, lost a part of your holyness (detection because your behavior, connection to the god, etc... or just priest's feeling ) - the cult where you want to learn, may have same kind of questions : what is the trick ? why this humakti ask me to learn trichery ? etc.. and of course, How can I trick him 😛 so the other way, longer, but at least with less social opposition/impact is to learn by yourself. Go meditate about the world in a cave/ hill /lake, what you want, see what you have to see (the harmony of the nature, the violence of the nature, ....) etc in all cases, changing your runes may be a hook for some adventure. Studying the wind, you heard a voice calling you / asking you to do something or to go somewhere, etc.. Is it a sylph who needs help and will, once done, give you an additional perspective on the air (+d6%) ? is it your god itself who want a pilgrimage and will lead you to some solo-heroquest ? is it a gargath minion who wants to manipulate you ? Is it some of your mundane nemesis who is tricking you ? Of course not for all runes improvements, but sometimes... i feel interesting to create story based on players choices (but not expected by the players)

i totally agree about the very "relativism" of any kind of honor (in glorantha or elsewhere) but the difference, imo, from the dragon pass honor perspecive I understand, is the poorly armed is (seen as) armed, when the surrender, hands in the air, even with knives on them, or why not axes, etc but not "accessible", is (seen as) not armed. Note that my point is not based on my values but on what I understand about their (dragon pass) values for me , if you are a trained/professional/heroic fighter there is no honor , there is even dishonor -if it means something-, to kill someone who is not able to face you, when you are able to just stun your opponent without risk for anyone on your side. But that's not the humakti version I think 😛

that is not (in my opinion / understanding of Honnor in glorantha) because your opponant is dishonorable that you are allowed to do dishonorable things. Maybe they did things that thr humakti wants to kill them abd accepts the price of the loss of honor: a conflict between different passions: revenge and honor (good material for tragedy, even more if only a part of the bandits were guilty but all are killed !). Something that Bab's maiden have decided honor is less a value than a complication Lying to oneself ! Some would say that, but if they meet any divine judge (Daka Fal, Humakt, etc...) during heroquest or their last travel, would face their own breach of honor and truth

I may misunderstand your question so apologies, if I m far from your idea 😛 I differentiate both. And identify a third option, for any person who was able to do great feat, great enough to be remembered and "worshipped". Let's say hundreds years ago Loco the hunter, initiate of foundchild, succeed to hunt a magical / divine prey and was able to discover some new magical ability (for example "dark walk" spell). Let's say that his name was praised by his mates, then his clan and all the region started to worship him as a hero of foundchild. We are now. Cult ancestor Of course his heirs, family, bloodline or maybe even clan, remember him as an ancestor. If they follow the cult of ancestors, they can summon him, and he will be here, able to cast the dark walk spell They can cast "incarnate ancestor", and he will be there, with all his abilities. But the "now" heirs, the worshipers of the ancestor, cannot, by themselves learn dark walk and use it. Hero subcult of a god Then we are now, the cult of foundchild has integrated Loco as one of his hero. And localy (in other far lands, they don't know Loco) foundchild initiates can join the subcult and learn dark walk. They don't have to have Loco as an ancestor, they see Loco as a member of Foundchild company. Spirit cult that's the third option: Loco is worshipped by at least one shaman, who manages a cult for him. Of course Loco is not a great god, so there is only one or two sacred places with shrines in the world. But anyone who joins this spirit cult can learn Dark walk. No need to have Loco as ancestor, no need to be initiate to Foundchild. You just need to find the local cult (or to create it if you are shaman, so maybe heroquest to find Loco, and/or to help the spirit of Loco to be strong enough to "become" a source of power/worship) , be accepted and initiated. Now if you have Loco as your ancestor and be initiate of Foundchild, you have both access to Loco (summon/incarnate your ancestor and learn the spell from the Foundchild's cult) And probably (but not required) the first circle of the spirit cult was made by one of his heir. Who knows Loco if not his family ?

I will not base my answer on irl but on a gloranthan question what do you need to understand then practice sorcery, alchimy, dwarf plans and such complex tasks. So for me there are a lot of options. what mathematic base ? depends probably on number of runes, or number of form runes, or power runes, or ... other runes

I think you already have the advices 🙂

for sure if you become assistant during the play. However if you start the adventure as assistant & initiate from, you have your shaman. This shaman may be from the same cult or not (background & passions discussion) but at least it is a shaman, so a source of what spirit spells you want (and the GM accepts to provide) But it is clear that if you want to add % to combat skill (=personal skills during the creation process), it could be a detriment to your shamanic skills (hard to reach the shaman requirements, or just to be efficient) but that's a question of choices.

we focused on Daka Fal shaman (axis mundi etc...) but remember that we can find shaman in a lot of cults too I agree (again !) with @Joerg when he dislikes the close combat shaman option but... what about Yinkin, Odayla, Telmor, Stormbull, Rathor.... or even Orlanth, Yelm, Bab's *... or ...Humakt* (good to see and manage all these dead people among us) same for heal, combining shaman and Ernalda, Chalana and other offers a lot of opportunities (and a better ready-made way to play, if you don't know how to play / enjoy your shaman) * not sure if you can beboth inititate and shaman of these gods, but it seems it is possible

the most important words of GM life ! Shaman or other, the GM is responsible (of course players too) to offer opportunities to players to play. If your players want to play a trade campaign, there is no sense to propose 20 dungeons to visit. That the same with the carreer they choose. if I had to play an assistant shaman, I would decide between : - become a range/close fighter. A bow, a sling, a spear & shield and it's done (75% should be the target before working only to become shaman). First rounds you fight, until the front line starts to be wounded, then you heal. if you are in close combat, you are close to the other fighters (not 10 meter behind) so you are the first one able to heal your friend. And even if you don't have rune spells, bladesharp 6, protection 6 (if you want to "tank"... are good and not so hard for an assitant to obtain) And you are able to find any spell for your bow without difficulty. - become a healer. Of course other can use runespells, but with heal 6+ you are able to do a lot of things. And those who fight well should focus to fight more than to heal their friends. And 6 mp lost... nothing in comparison of a rune point. Of course if people can regain rune point after every fight, that is less true. But if there are 2 or 3 difficult fights between two worship ceremonies, spirit magic is very powerful. - become a disrupter. (my favorite). You can confuse and other activities, you have pow, so you can eliminate in 5 rounds five opponents. They are not dead, but they are not able to fight. And if you have your first matrix with an elemental, you are able to do a lot of things: put your friends behind the ennemy line with your sylph, "eat" or at least "freeze" the big guy with your gnom, fear the healers with your darkness spirit, etc... Once shaman, there are so many options, it depends a lot of what you did when you were assistant, how important is roleplay and social activities (easy to have 10 rings with ten super powerful spirits with the rules. The question is would you like to play such game), GM opportunities (as @Joerg said) and player imagination. The issue with the shaman (like sorcerer in fact), in my opinion, compared to other cult/occupation is they are not "specialist" (ok there are spirit specialist, and so what ?). If you hear humakt, you probably understand warrior adventurer , if you hear issaries , you probably understand merchant/negotiator adventurer, if you hear ernalda, you probably understand healer. It is easier to imagine what you play, how you react. Of course, some will play differently, of course, and that is for me the strength of runequest, why I love this system, there is no class, so you can be a fighter and an ernaldan (probably magical, but why not a tank ? earth shield is fine) And that's exactly what you have to do with a shaman, there is not (for adventurer) a clear position in the group. Shaman have to build their own. Imagination is required to play shaman or sorcerer, when it is an option for others (and a lot of fun of course in all cases)

in the bestiary you can find it so for me, everything is left behind. I understand only the undead body becomes smoke

Of course but I mean text/explanation

thanks a lot ! But of course you expose yourself to questions 😛 Quantity : - If you remove the pictures, and focus on content, does it change the ratio ? Quality : - Is the content about the same than in previous editions (for those who were in previous edition, I see of course new content for new gods), or do we see a large part of change / deepest information than in the previous edition ? For example I was frustrated by the new rqg scenario of the rainbow mounds. I expected some new revealed secrets, a kind of sequel to the previous scenario (something I enjoyed with the different stages of Apple lane for example and the evolution of the npcs); not what I consider (other may disagree, it is just my taste), more a new version of the same scenario. I m pretty sure I will enjoy the discovery of new things, but will it be a lot or just few ?

it is an interesting question, and you will not find one answer as so many MGF vary 😛 so it depends a lot on you and your player. Personaly, it is hard to obtain a rune spell. We have the price from the rule but not the availability Like @JRE I consider that temples are organized (number of people, of rp, etc...) to manage their community. So depending of the day there is such availability or not (just after a replenish worship ceremony, there are 1 or 2 spells available, after one or two weeks, there are maybe 1 rp or not) From a gameplay perspective, I consider it is too easy if any wound can be healed without any issue (and a lot of spells can rebuild the body, even spirit magic so...). But that's my taste. And as rq fights are very violent, I understand that people would like to not see their character destroyed just because a roll. So I manage it differently, if you want to be healed (or any spell from npc), you have to do some effort (aka a scenario 😛 ) Sometimes that is a mission (bring me back x or y then I will answer you request), sometimes it is a quest (I can't do this, but I know someone who are able to do it and maybe more) or a mix (I can't do this, but I know someone who are are able to do it but she will probably require something) Of course if you pcs are already very powerfull, a spell they saw as a "challenge" when they are young, is now just a standard : if you are a runelord or priest or equivalent, of course someone will cast the spell you need without any request, if it is not too important (no you don't have access to 5 "free" sever spirit, even if you are the king) But now, the difficulty is different, elsewhere (there is no temple where you can find a friendly CA priest in the heroplan... maybe chalana... somewhere, but not a lot of locations, and probably noone in the pattern of the quest they follow)

I hope for you, australian friends that you will have the physical book before people who are not happy to read english will have access to their native language book (pdf or paper) but I m pretty sure, you will be the first ! Personaly I had to wait for physical book in some warehouse to buy the only pdf I wanted so ...

what I understand is that Yinkin the Orlanth subcult is like Yinkin the cult : there are not the Orlanth spells shared by Thunderous/Adventurous/Vinga However I see few difference : - you are known by the priests so if you want to join another subcult it may be easier (not img, ok for the reputation - but being in the community is enough for reputation so not a change with a full cult - , but you have to prove why you(character) want to join the other subcult - if it is a subcult it is the same runepool. My answer was a semi joke, I hope it is but I fully agree, if being initiate of Yinkin the cult provides less spells than being initiate of Orlanth Yinkin, that's sad (same for Heler, etc..)

that's an import point (even if I have not the same conclusion 🙂 ) For me, Daka Fal is not anymore Grandfather mortal (aka family member, first ancestor, what you want) because Grandfather mortal is dead, in the same way that Humakt is not Orlanth's brother any more. Death severs something in both case. That doesn't mean people don't remember what/who were these entities before they meet Death. Just that, now, they have not all the properties they had before. But they have some new (there is a new deal between Orlanth and Humakt, there is a new deal between Daka Fal and mortals). then if I meet a shaman who is dedicated to a family, or a community XXX. I will know him/her as the shaman of the XXX ancestors, not as a shaman of Daka Fal In the other and, If I meet an initiate of Daka Fal (in my glorantha) this person is not dedicated to a family, ancestor, or any community worship: This weird one is a kind of judge of spirits or someone applying Daka Fal's judgement (who said "judge dreed" ? no just "judge dead", but you got the idea). Do they exist ? not sure at all. But if yes, well this initiate would have generic rune spells for a lot of spirits. Is there usefull to have these spell when you are shaman ? don't know. You can manage them with your shaman powers Is it easy to follow this way when you are not a shaman ? mm probably not, you are too weak for your "targets". So that is most a question of "devotion", than a question of power.

by the way don't know if your Daka Fali is or not a shaman. But a shaman doesn't need a spell to manage it (well... if enough powerful) for me the Daka Fall cult should be seen as a pattern: few worship Daka Fal (they don"t command anybody) but their family/ clan / community ancestors

in my opinion yes but not like your french or my english 😛 I mean, you use the "listening" word but I would use "understanding" : visual : human beings (or other) can't change the color of their scales (or even skin) but can see it (at least a part of the spectrum). So they can understand more than they can express (not sure of the word subtilities: I mean ability to give to other idea by any means, not only voice) auditory: human can hear but maybe not all the spectrum. So they can understand more than they can express even harder olfactory, except with french cheese (I love them !), it is hard to offer a large range of odors for human, so they can und.... and empathic should be impossible or for those who are alreay illuminates (from a draconic perspective). That may be something like insight species, but dragonkin are so different (even runes !) so very hard and there is another difficulty: so at the end of the day, I would say you can speak at 25% max, and you can understand at 50% max (or 40 or ...)

In my opinion that is totally different no allied spirit (because there are no spirits -well I think or maybe human cultists who… failed so are they allied spirits or cursed spirits-) but you may gain a dragonewt or a lower kin (little wyrm , etc …) No divine intervention, there are no gods but you may be allowed to « speak » with some dragon or powerful dragonewt (inhuman king etc…) do they have rune spells ? That is the question. There are two options 1) human are able to use dragonewt magic in that case no rune spell because it means the draconic magic is the dragonewt magic (bestiary) for all species 2) the opposite : dragonewt magic is for dragonewt only. Other species can’t use it. It means then that rune spell(game design definition) is the way for human (or other man rune species) that doesn’t mean they have the same gloranthan mechanic but from rules you must sacrifice pow, create rune pool , use it, replenish it (by meditatio ?) when dragonewt can do magic without it (but the price is different) pow gain ? Yes maybe. But is it because you succeed a worship ceremony , I m note sure. Maybe something different. For me that one of the three rules I expect in dragon pass rune quest game: draconic way for human rules, heroquest rules then (less important for me) sorcery (with back ground not only rules)

I believed the collar blocked specific magic (collar anti divine magic, collar anti sorcery, etc) in that case guided teleport would not work? note my only reference about collar is a French scenario found in the web during the 90’s so it may be wrong ? (Or our glorantha may vary of course)

dwarves are able to do anything you propose. But that is not, in my opinion, with spells pc can learn. They have tools to cut the block (don't remember where, but I m sure that is somewhere, what I m not sure is if they have lost or not the adamant making secret) they may have "sorcery spells" but for me "dwarf sorcery" is not what we call sorcery (what pc can learn) These "spells" follow the same game mechanics but are not with the same "background" (aka that are dwarf techniques, not spells a dwarf may teach to someone else)